Had he controlled his temper, could John McEnroe have won the 1990 Australian Open?

[helterskelter]

McEnroe rolled through the opening three rounds, and I think many observers thought he was playing the best tennis of the event. It is worthy of note that both Ivan Lendl and, even more so, Stefan Edberg significantly raised their games in week two.

When McEnroe was disqualified, he was leading Pernfors 6-1 4-6 7-5 2-4. Given the scoreline, McEnroe probably should have closed it out eventually, whether in four sets or five, even though he was playing below par that day.

He'd have played Noah in the quarter-finals. McEnroe would have been favorite. Not a gimme, but this GS event was the only one other than 1983 Roland Garros at which Noah made the semis.

He'd have played Lendl in the semis. Clearly, McEnroe's record against Lendl in later years was not good. But I think observers at the time thought McEnroe playing well enough to challenge Lendl at least. As I said, Lendl raised his game. So, this is the big obstacle.

He'd have played Edberg in the final. Edberg was by then playing even better than Lendl and I'm confident he'd have won the final (against either Lendl or McEnroe) but for his torn stomach muscle. However, the tear occurred towards the end of his semi against Wilander, so Edberg might not have been able to finish the match.

I suppose my view is that McEnroe would most likely have lost narrowly against Lendl, but I do think this was a big opportunity for him.

 

[jrepac]

I think Lendl was playing a bit better than Mac in '90, yet he was not at peak levels either. Would expect Ivan in 4 sets over Mac. From '89 to '92 Mac's form was a bit erratic, unfortunately. Flashes of brilliance followed by fizzles. BTW, Edberg got screwed. I definitely picked him over Ivan. Was bummed when the match was scuttled.

 

[NicoMK]

Unfortunately it's impossible to rewrite history. Nice topic but I can't see 1990 Mac win over 1990 Ivan. Might be wrong though but we will never know. I wanted to vote "butterfly effect" which was nice but I chose: defeat in 4 against Lendl.

 

[martinezownsclay]

Didn't McEnroe lose almost every match vs Lendl from 85 U.S Open onwards. Yeah I don't see him beating Lendl in the semis, if he gets that far. Lendl really only beat Edberg in the final since Edberg got injured, but that in no way means an aged McEnroe, who had become Lendl's pigeon for years by then, could have ever beaten him.

 

[BTURNER]

It had been 3.5 years since his last slam wim and every one of those matches is 3 out of 5. I have a tough time seeing someone in this scenario win match after match for two solid weeks on this particular rubberized, sticky moderately slow hard court in Aussie heat. He's got physical, mental and emotional challenges to overcome as well as the inevitable flickering confidence when all these big points show up round after round. Its not so much any specific match, as the accumulation of mental pressure, the physical demands of court time, and real match tough play at this Olympian level of play that will do him in. He's just not had that kind of consistency in play for rd after rd over two weeks in his pocket. He can't afford any letdowns, or patchy play in that second week.

 

[BGod]

No. Lendl in 4, maybe 5. Mac was past winning Slams and even a gift draw would see him fumble somewhere late. He was beaten in straight by Lendl just the year prior albeit with two tiebreaks. His best shot at a Slam post 85 was likely 90 USO if he somehow beats Pete with guile.

 

[martinezownsclay]

No. Lendl in 4, maybe 5. Mac was past winning Slams and even a gift draw would see him fumble somewhere late. He was beaten in straight by Lendl just the year prior albeit with two tiebreaks. His best shot at a Slam post 85 was likely 90 USO if he somehow beats Pete with guile.

Yeah, and Agassi played such a wretched final, that even a past it McEnroe probably had a shot if he played a bit better than he did in his actual semi final with Sampras. Plus Agassi being a pretty nervy player in big matches at that point. Even if in a regular tour or even regular slam match that wasn't the final Agassi would be a clear favorite over McEnroe at that point.

 

[big ted]

i remember watching that tournament at the time and they were saying things like mcenroe was playing
the best tennis of the tournament so far (he was playing well but maybe they were just hyping him for ratings lol)...
that said, if he was having so much trouble with pernfors i dont think he could have beaten lendl if he got thru that one..

 

[martinezownsclay]

(he was playing well but maybe they were just hyping him for ratings lol)...

Bingo, bingo!

What would be more accurate is he might have been playing his own best tennis in a few years. That might have been accurate.

 

[jrepac]

Bingo, bingo!

What would be more accurate is he might have been playing his own best tennis in a few years. That might have been accurate.

Mac had flashes of brilliance in '89, '90 and '92. But nowhere near his glory days levels

 

[Raul_SJ]

McEnroe rolled through the opening three rounds, and I think many observers thought he was playing the best tennis of the event. It is worthy of note that both Ivan Lendl and, even more so, Stefan Edberg significantly raised their games in week two.

When McEnroe was disqualified, he was leading Pernfors 6-1 4-6 7-5 2-4. Given the scoreline, McEnroe probably should have closed it out eventually, whether in four sets or five, even though he was playing below par that day.

He'd have played Noah in the quarter-finals. McEnroe would have been favorite. Not a gimme, but this GS event was the only one other than 1983 Roland Garros at which Noah made the semis.

He'd have played Lendl in the semis. Clearly, McEnroe's record against Lendl in later years was not good. But I think observers at the time thought McEnroe playing well enough to challenge Lendl at least. As I said, Lendl raised his game. So, this is the big obstacle.

He'd have played Edberg in the final. Edberg was by then playing even better than Lendl and I'm confident he'd have won the final (against either Lendl or McEnroe) but for his torn stomach muscle. However, the tear occurred towards the end of his semi against Wilander, so Edberg might not have been able to finish the match.

I suppose my view is that McEnroe would most likely have lost narrowly against Lendl, but I do think this was a big opportunity for him.

Was Mac still doing coke at this time?

 

[big ted]

I suppose my view is that McEnroe would most likely have lost narrowly against Lendl, but I do think this was a big opportunity for him.

btw that one DQ really put macs career back in a tailspin..he worked his way back to #4 up to that point
but after that and i think a suspension it took him about 8 months to get his head back together and start
playing decent again which was at the USO


John McEnroe - Disqualified From Grand Slam For Verbal Abuse Of Umpire - YouTube

 

[Karma Tennis]

Loved watching McEnroe but he was well past it by 1990. No chance of getting through both Lendl and Edberg on Rebound Ace.
If it had been Grass he probably would have made the Final but Edberg would have creamed him.

 

[flanker2000fr]

My answer is no. By 1990 Lendl would clearly have had the wood over him. Edberg too, if not for injury.

 

[80s New Wave]

As alluded to already Lendl pretty much owned McEnroe at this point so I can't see McEnroe beating him here on a relatively slow HC. Honestly not sure Mac would have even closed out pernfors. For whatever reason pernfors played a horrible first set but after that the match was basically even.

 

[Rattler]

Had he controlled his temper, he’d have ended his career with a few more major titles.

 

[Karma Tennis]

Had he controlled his temper, he’d have ended his career with a few more major titles.

If he had got really really angy at Roland Garros in 1994, completely lost his temper ... perhaps he would have won that French Open Title he craved so much.

 

[jrepac]

Had he controlled his temper, he’d have ended his career with a few more major titles.

I'm not so sure about that. I mean, where did he lose a GS final due to his temper? Never really.

 

[big ted]

I'm not so sure about that. I mean, where did he lose a GS final due to his temper? Never really.

maybe FO '84 final? having a 2 set lead that deteriorated after a spat with a camera person SMH...
who knows for sure tho....

 

[Rattler]

I'm not so sure about that. I mean, where did he lose a GS final due to his temper? Never really.

I know legend has it that he played better angry…I’m not sure I agree that happened every time he was angry on court. He is incredibly talented, truly gifted by God. The ‘84 French is the most obvious example, but how many times has his anger derailed him in the earlier rounds? Aussie Open ‘90 (defaulted) springs to mind

 

[Waves]

Mac…Mac…Mac… if he had Edbergs or Borgs demeanour he would’ve been the goat. Lots of sports allow anger to translate into some kind of performance advantage, but tennis ain’t one of them.

 

[max_brat]

I'm not so sure about that. I mean, where did he lose a GS final due to his temper? Never really.

You're absolutely right. The '84 French had more to do with him nearly collapsing due to heat stroke. Richard Evans, the famous tennis writer, wrote in his '90 biography of McEnroe that Mac asked him to feel his head in the Queens Club bar a few days after that final, and it was still hot.

To be fair, Lendl was also on his last legs, as he vomited before the trophy presentation, and after having a conversation with a friend in the locker room after the match, said to the same friend days later when the friend told him he looked sick after the match, "What are you on about? You weren't even in Paris."

 

[BumElbow]

No. McEnroe's game was not as effective by 1990. His Continental forehand was outdated. When McEnroe threw a tantrum it was usually a sign that he was losing.

 

[GuyForget]

not a chance in hell

 

[buscemi]

I don't see the outcome as much different from the McEnroe/Lendl QF in 1989, which Ivan won 7-6, 6-2, 7-6. Maybe McEnroe could have extended it to four sets, but that's it.

 

[GuyForget]

hadn't reached SF of a non-grass slam since 85, + only 1 in total at that point + zero track record in Oz, + with his temper +fairness, doubt he liked the heat either

 

[jrepac]

I think Mac would have had a better shot vs. Edberg than Lendl at the AO. Both being S&V players, playing on a surface that tended to neutralize their skills somewhat. Would've come down to who was serving better that day; Mac was superior from the back court, IMHO, so it could have been interesting.

 

[tennistiger]

The other point is that if Noah would have defeated Lendl in te SF he would have won the AO 1990 against an injured Edberg!

 

[buscemi]

The other point is that if Noah would have defeated Lendl in te SF he would have won the AO 1990 against an injured Edberg!

Noah had a nice run on hard courts from Indian Wells 1989-Australian Open 1990:

-Made the 1989 Indian Wells final, beating Agassi along the way before losing a five set final to Mecir.​

-Made the 1989 Lipton SF, losing a five set SF to Muster.​

-Made the 1989 U.S. Open QF before losing to Becker.​

-Won 1990 Sydney just before the Australian Open, straight setting Lendl along the way.​

-And then of course made the Australian Open SF before losing to Lendl.​

I remember there being something in John Feinstein's book "Hard Courts" about the 1990 tennis season in which Lendl intimated that he was holding back in the Sydney match before taking it to Noah at the Australian Open.

 

[Vincent-C]

As alluded to already Lendl pretty much owned McEnroe at this point so I can't see McEnroe beating him here on a relatively slow HC. Honestly not sure Mac would have even closed out pernfors. For whatever reason pernfors played a horrible first set but after that the match was basically even.

Pernfors could grind so many players down.. likely including Mac, by that point.

 

[Mustard]

Lendl would have beaten him if McEnroe had made it that far.

 

[buscemi]

Pernfors could grind so many players down.. likely including Mac, by that point.

Still remember Pernfors rising from the ashes in the summer of 1993 to win the Canadian Open and lose that epic U.S. Open match against Wilander, who himself had risen from retirement.

 

[Vincent-C]

Still remember Pernfors rising from the ashes in the summer of 1993 to win the Canadian Open and lose that epic U.S. Open match against Wilander, who himself had risen from retirement.

I only saw Pernfors live once, but it was very up close against a shot-making player from USC, played at UCLA. Jorge Lozano won the first set in a walk; there was some struggle in the second, then it was all Pernfors after that. I was impressed. Todd Witsken's returning and great court sense at that event made a big impression, too.

 

[Mustard]

Mikael Pernfors famously blew 6-1, 6-1, 4-1, and 6-1, 6-1, 5-7, 3-0 leads against Jimmy Connors in their 1987 Wimbledon fourth round match, but I don't think that Pernfors actually choked in the match at all. It was more Connors' dogged determination, while Pernfors continued to play pretty well.

 

[buscemi]

Mikael Pernfors famously blew 6-1, 6-1, 4-1, and 6-1, 6-1, 5-7, 3-0 leads against Jimmy Connors in their 1987 Wimbledon fourth round match, but I don't think that Pernfors actually choked in the match at all. It was more Connors' dogged determination, while Pernfors continued to play pretty well.

His second blown 2 set lead on grass in close succession, the other being in (essentially) the deciding match of the 1986 Davis Cup final against Cash.

 

[Mustard]

His second blown 2 set lead on grass in close succession, the other being in (essentially) the deciding match of the 1986 Davis Cup final against Cash.

To be fair, prior to losing to Connors, Pernfors had beaten Tim Mayotte from 2 sets down in the previous round.

 

[NicoMK]

Still remember Pernfors rising from the ashes in the summer of 1993 to win the Canadian Open and lose that epic U.S. Open match against Wilander, who himself had risen from retirement.

I relever this match as if it was yesterday... had nothing against Pernfors but I was so happy to see Mats on court again, after his two-year hiatus... it was of course way before the internet times so it was very difficult to have relevant news, and I was so thrilled!

 

[NicoMK]

Noah had a nice run on hard courts from Indian Wells 1989-Australian Open 1990:

-Made the 1989 Indian Wells final, beating Agassi along the way before losing a five set final to Mecir.​

-Made the 1989 Lipton SF, losing a five set SF to Muster.​

-Made the 1989 U.S. Open QF before losing to Becker.​

-Won 1990 Sydney just before the Australian Open, straight setting Lendl along the way.​

-And then of course made the Australian Open SF before losing to Lendl.​

Very interesting. I had never noticed it before. Quite a nice run indeed, too bad he suddenly lost any interest in the game after his 1990 AO run, as he himself explained.

 

[recreationalplayer]

Regardless of what J. Mc could have done he got exactly what he deserved. Rehashing his tantrums decades later is like beating a dead horse. He's anchored forever where he is in history.

 

[GuyForget]

I think u meant 1980 Australian open

 

[insideoutforehands]

I would guess he almost certainly doesn't get by Lendl. Yes he was playing some of his best tennis at this stage of his career (the clearly past his prime one), but if he couldn't win any big matches vs Lendl anymore by 85 or 87, he isn't doing it in 1990 IMO. Yes Lendl was lucky Edberg who looked in scintillating form prior, got injured, but that doesn't mean an old McEnroe can beat him. Mcenroe won only 1 of his final 11 matches with Lendl btw. They also met at the Australian Open the previous year, and Lendl won in straight sets, albeit with 2 tiebreaks.

I do agree this was one of his best late career opportunities, but it still wasnt a great one.

 

[AndrewUtz]

Regardless of what J. Mc could have done he got exactly what he deserved. Rehashing his tantrums decades later is like beating a dead horse. He's anchored forever where he is in history.

True, goes down as having the best touch of any player ever in my opinion. Beethoven played the piano, Mcenroe played the Dunlop Max 200g. His 1984 season is still to this day untouchable imo.

 

[Torben]

I would guess he almost certainly doesn't get by Lendl. Yes he was playing some of his best tennis at this stage of his career (the clearly past his prime one), but if he couldn't win any big matches vs Lendl anymore by 85 or 87, he isn't doing it in 1990 IMO. Yes Lendl was lucky Edberg who looked in scintillating form prior, got injured, but that doesn't mean an old McEnroe can beat him. Mcenroe won only 1 of his final 11 matches with Lendl btw. They also met at the Australian Open the previous year, and Lendl won in straight sets, albeit with 2 tiebreaks.

I do agree this was one of his best late career opportunities, but it still wasnt a great one.

When Lendl beat McEnroe at the 1985 US open, the rivalry changed in Lendl’s favour.

 

[insideoutforehands]

When Lendl beat McEnroe at the 1985 US open, the rivalry changed in Lendl’s favour.

It sure did, and McEnroe was so much less a major threat in 1990 than 1985, while Lendl was still nearly just as much of one in 1990 (in some ways more as he had years of experience being the/a dominant player behind him now, even if he was past the height of his dominance by a couple years by then).

 

[Torben]

It sure did, and McEnroe was so much less a major threat in 1990 than 1985, while Lendl was still nearly just as much of one in 1990 (in some ways more as he had years of experience being the/a dominant player behind him now, even if he was past the height of his dominance by a couple years by then).

Absolutely, Lendl went on to win more Slams as a result. It was very smart of Lendl to hire Tony Roche in the early part of 1985. He brought vast experience to Lendl to help him move forward in his development as a player. A very wise move.