Zero Backswing on the Forehand - Can't Extend Hitting Arm!

RyanRF

RyanRF

Professional
Cherlos said:
About a year ago, I tried to learn from the Ricc Macci "ATP-forehand", keeping the backswing compact. After a few months I noticed that I had lost some power in my shots, and my coach was saying regularly that I swing too close to my body.

After filming my forehands for the first time in half a year, I saw that I had made some misinterpretation/mal-adaptations of the ATP forehand. I could see that I had NO BACKSWING, I just drop the racket down after the unit turn. with a slightly bent racket arm "in front".


I know that 99% of all youtube coaches (like Jeff Salzeinstein) says amateurs should shorten the backswing not enlargen it, but I feel my backswing is non-existent/too short now, since I can feel I lost some pop in my forehands compared to my previous technique.

After that I've been filming my forehands like 5-10 times in the last month, and I can't for the love of god extend my arm out to create a bigger backswing, it's still bent through the whole backswing. Feels like syntax error not being able to correct it.

Anybody else had this problem? How much backswing is the right amount?
Click to expand...
Meh. Looks a lot to me like Mannarino's forehand. I wouldn't worry too much about it.
 
Flash74

Flash74

New User
Cherlos said:
About a year ago, I tried to learn from the Ricc Macci "ATP-forehand", keeping the backswing compact. After a few months I noticed that I had lost some power in my shots, and my coach was saying regularly that I swing too close to my body.

After filming my forehands for the first time in half a year, I saw that I had made some misinterpretation/mal-adaptations of the ATP forehand. I could see that I had NO BACKSWING, I just drop the racket down after the unit turn. with a slightly bent racket arm "in front".


I know that 99% of all youtube coaches (like Jeff Salzeinstein) says amateurs should shorten the backswing not enlargen it, but I feel my backswing is non-existent/too short now, since I can feel I lost some pop in my forehands compared to my previous technique.

After that I've been filming my forehands like 5-10 times in the last month, and I can't for the love of god extend my arm out to create a bigger backswing, it's still bent through the whole backswing. Feels like syntax error not being able to correct it.

Anybody else had this problem? How much backswing is the right amount?
Click to expand...
When I first learned my private coach encouraged me to point with my elbow or opposite hand, for whatever reason it made the backswing more natural for me
 
ballmachineguy

ballmachineguy

Hall of Fame
Video done. I talked a lot. As you will see Dragy, the actual time you will need to swing the racquet to learn modern fh is short.
 
Better_Call_Raul

Better_Call_Raul

Hall of Fame
Cherlos said:
About a year ago, I tried to learn from the Ricc Macci "ATP-forehand", keeping the backswing compact
Click to expand...

nyta2 said:
looks like the backswing i strive for when i'm returning big serves (hand "patting the dog" in front of your chest at 90 degrees)
try "patting the dog" with your *hand* 45 degrees behind you (if your chest is facing the side fence)
Click to expand...

I think you are saying OP is patting the dog at 3 o'clock, which is not what you want on a forehand (maybe it is ok for serve return).
IIRC, Macci wants you to pat the dog around 5 o'clock or 5:30, for groundstrokes.
IIRC, the reason Macci wants pat the dog at 5 o'clock is that you will not get a proper "flip" if you pat the dog at 3 o'clock.
:unsure:

DFY9Wrv.gif
 
ballmachineguy

ballmachineguy

Hall of Fame
Anybody wanna try to explain why Rick Macci is so far into his forward swing before reaching max lag (notice he is being videoed a bit from the side and if camera was directly behind he’d appear even more open) and JSinner is at max lag so much earlier?

https://imgur.com/a/llOfax9
 
ballmachineguy

ballmachineguy

Hall of Fame
matterer said:
Because their technique is different therefore it looks different. Now let's see that video.
Click to expand...
Every ATP pro utilizes the same technique (with the possible exception of Medvedev). One of the above is doing it correctly, the other isn’t. Wanna guess who has a clue?
 
Dragy

Dragy

Legend
nyta2 said:
i imagine his groundstrokes will be the model for generations to come... the price of being the goat.
Click to expand...
Well that’s tricky:
- Not many consider his FH as best model. Despite it actually is very-very good.
- He uses quite a heavy and high-SW racquet compared to what youngsters use (and where industry shifted). Which has its effect on the technique. Try to hit exactly like Nole with Alcaraz “stock” racquet, and it’s quite possible you aren’t going anywhere high in rankings.

But back to the question, how big is his backswing on your scale, from 1 to 10?
 
O

optic yellow

Legend
Dragy said:
Well that’s tricky:
- Not many consider his FH as best model. Despite it actually is very-very good.
- He uses quite a heavy and high-SW racquet compared to what youngsters use (and where industry shifted). Which has its effect on the technique. Try to hit exactly like Nole with Alcaraz “stock” racquet, and it’s quite possible you aren’t going anywhere high in rankings.

But back to the question, how big is his backswing on your scale, from 1 to 10?
Click to expand...
It is so simple and clean looking.
 
N

nyta2

Hall of Fame
Dragy said:
Well that’s tricky:
- Not many consider his FH as best model. Despite it actually is very-very good.
- He uses quite a heavy and high-SW racquet compared to what youngsters use (and where industry shifted). Which has its effect on the technique. Try to hit exactly like Nole with Alcaraz “stock” racquet, and it’s quite possible you aren’t going anywhere high in rankings.

But back to the question, how big is his backswing on your scale, from 1 to 10?
Click to expand...
what's you criteria fo "backswing"... eg. how far hadn goes back? how much flip the racquet does and/or how much the racquet tip travels?
 
N

nyta2

Hall of Fame
optic yellow said:
It is so simple and clean looking.
Click to expand...
simplest and cleanest is agassi imo... his technique (imo/from reading) allowed him to play closer to the baseline than other baseliners.
simple and clean did not give him a ton of topspin (brody book?), therefore less margin, but does require a high level of skill to execute consistently
 
Dragy

Dragy

Legend
nyta2 said:
for kids/beginners, i've had to put barriers in place to prevent them from taking a big backswing
Click to expand...
No, my friend, I’m asking what’s your definition, frankly interested what you were talking about here. Where the barrier?
 
O

optic yellow

Legend
Curious said:
I don’t think his racket inversion is that simple and clean.
Click to expand...
nyta2 said:
simplest and cleanest is agassi imo... his technique (imo/from reading) allowed him to play closer to the baseline than other baseliners.
simple and clean did not give him a ton of topspin (brody book?), therefore less margin, but does require a high level of skill to execute consistently
Click to expand...
They look basically the same to me.
 
Jono123

Jono123

Professional
I share a similar compact back swing on my FH. However the OP's is low powered due to a lack of coil and rotation in his trunk.
 
N

nyta2

Hall of Fame
Dragy said:
No, my friend, I’m asking what’s your definition, frankly interested what you were talking about here. Where the barrier?
Click to expand...
(but don't usually have a chair handy, to sit in)

usually resort to just using the ball basket or net to prevent racquet from going back too far.
 
ballmachineguy

ballmachineguy

Hall of Fame
Curious said:
@Dragy
How much were you impressed by BMG’s video? I guess saying that much won’t violate the copyright contract! :oops:
Click to expand...
Haven’t sent it yet. Getting my friend’s ball machine to make a hitting video for Dragy first. It will help to have credibility before he takes the leap.
Care to make disparaging comments before this all happens?
 
Curious

Curious

G.O.A.T.
ballmachineguy said:
Haven’t sent it yet. Getting my friend’s ball machine to make a hitting video for Dragy first. It will help to have credibility before he takes the leap.
Care to make disparaging comments before this all happens?
Click to expand...
All good. Will you send the video to me as well? I doubt anyone deserves it more than I do given the history between us! :D
 
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