Zverev (and Murray) Wild Card into Barcelona to Take on the Best on Clay

Meles

Meles

Bionic Poster
After somewhat short weeks in Monte Carlo these two have decided to make Barcelona a better tournament then Monte Carlo(MC) this year.

There seems to be some confusion among the TTW arm chair quarterbacks so here we go.;) The Best on Clay:
Exhibit A. Nadal - somewhat tainted victory over Goffin, but no doubt Nadal's improved serve game is working on clay. Possible SF rematch.

Exhibit B. Goffin - excellent win over Thiem followed by superlative win over Djokovic at MC - was closing on first set win against Nadal today until horrible officiating spoiled the match.:mad:

Exhibit C. - Thiem - how Thiem fared in Rio run against some of the top performers at Monte Carlo
F Rio Dominic Thiem (AUT) 2 Pablo Carreno Busta (ESP) 4 7‑5 6‑4
R16 Monte Carlo Masters Clay Novak Djokovic Pablo Carreno Busta 6-2 4-6 6-4 (Advantage Thiem over Nole;))
SF Rio Dominic Thiem (AUT) 2 Albert Ramos-Vinolas (ESP) 5 6‑1 6‑4
R16 Monte Carlo Masters Clay Albert Ramos-Vinolas Andy Murray 2-6 6-2 7-5 (Advantage Thiem over Muzziah;))
QF Rio Dominic Thiem (AUT) 2 Diego Sebastian Schwartzman (ARG) 6‑2 6‑3
QF Monte Carlo Masters Clay Rafael Nadal Diego Sebastian Schwartzman 6-4 6-4 (But for some butterflies Diego probably would have take at least one set from Rafa. Advantage Thiem over Nadal;))

The three best players on clay will be playing Barcelona along with ARV and PCB from above. Wawrinka slayer Cuevas will be in the mix at Barcelona as well not to mention Zverev and Murray throwing their hat in the ring at that last moment.:p

Two fantastic young players also will be stepping out on the big stage at Barcelona. Casper Ruud who had match points on PCB at Rio has one more round of qualifying. Mikael Ymer wildcards in against Seppi and if he prevails gets his own shot of PCB in the 2nd round. (Ymer last year schooled Versdasco in Sweden and nearly beat Karlovic.)

Pro match tourn thread:https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...nc-sabadell-atp500-general-discussion.588171/
Draw for reference:
C-ApUPkWAAAsS2y.jpg

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------LULZ Nishikori shat himself and quickly withdrew from the event once he saw this field. Paire replaces him in the draw.:rolleyes:

Best on Clay will be clear by the end of this week with Thiem having a seemingly clear path to the final for a possible showdown with "Mr. La Decima" who goes for his 10th Barcelona title.:p
 
Meles said:
After somewhat short weeks in Monte Carlo these two have decided to make Barcelona a better tournament then Monte Carlo(MC) this year.

There seems to be some confusion among the TTW arm chair quarterbacks so here we go.;) The Best on Clay:
Exhibit A. Nadal - somewhat tainted victory over Goffin, but no doubt Nadal's improved serve game is working on clay. Possible SF rematch.

Exhibit B. Goffin - excellent win over Thiem followed by superlative win over Djokovic at MC - was closing on first set win against Nadal today until horrible officiating spoiled the match.:mad:

Exhibit C. - Thiem - how Thiem fared in Rio run against some of the top performers at Monte Carlo
F Rio Dominic Thiem (AUT) 2 Pablo Carreno Busta (ESP) 4 7‑5 6‑4
R16 Monte Carlo Masters Clay Novak Djokovic Pablo Carreno Busta 6-2 4-6 6-4 (Advantage Thiem over Nole;))
SF Rio Dominic Thiem (AUT) 2 Albert Ramos-Vinolas (ESP) 5 6‑1 6‑4
R16 Monte Carlo Masters Clay Albert Ramos-Vinolas Andy Murray 2-6 6-2 7-5 (Advantage Thiem over Muzziah;))
QF Rio Dominic Thiem (AUT) 2 Diego Sebastian Schwartzman (ARG) 6‑2 6‑3
QF Monte Carlo Masters Clay Rafael Nadal Diego Sebastian Schwartzman 6-4 6-4 (But for some butterflies Diego probably would have take at least one set from Rafa. Advantage Thiem over Nadal;))

The three best players on clay will be playing Barcelona along with ARV and PCB from above. Wawrinka slayer Cuevas will be in the mix at Barcelona as well not to mention Zverev and Murray throwing their hat in the ring at that last moment.:p

Two fantastic young players also will be stepping out on the big stage at Barcelona. Casper Ruud who had match points on PCB at Rio has one more round of qualifying. Mikael Ymer wildcards in against Seppi and if he prevails gets his own shot of PCB in the 2nd round. (Ymer last year schooled Versdasco in Sweden and nearly beat Karlovic.)

Pro match tourn thread:https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...nc-sabadell-atp500-general-discussion.588171/
Draw for reference:
C-ApUPkWAAAsS2y.jpg

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------LULZ Nishikori shat himself and quickly withdrew from the event once he saw this field. Paire replaces him in the draw.:rolleyes:

Best on Clay will be clear by the end of this week with Thiem having a seemingly clear path to the final for a possible showdown with "Mr. La Decima" who goes for his 10th Barcelona title.:p
Click to expand...

Why does Nishikori keep withdrawing. Is he injured?
 
helterskelter said:
@Meles

Nadal is going to sweep the clay-court season. He will at the very least win Monte Carlo and Barcelona. He is clear favorite for Roland Garros and Rome, too, and at least slight favorite for Madrid.
Click to expand...
He can be had. Shwartzman was up nicely midway through both sets and got jitters. ARV has the exact type of aggressive game to challenge Rafa in the Monte Carlo final. I must admit Zverev has a thing or two prove if they both make their QF after his recent beating.:oops:

The best players from this week are pretty much at it again in Barcelona, so this tournament is not the normal Rafa walk in the park.
 
Meles said:
He can be had. Shwartzman was up nicely midway through both sets and got jitters. ARV has the exact type of aggressive game to challenge Rafa in the Monte Carlo final. I must admit Zverev has a thing or two prove if they both make their QF after his recent beating.:oops:

The best players from this week are pretty much at it again in Barcelona, so this tournament is not the normal Rafa walk in the park.
Click to expand...

If Zverev and Nadal meet again on clay in Barcelona, Nadal will crush him like a bug again. You think in one week Zverev is going to become a clay beast? This isn't hard court.
 
Meles said:
Injured still from Miami. Rather rude of him to withdraw after the draw.:rolleyes: I think he saw Goffin lining up in the QF and it was more GTFO than his injury issues.
Click to expand...

Yes, world beater Goffin strikes fear into the entire tour! The head to head between Nishikori and Goffin is 3-0 for Nishikori!

I'm sure Federer will be quaking in his boots the next time he has to play Goffin!
 
cc0509 said:
If Zverev and Nadal meet again on clay in Barcelona, Nadal will crush him like a bug again. You think in one week Zverev is going to become a clay beast? This isn't hard court.
Click to expand...
Its kind of sad he's got Rafa as early as possible. The best he can do is make it respectable. Last year Thiem stopped him in three clay events now Rafa seems to be his new buddy.:confused: I mention Zverev in OP merely because he wildcarded into Barcelona.;)

So are calling this a false dawn for Zverev on clay?:p
 
cc0509 said:
Yes, world beater Goffin strikes fear into the entire tour! The head to head between Nishikori and Goffin is 3-0 for Nishikori!

I'm sure Federer will be quaking in his boots the next time he has to play Goffin!
Click to expand...
Haha. So you're on the Ninja bandwagon.:confused: He's dropping like a rock with his ranking points and has SFs at Rome and Madrid. The guy got smoked trying to vulture on SA clay. At the rate things are going Zverev has a shot of knocking Nole and Kei out of WTF this year.:eek: At the rate he's going Kei might not be in the top 8 seeds for RG.;)
 
cc0509 said:
@Meles, more hyping of Thiem and Goffin the spoiler on clay? How many titles will both of these players win during the clay season do you reckon?


How about zero? ;)
Click to expand...
I'd give Thiem a pretty good shot here if its Nadal in the final (over Goffin). Edmund matched up pretty well against Nadal and might trouble a passive Thiem, but hard to see him prevailing. I'd say Thiem and Goffin will make 2 finals between them.
 
helterskelter said:
@Meles

Nadal is going to sweep the clay-court season. He will at the very least win Monte Carlo and Barcelona. He is clear favorite for Roland Garros and Rome, too, and at least slight favorite for Madrid.
Click to expand...

I like how all the Nadal fans are in denial and are saying he's so far gone that he isn't going to win anything ever again. Pretty sure he's getting at least 2 clay court titles this year, if he doesn't sweep all the events he attends until the end of the French Open. More than anything I really hope he gets 10 French Open titles. Funny how a Sampras/Fed fan roots for Nadal more than some of his own fans.
 
xFullCourtTenniSx said:
I like how all the Nadal fans are in denial and are saying he's so far gone that he isn't going to win anything ever again. Pretty sure he's getting at least 2 clay court titles this year, if he doesn't sweep all the events he attends until the end of the French Open. More than anything I really hope he gets 10 French Open titles. Funny how a Sampras/Fed fan roots for Nadal more than some of his own fans.
Click to expand...
tennisaddict said:
When will this hypetrain stop ?

It will be the same old same old - Murray vs Rafa or some Spanish lapdog vs Rafa in the finals and Rafa will win 10 each of Barcelona , MC and RG
Click to expand...
Big 4 fans flock together to some extent.

This is the conventional wisdom. Its been shown to be off the mark in Monte Carlo for 4 of the big 5. I do believe Djokovic played surprisingly well in his defeat to Goffin and his best level in a match since RG final. He's at leasting heading in the right direction. Murray is in trouble and seems to want more match play so he's in this event. He's very far from assured as the only signs of his great play at the end of 2016 was a bit of a spark in the Doha when he was down a set and in trouble in the 2nd. He's lost the plot right now and time is running out on clay. Djokovic faces the same issue and needs a deep run at RG. Federer it appears won't even play on clay. Wawrinka is unpredictable, but clay favors the younger playes and disfavors the older, so time is not on Wawa's side.:oops:

Nadal is far from assurred with his only decisive match against Zverev. He's been playing a fair bit and his team had him pull out of Rotterdam due to wanting him to recover more from Auz. With a tendency towards a few lulls in matches these days, definitely slower movement, and his injury history, Rafa will have to fight more than he'd care too and like last year something may degrade him on the physical front.

The youngest top players seem a natural choice to prosper from this weakness, but as we saw in Monte Carlo much depends on the draw. Players like PCB, ARV, and Cuevas, have done very well this year and may be the ones to harvest the rewards. Pouille did extremely well at Monte Carlo so NextGen already getting some results.
 
Last edited:
Deon Sanders said:
This is the last year he will be able to get direct entry into ATP level tournaments so he is sucking up whatever 1st round money he can before his career is over
Click to expand...
haha. You're right. This is Tomic's trajectory by the end of Wimbledon if he doesn't start competing:
80th Bernard Tomic 24 21.10.1992 960 41 490

He's got a QF at Cincinnati and dropping 180 points with such a low ranking would hammer him down much further.:eek:

Tomic has injury issues, but even at his young age they could be his downfall as he's past his speed prime so his returning will only get worse.:oops:

Nishikori is not in the same situation as Tomic, but injury issues in what should be a peak year may harm his game enough that he's unable to return to his best let alone achieve a new best level once he turns 28 at the end of the year..:confused:
 
Meles said:
Big 4 fans flock together to some extent.

This is the conventional wisdom. Its been shown to be off the mark in Monte Carlo for 4 of the big 5. I do believe Djokovic played surprisingly well in his defeat to Goffin and his best level in a match since RG final. He's at leasting heading in the right direction. Murray is in trouble and seems to want more match play so he's in this event. He's very far from assured as the only signs of his great play at the end of 2016 was a bit of a spark in the Doha when he was down a set and in trouble in the 2nd. He's lost the plot right now and time is running out on clay. Djokovic faces the same issue and needs a deep run at RG. Federer it appears won't even play on clay. Wawrinka is unpredictable, but clay favors the younger playes and disfavors the older, so time is not on Wawa's side.:oops:

Nadal is far from assurred with his only decisive match against Zverev. He's been playing a fair bit and his team had him pull out of Rotterdam due to wanting him to recover more from Auz. With a tendency towards a few lulls in matches these days, definitely slower movement, and his injury history, Rafa will have to fight more than he'd care too and like last year something may degrade him on the physical front.

The youngest top players seem a natural choice to prosper from this weakness, but as we saw in Monte Carlo much depends on the draw. Players like PCB, ARV, and Cuevas, have done very well this year and may be the ones to harvest the rewards. Pouille did extremely well at Monte Carlo so NextGen already getting some results.
Click to expand...

ARV is 29 years and Cuevas 31. So they joined the nextgen ? Great news.
 
tennisaddict said:
ARV is 29 years and Cuevas 31. So they joined the nextgen ? Great news.
Click to expand...
No, but with all the top players dropping like flys on clay or too old to play on clay, somebody has to fill the vacuum.:D In any event Pouille schooled Cuevas and had the momentum against ARV but sadly had an injury issue (Pouille has been fighting some minor issues all season so has been a bit off the radar.) Next.:rolleyes:
 
Meles said:
No, but with all the top players dropping like flys on clay or too old to play on clay, somebody has to fill the vacuum.:D In any event Pouille schooled Cuevas and had the momentum against ARV but sadly had an injury issue (Pouille has been fighting some minor issues all season so has been a bit off the radar.) Next.:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

What next ? The two finalists are 29 and 30. Bottom line - your nextgen sucked one more big tournament
 
tennisaddict said:
What next ? The two finalists are 29 and 30. Bottom line - your nextgen sucked one more big tournament
Click to expand...
What?
-Little Diego gave Rafa a great run for his money and Edmund even more.
-Thiem in fine form and looking for more matches - he's a near shoe in for SF at Barcelona and likely to take out Murray should they meet, very likely should he reach the final to have a chance of taking the Bull down again.
-Goffin not nextgen per se, but clearly entering his peak years and has a likely Rafa rematch in QF here
-Pouille - back from the dead and #1 seed from Budapest and hopefully his back will recover to make a strong showing. 14 in rankings and rising
-Kyrgios - off celebrating his 22 birthday after great Davis Cup and Fed match. He's likely to win Estoril and have momentum for Madrid (ranked 5th in jrankings on clay fyi.;))
-PCB - nearly got Djokovic who he had an awful head to head with and in top 20 now and rising probably into top 15
-Diego has rocketed to 34 in the rankings and will be a great force on clay this year.

They are all doing quite well TA and an even younger bunch is following, but we won't know the standouts for sure, but as stated above 18 year olds Mikael Ymer and Casper Ruud playing Barcelona and might suprise.;)

It must be disheartening for you that Federer is afraid to deal with the Nextgen on clay, but who can blame him after playing Zverev and Thiem back to back in Rome knocked him out of RG last year.:(
 
KINGROGER said:
I wouldn't write off Kyrgios. I can see him playing Madrid and blasting Nadal off the court.
Click to expand...
I am kind of shocked at his ranking on clay in this jrank system:
http://tennisabstract.com/jrank/atp-clay.html

ClayRank Player ClayPoints
1 Novak Djokovic 13615
2 Andy Murray 8451
3 Roger Federer 5159
4 Rafael Nadal 4186
5 Nick Kyrgios 3998
6 Stanislas Wawrinka 3413
7 Kei Nishikori 2609
8 Jo Wilfried Tsonga 2399
9 Milos Raonic 2376
10 Dominic Thiem 1889
11 Alexander Zverev 1574
12 Grigor Dimitrov 1563
13 Jack Sock 1515
14 Richard Gasquet 1464
15 Tomas Berdych 1405
16 Marin Cilic 1390
17 Juan Martin Del Potro 1366
18 Gael Monfils 1238
19 David Goffin 1201
20 Alexandr Dolgopolov 1198
 
Steve0904 said:
He's already worth 10 million. How much more does he need? Greedy baztard. :D
Click to expand...

He's probably blown through $15 million of that $10 million on cars, women, and coke. By this point, he's playing just to stave off bankruptcy as long as possible. I doubt he'll make it to 30 before his debts catch up to him.
 
Wawrinka can lose to anyone in the warmups, but come RG he may well be favorite against anyone but Nadal.

Meles said:
Big 4 fans flock together to some extent.

This is the conventional wisdom. Its been shown to be off the mark in Monte Carlo for 4 of the big 5. I do believe Djokovic played surprisingly well in his defeat to Goffin and his best level in a match since RG final. He's at leasting heading in the right direction. Murray is in trouble and seems to want more match play so he's in this event. He's very far from assured as the only signs of his great play at the end of 2016 was a bit of a spark in the Doha when he was down a set and in trouble in the 2nd. He's lost the plot right now and time is running out on clay. Djokovic faces the same issue and needs a deep run at RG. Federer it appears won't even play on clay. Wawrinka is unpredictable, but clay favors the younger playes and disfavors the older, so time is not on Wawa's side.:oops:

Nadal is far from assurred with his only decisive match against Zverev. He's been playing a fair bit and his team had him pull out of Rotterdam due to wanting him to recover more from Auz. With a tendency towards a few lulls in matches these days, definitely slower movement, and his injury history, Rafa will have to fight more than he'd care too and like last year something may degrade him on the physical front.

The youngest top players seem a natural choice to prosper from this weakness, but as we saw in Monte Carlo much depends on the draw. Players like PCB, ARV, and Cuevas, have done very well this year and may be the ones to harvest the rewards. Pouille did extremely well at Monte Carlo so NextGen already getting some results.
Click to expand...
 
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