Zverev Exsected

Meles

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Some recent statistical study of Zverev has convinced me that he will not conform to normal player development patterns.

Serve Points Won:
Zverev will make rapid progress this year and he's already up big on early hard courts and clay, so the real question is will it continue? How good will Zed be? Let's check the other big players:
-Raonic went from winning 65.4% in 2010 to 70.9% in 2011 and has held pretty steady since peaking at 72.9% in 2015.
-Querrey came on tour at a very young age winning 65.4% and has never really improved rapidly, but has been as high as 68.2%
-Soderling bumped between 18 and 19 never getting all that higher than the 68.2% achieved that year
-Berdych in 2007 went from 65.4% the previous year to a career high of 68.8%
-Del Potro had a slow steady rise and was just 66.4% in 2009

Zverev jumped on clay and early hard this year going from 64.2% to 67.7% (up 3.5% but the year is not over). 67.7% is tracking right along with Kyrgios unless Zverev ups that number even more with further play in 2017.:eek: Kyrgios at two years older nearly leads the tour at 72.4% serve points won this year virtually tie with Isner. It will be hard for Zverev not to make similar progress as all the components of his game improve over the next two years and improve his serve points. Zverev should easily be up around Raonic type numbers at the very least (71%).

Return Games Won:
-This is where Del Potro excelled and he spiked from a class leading 26.5% in 2007 to a phenomenal 32.6% return games won in 2008, but then back to 26.7% in 2009 at age 21.
-Cilic never matched Delpo's excellent 2008, but he was very close in on 2007 and 2009, but since then it's been a general decline, but still always above 20% return games won.
-Querrey peaked by age 21 at 21.1% return games won and it has been a steady decline until 2017 where same currently has a late peak going with 25.5% games won fueled by his great Acapulco run.:eek:
-Raonic has cracked the 20% return game barrier just in the last few years proving that hard work can improve numbers.
-Soderling peaked at age 23 and from age 22 maintained 23.3% games won steadily improving over his last years on tour to 26.6%.

Zverev has been up and down, but so far looks like a worse returning Cilic at the same age. If we were to switch to return points won we'd see how sensitive games won is to points. For Delpo, taking return points from 39% to 42% in 2008 boosted his games won from 26.5% to 32.6%. Cilic fluctuated around 38% with results in the low 20%s for return games won. Zverev was 37.1% last year, but has been a disturbingly low 34.5% so far in 2017.:confused:

Looking at these return numbers Zverev may end up being a lesser return player than Cilic on hard courts. If he doesn't get his numbers up later this year. Zverev is tracking towards post peak Roddick type numbers which may be good enough with a Big 4 free field if Zverev ends up with the best serve game on tour.:confused: Around the US Open and the month beyond last year Zverev got to 41% on points for a stretch. He would be unstoppable if he got to 40% or better on return points with a tour leading serve.:eek: Even 38 or 39% would be tremendous. 2016 ended up at 37.1%.

It's reading tea leaves at this point, but my gut says Zverev will have done well to get around 37% on return points which is on par with current Cilic, but a bit less than Marin's earlier years were around 38%. With his serve numbers expected to be higher than Marin's, Zverev may be a player regularly similar to peak Cilic who won the US Open in 2014. Zverev has shown he can get hot on return, so the combination should be good enough to win quite a few slams as Zverev is equally good on all surfaces.:p It's razor thin margins on return points and this one stat has Zverev on the edge of greatness or being a player little better than Roddick.:confused: It seems we have a statistical Zedbot on our hands who in his best years may play like a slightly more dangerous and dynamic Raonic2016.:oops:
 
Ok, what does that mean? He won't win multiple slams? How does he fare with the Big 3's numbers as reference?
 
Ok, what does that mean? He won't win multiple slams? How does he fare with the Big 3's numbers as reference?
Well he may get Sampras like serve numbers going, so it all depends on Zed getting a statistical semblance of a return game. The alarming thing from this study is that he may not have much upside from his current level. Roddick in his later career was probably 72% serve points won and closer to 35% on return points. Sampras won 38% for his career on return, but was 69.9% on service. If Zverev can pull 71%/37% he's there with Sampras, but I think he's still a little light on return game. 72%/37% puts him squarely above Roddick and he might do quite well (ten slams.) Feddy is 69.5/40.0% so that is a huge difference in return game. If Zed has slam winning numbers with 90's like competition he could do quite well given he's mentally strong.
 
Well he may get Sampras like serve numbers going, so it all depends on Zed getting a statistical semblance of a return game. The alarming thing from this study is that he may not have much upside from his current level. Roddick in his later career was probably 72% serve points won and closer to 35% on return points. Sampras won 38% for his career on return, but was 69.9% on service. If Zverev can pull 71%/37% he's there with Sampras, but I think he's still a little light on return game. 72%/37% puts him squarely above Roddick and he might do quite well (ten slams.) Feddy is 69.5/40.0% so that is a huge difference in return game. If Zed has slam winning numbers with 90's like competition he could do quite well given he's mentally strong.
Thanks. I suspected of the same with those numbers. One more question. When, in terms of their peak/tennis years, did the reference players achieve their peak percentages? Coz zed still has couple of years to mature. That makes me hope he cam improve and transition from the raonic berdych levels to Stan Murray levels?
 
Thanks. I suspected of the same with those numbers. One more question. When, in terms of their peak/tennis years, did the reference players achieve their peak percentages? Coz zed still has couple of years to mature. That makes me hope he cam improve and transition from the raonic berdych levels to Stan Murray levels?
Pete's peak would have been up through 96 and even higher on return. Federer was 41-42% return points on hard courts in his peak years. Roddick hit 38% in 2004 on return.

Murray has a much weaker serve and Stan is basically not consistent enough to compare.

The thing to remember about Zverev versus Sampras or Roddick is that clay is a strong surface for Zed.:p It is going to be a lot easier for him to keep in #1-2 ranking range possibly as early as next year.:D
 
Pete's peak would have been up through 96 and even higher on return. Federer was 41-42% return points on hard courts in his peak years. Roddick hit 38% in 2004 on return.

Murray has a much weaker serve and Stan is basically not consistent enough to compare.

The thing to remember about Zverev versus Sampras or Roddick is that clay is a strong surface for Zed.:p It is going to be a lot easier for him to keep in #1-2 ranking range possibly as early as next year.:D
Thanks. Sorry to bother again. I mean, where in their careers did others make their peak percentage? Is it like right in their best year, for ex. 2006 for Federer? Or is it just before hitting peak? Or just after?... I'm looking at when can zed possibly hit his peak... I'm expecting it between his physical age 23-25 which would be a great transition period from the big 4 to the next gen by about 2020
 
Thanks. Sorry to bother again. I mean, where in their careers did others make their peak percentage? Is it like right in their best year, for ex. 2006 for Federer? Or is it just before hitting peak? Or just after?... I'm looking at when can zed possibly hit his peak... I'm expecting it between his physical age 23-25 which would be a great transition period from the big 4 to the next gen by about 2020
Well Fed hit 72.0% serve points won on hard courts in 2007 with 40.6% on return points. 2006 was 70.0/42.2% for Fed's peak return year. Roddick in 2004 was 72.1%/37.9%. Sampras lost in his best serve and return years (94&97). 93 was 70.5/40.5%, 1995 70.0/38.7%, 1996 72.7%/36.4%.

We can guestimate 1990. Sampras won with only 55.1% of games which would be about 52.5% of points (very low.) In 1991 he was 69.9/39.4% so at US Open he was probably close to that level at end of 1990. Courier straight setted him in QF 1991.:p

Zverev is tall so he should peak earlier. His return may not improve that much more.:( Peak serve may happen as early as 2019 or 2020.

If Zed has a good finish this year on hard courts he may be in the hunt everywhere in 2018.:eek:. With his prowess on clay and grass he might hit number one if he gets to 70.0%/38.0% on hard courts (very possible.) The big player that could really stall him is Murray in particular at the top of the game and of course Nadal on clay.:oops:
 
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I went ahead and looked up excreted - expel · pass · void · discharge · eject · evacuate · defecate · urinate.

I don't know. I'm not sure which one the OP meant, but I've tried substituting Zverev in front of each one of those, but I couldn't see Zverev voided, Zverev defecated, or Zverev unrinated. :D
:rolleyes:
Means cutting out something(to look within; or even if not) . Like cut out and have a deeper view with numbers in this case.
 
Yeah, exsected does not exist outside of a medical or legal terms - means to simply cut out.

Exegeted does - a person skilled in exegesis. Exegesis means - critical explanation of analysis.

Thanks for this. These are both pretty obscure words, even for us native English speakers. Had no idea what the OP was trying to say with his thread title.


<blockquote class="instagram-media" data-instgrm-captioned data-instgrm-version="7" style=" background:#FFF; border:0; border-radius:3px; box-shadow:0 0 1px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.5),0 1px 10px 0 rgba(0,0,0,0.15); margin: 1px; max-width:658px; padding:0; width:99.375%; width:-webkit-calc(100% - 2px); width:calc(100% - 2px);"><div style="padding:8px;"> <div style=" background:#F8F8F8; line-height:0; margin-top:40px; padding:62.5% 0; text-align:center; width:100%;"> <div style=" background:url(data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAACwAAAAsCAMAAAApWqozAAAABGdBTUEAALGPC/xhBQAAAAFzUkdCAK7OHOkAAAAMUExURczMzPf399fX1+bm5mzY9AMAAADiSURBVDjLvZXbEsMgCES5/P8/t9FuRVCRmU73JWlzosgSIIZURCjo/ad+EQJJB4Hv8BFt+IDpQoCx1wjOSBFhh2XssxEIYn3ulI/6MNReE07UIWJEv8UEOWDS88LY97kqyTliJKKtuYBbruAyVh5wOHiXmpi5we58Ek028czwyuQdLKPG1Bkb4NnM+VeAnfHqn1k4+GPT6uGQcvu2h2OVuIf/gWUFyy8OWEpdyZSa3aVCqpVoVvzZZ2VTnn2wU8qzVjDDetO90GSy9mVLqtgYSy231MxrY6I2gGqjrTY0L8fxCxfCBbhWrsYYAAAAAElFTkSuQmCC); display:block; height:44px; margin:0 auto -44px; position:relative; top:-22px; width:44px;"></div></div> <p style=" margin:8px 0 0 0; padding:0 4px;"> <a href="https://www.instagram.com/p/BWv1pF6glFD/" style=" color:#000; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; font-style:normal; font-weight:normal; line-height:17px; text-decoration:none; word-wrap:break-word;" target="_blank">I think you can tell we don&#39;t enjoy track sessions during summer in Florida #brothers #risetogether</a></p> <p style=" color:#c9c8cd; font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; line-height:17px; margin-bottom:0; margin-top:8px; overflow:hidden; padding:8px 0 7px; text-align:center; text-overflow:ellipsis; white-space:nowrap;">A post shared by Alexander Zverev (@alexzverev123) on <time style=" font-family:Arial,sans-serif; font-size:14px; line-height:17px;" datetime="2017-07-19T23:59:57+00:00">Jul 19, 2017 at 4:59pm PDT</time></p></div></blockquote> <script async defer src="//platform.instagram.com/en_US/embeds.js"></script>

And what is this mess? Trying to warp our minds with the thread title and post #20?
 
Thanks for this. These are both pretty obscure words, even for us native English speakers. Had no idea what the OP was trying to say with his thread title.




And what is this mess? Trying to warp our minds with the thread title and post #20?
Testing and didn't realized that was left instead of saying testing
 
So basically the stats conform he is a giraffe and won't win much more than Cilic. Not very promising.
Zed very close to Cilic now, but mentally tougher (not that Cryic is horrible.) His serving looks on track to make him regularly like 2014 US Open Cilic (nts). Zed's return game was around 41% return points for a period from the US Open up through his Ferrer match. Combine those two and it's GOAT time.:D Sadly Zverev made no progress on hard court return so far this year. Then its more like Roddick time.:confused:
 
Zed very close to Cilic now, but mentally tougher (not that Cryic is horrible.) His serving looks on track to make him regularly like 2014 US Open Cilic (nts). Zed's return game was around 41% return points for a period from the US Open up through his Ferrer match. Combine those two and it's GOAT time.:D Sadly Zverev made no progress on hard court return so far this year. Then its more like Roddick time.:confused:
Remember he beat Cilic on clay the day after he he had won that 500 tournament in Germany getting the car.
In my mind I think Sasha would beat Cilic on HC, but that is based on from clay which is not right.
We have no clue what Sasha is up to right now, except training hard. Maybe his new coach could do something w his game.
 
Remember he beat Cilic on clay the day after he he had won that 500 tournament in Germany getting the car.
In my mind I think Sasha would beat Cilic on HC, but that is based on from clay which is not right.
We have no clue what Sasha is up to right now, except training hard. Maybe his new coach could do something w his game.
Cilic won't be much of a problem:rolleyes::
18/2017 R32 Madrid Masters Clay Alexander Zverev Marin Cilic 6-7(3) 6-3 6-4 1.83 - 1.83
40/2016 R32 Shanghai Masters Hard Alexander Zverev Marin Cilic 3-6 6-3 6-2 2.50 - 1.54
5/2016 R16 Montpellier I Hard Alexander Zverev Marin Cilic 7-6(4) 7-6(1) 4.00 - 1.23
32/2015 QF Washington Hard Marin Cilic Alexander Zverev 7-5 7-6(3) 1.16 - 5.20
 
Cilic won't be much of a problem:rolleyes::
18/2017 R32 Madrid Masters Clay Alexander Zverev Marin Cilic 6-7(3) 6-3 6-4 1.83 - 1.83
40/2016 R32 Shanghai Masters Hard Alexander Zverev Marin Cilic 3-6 6-3 6-2 2.50 - 1.54
5/2016 R16 Montpellier I Hard Alexander Zverev Marin Cilic 7-6(4) 7-6(1) 4.00 - 1.23
32/2015 QF Washington Hard Marin Cilic Alexander Zverev 7-5 7-6(3) 1.16 - 5.20
Zverev vs big men servers not his problem :D
Its other types of players we hope 4 Sasha to avoid! Zverev in final Halle he was damn flat, he can do better.
 
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