joe sch
Legend
The Vortex ES rackets provide a extended lenght handle and wider open throat to give more control for the "extreme spin" possible thus the mold is an advantage over the more conventional Wilson racket with the open string pattern.
Vortex Extreme Spin Rackets
- Thread starter BlaackSheeep
- Start date
The Dark Knight
Legend
tlm
G.O.A.T.
At the time they only had the 100, now they have a 95 that I am interested in trying. Plus the racket I used had a stiffness rating of 70 and I try to avoid rackets over 65 stiffness. I also broke a lot of strings quickly with this racket, but I will say I could use about any string and still get huge spin.
tlm
G.O.A.T.
Not true at all I have tried the Wilson spin rackets and that was my biggest complaint is the control was not good and they are string eaters.
The Dark Knight
Legend
My complaint with the Wilson spin racquets was that they did not hit as heavy a ball as the vortex .
Wilson had spin but not the power .
Wilson had spin but not the power .
Maybe i shouldn't have sold it ..I think Vortex has a stigma against it because it's not a "cool" name brand..I got it from a Vortex Rep that lives near me..I didn't even realize it was 28 1/4 inches at the time..But i really liked the extra length on serves and backhand slice/volleys..So if i cut it shorter it maybe it would have worked with my forehand.but not on the other shots (who knows).I'll definetly see the Vortex Rep again this summer and hopefully try the ES 116...But if you look at their facebook a lot of senior tournament 4.5 players use them and they have other smaller players rackets also..I still have the 108 but need to restring it and give it time..Demoing rackets is time consuming because of the stringing..Right now nothing gives me more spin than the 105s
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probably true..my 105s is light has more spin but ok power and i really like the lighter 18g kevlar in the mains..
The Dark Knight
Legend
I had an affair with the 105s ( by the way vortex makes a 108).....I actually at first chose the 105s over the vortex as well.
I found the 105s was more precise but the problem was it just did not hit as heavy as a shot as the vortex .
If you ever go back to vortex I think you should try an Es 108.....I think you will be quite pleased . The 116 may just be too powerful .
The Dark Knight
Legend
So as you know I'm in love with my ES 116 but I cheated on her and I am so sorry
I tried the 133 . Fun racquet but it's no ES 116.
I tried the 133 . Fun racquet but it's no ES 116.
The Dark Knight
Legend
Except for the string pattern ....Donnay has come out with a stick very similar to my ES 116 and the pro 116 .
The reviews are very similar to my findings of ES 116.....here is the tennis magazine review:
The reviews are very similar to my findings of ES 116.....here is the tennis magazine review:
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Sander001
Hall of Fame
TinTin 1
Professional
Where did you find this so fast?
The Dark Knight
Legend
Where did you find this so fast?
I'm going through withdrawal .....I have no one to talk about my vortex with .
Best kept secret ....that's great ! But no one to tell ....that's bad .
Anyway the reason I started writing again is because I figured out how to use the Es 116 and it's just so perfect for my game that I'm speechless.
schenkelini
Semi-Pro
I am starting to have some shoulder issues. I have a Superlite 114 demo on the way. It will be interesting to see if that helps.
The Dark Knight
Legend
Oh wow ....please put a detailed review up!!
Have you ever tried the Vortex ES 116? Because I would be super interested in a comparison .
I can't do a comparison because I'm in Europe for a little while .
schenkelini
Semi-Pro
Yes I have an ES 116 and 2 Pro 116's.
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Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk
schenkelini
Semi-Pro
Actually I received an Superlite 114 that had a huge crack last week. They shipped it in a plastic bag. I was afraid to try it.
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Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk
The Dark Knight
Legend
Really ? Now I'm really excited !!!!! Can't wait for the review .
You are a big tease though because you say that the Donnay has a crack in it . Why not call them up and tell them ? This way if it breaks they won't charge you for it .
In any event can you do a comparison of the ES and pro version ?
Obviously you prefer the pro version as you have two of those .....I'm not sure if it was you but someone here cut the pro down to the same size as the ES.
This same person said he noticed very little difference between the two sticks . I find this puzzling because they are very different .....maybe it's because he cut it down ? The balance would be very different if this were the case .
Would really love a comparison as I've never tried the pro .
The Dark Knight
Legend
schenkelini
Semi-Pro
Yeah that was me
I did call them, but the crack is so bad I didn't want to play with it plus they want me to send it back.
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I did call them, but the crack is so bad I didn't want to play with it plus they want me to send it back.
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schenkelini
Semi-Pro
This is why I didn't want to try it. I just tracked the replacement and it will be here today. I am going to see if I can get someone to hit with me tonight and try it ou.
The Dark Knight
Legend
This is why I didn't want to try it. I just tracked the replacement and it will be here today. I am going to see if I can get someone to hit with me tonight and try it ou.
Wow that's some crack !
Thanks for doing all this ! I'm really looking forward to that review .
I think you may just be the only person who has ever tried all three sticks.
I am a bit surprised that you find the pro to be so similar to the ES.
I spoke to Tom at length about it and he confirms they are vastly different sticks even with the pro cut down .
.
schenkelini
Semi-Pro
My practice partner is out of town, so I am going to hit on my ball machine. I am dying to try it.
The Dark Knight
Legend
Haha ....I know the feeling ....but you can only tell so much from a ball machine :-(
schenkelini
Semi-Pro
It just arrived. This one made the trip without injury. I will hit with it tonight.
The Dark Knight
Legend
Can't wait ! But do me a favor try the ES 116 as well .
The Dark Knight
Legend
So ? How does the Donnay compare ?
By the way something has been really eating at me and I thought I'd share as we are on the topic.....
I have a head Ti6 and I play pretty well with it.....in fact I serve better with this racquet than any other .....but volleys are far inferior to the ES 116 and so are ground strokes .....the maneuverability of the TI6 is pretty poor in comparison .
I could not understand why ? The TI6 is one ounce lighter,one inch smaller , and everything else is identical as well ......so how could the Vortex be more manueverable .
I matched up both sticks side by side and I noticed that the Throats were quite different ....also the head of the vortex was a bit wider and shorter than the TI6.
Anyway I wrote to Tom Olstead the owner of vortex and here is what he had to say :
schenkelini
Semi-Pro
I just sent in back. I wanted to hit with it for a while before I posted. The Superlite 114 came strung with some sort of synthetic gut that felt like it had been in the racquet for a while. I am used to playing with poly so that in itself was an adjustment. The shape of the hoop is narrower and longer than my Vortex ES-116 or Pro 116. It reminds me of the first oversized racquets from the early 80's. The first time I hit with it the racquet made this horiffic ping sound. I didn't have a dampner with me so I was stuck trying to get to where the sound didn't bother me. Once I added a dampner things were much better. I have read reviews of other Xenecore racquets that indicate that the foam usually dampends the ping sound and a dampner is not necessary. That is not the case with this frame. I think it may have something to do with the superlite foam vs the regular foam.
Serve - I found that I was able to get great power and spin from this racquet. Spin was actually easier with this racquet than the Vortex frames. I think the shape of the hoop has something to do with it. I have found over the years that narrow width frames tend to spin easier for me. Power was on par with both Vortex racquets. I am guessing that if strung with poly that the Superlite would play better than the Vortex racquets.
Volley - This racket is a real winner here. I have been trying to learn how to take pace off of volleys that are hit to me really hard. The power of the Vortex racquets usually sends shots like this well long. I found that the foam in this racquet really soaked up the pace and allowed me to either place my volley or make a drop volley. The surprised a lot of my friends who I regularly play with.
Ground Strokes - I found that it was easy to generate pace and spin with this racquet. I notice that the spin was a more loopy spin that with my Vortex racquets using the same swing. It made me feel like I was hitting Rafa shots and gave those I hit to a lot of trouble when I kept the ball close to the baseline. It was a lot of fun. The narrower hoop makes this racquet not as forgiving side to side compard to the the Vortex frames. It seems to have a longer narrower sweet spot which makes it more forgiving top to bottom. While this is a negative, it is not a big negative. I found I had to have a little better footwork to hit the ball well. The Vortex racquets allow me to be a bit lazy at times.
Overall I really like the frame. I could switch to this frame with only minor adjustments to my game. I think that the biggest surprise for me was that this racquet is every bit as spin friendly as the Vortex frames and yet has denser string pattern. I think with a shaped poly it could be off the charts!
I am seriously considering ordering one to add to my bag. I spoke to Bill at Xenecore a number of times. He set me up on a program where I can get a 15% discount for me and my friends.
Serve - I found that I was able to get great power and spin from this racquet. Spin was actually easier with this racquet than the Vortex frames. I think the shape of the hoop has something to do with it. I have found over the years that narrow width frames tend to spin easier for me. Power was on par with both Vortex racquets. I am guessing that if strung with poly that the Superlite would play better than the Vortex racquets.
Volley - This racket is a real winner here. I have been trying to learn how to take pace off of volleys that are hit to me really hard. The power of the Vortex racquets usually sends shots like this well long. I found that the foam in this racquet really soaked up the pace and allowed me to either place my volley or make a drop volley. The surprised a lot of my friends who I regularly play with.
Ground Strokes - I found that it was easy to generate pace and spin with this racquet. I notice that the spin was a more loopy spin that with my Vortex racquets using the same swing. It made me feel like I was hitting Rafa shots and gave those I hit to a lot of trouble when I kept the ball close to the baseline. It was a lot of fun. The narrower hoop makes this racquet not as forgiving side to side compard to the the Vortex frames. It seems to have a longer narrower sweet spot which makes it more forgiving top to bottom. While this is a negative, it is not a big negative. I found I had to have a little better footwork to hit the ball well. The Vortex racquets allow me to be a bit lazy at times.
Overall I really like the frame. I could switch to this frame with only minor adjustments to my game. I think that the biggest surprise for me was that this racquet is every bit as spin friendly as the Vortex frames and yet has denser string pattern. I think with a shaped poly it could be off the charts!
I am seriously considering ordering one to add to my bag. I spoke to Bill at Xenecore a number of times. He set me up on a program where I can get a 15% discount for me and my friends.
The Dark Knight
Legend
Wow thanks !!!! Great review !!!
A couple of comments :
1- serve : what you said makes perfect sense . Everyone you ask about spin will give you a different answer as to what creates more spin.
I have always felt that it is head speed and not the strings . So a very tightly strung racquet will give you more spin because you will be able to swing harder and still keep the ball in .
The Donnay's are great in this regard because they are so thin you can swing the stick harder through the air .
But spin is not the reason I use the ES 116 and I'll get to why I use it a little later .
2-Volley ....here is where I'm going to disagree with you slightly .
First let me say that you play with the pro 116 and I play with the ES 116.
You have said there is little difference . I now have played with both and I could not disagree more . The sticks are vastly different in my opinion and even their measurements are different . Maybe it's because you sawed yours down and that's why they seem so similar ? But basically the ES 116 is far far more powerful and that is what I LOVE and what you dislike .
I agree that on volleys the Vortex is a bit powerful and does send some balls long .....but the power is needed on a far more important shot ......the approach shot !!!!
This is where the Vortex shines ......I need a powerful approach shot to set up the volley . If your the net man in doubles it's a different story ....but I play singles as well and the approach shot is crucial .
Furthermore I am playing outdoors now on red clay.....I desperately need the power of the ES 116 and would not dare to go to a less powered frame .
Having said that ....if you want to take the power away a bit then try string savers .
The second reason I use a vortex has also nothing to do with spin.....but rather the stability .
Match up your vortex with any racquet and you will notice one huge difference .....the throat and the head . If you take a look the throat is much higher & wider than other frames ....the head is also very wide .
The racquet is extremely stable ....so that even off center volleys go over the net.
I'm just able to make the most incredible volleys because the stick is so stable .
Ground strokes ....I don't have any lol. I play like mcenroe and therefore I need the power of the Es 116 ...something the Donnay does not provide .
So in conclusion I am not interested in the Donnay for the exact reasons you are interested ......I want the power of the ES 116 whereas you do not .....but once again try the string savers to lessen the power issue .
Thanks for the feedback .......it really helped me !
**** as far as the ping sound I have not found that to be a problem in any of the Donnay sticks with the exception of the Donnay pro one 16x19 . It also had a weird ping .
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schenkelini
Semi-Pro
I play with both the ES-116 and the Pro. I switch back and forth. It usually depends on the strings and how they feel on a given day. I think the Superlite has a power level similar to the Es-116. I do play mostly doubles and I find the Superlite more controllable at the net.
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The Dark Knight
Legend
Hmm ....a bit confused then because you say
So it seems from this statement that the ES 116 is more powerful than the superlite ? And remember the ES 116 is a LOT more powerful than the pro 116.....the ES is very head heavy, thicker Frame and a wider string pattern.
But there's another reason I'm not interested in the Donnay. I have no problem with shots hit at me .....I'm not looking to make drop volleys as you are ......
Rather I'm looking for the out of reach volleys ....the tough to handle ones .....and that's where the Vortex shines more than any other racquet I have ever played with .
As you said the racquet seems more stable than the Donnay.
I have a Head TIs6 .....almost the exact same measurements as the Vortex.....but I cannot volley nearly as well with the Head ....why?
The answer is the construction of the wide throat and the wide head ......so even off center shots are winners .
I hit the absolute best volleys of my life with this racquet .....I'm talking about really hard to reach ones ....I make volleys that I cannot make with any other racquet .
It is not the strings that impress me about the vortex or the spin .....it's the unbelievable stability .
And you have pretty much said the same even better than I :
This is why I have hit the best volleys and approaches of my life and I will not give that up for anything ......I do not think the vortex can be matched in the stability department .
I respectfully disagree that stability is not a big negative ....for me it is the most important aspect of any racquet.
If your racquet is stable it will not twist.....now on an easy shot or a shot hit at you I agree stability is not a big deal .....but on hard to reach shots it's huge .
I was thinking about the superlite but you saved me a lot of work .....I know the Donnay is not for me .......even though I'm sure the superlite is a great stick and may actually be better than the Vortex for your game .....but not for me .
By the way I believe your review of the superlite is the first and only review on the net ! Congrats !
Note : I asked Tom about tips for serving with th vortex ....he said that because it's so wide you almost have to hit a kick serve to serve big with this stick .
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The Dark Knight
Legend
Xisbum
Semi-Pro
Interesting thread. I have several friends in my Saturday morning group who have switched or are in the process of switching to Vortex. I, however, recently switched from Yonex RQiS 10 to Wilson's new Ultra 103S. Loved the Yonex sticks for topspin potential, but couldn't generate much power. The 103S, however, provides just as much access to topspin and allows you to hit a flat shot when you need to. Read the earlier comments on Wilson's Steam line, but the Ultra feels pretty solid to me. Spinny serves are wicked, sliced backhands just as easy to hit, and volleys are crisp and solid. Took a lot to get me away from Yonex, but the 103S has all the ingredients. I'm a 69-year-old guy in the 3.5-4.0 range, with pretty good mobility still although these days I play mostly dubs. Did play one set of singles this morning, and the ball went pretty much where I wanted it to go. I've tried one of my friend's Vortex sticks, and I still prefer the Wilson. Just my 2 cents, guys.
schenkelini
Semi-Pro
Yes but not the Superlite. I am using the XP-Dual lite. It is the best combination of spin and control of any racquet I have played with. It is very arm friendly too
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Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk
The Dark Knight
Legend
Cool ! I will take a look at it .
The Dark Knight
Legend
Although the Vortex spin potential is great that's not at all why I use it .
What I didn't realize was the unbekievable stability of the racquet .
For example I tried out the head TI s6 and it's about the same size as the vortex but it's lighter .
For some strange reason the vortex was a 100 more times more maneuverable .
I compared the heads of both sticks and notice that the vortex Raquet head is wider than the tis6 but shorter vertically .
I call the owner of vortex and asked him why the vortex is just so maneuverable ?
The answer was that it just seems more maneuverable because the racquet is so stable that my shots were good despite bad stroke mechanics .
It's absolutely the most stable racquet I have ever played with .....I use the ES 116 but it feels as maneuverable as a 90 inch frame .
That's what I see is the greatest advantage of the vortex
The Dark Knight
Legend
I have been playing with different Vortex's throughout the years and I have an opinion of which Vortex is for which person . I have not tried all the sticks but here's my opinion on each :
Vortex ES 116....my holy grail ! I stress the word "MY" because this stick is not for everyone.
If you have a semi western with huge ground strokes clearly this is not the stick for you .
This racquet is by far the most powerful racquet I have ever played with and yet it is unbelievably maneuverable .....as maneuverable I dare say as a 90 inch .
It's meant for a net player who has mediocre ground strokes .
At the net this stick is just a monster . I have never in my life played with a better volley stick in my entire life .
For ground strokes it's great for me as well because I don't hit hard but I hit with precision . The racquet provides the power I need in spades ......I can have a small stroke and still put the ball away.
The serve is where this racquet is really hard to get used to ......it's just so damn powerful .
But once you learn to control the awesome power then you can serve some bombs .
I actually had to serve with a semi west to control the power
Vortex ES 100
this is Vortex's version of the APD. This is a great all around racquet . It does everything very well .
Volleys are awesome with this stick , serves are incredible .
Ground strokes are very good but you will need to provide some power ....but not a lot .
This is a tweener stick and best for a 4.0 all around player .
Vortex Pro 100
A real players stick .....if you have your own power and you are looking for precision then this stick is for you .
This stick does everything very well but it is way too low powered for my game .
I also thought that return of serves were on the weak side with this stick .....this may be due to my skill level I'm not sure.
Vortex ES 108
This racquet is just amazing and I'm sorry I didn't test it more .
At the time I refused to play with anything over a 100 inch head .
It did everything that the Es 100 did just better .
I am very very intrigued with this racquet and it may just be better than my Es 116....I just have not played with the 108 enough.
The ES 116 is just so freaking powerful while the 108 has power in between the 116 and the 100.
I am absolutely dying to give this racquet another test as it may somehow beat out my Es 116 which I LOVE.
Tune in soon for the final conclusion .
vortex Es 133
This racquet is just FUN. You can hit the sickest spins in your life .....it's like magic.
Despite its gigantic size it is unbelievably maneuverable and light .
Volleys are great and if your slow you will be able to get to every ball because it's extra extra long ......vortex will lengthen it even more to an illegal size if you so choose. It's a great volley racquet and second only to the Es 100.
As far as return of serve there is no better racquet on the market now or in the history of tennis . It's just incredible .
Serving was a serious issue ....it's not that maneuverable on the serve and I couldn't reall take a big stroke.
This racquet is meant for the person who does not have a big serve and short swings on ground strokes .....also meant for volleys and doubles specialists who chip and charge or like to play the net .
It's also meant for a slow player ....this stick will get to just about anything and they will extend it past the legal limit if you so choose .
That's all the Vortex's that I have tried .....there are others as well that you should give a try .
Vortex also has some great strings you may be interested in .
Vortex ES 116....my holy grail ! I stress the word "MY" because this stick is not for everyone.
If you have a semi western with huge ground strokes clearly this is not the stick for you .
This racquet is by far the most powerful racquet I have ever played with and yet it is unbelievably maneuverable .....as maneuverable I dare say as a 90 inch .
It's meant for a net player who has mediocre ground strokes .
At the net this stick is just a monster . I have never in my life played with a better volley stick in my entire life .
For ground strokes it's great for me as well because I don't hit hard but I hit with precision . The racquet provides the power I need in spades ......I can have a small stroke and still put the ball away.
The serve is where this racquet is really hard to get used to ......it's just so damn powerful .
But once you learn to control the awesome power then you can serve some bombs .
I actually had to serve with a semi west to control the power
Vortex ES 100
this is Vortex's version of the APD. This is a great all around racquet . It does everything very well .
Volleys are awesome with this stick , serves are incredible .
Ground strokes are very good but you will need to provide some power ....but not a lot .
This is a tweener stick and best for a 4.0 all around player .
Vortex Pro 100
A real players stick .....if you have your own power and you are looking for precision then this stick is for you .
This stick does everything very well but it is way too low powered for my game .
I also thought that return of serves were on the weak side with this stick .....this may be due to my skill level I'm not sure.
Vortex ES 108
This racquet is just amazing and I'm sorry I didn't test it more .
At the time I refused to play with anything over a 100 inch head .
It did everything that the Es 100 did just better .
I am very very intrigued with this racquet and it may just be better than my Es 116....I just have not played with the 108 enough.
The ES 116 is just so freaking powerful while the 108 has power in between the 116 and the 100.
I am absolutely dying to give this racquet another test as it may somehow beat out my Es 116 which I LOVE.
Tune in soon for the final conclusion .
vortex Es 133
This racquet is just FUN. You can hit the sickest spins in your life .....it's like magic.
Despite its gigantic size it is unbelievably maneuverable and light .
Volleys are great and if your slow you will be able to get to every ball because it's extra extra long ......vortex will lengthen it even more to an illegal size if you so choose. It's a great volley racquet and second only to the Es 100.
As far as return of serve there is no better racquet on the market now or in the history of tennis . It's just incredible .
Serving was a serious issue ....it's not that maneuverable on the serve and I couldn't reall take a big stroke.
This racquet is meant for the person who does not have a big serve and short swings on ground strokes .....also meant for volleys and doubles specialists who chip and charge or like to play the net .
It's also meant for a slow player ....this stick will get to just about anything and they will extend it past the legal limit if you so choose .
That's all the Vortex's that I have tried .....there are others as well that you should give a try .
Vortex also has some great strings you may be interested in .
The Dark Knight
Legend
I don't think they make a 103? I think you mean the Wilson?
The Dark Knight
Legend
Anyone try these sticks or have any updates ?
Vortex came out with 2 new stick
The the XF 116 & 125.....anyone try them ? I have the XF 116 on order .
Donnay superlite 114 .....any updates ?
Vortex came out with 2 new stick
The the XF 116 & 125.....anyone try them ? I have the XF 116 on order .
Donnay superlite 114 .....any updates ?
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