Is it all about calories or does insulin play a bigger role in fat accumulation?

[FedTheMan]

If you ask anyone at school, work, gym, in your home and on the streets: "why are people fatter than ever and why are the obesity rates increasing?"

They will answer: "People are eating too much and not exercising enough".

That answer is what has been drilled into our heads from childhood and we all believe it to be the universal truth. We believe that ultimately, it's calories in vs calories out (CICO); If we eat more calories than we burn, then we will gain weight. On the other hand, if we burn more calories than we eat, then we will lose weight.

At some point in our lives, we all have searched up: "How many calories should I eat?". The results on the internet point to calculators which give you a certain range. A widely used approximation is body weight in pounds X 15 for maintenance. So if you weigh 200 lbs, your maintenance calories are 200x15= 3000 calories a day.

They state that a pound is equivalent to 3500 calories. So to lose a pound a week, you have to cut down your maintenance by 500 calories (3500/7 days). So this 200 lb person would have to eat 2500 calories to lose a pound a week and then adjust as they get skinnier.

However, we all have that one friend who ate continuously throughout the day and maintained a healthy weight. Why does one person have higher maintenance calories than another person if they work at the same place and are sedentary? Calories out for a person is vastly different than someone else even if they do the same exercise or live similar lives.

Another thing that never made sense is how can 2000 calories of ice cream be equivalent to 2000 calories of steak? Your body will use the steak to rebuild, replenish and strengthen itself and it will react totally different to the ice cream.

I am starting to lean towards the fact that hormones play a much larger role than calories do for weight loss and maintenance.

Most people nowadays barely eat real meats and vegetables. They instead devour processed foods such as: bread, pasta, luncheon meats, sauces, sweets, etc.

If we eat real food that we cook ourselves at home, the body will use that to get stronger, you will fall sick less frequently, you won't constantly think about food or have sugar cravings. Simply listen to your body and eat when you are hungry and stop when you are full. Then move on and live your life for that day. There are many more important things than food in this life and when you begin to eat food for nutrients rather than pleasure, your whole outlook on life becomes better.

I have seen countless people checking every label for the calorie count, logging in to a food diary, avoiding eating home cooked food because they do not know how many calories is in that meal! They begin to idolize food. That is no way to live! You cannot run away from food forever, just make good healthy choices and move on.

People choose to eat 100 calorie pack of oreos vs 300 calories of almonds because of the energy count. However, almonds destroy oreos in all nutritional aspects.

Please see this video from a professional bodybuilder about calories vs insulin. He states that it is carbohydrates that make people fat, not calories.

We really do not need to eat grains. Try to get all your carbs from vegetables, avoid fruits (high in sugar) and eat healthy fats and meats. Avoid processed meats like luncheon meats, etc. Get brands of bacon and other meats that have no sugar, nitrites or any other additives.

For weight loss: eat real meats (whole eggs, chicken, ground beef, steak, fish) and leafy green vegetables (spinach, kale, lettuce)

For maintenance: eat real meats (whole eggs, chicken, ground beef, steak, fish) and all vegetables.

I was curious myself, so I ate as many eggs, steak, almonds, olive oil and chicken that I wanted for 3 weeks and I did not gain a single pound.

Yes, calories in vs calories out works. It is great for quick weight loss and I use it to lose weight simply because I am impatient and want to see results fast. However, for those of you who have severe health problems such as high acidity, chronic gastritis, IBS, etc. and who want to take your time to lose weight, I would suggest to eat only meats and vegetables cooked at home for six months and then see how you feel and look.

Sometimes it may take years for your body to heal and clean itself from all the junk we put into it for decades. Only then, will it start to reduce fat and you will lose weight.

This is a fantastic quote about being patient when it comes to losing weight while eating real food:

"And if you are eating foods you have a sensitivity to, an inflammatory reaction takes place in your body and your body is NOT going to lose weight. Your body is going to focus on healing areas that are affected (damaged and inflamed) by the food you are eating. When you have chronic inflammation going on, the last thing your body is going to do is lose weight." (source: https://www.cassie.net/im-eating-real-food-and-not-losing-weight/)


Please also see this person who ate close to 6000 calories a day and put on lean muscle:
http://live.smashthefat.com/why-i-didnt-get-fat/

Please discuss below your thoughts on this matter.

 

[r2473]

There probably are several factors. My advice would be to:

1. List the contributing factors
2. Rank the factors from most to least contributory
3. Rank the factors from easiest to hardest to change (find the "low hanging fruit")
4. Make an action plan based up these rankings
5. Your action plan should probably only address one factor at a time, until that factor has become habit
6. After mastering one factor, move on to the next. Or perhaps mastery isn't needed. You'll need to use your discretion on this as to how to judge when you've properly addressed the factor you are considering.

Bear in mind, everyone is different. Not all factors are related to lifestyle. But these are the ones you are best able to address. (In other words, though genetic and socio-economic factors are interesting, there really isn't much you can do to control those factors. So, while it's important to understand them, they are for the most part "sunk costs" in all of this).

My advice: Don't get bogged down in the details. Lot's can be accomplished with "common sense". Remember, your goal is "health", not perfection. Don't confuse the two.

Best of luck

By the way OP, your poll is an example of a false dichotomy.

 

[Vanhalen]

TLTR

 

[Raul_SJ]

I was curious myself, so I ate as many eggs, steak, almonds, olive oil and chicken that I wanted for 3 weeks and I did not gain a single pound.
.

?!
Impossible. I will gain many pounds if I did that.
You must have burned it off with more exercise.

 

[r2473]

Impossible. .

Really? When I was in college I was 6' 1" and 155 lbs. I wanted to gain weight. I ate like a horse and even ate weight gain formula from one of the snake oil shops.

Of course, like a lot of skinny young men, I didn't gain an ounce. I just went to the bathroom more often.

As hard as it is to believe, your body isn't a perfect mathematical equation. Eating an extra 10 calories over your calculated maintenance doesn't result in 10 calories of weight gain. Just as eating 10 calories under your maintenance doesn't result in 10 calories of weight loss. Everyone seems to understand this intuitively, but somehow we always base our decisions as if our body is a mathematical equation. An apparent paradox that is hard for me to reconcile.

Furthermore, not everyone is the same. So the same principles and strategies won't work equally for everyone. There are of course commonalities. This is why it is often best to take a "common sense" approach to all of this first. Evaluate your current lifestyle habits. What does your diet look like? What does your exercise routine look like? To make an accurate assessment, it is useful to keep a journal for several weeks recording ACTUAL eating and exercise. This simple exercise should suggest enough things you can address to keep you occupied for quite some time I'd imagine.

 

[Raul_SJ]

Really? When I was in college I was 6' 1" and 155 lbs. I wanted to gain weight. I ate like a horse and even ate weight gain formula from one of the snake oil shops.
.

I stand corrected. I would still contend that for the vast majority the caloric deficit/surplus creates the weight loss/gain. That is what all my Doctors have told me.

Researchers are still trying to determine just what makes some people gain more weight than others given the same conditions, although one theory is that some people have more growth hormone than others, causing them to use more energy through their daily activities.

https://www.livestrong.com/article/438633-why-if-youre-constantly-eating-cant-you-gain-weight/​

 

[FedTheMan]

There probably are several factors. My advice would be to:

...
My advice: Don't get bogged down in the details. Lot's can be accomplished with "common sense". Remember, your goal is "health", not perfection. Don't confuse the two.

Best of luck

By the way OP, your poll is an example of a false dichotomy.

Thanks for the replies. Yes, health is the ultimate goal as I learned two years ago. I got down to less than 10% body fat and I was working out 6 times a week but I was only eating 1500 calories or so as that was my first time counting calories. It worked and I got well below my goal weight and got a six pack and kept my bench, dead lift, squats at an intermediate level. However, I continued that kind of regimen for 8 months and got severely ill and have still not recovered. I wish I had stopped when I met my goal weight that time and not pursued "perfection".

Yes, the poll options are not the only two choices in the world. People are so unique and each person has such a variety of contributing factors regarding weight. I just wanted to see in general which choice does the TT board lean toward.

 

[r2473]

I stand corrected. I would still contend that for the vast majority the caloric deficit/surplus creates the weight loss/gain. That is what all my Doctors have told me.

Researchers are still trying to determine just what makes some people gain more weight than others given the same conditions, although one theory is that some people have more growth hormone than others, causing them to use more energy through their daily activities.

https://www.livestrong.com/article/438633-why-if-youre-constantly-eating-cant-you-gain-weight/​

Well I don't have any problem gaining weight now. We are just different at different stages of our lives (in addition to the other factors). It makes a "one size fits all" plan successful for some and not for others (and the ones it is successful for will chastise the others as being undisciplined......which might be true. But it might not be).

Sure. Percentage-wise, we are all "pretty much the same". Meaning, we all share far more commonalities than differences. But, it's the small differences that make all the difference I'd argue.

Take personality as an example. In many ways, we all act "pretty much the same". We are all human after all. We all live in similar conditions. But, the reason why we like certain people and not others; the reason why some people are more successful than others is based on our "small" differences.

Some of the differences are genetic. Some socio-economic. Some are lifestyle choices. They all contribute to what makes each of us uniquely "us".

 

[FedTheMan]

?!
Impossible. I will gain many pounds if I did that.
You must have burned it off with more exercise.

Nope, I just went to work and trained only two times a week at the gym as I normally do these days. You would be surprised.

Please try it out for yourself! For one month, buy beef (grass-fed if it meets your budget), steak, chicken, real fish, whole eggs (not egg whites!!) and use olive or coconut oil. Eat a massive breakfast, lunch and dinner with mostly meats and oil. I use spices on my meat to give it more flavor (make sure they are natural spices and not artificial).

Only drink water! (no juices, coffee, tea, etc.). Do not eat fruits due to the sugar and carbs.

Only snack on low carb nuts like almonds, walnuts and pecans. Do not buy roasted as they use vegetable oil. Buy them raw and then roast them at home with oil and salt.

Do not force feed yourself. Simply eat till your stomach is good and full but not to the point where you are throwing up. Just honor your body and the rest will take care of itself.

Give it 3-4 weeks and continue the same amount of tennis or gym that you are currently used to and you will notice improvement in your health. The first week will be tough as you will feel weak due to lack of carbs but by the second week, your body should adjust. Drink lots of water and season your meats with salt, pepper and other spices.

 

[Ramon]

A low carb diet does help most people lose weight. I once lost 55 pounds by switching to low carb. However, the more I research it, the more I think it has do with calories. If you've been eating fast food lunches (burgers, sandwiches, french fries, etc.) and suddenly you've switched to salads with meats and a minimal amount of dressing, you've cut your calories in half! All those veggies that take up space in your stomach probably only have 30 calories or less (ex. 4 cups of spinach is only 20 calories)! So now you've fooled your stomach into satisfying your appetite, and you're losing weight because your calorie intake is so low. On the flip side, if you have a poor diet, you're eating junk food that's hyper palatable. The sugar is setting off your happy hormones and you crave more and more of it. Also, keep in mind that carbs are not the only thing that triggers Insulin; protein does this also. One thing I discovered is that I can't get a good workout in the gym with a low carb diet, so for me, carbs are necessary for athletic performance.

 

[Soul]

I believe low carb dieting helps many to loose weight. I'm not sure how helpful low carb is long term, it might be helpful, might not, but in the short term it appears to help I'd guess half that eat that way. Others have found low carb dieting to not be all that helpful with weight loss from my experience.

Some medications cause weight gain. I was recently hearing the sad situation of a former neighbor. For an operation surgeons told him he needed to loose 50lbs. He was taking corticosteroids though for a condition, which is a medication that cause many to put on a great amount of weight. He had the surgery, not sure if he lost the asked for weight or not, he was struggling even after working with a trainer and dietician, and now as a result has lost a huge amount of weight. He's been bedridden and in pain from the operatiion. It had me wondering why the surgeon was insisting the former neighbor work hard to loose 50lbs. Hmmm...

 

[arnott]

>Yes, calories in vs calories out works.

It does not, the human body is not a closed system.

 

[r2473]

>Yes, calories in vs calories out works.

It does not, .

I can produce empirical evidence to the contrary.

How would you respond to that?

 

[arnott]

I can produce empirical evidence to the contrary.

How would you respond to that?

Check this article.

 

[r2473]

Check this article.

So, where are the studies that show that cutting calories causes long term weight loss? After 50 years of desperate, intense research, guess how many studies prove its effectiveness? How about zero? That’s right, Nada. Zilch. Zero. The only reason we think the ‘caloric reduction as primary’ strategy is effective is because it’s been repeated so often. It’s like Santa Claus.

It's funny how he asserts this and then follows it up with a long article that doesn't cite a single study to back him up.

I'm not saying he's right or wrong. I just find his method of argument "interesting".

 

[arnott]

So, where are the studies that show that cutting calories causes long term weight loss? After 50 years of desperate, intense research, guess how many studies prove its effectiveness? How about zero? That’s right, Nada. Zilch. Zero. The only reason we think the ‘caloric reduction as primary’ strategy is effective is because it’s been repeated so often. It’s like Santa Claus.

It's funny how he asserts this and then follows it up with a long article that doesn't cite a single study to back him up.

I'm not saying he's right or wrong. I just find his method of argument "interesting".

Thanks for reading the article. If you really want the science/studies behind his claims, read Gary Taubes books. This is a much easier read : Why We Get Fat: And What to Do About It. You can also find many videos from Dr. Fung and Taubes of youtube.

>single study
If you check his blog, he has many posts on CICO with sources.

 

[r2473]

Thanks for reading the article. If you really want the science/studies behind his claims, read Gary Taubes books. This is a much easier read : Why We Get Fat: And What to Do About It. You can also find many videos from Dr. Fung and Taubes of youtube.

>single study
If you check his blog, he has many posts on CICO with sources.

https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/82/1/222S/4863393


ABSTRACT
There is a general perception that almost no one succeeds in long-term maintenance of weight loss. However, research has shown that ≈20% of overweight individuals are successful at long-term weight loss when defined as losing at least 10% of initial body weight and maintaining the loss for at least 1 y. The National Weight Control Registry provides information about the strategies used by successful weight loss maintainers to achieve and maintain long-term weight loss.



SUMMARY
Results of random digit dial surveys indicate that ≈20% of people in the general population are successful at long-term weight loss maintenance. These data, along with findings from the National Weight Control Registry, underscore the fact that it is possible to achieve and maintain significant amounts of weight loss.

Findings from the registry suggest six key strategies for long-term success at weight loss: 1) engaging in high levels of physical activity; 2) eating a diet that is low in calories and fat; 3) eating breakfast; 4) self-monitoring weight on a regular basis; 5) maintaining a consistent eating pattern; and 6) catching “slips” before they turn into larger regains. Initiating weight loss after a medical event may also help facilitate long-term weight control.

Additional studies are needed to determine the factors responsible for registry participant’ apparent ability to adhere to these strategies for a long period of time in the context of a “toxic” environment that strongly encourages passive overeating and sedentary lifestyles.

RRW is the cofounder of the National Weight Control Registry (with James O Hill). RRW coauthored the manuscript with SP, who is a coinvestigator of the National Weight Control Registry. RRW and SP have no financial or personal interest in the organizations sponsoring this research.

 

[r2473]

Thanks for reading the article. If you really want the science/studies behind his claims, read Gary Taubes books. This is a much easier read : Why We Get Fat: And What to Do About It. You can also find many videos from Dr. Fung and Taubes of youtube.

>single study
If you check his blog, he has many posts on CICO with sources.

I'd argue that there are many ways to lose weight and stay healthy. If Dr. Fung's ideas and methods appeal to you, then you should go with them. I'm sure you will be successful.

But I'm sure others can achieve long term health and lose weight by employing different methods. So perhaps the most important factor might be to really think about short-term and long-term strategies you can actually adopt.

My personal method relies heavily on "engaging in high levels of physical activity". This suits my personality and lifestyle. And has proven effective. Not only is exercise effective as a means of controlling weight, but living an active lifestyle contributes to many other areas of health.

But, this isn't for everybody. And I wouldn't suggest you follow this method if it doesn't suit your personality and lifestyle. Instead, find what works for you.

 

[arnott]

https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/82/1/222S/4863393


ABSTRACT
There is a general perception that almost no one succeeds in long-term maintenance of weight loss. However, research has shown that ≈20% of overweight individuals are successful at long-term weight loss when defined as losing at least 10% of initial body weight and maintaining the loss for at least 1 y. The National Weight Control Registry provides information about the strategies used by successful weight loss maintainers to achieve and maintain long-term weight loss.



SUMMARY
Results of random digit dial surveys indicate that ≈20% of people in the general population are successful at long-term weight loss maintenance. These data, along with findings from the National Weight Control Registry, underscore the fact that it is possible to achieve and maintain significant amounts of weight loss.

Findings from the registry suggest six key strategies for long-term success at weight loss: 1) engaging in high levels of physical activity; 2) eating a diet that is low in calories and fat; 3) eating breakfast; 4) self-monitoring weight on a regular basis; 5) maintaining a consistent eating pattern; and 6) catching “slips” before they turn into larger regains. Initiating weight loss after a medical event may also help facilitate long-term weight control.

Additional studies are needed to determine the factors responsible for registry participant’ apparent ability to adhere to these strategies for a long period of time in the context of a “toxic” environment that strongly encourages passive overeating and sedentary lifestyles.

RRW is the cofounder of the National Weight Control Registry (with James O Hill). RRW coauthored the manuscript with SP, who is a coinvestigator of the National Weight Control Registry. RRW and SP have no financial or personal interest in the organizations sponsoring this research.

Will read it and respond soon.

 

[Sentinel]

avoid fruits (high in sugar)

Are we seriously to avoid fruit ? Don't they have fibre ? In addition to vitamins. I have some apple and papaya daily.

What about dried fruit ? Dates/ raisins ? Are they out too ? (that's my only potassium source since I can't eat a banana).

Also, keep in mind that carbs are not the only thing that triggers Insulin; protein does this also

I just read this the other day somewhere. Said that fats do not trigger insulin.

eating a diet that is low in calories and fat

I thought fats were getting a better rep nowadays.

-----
I have just begun reading about the area of insulin recently, since I have a lot of diabetes in my family (father's side), and I am hoping to avoid it. Any links would be welcome.

 

[Sentinel]

My personal method relies heavily on "engaging in high levels of physical activity". This suits my personality and lifestyle. And has proven effective. Not only is exercise effective as a means of controlling weight, but living an active lifestyle contributes to many other areas of health.

I've been trying to find out about this thing. Does exercise within a certain time frame of eating carbs help in reducing the insulin response. Do you (or anyone else here) have any info on this ?
What kind of exercise would be required ? Is a simple walk 30 mins after a meal / sweet snack good enough, or is a jog required ?

Thanks.

 

[FedTheMan]

Are we seriously to avoid fruit ? Don't they have fibre ? In addition to vitamins. I have some apple and papaya daily.

What about dried fruit ? Dates/ raisins ? Are they out too ? (that's my only potassium source since I can't eat a banana).



I just read this the other day somewhere. Said that fats do not trigger insulin.



I thought fats were getting a better rep nowadays.

-----
I have just begun reading about the area of insulin recently, since I have a lot of diabetes in my family (father's side), and I am hoping to avoid it. Any links would be welcome.

Hi Sentinel, from what I read over the years on this board, you have various stomach problems dealing with acidity. I have chronic gastritis and have been living with it for the past two years where my stomach lining is so weak that there is so much acidity throughout the day. I can barely sleep due to the pain most days. Therefore, I think I can relate to you a little bit.

The most important thing for people like us, is to get better before we even worry about weight. We need to know what foods are ailing our stomach and causing discomfort. For example, I know that if I eat any dairy products, I get severe acidity and bathroom problems. I also cannot eat any oranges, tomatoes, or any other acidic vegetables or fruits.

Try eliminating all grains and just eat baked meats and vegetables. Keep it simple with just a few types of your favorite vegetables. Then remove anything that causes pain and then re-evaluate after a few days. Slowly add in more vegetables and grains if your body allows.

I also remember you stating that you are very skinny and run a lot. Therefore, a few pieces of fruit should be okay due to your carb need as you train more than the average office worker. Berries are better in my opinion due to the lower amount of sugar as compared to the sweeter fruits. Dried fruits are not as healthy as whole fruit due to higher sugar count. Yes, there is no denying that fruits have a lot of healthy vitamins. However, some people are insulin resistant and therefore eliminating fruits will be greatly beneficial if they want to lose weight.

People are still eating a very low fat diet when they are trying to lose weight. Hence, the abundance of low fat milk, low fat yogurt, low fat cottage cheese, etc.

Again, it all depends how efficient your body is in dealing with insulin. Some people do fine eating oatmeal, rice, bread and do not put on weight. While others may gain easily.

 

[Sentinel]

Hi Sentinel, from what I read over the years on this board, you have various stomach problems dealing with acidity. I have chronic gastritis and have been living with it for the past two years where my stomach lining is so weak that there is so much acidity throughout the day. I can barely sleep due to the pain most days. Therefore, I think I can relate to you a little bit.

The most important thing for people like us, is to get better before we even worry about weight. We need to know what foods are ailing our stomach and causing discomfort. For example, I know that if I eat any dairy products, I get severe acidity and bathroom problems. I also cannot eat any oranges, tomatoes, or any other acidic vegetables or fruits.

Try eliminating all grains and just eat baked meats and vegetables. Keep it simple with just a few types of your favorite vegetables. Then remove anything that causes pain and then re-evaluate after a few days. Slowly add in more vegetables and grains if your body allows.

I also remember you stating that you are very skinny and run a lot. Therefore, a few pieces of fruit should be okay due to your carb need as you train more than the average office worker. Berries are better in my opinion due to the lower amount of sugar as compared to the sweeter fruits. Dried fruits are not as healthy as whole fruit due to higher sugar count. Yes, there is no denying that fruits have a lot of healthy vitamins. However, some people are insulin resistant and therefore eliminating fruits will be greatly beneficial if they want to lose weight.

People are still eating a very low fat diet when they are trying to lose weight. Hence, the abundance of low fat milk, low fat yogurt, low fat cottage cheese, etc.

Again, it all depends how efficient your body is in dealing with insulin. Some people do fine eating oatmeal, rice, bread and do not put on weight. While others may gain easily.

Thanks. The dyspepsia seems to be okay right now. I have a glass of warm water with lemon juice in the morning, and that seems to be helping.
I was running a lot till two years ago, currently house-bound due to domestic issues.
I don't have dairy issues, actually I've been having yogurt twice a day after meals. Trying to increase that.

Currently, my concern is more about not getting into diabetes. I try to do 15-20 minutes of spot/stationary jogging in the evening. Unfortunately, due to reasons not in my control, I do have to have some sugary stuff almost daily (could be a serving of icecream or a slice of cake or whatever) so i am wondering how to counteract the ill-effects w.r.t diabetes. I also have white rice at lunch.

 

[FedTheMan]

Thanks. The dyspepsia seems to be okay right now. I have a glass of warm water with lemon juice in the morning, and that seems to be helping.
I was running a lot till two years ago, currently house-bound due to domestic issues.
I don't have dairy issues, actually I've been having yogurt twice a day after meals. Trying to increase that.

Currently, my concern is more about not getting into diabetes. I try to do 15-20 minutes of spot/stationary jogging in the evening. Unfortunately, due to reasons not in my control, I do have to have some sugary stuff almost daily (could be a serving of icecream or a slice of cake or whatever) so i am wondering how to counteract the ill-effects w.r.t diabetes. I also have white rice at lunch.

This may not completely answer your question but I used to have a severe sweet tooth more than a year ago and so I cut out all grains including bread, oatmeal, etc, as processed grains turn into sugar in your body. I just ate meats, vegetables and low carb nuts like almonds and all of my sweet cravings went away. I have not eaten ice cream in over a year. Honestly going just eating meats and vegetables and avoiding fruits and grains heals a lot of ailments and I got so much stronger at the gym and all of my lifts increased to my personal best.

Sorry I cannot help with your question about diabetes. Perhaps someone else on the board can answer your question.

 

[T1000]

Both contribute to fat/weight gain. The best results will come from resetting your insulin sensitivity which usually goes along with a lower calorie diet anyways.

Avoiding fruits is terrible advice. You can lose weight and reset your insulin resistance while eating carbs. It's not rocket science

 

[arnott]

Thanks. The dyspepsia seems to be okay right now. I have a glass of warm water with lemon juice in the morning, and that seems to be helping.
I was running a lot till two years ago, currently house-bound due to domestic issues.
I don't have dairy issues, actually I've been having yogurt twice a day after meals. Trying to increase that.

Currently, my concern is more about not getting into diabetes. I try to do 15-20 minutes of spot/stationary jogging in the evening. Unfortunately, due to reasons not in my control, I do have to have some sugary stuff almost daily (could be a serving of icecream or a slice of cake or whatever) so i am wondering how to counteract the ill-effects w.r.t diabetes. I also have white rice at lunch.

If you are worried about diabetes, have you checked your fasting insulin and triglycerides ?

 

[arnott]

Are we seriously to avoid fruit ? Don't they have fibre ? In addition to vitamins. I have some apple and papaya daily.

What about dried fruit ? Dates/ raisins ? Are they out too ? (that's my only potassium source since I can't eat a banana).



I just read this the other day somewhere. Said that fats do not trigger insulin.



I thought fats were getting a better rep nowadays.

-----
I have just begun reading about the area of insulin recently, since I have a lot of diabetes in my family (father's side), and I am hoping to avoid it. Any links would be welcome.

Check out D. Fung's blog, he specializes in treating T2D. Also check this video.

 

[Fedinkum]

Significant reduction of Sugar and white rice/ white bread and not eating after 6pm. These 3 factors made an huge impact to my weight lost.

 

[arnott]

https://academic.oup.com/ajcn/article/82/1/222S/4863393


ABSTRACT
There is a general perception that almost no one succeeds in long-term maintenance of weight loss. However, research has shown that ≈20% of overweight individuals are successful at long-term weight loss when defined as losing at least 10% of initial body weight and maintaining the loss for at least 1 y. The National Weight Control Registry provides information about the strategies used by successful weight loss maintainers to achieve and maintain long-term weight loss.



SUMMARY
Results of random digit dial surveys indicate that ≈20% of people in the general population are successful at long-term weight loss maintenance. These data, along with findings from the National Weight Control Registry, underscore the fact that it is possible to achieve and maintain significant amounts of weight loss.

Findings from the registry suggest six key strategies for long-term success at weight loss: 1) engaging in high levels of physical activity; 2) eating a diet that is low in calories and fat; 3) eating breakfast; 4) self-monitoring weight on a regular basis; 5) maintaining a consistent eating pattern; and 6) catching “slips” before they turn into larger regains. Initiating weight loss after a medical event may also help facilitate long-term weight control.

Additional studies are needed to determine the factors responsible for registry participant’ apparent ability to adhere to these strategies for a long period of time in the context of a “toxic” environment that strongly encourages passive overeating and sedentary lifestyles.

RRW is the cofounder of the National Weight Control Registry (with James O Hill). RRW coauthored the manuscript with SP, who is a coinvestigator of the National Weight Control Registry. RRW and SP have no financial or personal interest in the organizations sponsoring this research.

According to their site:

If you are a successful weight loser and under 18 years old, click here!
​

They want data from only people who were successful. So its data from people who are highly motivated, active and who eat healthy like you.

Exercise is great for your health. Especially tennis. Both exercise and being active provide intrinsic benefits to health beyond burning just calories.

Lazy people do not become fat, fat people become lazy. Its Gary Taubes's point and it very interesting. I do not believe Agassi put on weight because he is lazy. He has developed insulin resistance.

I did not realize you were taking this personally. Al of us need to avoid processed foods and high carbs and sugar.

 

[arnott]

Significant reduction of Sugar and white rice/ white bread and not eating after 6pm. These 3 factors made an huge impact to my weight lost.

Exactly ! Lower carbs and intermittent fasting.

 

[Fedinkum]

Exactly ! Lower carbs and intermittent fasting.

I guess it is a form of fasting, but mentally, I don’t want to call it fasting (because I love eating...Ahahahaha) I still eat 3 meals a day, I have the heaviest meal during lunch and a very light dinner before 6pm. Saying good bye to midnight instant cup noodle was difficult and I still cave in every now and then...I am human after all

 

[arnott]

I've been trying to find out about this thing. Does exercise within a certain time frame of eating carbs help in reducing the insulin response. Do you (or anyone else here) have any info on this ?
What kind of exercise would be required ? Is a simple walk 30 mins after a meal / sweet snack good enough, or is a jog required ?

Thanks.

Check out this opinion on exercise. The whole site is worth reading. I try to do this.

 

[arnott]

I guess it is a form of fasting, but mentally, I don’t want to call it fasting (because I love eating...Ahahahaha) I still eat 3 meals a day, I try have the heaviest meal during lunch and a very light dinner before 6pm. Saying good bye to midnight instant cup noodle was difficult and I still cave in every now and then...I am human after all

We as humans are so afraid of starving, that we confuse starving and fasting, and panic.

Try to eat an avocado or cheese/butter instead of noodles.

 

[arnott]

I guess it is a form of fasting, but mentally, I don’t want to call it fasting (because I love eating...Ahahahaha) I still eat 3 meals a day, I try have the heaviest meal during lunch and a very light dinner before 6pm. Saying good bye to midnight instant cup noodle was difficult and I still cave in every now and then...I am human after all

Just noticed you are from Australia, have you heard about Dr. Fettke ? Check out his blog. "Low carb down under" has great videos on youtube on these topics.

Btw, follow cricket ? What you think about the 12 month bans ?

 

[Fedinkum]

We as humans are so afraid of starving, that we confuse starving and fasting, and panic.

Try to eat an avocado or cheese/butter instead of noodles.

Yes, avocado is a god-sent. Along with Smoke salmons and almonds, they make a great snack if I really need munching.

 

[Fedinkum]

Just noticed you are from Australia, have you heard about Dr. Fettke ? Check out his blog. "Low carb down under" has great videos on youtube on these topics.

Btw, follow cricket ? What you think about the 12 month bans ?

Thanks for the link, will check it out.

All I can say is I won’t penalise them for cheating but they deserve a 12 month bans for being such a dump-@ss to carry out a half-@ss cheat with so little gain but having so much to lose and still be so arrogant about it afterwards.

 

[arnott]

Thanks for the link, will check it out.

All I can say is I won’t penalise them for cheating but they deserve a 12 month bans for being such a dump-@ss to carry out a half-@ss cheat with so little gain but having so much to lose and still be so arrogant about it afterwards.

My concern: are we sure they did not cheat before ?

Also check Low carb website.

 

[Raul_SJ]

People choose to eat 100 calorie pack of oreos vs 300 calories of almonds because of the energy count. However, almonds destroy oreos in all nutritional aspects.

Please see this video from a professional bodybuilder about calories vs insulin. He states that it is carbohydrates that make people fat, not calories.

In that video at 07:30, he talks about insulin resistance. When things are working correctly, the insulin acts like a key and allows glucose in the blood to enter the fat cells and it will be stored as fat.

Insulin resistance means that there is glucose in the blood that has not been cleared and cannot enter the fat cells.

But why does having glucose in the blood lead to obesity?

 

[r2473]

I've been trying to find out about this thing. Does exercise within a certain time frame of eating carbs help in reducing the insulin response. Do you (or anyone else here) have any info on this ?
What kind of exercise would be required ? Is a simple walk 30 mins after a meal / sweet snack good enough, or is a jog required ?

Thanks.

I don't know much about this type of stuff. Sorry Senti.

 

[r2473]

I did not realize you were taking this personally.

Well of course I take it personally. Perhaps not quite in the way you meant the comment however.

 

[arnott]

Well of course I take it personally. Perhaps not quite in the way you meant the comment however.

Really? When I was in college I was 6' 1" and 155 lbs. I wanted to gain weight. I ate like a horse and even ate weight gain formula from one of the snake oil shops.

Of course, like a lot of skinny young men, I didn't gain an ounce. I just went to the bathroom more often.

As hard as it is to believe, your body isn't a perfect mathematical equation. Eating an extra 10 calories over your calculated maintenance doesn't result in 10 calories of weight gain. Just as eating 10 calories under your maintenance doesn't result in 10 calories of weight loss. Everyone seems to understand this intuitively, but somehow we always base our decisions as if our body is a mathematical equation. An apparent paradox that is hard for me to reconcile.

Furthermore, not everyone is the same. So the same principles and strategies won't work equally for everyone. There are of course commonalities. This is why it is often best to take a "common sense" approach to all of this first. Evaluate your current lifestyle habits. What does your diet look like? What does your exercise routine look like? To make an accurate assessment, it is useful to keep a journal for several weeks recording ACTUAL eating and exercise. This simple exercise should suggest enough things you can address to keep you occupied for quite some time I'd imagine.

What you said in the quote above is accurate. Basically you are saying the type of calories you eat matters. The part I have made bold is Dr. Fung's main argument.

 

[arnott]

In that video at 07:30, he talks about insulin resistance. When things are working correctly, the insulin acts like a key and allows glucose in the blood to enter the fat cells and it will be stored as fat.

Insulin resistance means that there is glucose in the blood that has not been cleared and cannot enter the fat cells.

But why does having glucose in the blood lead to obesity?

Because having extra glucose in the blood is not healthy, so the body starts making more and more insulin, leading to insulin resistance. And the extra glucose is sent to the liver, under the guidance of insulin (the storage hormone) to be converted to triglycerides. The triglycerides are shipped on the LDL boats to all parts of the body to be saved as fat, leading to weight gain. And since your body is in a carb burning mode, it cannot use the stored fat. When you eat more carbs, the cycle repeats, more glucose, more insulin, cells are full, triglycerides etc ..

 

[arnott]

In that video at 07:30, he talks about insulin resistance. When things are working correctly, the insulin acts like a key and allows glucose in the blood to enter the fat cells and it will be stored as fat.

Insulin resistance means that there is glucose in the blood that has not been cleared and cannot enter the fat cells.

But why does having glucose in the blood lead to obesity?

That's not accurate, when things are normal, glucose enters cells and are used for energy. Excess glucose in the blood starts the problem.

 

[Raul_SJ]

That's not accurate, when things are normal, glucose enters cells and are used for energy. Excess glucose in the blood starts the problem.

I was going by the OP video at 7:30.

" Insulin is going to act like a key. It's going to take all these glucose molecules and it's one by one going to start unlocking fat cells and allowing that glucose to go into the fat cell thereby getting it all out of your bloodstream. It's literally storing fat."

With insulin resistance, i would think the glucose would never enter the cells to be stored as fat. It would be excreted in the urine and one would not get obese.

 

[arnott]

I was going by the OP video at 7:30.

" Insulin is going to act like a key. It's going to take all these glucose molecules and it's one by one going to start unlocking fat cells and allowing that glucose to go into the fat cell thereby getting it all out of your bloodstream. It's literally storing fat."

With insulin resistance, i would think the glucose would never enter the cells to be stored as fat. It would be excreted in the urine and one would not get obese.

Check this video. Also see my earlier comment.

 

[Raul_SJ]

Check this video. Also see my earlier comment.

About halfway through that video. It's confusing to me but trying to understand from a layperson's view. His pic of the Type I diabetic is what I would have expected when glucose cannot enter the cell. Now I have to figure out why the Type 1 starves while the Type 2 diabetic gets fat....

 

[arnott]

About halfway through that video. It's confusing to me but trying to understand from a layperson's view. His pic of the Type I diabetic is what I would have expected when glucose cannot enter the cell. Now I have to figure out why the Type 1 starves while the Type 2 diabetic gets fat....

Type 1 has no insulin, with no storage hormone, how are you going to unlock the cells to feed them glucose, and store the excess as fat ?

For type 2, because of insulin resistance excess sugar is converted to triglycerides and stored as fat. Many doctors do not understand the difference.

 

[arnott]

Type 1 has no insulin, with no storage hormone, how are you going to unlock the cells to feed them glucose, and store the excess as fat ?

For type 2, because of insulin resistance excess sugar is converted to triglycerides and stored as fat. Many doctors do not understand the difference.

So if someone has high fasting insulin (and high triglycerides), it is a sign of insulin resistance.

 

[Unpossible]

What about this?

 

[Raul_SJ]

So if someone has high fasting insulin (and high triglycerides), it is a sign of insulin resistance.

In terms of weight loss, I lean towards the calories in/out theory as this what all my Doctors have told me.

Is the alternate weight loss theory focusing on foods that have a low glycemic index that does not spike glucose/insulin levels and not so much focused on the calorie count?