CVT Transmissions - Your thoughts

Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
Well this thread is about people’s thoughts on the success or failure of CVT gear boxes.
Companies such as Nissan started putting them into their cars sought of around 2005 instead of the conventional Jatco torque converter units. It went into cars like the Altima, Maxima, Pathfinder and the small car that we call here the Pulsar. Subaru followed with their Outback and Liberty/Legacy models and Mitsubishi and Toyota also produced one however I believe the Toyota one was produced by a Toyota owned factory called Aisin.
The purpose of the CVT was to enhance fuel economy, however I know so many people with say a Nissan Pathfinder and Subaru Outback’s that have had transmission failures as early as 80k on the odometer needing a $12000 dollar repair. Luckily in some instances the manufacturer covered the expense.
I know that Subaru revised their CVT’s in 2018 and the 2023 Nissans have gone to a conventional 9 speed auto, but anyway the purpose of this post is to get some feedback of your experiences if you have owned a car with a CVT. Personally I wouldn’t buy a car with a CVT instead opting for a conventional automatic gear box;
 
J

jimmy8

Legend
2005 to 2022 nissans with cvts failed at 50,000 miles with an expired warranty and owners paying $6000+ for a new transmission. I'm not sure how nissan kept selling cars and how they are still in business. I wouldn't touch a Nissan with a 10 foot pole.

Subarus are pieces of crap, everything falls apart on them. There are so many recalls, I don't know how Subaru still operates. I will never buy a Subaru ever again. My Subaru broke down so many times and cost me so much money, it is a money pit. Don't ever buy Subaru or nissan. Trust me.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
jimmy8 said:
2005 to 2022 nissans with cvts failed at 50,000 miles with an expired warranty and owners paying $6000+ for a new transmission. I'm not sure how nissan kept selling cars and how they are still in business. I wouldn't touch a Nissan with a 10 foot pole.

Subarus are pieces of crap, everything falls apart on them. There are so many recalls, I don't know how Subaru still operates. I will never buy a Subaru ever again. My Subaru broke down so many times and cost me so much money, it is a money pit. Don't ever buy Subaru or nissan. Trust me.
Click to expand...
What’s your favourite go to car brand right now ?
 
D

dkmura

Professional
I'll have to be the contrary voice in this thread. I have a 2007 Nissan Versa, which was my Mom's car for almost seven years. It was the first CVT offered by Nissan for the USDM and has been utterly reliable since the day it was delivered. Yes, it had a CVT fluid change at 60K, and assorted other repairs, but can't complain about what has been essentially a trouble-free experience. After test driving CVTs in a variety of makes and models, I think of them as essentially another form of an automatic transmission.
 
kevin qmto

kevin qmto

Hall of Fame
Hate em. Horrid sounding, complicated and failure prone. and embarrassing when they start adding fake 'shifts' for no reason.

Manual transmissions or bust. If a car doesn't have a manual as an option, you might as well stop talking about it to me, I don't care.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
Really enjoying the comments so far and if you want to expand on your experience with cars over just the CVT issue, please do.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
I’ve been a car enthusiast for many years and owned lots of used cars but never bought a new car and many of the cars I bought were under 8 grand and cheapies.
I always tried to get the lowest kilometre car with the best condition and service history and it’s served me well. Sometimes I’ve made money on a sale but usually got my money back or lost a little, but that’s because by the time I sold the car it would have about 180, 000 on the odometer.
Normally I would buy a car with say either just under 100 k if it was chain driven or just over 100k if the previous owner changed the timing belt. A few times I did do a timing belt change. Nearly all of the cars I bought were from a private sale with say 4 being a dealer and I have owned heaps of cars:
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
What I would like to touch on is the Nissan brand . In Australia up to 1984 they were called Datsuns and then changed to Nissan after that.
During the 1970’s, 1980’s and 1990’s till about 2002 most of the Nissans I had were very good and simply made.
The early Datsun Z cars ( 240z, 260z, 280zx , z31 and to a point Z32) were very roomy, and found cars to own. The Z32 started to become much harder but if you bought the NA you would be mostly OK. The early Nissan skylines with their RB motors were very good and so was the 200sx ( US 240X) we’re great.
Over the years however Nissan seemed to have lost the plot with quality and reliability dropping. The 350Z, 370z and current Z are very cramped cars and not that special,
Australia has gone from 80k sakes yearly to under 20k sakes in a decade and the Infiniti franchise collapsed last year so it’s a pretty sad situation with dealerships closing now.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
The other thing with many car brands is that they have their good and bad models as well as good and bad eras or decades.
To me with the Europeans the good period was when they were simply made. That included the Mercedes W123 period, the BMW E21. E28, E32, E38, the Audi 100 coupe, Volvo 142 coupe and 240 Box car and the old Peugeot 505 and 504. These cars were east to own and fix. After that they got really complex and expensive to keep,
Peugeot went through a borrow period with their 407 series but what I like about the new 508 is that they managed to build a large lift back sedan that weighs around 1420kg with ab1.6 litre turbo that makes 165kw which is pretty ok for a large light car. Most large cars these days are more around 1650kg and obviously need more power and fuel consumption to get the job done.
 
O

optic yellow

Legend
Crocodile said:
What I would like to touch on is the Nissan brand . In Australia up to 1984 they were called Datsuns and then changed to Nissan after that.
During the 1970’s, 1980’s and 1990’s till about 2002 most of the Nissans I had were very good and simply made.
The early Datsun Z cars ( 240z, 260z, 280zx , z31 and to a point Z32) were very roomy, and found cars to own. The Z32 started to become much harder but if you bought the NA you would be mostly OK. The early Nissan skylines with their RB motors were very good and so was the 200sx ( US 240X) we’re great.
Over the years however Nissan seemed to have lost the plot with quality and reliability dropping. The 350Z, 370z and current Z are very cramped cars and not that special,
Australia has gone from 80k sakes yearly to under 20k sakes in a decade and the Infiniti franchise collapsed last year so it’s a pretty sad situation with dealerships closing now.
Click to expand...
you are telling me it is not innovation that excites?
 
kevin qmto

kevin qmto

Hall of Fame
Crocodile said:
I’ve been a car enthusiast for many years and owned lots of used cars but never bought a new car and many of the cars I bought were under 8 grand and cheapies.
I always tried to get the lowest kilometre car with the best condition and service history and it’s served me well. Sometimes I’ve made money on a sale but usually got my money back or lost a little, but that’s because by the time I sold the car it would have about 180, 000 on the odometer.
Normally I would buy a car with say either just under 100 k if it was chain driven or just over 100k if the previous owner changed the timing belt. A few times I did do a timing belt change. Nearly all of the cars I bought were from a private sale with say 4 being a dealer and I have owned heaps of cars:
Click to expand...
My dad is probably the polar opposite of you, but not in a bad way. He only bought a used car for the first time in the last year or so. Let me explain. He's the type of guy who NEVER sells a car, unless its to a family member, or the scrap heap. He buys a new car, then drives it until its no longer reliable for daily use. And not a moment before. And As a result, at the age of 64, my father has owned a grand total of 5. FIVE cars in his entire adult life.

they were:
(before 1982, when he needed a car, he used my grandparents cars, or his great aunt's 1963 Buick Special sedan, which he always told me he hated...)

1982 Honda Accord
1985 Toyota Celica (gave the accord to my mom)
1990 Toyota Corolla (was my moms daily, then his after rust made the Celica not pass inspection around 2005, then mine briefly but I sold it for 400 in 2013)
2009 Scion xD (sold to my older brother, who then crashed it...)
2015 Toyota Rav4 - current car.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
kevin qmto said:
My dad is probably the polar opposite of you, but not in a bad way. He only bought a used car for the first time in the last year or so. Let me explain. He's the type of guy who NEVER sells a car, unless its to a family member, or the scrap heap. He buys a new car, then drives it until its no longer reliable for daily use. And not a moment before. And As a result, at the age of 64, my father has owned a grand total of 5. FIVE cars in his entire adult life.

they were:
(before 1982, when he needed a car, he used my grandparents cars, or his great aunt's 1963 Buick Special sedan, which he always told me he hated...)

1982 Honda Accord
1985 Toyota Celica (gave the accord to my mom)
1990 Toyota Corolla (was my moms daily, then his after rust made the Celica not pass inspection around 2005, then mine briefly but I sold it for 400 in 2013)
2009 Scion xD (sold to my older brother, who then crashed it...)
2015 Toyota Rav4 - current car.
Click to expand...
Yes my dad was the same. In his time in Australia he only owned maybe 3 cars and 2 were brand new and the third was 1 year old. They were:
1964 EK Holden Hydromatic station wagon
1972 VH Chrysler Valiant Station Wagon 245 Hemi
1987 Holden Commodore VL Executive 3.0l Nissan motor
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
optic yellow said:
Idk how they market in Australia but that was the slogan they drilled into the heads of American audiences.
Click to expand...
The started going plastic here in 1984 when they released the Australian made VK Commodore and Ford XF Falcon.
Meanwhile the Classic Car culture is very popular here with lots of car clubs and cars and and coffee mornings or evenings. There seems to be quite a few categories:
1. Aussie classics
2. American classics
3. Euro and Brit classics
4. Japanese classics and JDM grey imports
5. Custom groups
6. Historic racing
7. Exotic cars
8. Kit cars
9. Emerging trend courtesy of Hub-nut, Ian Seabrook and Steph, I drive a classic - the unexceptional old cars - growing group because you can get into classic motoring at a cheaper and more affordable price point. I enjoy their YouTube channels,
 
Mr.Lob

Mr.Lob

G.O.A.T.
My thought was that manufacturers first went to CVTs to meet federal government guidelines for higher mpg cars. As well as for marketing purposes with manufacturers touting higher mpg versus their competion. I Googled which is less expensive for a manufacturer to produce, a CVT or conventional automatic transmission, but could not find any info. I expect a cvt is cheaper to make. But, my understanding is they cannot be taken apart and repaired when defective, the whole cvt unit needs to be removed and replaced with a new cvt.

I have a 2020 Honda Accord EX-L. It has the CVT. It is responsive and smooth. A bit of drone noise at lower rpm's, but nothing bothersome. I bought an extended warranty because CVTs are fairly new to the Honda Accord (first appeared in the 2018 model) as well as the fact it has a turbocharger.

CVT's seem to be the future, as more and more manufacturers are going to them. My preference is to have the most reliable transmission, because whichever you have, they are expensive to repair/replace. So keep up with you fluid changes and maintenance.
 
LuckyR

LuckyR

Legend
kevin qmto said:
Hate em. Horrid sounding, complicated and failure prone. and embarrassing when they start adding fake 'shifts' for no reason.

Manual transmissions or bust. If a car doesn't have a manual as an option, you might as well stop talking about it to me, I don't care.
Click to expand...

I agree for my personal car, though autos are a mature technology that you shouldn't fear. Of course, newer iterations can have growing pains, as this one likely is doing.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
Mr.Lob said:
My thought was that manufacturers first went to CVTs to meet federal government guidelines for higher mpg cars. As well as for marketing purposes with manufacturers touting higher mpg versus their competion. I Googled which is less expensive for a manufacturer to produce, a CVT or conventional automatic transmission, but could not find any info. I expect a cvt is cheaper to make. But, my understanding is they cannot be taken apart and repaired when defective, the whole cvt unit needs to be removed and replaced with a new cvt.

I have a 2020 Honda Accord EX-L. It has the CVT. It is responsive and smooth. A bit of drone noise at lower rpm's, but nothing bothersome. I bought an extended warranty because CVTs are fairly new to the Honda Accord (first appeared in the 2018 model) as well as the fact it has a turbocharger.

CVT's seem to be the future, as more and more manufacturers are going to them. My preference is to have the most reliable transmission, because whichever you have, they are expensive to repair/replace. So keep up with you fluid changes and maintenance.
Click to expand...
Yes I was just thinking about this as I was going for a walk in -1 Celsius on the East coast of Australia just this morning.
What I was thinking of was that when I was around 18 ( which was in the late 80’s) I bought my first car. It was a 1973 Holden Torana 6 cylinder with a carburettor for $1000. The thing about this car was that I could pretty much work on it myself for most basic things like change leads, spark plugs and fan belts, radiators and generators/alternators. Things like brakes and tuning and transmission service could be done by my friendly local mechanic and it was cheap. Parts were plentiful so you could own this car for decades. The main concern was rust repairs.
Yes there were some disadvantages for the time and that was that the cars would need tuning and you had to use a manual choke in the morning on a cold start and sometimes when the car was really hot it would suffer vapour lock, but on the whole you could manage this yourself,
In the 1980’s things improved and some 70’s cars as well came with fuel injection which did away needing a choke and cold and hot starting problems were by and large a thing of the past. Disc brakes all round started to appear in some cars.
Then in the 90’s safety became more prominent with air bags, ABS and passive safety features. Some European cars became more complex such as BMW, Audi and Mercedes and you could see them becoming harder to work on and more expensive to keep. The exception was Volvo with their 240 range and you see them running reliably even today. Australian cars also remained relatively low tech so they were easy to keep long term along with some Toyotas and Mitsubishi’s.
I would say that this low tech, maintain at the local garage probably lasted till about 2006 - 2008 and after that I feel things really changed.
Now if you look at the EV’s and other modern cars you and your local mechanic can’t touch them. So a $200 service at your local garage is now a $1500 service at the dealer and the software in your car control everything. I don’t like this direction at all and I’m keen to support a brand that offers a freedom concept with their cars.
Looking back, probably the 1990’s to 2006 are peak motoring.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
Interesting comparing the history of the once Australian made car industry to other makes around the world.
Apart from the RHD that we share with the UK, NZ and Japan Australian cars were kind of based on either US, Japanese or German models and adapted to Australian tastes and conditions. The brands that were made in Australia were mainly:
1. Holden - GM
2. Ford
3. Chrysler
Then we had other brands that were designed overseas but assembled here at various times including:
1. Nissan
2. Toyota
3. Mitsubishi
4. Leyland
5. Volvo
Chrysler was sold off to Mitsubishi around 1979.
However now there is no local production and all cars are imported. Most popular imported brands for private buyers have been Toyota, Mazda, Hyundai and Kia.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
Interesting development in the JDM scene in Australia is the resurgence of young guys wanting to buy station wagons instead of an SUV. Right now you can buy a high performance sporty wagon that has the motor of some sports cars ( sort of almost ) for a much cheaper price. They seem to be quite cool and include:
1. Nissan Stagea
2. Mitsubishi Legnum
3. Toyota Caldina
Other JDM cars people are importing are sleeper cars and oddities such as;
1. Toyota Crown
2. Nissan Fuga
3 Toyota Chaser
4. Nissan Figaro
5. Nissan Cube
6. Toyota Century
Many of the 90’s and 80’s JDM’s are drying up, or in poor condition or too expensive but there are a few that you might be able to snatch up such as:
1.Mitsubishi FTO and Galant VR4
2. Nissan Z31 300z and V35 and V36 skylines from the next decade
3.Mitsubishi GTO NA SR AWD unicorn
4. Subaru SVX
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
Has anyone bought a 1971 Opel GT or Datsun 240z -280z - 280zx 2 seater turbo. Which is the best state to find a good one at a good price ?
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
One of the most underrated used cars in Australia that you can buy cheap is the 2005 to 2008 Mitsubishi 380 with the 6G75 3.8 litre motor. Excellent car, very reliable for an Australian made car with the only downside is that it’s FWD and likes a drink. A very rare version called a TMR ( 20 built) came with a sprinter super charger which boasted power to 230kw, but that’s through the front wheels, so there must be some torque steer there. In the US the body shape was called the Galant,
 
D

dkmura

Professional
Crocodile said:
Has anyone bought a 1971 Opel GT or Datsun 240z -280z - 280zx 2 seater turbo. Which is the best state to find a good one at a good price ?
Click to expand...
The early Z cars are rising in value. The ones in the best condition are in Cali, but pricing is another matter. To get a great price, you'll need to search high and low to get a barn find.
 
Subway Tennis

Subway Tennis

Legend
I drive an older Nissan import that I absolutely love. I am pretty loyal to the brand because I’ve never had a bad experience.

In regards to CVT, when I was shopping around for my current car I was told to avoid the CVT sedan version, which had a reputation for failure and very expensive repair costs. For this reason I have become wary of CVT technology in general in 10-20 year old cars, perhaps unfairly.

My view of CVT is based on older implementations. I imagine the modern versions with current day management systems are completely different in terms of longterm reliability, and the repair costs are probably defrayed substantially by pretty crazy efficiency gains.
 
D

dkmura

Professional
Subway Tennis said:
I drive an older Nissan import that I absolutely love. I am pretty loyal to the brand because I’ve never had a bad experience.

In regards to CVT, when I was shopping around for my current car I was told to avoid the CVT sedan version, which had a reputation for failure and very expensive repair costs. For this reason I have become wary of CVT technology in general in 10-20 year old cars, perhaps unfairly.

My view of CVT is based on older implementations. I imagine the modern versions with current day management systems are completely different in terms of longterm reliability, and the repair costs are probably defrayed substantially by pretty crazy efficiency gains.
Click to expand...
Since my '07 Versa is the oldest CVT in modern Nissan history, I have to report that while it's been reliable, there haven't been any "crazy" efficiency gains. This hatchback has always been around the 24-26 MPG area in city driving and can get 33-39 MPG on the highway. Nissan has refined the Xtronic CVT a few times to cut pumping losses, but since they also went with a 1.6-liter engine (mine is the 1.8), it's hard to tell which component was more responsible for increased mileage.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
optic yellow said:
wydm by this
Click to expand...
What I’m asking is whether people in the US are prepared to travel to other parts of the country to buy a car.
Would a car for sale in say Arizona be more rust free example then say in a different state and would you hunt down a car from there.
Also are the same cars priced differently in different states. Here in Australia I have found that cars are cheaper in Perth then say Sydney or Melbourne
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
dkmura said:
Since my '07 Versa is the oldest CVT in modern Nissan history, I have to report that while it's been reliable, there haven't been any "crazy" efficiency gains. This hatchback has always been around the 24-26 MPG area in city driving and can get 33-39 MPG on the highway. Nissan has refined the Xtronic CVT a few times to cut pumping losses, but since they also went with a 1.6-liter engine (mine is the 1.8), it's hard to tell which component was more responsible for increased mileage.
Click to expand...
I now one lady who just had her CVT replaced by the dealer ( at no cost to her). It was a 2013 Nissan Pathfinder with just over a 100k. Another person had his 2017 Subaru Outback get a new CVT at 80,000km. These gearboxes are about 12k AU to replace.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
With Nissan they used to be one of my favourite brands, especially from the 1960’s all the way up to the 1990’s and till about 2002 and when they merged with Renault I think Nissan’s quality dropped.
Nissans were even made locally here in Australia with the R31 Skylines and later Pintara’s but it was the Z cars coming from Japan that were well regarded, the pulsar ( which is probably called the Sentra in the US), the 200sx ( not the same as the US 240SX or 180SX as sold in the US and Japan respectively and the imported Maxima till about 2003.
 
Crocodile

Crocodile

G.O.A.T.
A lot of JDM grey imports came to Australia in the 2000’s which included 1990’s Nissan 300zx TT known as the Fairlady z, in both 2 seater and 2+2 and various Skyline models R32, R33, R34 and more recently the V35 350gt. People even imported the Nissan Figaro, so Nissan had some interesting cars from the 1990’s.
 
O

optic yellow

Legend
Crocodile said:
What I’m asking is whether people in the US are prepared to travel to other parts of the country to buy a car.
Would a car for sale in say Arizona be more rust free example then say in a different state and would you hunt down a car from there.
Also are the same cars priced differently in different states. Here in Australia I have found that cars are cheaper in Perth then say Sydney or Melbourne
Click to expand...
Others can answer too but yes generally people are willing to travel at least a bit if they find a used car that really interests them.
 
Mongolmike

Mongolmike

Hall of Fame
Hate CVTs.
My last manual trans was in the 1994 Ford Ranger pickup I sold in 2004? Bought a Toyota Rav4 with automatic. Had for 10 years, bought an Audi A3 with automatic. Just traded it in for another Toyota...but this time, with a 6 spd manual. Almost 20 years since I drove a stick, just like riding a bike. No issues, fun, but a huge difference between a manual (even if shifted well), and today's current automatics. Wow. Car technology has come a long, long way.

On the other hand, my wife could drive a CVT and not bat an eye. She too can drive a stick, but for her, cars are only meant for safe transport. Wouldn't matter to her if her transmission was a CVT, an automatic, or Harry Potter magic. What type of transmission would be far down on her list of concerns.
 
Azure

Azure

G.O.A.T.
Crocodile said:
Yes I was just thinking about this as I was going for a walk in -1 Celsius on the East coast of Australia just this morning.
What I was thinking of was that when I was around 18 ( which was in the late 80’s) I bought my first car. It was a 1973 Holden Torana 6 cylinder with a carburettor for $1000. The thing about this car was that I could pretty much work on it myself for most basic things like change leads, spark plugs and fan belts, radiators and generators/alternators. Things like brakes and tuning and transmission service could be done by my friendly local mechanic and it was cheap. Parts were plentiful so you could own this car for decades. The main concern was rust repairs.
Yes there were some disadvantages for the time and that was that the cars would need tuning and you had to use a manual choke in the morning on a cold start and sometimes when the car was really hot it would suffer vapour lock, but on the whole you could manage this yourself,
In the 1980’s things improved and some 70’s cars as well came with fuel injection which did away needing a choke and cold and hot starting problems were by and large a thing of the past. Disc brakes all round started to appear in some cars.
Then in the 90’s safety became more prominent with air bags, ABS and passive safety features. Some European cars became more complex such as BMW, Audi and Mercedes and you could see them becoming harder to work on and more expensive to keep. The exception was Volvo with their 240 range and you see them running reliably even today. Australian cars also remained relatively low tech so they were easy to keep long term along with some Toyotas and Mitsubishi’s.
I would say that this low tech, maintain at the local garage probably lasted till about 2006 - 2008 and after that I feel things really changed.
Now if you look at the EV’s and other modern cars you and your local mechanic can’t touch them. So a $200 service at your local garage is now a $1500 service at the dealer and the software in your car control everything. I don’t like this direction at all and I’m keen to support a brand that offers a freedom concept with their cars.
Looking back, probably the 1990’s to 2006 are peak motoring.
Click to expand...
Interesting. My dad says the same about motorbikes. He was quite an enthusiast. He used to maintain his bikes all by himself…could take it all apart and put them together and would do all the service and maintenance himself. With today’s new motorbikes they are so complex that you are reliant on only the experts doing some of the routine stuff that should be manageable by a local mechanic. I am sure he has the same thing to say about cars too.
 
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