What to include in a College Recruiting Video

[PURETENNISsense]

I played juniors in the US and when it was my time to play college tennis, recruiting videos were not a thing to do. Nowadays almost all recruits have a video of some sort. Some are pure with no edits and productions.... others look like an amateur film major/graduate is trying to make an average tennis player look like the next high-end ad for a major company.

What do you all think are the most important elements to include in a college tennis recruiting video?

What does the Coach most want to see?
What do they want to see that they can't notice from an actual campus visit?
How long should the video be?
Do they care about the fact that you can go through a footwork ladder? (Sorry seen a ton of these)

Any comments, input welcome! Curious on your thoughts.

 

[jcgatennismom]

I think recruiting videos should show actual match play, full court on display with recruit playing against a similar level opponent (or even a better opponent or one with UTR level similar to guys on college team). I am just a parent, but on websites where recruits post videos, I scan them occasionally. So many go through all the strokes in order while the right selection of points within a matchplay or tournament video could show a player's serves, volleys, forehand, backhand, approach, DTL, crosscourt, etc. Anyone now can take video with a smartphone, and there are instructional videos on the Internet on how to anchor a phone to court fence for recording. Plus there are Playsight courts where a recruit could possibly get a copy of his matchplay. I think video has been very important for 5+ years, but with fewer tourneys and coaches not traveling to watch players, it is even more important. Even without tourneys, recruits can find a local opponent to play a practice match to videotape, and then edit it down to 5-8min. When we did our son's college video, his video was 6-6 1/2 minutes of various long and short points pulled from a videotaped junior tournament match.

Some software I like is Screen-cast-o-matic. I've used it for college matches but it could be used for junior matches too to create recruiting video if juniors playing any matches that are livestreamed. I have screen captured live video from some of my son's team matches. If I have time to sit at the computer, I can start and stop the taping so a 90 min match will just be 15-20 min once the changeovers and ball chasing is eliminated. It's fun to screen capture the dubs which is really short after edits. The short clips can be shared with teammates who can send links to family and friends who may be in a different countries and time zones and miss watching matches.

 

[ChaelAZ]

What do you all think are the most important elements to include in a college tennis recruiting video?

I think some basic development philosophy (vision/mission) for an athlete is important. Something where they have to articulate themselves. Academics and life goals as well. Then the sundry selection of strokes in practice a bit and curated match points. The video is to pique interest. I think with the social distancing now though, including raw match play video links would be good. to let them watch whole matches to get a better feel for who they are.

As mentioned, I was just looking through a bunch, so if you haven't looked - https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query="recruitment+video"+2021+tennis

 

[Chezbeeno]

I was told by multiple college coaches at the time I was going through the recruiting process that point-play is the big thing they want to see. Someone can have the best strokes in the world but if they have no idea how to use them to construct points then it doesn't matter.

 

[LOBALOT]

My son is a senior and we put together his tennis recruiting video about a year ago and have it on tennis recruiting. We received a lot of input on what to include. The guidance we received was:

1. Match Video with comparable player.
2. From back of court viewing full court and have the recruit play on both sides of the court (shots from behind and in front).
3. Do not move the camera back and forth and do not film through the fence.
4. Have the video include all shots (Serve, return of serve, forehand, backhand, net play, overhead).
5. Edit out ball pickup, dead time etc. and keep it to about 5 minutes.

We did a few other specific things. So far the feedback on his video is favorable.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

I was told by multiple college coaches at the time I was going through the recruiting process that point-play is the big thing they want to see. Someone can have the best strokes in the world but if they have no idea how to use them to construct points then it doesn't matter.

Absolutely right! I always wonder why players spend majority of their video showcasing their strokes then do a highlight reel at the end of them winning 10 of 12 points against someone below their level.... not sure the logic on those.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

My son is a senior and we put together his tennis recruiting video about a year ago and have it on tennis recruiting. We received a lot of input on what to include. The guidance we received was:

1. Match Video with comparable player.
2. From back of court viewing full court and have the recruit play on both sides of the court (shots from behind and in front).
3. Do not move the camera back and forth and do not film through the fence.
4. Have the video include all shots (Serve, return of serve, forehand, backhand, net play, overhead).
5. Edit out ball pickup, dead time etc. and keep it to about 5 minutes.

We did a few other specific things. So far the feedback on his video is favorable.

This is perfect, I completely agree. These are the ones that keep my attention and I know what I'm looking for rather than having to forward and thumb through the entirety of the 12+ minute cinema production.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

I think some basic development philosophy (vision/mission) for an athlete is important. Something where they have to articulate themselves. Academics and life goals as well. Then the sundry selection of strokes in practice a bit and curated match points. The video is to pique interest. I think with the social distancing now though, including raw match play video links would be good. to let them watch whole matches to get a better feel for who they are.

As mentioned, I was just looking through a bunch, so if you haven't looked - https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query="recruitment+video"+2021+tennis

Whole matches are quite telling and really show the narrative of a player start to finish in a match. This would be great, wish more players showed this. It's pretty rare to come across for me when recruiting. Typically I have to ask for a second or third video in which I can see this.

 

[Cashman]

Your capabilities at beer pong and keg stands are critical, make sure you highlight them.

 

[Chezbeeno]

Your capabilities at beer pong and keg stands are critical, make sure you highlight them.

Nah, any college player worth their salt should have the athleticism to pick these skills up in college

 

[bobleenov1963]

I played juniors in the US and when it was my time to play college tennis, recruiting videos were not a thing to do. Nowadays almost all recruits have a video of some sort. Some are pure with no edits and productions.... others look like an amateur film major/graduate is trying to make an average tennis player look like the next high-end ad for a major company.

What do you all think are the most important elements to include in a college tennis recruiting video?

What does the Coach most want to see?
What do they want to see that they can't notice from an actual campus visit?
How long should the video be?
Do they care about the fact that you can go through a footwork ladder? (Sorry seen a ton of these)

Any comments, input welcome! Curious on your thoughts.

@PURETENNISsense: Having work in technology for almost 25 years, I can tell you what what you see in a recruit video is very similar to what you see in someone resume. People put what they do best in the resume and a lot of times, they are not completely truthful. Same can be said about recruiting videos. In the high-tech field, I have candidates that really good on resumes (graduated from Carnegie Mellon, Purdue, etc...) but when you bring them on-site for an in-person interview, they are just bad. It gets even worse when I have a practical lab exam real world scenario, coding in Java, Python, or stopping a Distributed Denial of Service (DDOS) that requires mitigations. On the other hands, the reverse is also true, candidates who look so average on resumes; however, when they get on-site for in-person interview and practical lab exams, they blew me away. The key is to observe how people react in an uncomfortable environment and watch how they adapt and adjust to the environment. Recruiting an tennis athlete, I imagine, is very similar.

Here is what I would do when an athlete visit on campus. I would warn that athlete that the first half of the visit will be all work and no play. I would make the athlete do this on campus:

1- How fast he/she can run 1 mile? For a good athlete, a 1 mile run should be in less than five minutes,
2- How high can he/she jump?
3- How fast can he/she run a 40 yard dash?
4- Play a few matches against current tennis players on the roster? both against better and lesser players,
5- Let he/she hangout with other players on the team and get feedback from them,
6- Other interests outside tennis,

Not sure recruits are allowed to do this during college visit due to NCAA rules

You can learn a lot about an individual in "un-filtered" situations

 

[PURETENNISsense]

You said this perfectly! I completely agree with your first paragraph.

It would be great to be able to examine the player with the 6 items you listed. We can sometimes do a few of those, but time restraints and other items like campus visit, attending a class, meeting with advisor, etc. takes a bit of time away.

See the most recent post I put on here: https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...rs-and-huge-drop-in-utr.682098/#post-14780326

I'd also add:
1) Less than 11 seconds for a 1-court suicide (to be PC I call them fun-runs now).
2) .25 mile sprint at 1min or less (very generous) 50-55secs would be ideal.
3) Can they do a proper pushup!?!? You'd be surprised how often this is not the case.
4) Team exercise with relay runs, sprint races, etc. (Will show competitive attitude and working with others).

NCAA and NAIA rules are different so just depends on the coach and the rules.

Great post!!

 

[Fabresque]

From what I can tell, coaches don’t care about technique, they care more about results. So, put a video of match highlights. Not just his, his opponents as well (to see what he does wrong as well). Include links to UTR, tennisrecruiting, and HS match results so coaches can get an idea of how they’d fit in the team.

That’s all.

 

[RiverRat]

Good god. Do coaches really have to look through all of these videos? When I was young, coaches just looked at your results, national ranking, Junior Davis Cup, state championships. They went to a few tournaments, especially Kalamazoo, and watched you play. They made contact with the players that interested them and recruited the ones that were interested in their schools.

As far as how to select a school, that depends on the student/athlete. Do you want to use tennis to get into a better academic school than your academics? Do you want it to pay for school? Do you want to develop your game to the maximum level? There is little advice anyone can give without knowing the person.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

From what I can tell, coaches don’t care about technique, they care more about results. So, put a video of match highlights. Not just his, his opponents as well (to see what he does wrong as well). Include links to UTR, tennisrecruiting, and HS match results so coaches can get an idea of how they’d fit in the team.

That’s all.

This is not competely true.

I look at technique pretty strictly to know if it's something that can be worked on or if it's too far beyond. I don't mention this to say that some players need their strokes to be fixed. It's more about the fact that if they are on the team for 4 years, that's a long time to continue to develop and reach new peaks with better stroke production.

Although I see what you mean. I have met coaches in the past that have told me verbatim, "I don't care about their technique much. When they get here I want to teach them how to win." I asked this after observing a player with a full-western grip who couldn't hit the ball much past the service line unless it was a lob. This was quite shocking to me since about 1-2 months of work would've taken care of her grip issue.

In the end, all coaches are different and have different goals with their players. My goal with my players is how to maximize their performance on court and if it's necessary to make certain adjustments to meet that objective.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

Good god. Do coaches really have to look through all of these videos? When I was young, coaches just looked at your results, national ranking, Junior Davis Cup, state championships. They went to a few tournaments, especially Kalamazoo, and watched you play. They made contact with the players that interested them and recruited the ones that were interested in their schools.

As far as how to select a school, that depends on the student/athlete. Do you want to use tennis to get into a better academic school than your academics? Do you want it to pay for school? Do you want to develop your game to the maximum level? There is little advice anyone can give without knowing the person.

Great point!

When I went to college, videos were still not very common and Official visits did most of the leg work with that. But in the last 10-15 years juniors have changed, their behavior, attitude, goals, etc. I don't find many juniors with the mentality that I and many of my friends had growing up. It's more rare to find the ideal student-athlete or at least close to it now days than before. Just my opinion though.

As far as how to select a school, that depends on the student/athlete. Do you want to use tennis to get into a better academic school than your academics? Do you want it to pay for school? Do you want to develop your game to the maximum level? There is little advice anyone can give without knowing the person.
This is spot on though! These are the questions the player should be asking themselves and their family situation before even starting conversations with appropriate institutions/coaches.

 

[RiverRat]

Great point!
When I went to college, videos were still not very common and Official visits did most of the leg work with that. But in the last 10-15 years juniors have changed, their behavior, attitude, goals, etc. I don't find many juniors with the mentality that I and many of my friends had growing up. It's more rare to find the ideal student-athlete or at least close to it now days than before.

I enjoyed the video of you playing the other day. I admire any coach/instructor, and you're both, who can still kindle a personal fire for competitive play. I couldn't during the summers when I taught to supplement my scholarship and it took me out of the playing line-up and tennis for this and a number of other reasons. I also admire you for continuing to give to our community. You are one motivated dude. I also feel for you and all of the video you must have to sift through with a critical eye, not just for the player's game, but any and all alterations and omission that might be there. Daunting to say the least.

 

[Fabresque]

This is not competely true.

I look at technique pretty strictly to know if it's something that can be worked on or if it's too far beyond. I don't mention this to say that some players need their strokes to be fixed. It's more about the fact that if they are on the team for 4 years, that's a long time to continue to develop and reach new peaks with better stroke production.

Although I see what you mean. I have met coaches in the past that have told me verbatim, "I don't care about their technique much. When they get here I want to teach them how to win." I asked this after observing a player with a full-western grip who couldn't hit the ball much past the service line unless it was a lob. This was quite shocking to me since about 1-2 months of work would've taken care of her grip issue.

In the end, all coaches are different and have different goals with their players. My goal with my players is how to maximize their performance on court and if it's necessary to make certain adjustments to meet that objective.

I guess some coaches are different. I see your point, but a lot of coaches care more about results and winning rather than the players improving their games. When I started playing college tennis I was a 6.9 UTR, and I didn't improve anything in my game except my attitude, in which I refuse to lose. I jumped to a 8.3 during season. It was because our coach cared about results above all else, and that mentality was infectious.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

I guess some coaches are different. I see your point, but a lot of coaches care more about results and winning rather than the players improving their games. When I started playing college tennis I was a 6.9 UTR, and I didn't improve anything in my game except my attitude, in which I refuse to lose. I jumped to a 8.3 during season. It was because our coach cared about results above all else, and that mentality was infectious.

I see what you mean. Great to see your stubbornness with losing propelled you to improve! That is a big part of college tennis that a Coach loves to see on their team. Like you said, once its infectious, teams like that are hard to beat!

 

[PURETENNISsense]

I enjoyed the video of you playing the other day. I admire any coach/instructor, and you're both, who can still kindle a personal fire for competitive play. I couldn't during the summers when I taught to supplement my scholarship and it took me out of the playing line-up and tennis for this and a number of other reasons. I also admire you for continuing to give to our community. You are one motivated dude. I also feel for you and all of the video you must have to sift through with a critical eye, not just for the player's game, but any and all alterations and omission that might be there. Daunting to say the least.

Thank you so much for the acknowledgement! I really appreciate it. I still can't get enough of training and competing. My attitude now at 33 is just as fiery as it ever was in my 20s. Getting back in shape and competing/training has been a lot of fun lately.

Tennis has always been a huge passion and I've learned so much from the sport and how it helps to mold good habits for my life. My goal has been to share what I've learned to young athletes and help them to realize how much of adaption in the sport of tennis can be applied to their life.

It is daunting sometimes. However, over the years I've developed a process of exactly what I'm looking for and it speeds up the process. Also, there's specific questions that can be asked to potential recruits that lets me know rather quickly if they will be a good fit for our program or not.

 

[Alekok1221]

Hi everyone, i think that what you said guys is very important, the results are not the most important thing. I think I prefer go to a place that maybe I can't win a lot but maybe I will improve in my game. Talking about this makes me ask something: what do you guys prefer going to a good team where your position in the lineup is low like 4,5,6 or maybe a lower college where you are going to play high in the lineup? What is the best option to improve a lot in your game?

 

[andfor]

Hi everyone, i think that what you said guys is very important, the results are not the most important thing. I think I prefer go to a place that maybe I can't win a lot but maybe I will improve in my game. Talking about this makes me ask something: what do you guys prefer going to a good team where your position in the lineup is low like 4,5,6 or maybe a lower college where you are going to play high in the lineup? What is the best option to improve a lot in your game?

Back in the stone age when I went to college, out of HS I was not college tennis ready. Was lucky to go to a well funded and established NAIA program where the coach did a good job training players like myself who needed time on court, solid coaching and had the desire to improve. My game jumped levels during my freshman year, got to play #8 on varsity #2 JV. We actually had a JV schedule so I did get to play some matches fall and spring freshman year. Also got to play some exhibition matches against 3 DI opponents, winning one against Creighton. Soph - Sr. years played 5 - 2 lines and mostly 2 doubles.

I'd say either path could work. For me it would come down to the college, coach and players. Talk with the players as well, ask them honest questions looking for real answers. Regardless of playing high or low in the line up look for a school and program that is the best match for you.

 

[jcgatennismom]

Hi everyone, i think that what you said guys is very important, the results are not the most important thing. I think I prefer go to a place that maybe I can't win a lot but maybe I will improve in my game. Talking about this makes me ask something: what do you guys prefer going to a good team where your position in the lineup is low like 4,5,6 or maybe a lower college where you are going to play high in the lineup? What is the best option to improve a lot in your game?

The players lower in the lineup improve by practicing with guys higher in the lineup. However, the guys higher in the lineup get more athletic $. So players have to make a choice-do I want to play at a college where I come in somewhere between #5-#8, I'll probably improve but I will have to walk on or get very low $. Or do I want to attend a college where I will play 1 or 2, earn a big scholarship, but my tennis level could stay the same or drop (that wont happen at P5, but could happen at MM D1 and other divisions depending on level of competition). Best bet aim for college where you can play #3-4, you will get better, and you probably will get some athletic aid. Now there are US players who can afford to go to any college, and for those guys, they will aim for the highest tennis level college even if they walk on and dont know if they will get to play. Other option, choose the highest level public in-state school that will take you on the team-you will at least have low tuition even if you walk on.

In following college results, I have seen walk ons improve a lot in college and earn athletic $ for their soph year but there is no guarantee... I know of former TRN 2 stars who play Futures and former 3 stars who won matches vs a D1 top 30 teams-rare but it happens.

 

[Spadea]

I’m an assistant coach at a D1 university. Full unedited match play.

And you guys are correct. Utr and tennis recruiting are things that are used as cutoffs to weed out other recruits. Think of rankings and ratings as a test score. Then the match play video is sort of an interview.

 

[Bronc10is]

I didn't get recruited until coaches saw me play live tournament/match play. Once I received some letters of interest, I invited the coaches who were not too far away to come watch a training session - ended up getting a handful of offers and a few extra letters. In New Jersey, there is a statewide tennis tournament where college coaches really start watching once you get to the final 64 in the state. Other than that, I sent in rankings, high school record and particular match results against other high ranked players to schools to try to garner attention.

 

[texrunner]

My daughter’s video was a shortened version of a pro set she played at one of those showcases. They recorded the entire match but we edited it down for time - I made sure however not to just show all the points she won, but a good cross section of the entire match, especially so a coach could see how she carried herself when she made unforced errors or double faulted. If I were a coach I would want to see that kind of match play so I could see how the player reacts to different things - good and bad - that arise during a match and how or if they keep their composure.

Also if I were a coach who had to look through umpteen videos, background music some players include would drive me crazy, as would a video where it’s obvious the recruit’s “opponent” is hitting in a way that makes the player look good on every single shot.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

Hi everyone, i think that what you said guys is very important, the results are not the most important thing. I think I prefer go to a place that maybe I can't win a lot but maybe I will improve in my game. Talking about this makes me ask something: what do you guys prefer going to a good team where your position in the lineup is low like 4,5,6 or maybe a lower college where you are going to play high in the lineup? What is the best option to improve a lot in your game?

When I went to college, I was playing #1 singles. It was a huge eye-opener for me being in one of the toughest conferences in NCAA D2 and literally playing guys coming off the futures/high level ITF tournaments in their youth. I still remember being shell-shocked by it but it was great. It propelled me to train harder and I ended up getting close to beating 2 guys ranked top 10 in singles my 2nd year in college.

This decision honestly depends on the type of person you are and what you are looking for. Being a top player on the team means you command a lot of respect by default just because of your game. However, with that comes responsibility of making sure that you represent yourself well to the rest of the team and future teammates due to your high level and position held. You are held to a standard by the rest of the team whether you like it or not.

If you play lower in the lineup you hold an equally important role on the team but it is different. You will likely play/fight to keep your spot and constantly strive to get higher up. If this type of tennis activates you then go for it.

For improvement... This depends on the coach. Some coaches really want to take the time to still work with and develop the players they bring in. Many coaches don't really care much to develop a player but rather want to just "teach them how to win" I've seen this plenty in my 4 years of college coaching. My philosophy is the opposite: Make a great athlete, have solid foundations and be disciplined in the game style that works for you. Once you do this, the results (W's) will come! I spend a lot of time with my players adjusting their technique, teaching them new aspects of their game to incorporate and giving them confidence to have the right game that is suited for their physical abilities.

Hope this gives you some insight!

 

[PURETENNISsense]

I'd say either path could work. For me it would come down to the college, coach and players. Talk with the players as well, ask them honest questions looking for real answers. Regardless of playing high or low in the line up look for a school and program that is the best match for you.

Absolutely! Well stated and exactly how it needs to be done!

 

[bobleenov1963]

@PURETENNISsense: I have a few questions and hope you can elaborate on them, if you don't mind:

1- Do you have any regrets playing college tennis? Did you study the major you wanted in college or you changed major because of tennis?
2- How did you find time to study when tennis took up a lot of time? Did you get good grades in college?
3- Do you wish you could have gotten a high paying job after graduating college before jumping into tennis coaching so that you can save for your retirement earlier in career?
4- How long do you think you will continue coaching before deciding that it is time to move on to a better paying job because you did mention that coaching tennis is just barely enough to make a living,

One of my coworkers has a son who graduated from one of the best public magnet schools in the US, Blair HS in Montgomery Maryland, and he is currently attending UCLA Computer Engineering program. He is spending, on average, about 80 hours for both classes and studying time. He was the top 0.5% in his class with 1590 SAT. He said that every students at UCLA computer engineering was a superstar at their high school. You're talking about academic competition at a completely different level. He is not even getting all A's in his classes even when he spends 80 hours per week studying.

I played golf yesterday with a former baseball player who graduated from Tulane, with a degree in biology. He spent five years in the minor for the San Francisco Giants and quit after. He is now coaching youth baseball full-time. He is 30 years old, and barely making enough to live with no savings and retirements.

 

[andfor]

 

[LOBALOT]

The players lower in the lineup improve by practicing with guys higher in the lineup. However, the guys higher in the lineup get more athletic $. So players have to make a choice-do I want to play at a college where I come in somewhere between #5-#8, I'll probably improve but I will have to walk on or get very low $. Or do I want to attend a college where I will play 1 or 2, earn a big scholarship, but my tennis level could stay the same or drop (that wont happen at P5, but could happen at MM D1 and other divisions depending on level of competition). Best bet aim for college where you can play #3-4, you will get better, and you probably will get some athletic aid. Now there are US players who can afford to go to any college, and for those guys, they will aim for the highest tennis level college even if they walk on and dont know if they will get to play. Other option, choose the highest level public in-state school that will take you on the team-you will at least have low tuition even if you walk on.

In following college results, I have seen walk ons improve a lot in college and earn athletic $ for their soph year but there is no guarantee... I know of former TRN 2 stars who play Futures and former 3 stars who won matches vs a D1 top 30 teams-rare but it happens.

We are in the thick of this whole process with my son right now. He is half way through his Senior year of High School. The pandemic has made it a slow process.

His strong academic performance, our desire to be somewhat close (He is our only child), our financial situation (I lost my job with the pandemic, my company brought me back, but will most likely furlough me again come the holidays), etc. add to a matrix of measures that add complexity to his decision. Fortunately, he has some very good opportunities he is evaluating.

He has a recruiting video and it is linked to his tennis recruiting dot net profile. It is a bit out of date now as it was created last December and a lot changes at this age. I think the video gives the coach an initial assessment but then once the player is a little further in the process the video loses its usefulness to the coaches vs. other items like wanting to see the prospect compete in a match, phone interviews, academic performance, etc.

I am not sure if you have seen but the UTR app has a Power 6 feature which is helpful in identifying a college. When one looks up a team on UTR it lists next to the team a Power 6 number. This is a sum of the top 6 player UTRs on the team. One then can take that number and divide by 6 and then take the prospect's forecasted UTR as an incoming Freshman and if they are the same or close to the same the prospect will fall into a range somewhere within the top 6 players on the team (Not highest so they are pushed by teammates and not the lowest so they make the starting lineup and play).

They also have a search feature where one can enter the prospects UTR and it will return D1, D2, D3, NAIA, etc. teams that are a good match based on above.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

@PURETENNISsense: I have a few questions and hope you can elaborate on them, if you don't mind:

1- Do you have any regrets playing college tennis? Did you study the major you wanted in college or you changed major because of tennis?
2- How did you find time to study when tennis took up a lot of time? Did you get good grades in college?
3- Do you wish you could have gotten a high paying job after graduating college before jumping into tennis coaching so that you can save for your retirement earlier in career?
4- How long do you think you will continue coaching before deciding that it is time to move on to a better paying job because you did mention that coaching tennis is just barely enough to make a living,

One of my coworkers has a son who graduated from one of the best public magnet schools in the US, Blair HS in Montgomery Maryland, and he is currently attending UCLA Computer Engineering program. He is spending, on average, about 80 hours for both classes and studying time. He was the top 0.5% in his class with 1590 SAT. He said that every students at UCLA computer engineering was a superstar at their high school. You're talking about academic competition at a completely different level. He is not even getting all A's in his classes even when he spends 80 hours per week studying.

I played golf yesterday with a former baseball player who graduated from Tulane, with a degree in biology. He spent five years in the minor for the San Francisco Giants and quit after. He is now coaching youth baseball full-time. He is 30 years old, and barely making enough to live with no savings and retirements.

1) I chose the non-tradional path for college tennis. I played 2 years of D2 tennis and then transferred to a major state school to finish my major in Architecture. Did not play tennis there (it was a high-ranked NCAA D1 college). At the D2 school I studied core classes and knocked them out of the way. Still had to take 4 years at the major state Uni but that was due to architecture requiring 4 years of Studio (drawing/design) classes. My senior year I was only required to take the studio class due to having plenty of credits so I got to take anything else I wanted which was great. I signed up for some really cool grad classes and got a lot of interaction with some very intellectual students in grad programs.
So I didn't play 4 years of college tennis. Just 2 years, I don't regret it but it did continue to fuel the fire to play competitively after my degree. I played 3-4 years of National opens, Mopens, prize money events and futurues qualies after I graduated.
2) I had solid GPA from my D2 college while being a student-athlete. For me at the time tennis was still very important to excel at so the balance was difficult but nothing I couldn't learn to handle from one semester to the next.
3) Not at all. I absolutely enjoy and am passionate about coaching. It also gave me the liberty to travel and compete while still making a living when I was back in town. What corporate job allows you to leave anytime you want during the week, month, year and come back for the same pay, no changes. I know retirement is important but for my personal lifestyle I try and stay very healthy and active and want to have a positive impact to others in the tennis world so I'd be happy coaching tennis as a career (at least for now).
4) So I'll elaborate on this. "better paying" or "high paying" as you put it is HIGHLY subjective to each individual. College coaching can be something that pays enough but it truly depends on the institution you coach at and your expertise/experience in the field. At least that's how I see it. People can supplement income in different ways and that's what I do with the college gig. I have private lessons I do to take care of the rest of my needs for my family.

To each person, struggle in their field of study or work is what they make of it. There have been times in my life where I have to work 65-70hrs a week and some where I've worked 25-30hrs a week and made the exact same amount. In the field of coaching, there are different avenues to make your life what it is.

I'll end with this: If coaching a sport vs having a corporate job can only be compared by the amount of money someone makes then that's not really a conversation I would talk about much. There are motives and reasons why people choose their careers, sometimes by choice, sometimes necessity and many times, we have no idea why. To me, financial stability is what you make of it. Each person may have a "set amount" they deem as getting by, making a living or whatever they want to call it. If people are happy and living a healthy lifestyle, to each their own.

 

[jcgatennismom]

I am not sure if you have seen but the UTR app has a Power 6 feature which is helpful in identifying a college. When one looks up a team on UTR it lists next to the team a Power 6 number. This is a sum of the top 6 player UTRs on the team. One then can take that number and divide by 6 and then take the prospect's forecasted UTR as an incoming Freshman and if they are the same or close to the same the prospect will fall into a range somewhere within the top 6 players on the team (Not highest so they are pushed by teammates and not the lowest so they make the starting lineup and play). They also have a search feature where one can enter the prospects UTR and it will return D1, D2, D3, NAIA, etc. teams that are a good match based on above.

I am well aware of that feature. I would say outside the guys currently playing on P5 rosters that most juniors drop in UTR in college. Let's say your son is UTR 12 and sees there are current players ranked around 12 playing in the lineup. You may assume your son would play in the lineup. However, if you look at the historical stats of those players, they may have been 1.0+ when recruited as juniors. My son in D1 played over 100 college matches before the pandemic, winning 75% of them and yet he is ranked .6 below his highest jr ranking. People have to take junior rankings with a grain of salt.

"our desire to be somewhat close" This is key with pandemic. Our son is an 10-11 hr drive away. If we'd had a crystal ball, we would have encouraged him to take an offer close to home. At least he didnt take the offer 17 hours from home!

Good luck to your son.

 

[LOBALOT]

I am well aware of that feature. I would say outside the guys currently playing on P5 rosters that most juniors drop in UTR in college. Let's say your son is UTR 12 and sees there are current players ranked around 12 playing in the lineup. You may assume your son would play in the lineup. However, if you look at the historical stats of those players, they may have been 1.0+ when recruited as juniors. My son in D1 played over 100 college matches before the pandemic, winning 75% of them and yet he is ranked .6 below his highest jr ranking. People have to take junior rankings with a grain of salt.

"our desire to be somewhat close" This is key with pandemic. Our son is an 10-11 hr drive away. If we'd had a crystal ball, we would have encouraged him to take an offer close to home. At least he didnt take the offer 17 hours from home!

Good luck to your son.

Yes, and this is one of several nuances in identifying what schools to explore as an opportunity.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

Yes, and this is one of several nuances in identifying what schools to explore as an opportunity.

I think that a potential recruit should make the decision with their family. This is a choice (quite likely) for the next four years of life/development/adulthood, etc. It's a very big deal and is one that can bring the family closer or apart depending on how the family chemistry is to begin with. At least this is what I've noticed in my family for 2 of us that went on to play college tennis and from many of the athletes I've seen in my time coaching college tennis.

Student-Athletes sometimes make a choice without realizing the bigger picture or effects that it can have on them and their growth. However, this is life and as we make these choices we can also come up with alternate solutions to them as well. Transferring to another institution, though a difficult choice, teaches a young student-athlete how to effectively (hopefully effectively) communicate with their family, friends, teammates and Coach about their decision to move and seek opportunities elsewhere. I think this is an important lesson to learn at a young age if it comes to it and understand the right way of make this choice and having this conversation. I've had athletes come to me and talk to me very respectfully and at the right moments (well before season is completed to ensure I can find a replacement for them). I've also had some that just don't even show up the next term with almost no communication. Not sure what to make of the latter but I think in the end it's a good life lesson to learn.

We all end up leaving a job one day in our 20s or 30s. Sometimes due to unforseen circumstances and sometimes due to poor management. How do we handle this? What do we say? Maybe for some they can think back on the lessons learned from college to make this decision respectfully and effectively.

 

[bobleenov1963]

I think that a potential recruit should make the decision with their family. This is a choice (quite likely) for the next four years of life/development/adulthood, etc. It's a very big deal and is one that can bring the family closer or apart depending on how the family chemistry is to begin with. At least this is what I've noticed in my family for 2 of us that went on to play college tennis and from many of the athletes I've seen in my time coaching college tennis.

Student-Athletes sometimes make a choice without realizing the bigger picture or effects that it can have on them and their growth. However, this is life and as we make these choices we can also come up with alternate solutions to them as well. Transferring to another institution, though a difficult choice, teaches a young student-athlete how to effectively (hopefully effectively) communicate with their family, friends, teammates and Coach about their decision to move and seek opportunities elsewhere. I think this is an important lesson to learn at a young age if it comes to it and understand the right way of make this choice and having this conversation. I've had athletes come to me and talk to me very respectfully and at the right moments (well before season is completed to ensure I can find a replacement for them). I've also had some that just don't even show up the next term with almost no communication. Not sure what to make of the latter but I think in the end it's a good life lesson to learn.

We all end up leaving a job one day in our 20s or 30s. Sometimes due to unforseen circumstances and sometimes due to poor management. How do we handle this? What do we say? Maybe for some they can think back on the lessons learned from college to make this decision respectfully and effectively.

@PURETENNISsense: Wow... Not only you taught your students/athletes tennis, you also taught them how to succeed in life. You're a wonderful human being.

 

[PURETENNISsense]

@PURETENNISsense: Wow... Not only you taught your students/athletes tennis, you also taught them how to succeed in life. You're a wonderful human being.

I appreciate the kind words. I don't think that my job ends at just coaching tennis. For many coaches our responsibility is to mentor in a positive and constructive way as well instruct on the sport. They go hand in hand especially for students growing towards independent adulthood.

 

[andfor]

1) I chose the non-tradional path for college tennis. I played 2 years of D2 tennis and then transferred to a major state school to finish my major in Architecture. Did not play tennis there (it was a high-ranked NCAA D1 college). At the D2 school I studied core classes and knocked them out of the way. Still had to take 4 years at the major state Uni but that was due to architecture requiring 4 years of Studio (drawing/design) classes. My senior year I was only required to take the studio class due to having plenty of credits so I got to take anything else I wanted which was great. I signed up for some really cool grad classes and got a lot of interaction with some very intellectual students in grad programs.
So I didn't play 4 years of college tennis. Just 2 years, I don't regret it but it did continue to fuel the fire to play competitively after my degree. I played 3-4 years of National opens, Mopens, prize money events and futurues qualies after I graduated.
2) I had solid GPA from my D2 college while being a student-athlete. For me at the time tennis was still very important to excel at so the balance was difficult but nothing I couldn't learn to handle from one semester to the next.
3) Not at all. I absolutely enjoy and am passionate about coaching. It also gave me the liberty to travel and compete while still making a living when I was back in town. What corporate job allows you to leave anytime you want during the week, month, year and come back for the same pay, no changes. I know retirement is important but for my personal lifestyle I try and stay very healthy and active and want to have a positive impact to others in the tennis world so I'd be happy coaching tennis as a career (at least for now).
4) So I'll elaborate on this. "better paying" or "high paying" as you put it is HIGHLY subjective to each individual. College coaching can be something that pays enough but it truly depends on the institution you coach at and your expertise/experience in the field. At least that's how I see it. People can supplement income in different ways and that's what I do with the college gig. I have private lessons I do to take care of the rest of my needs for my family.

To each person, struggle in their field of study or work is what they make of it. There have been times in my life where I have to work 65-70hrs a week and some where I've worked 25-30hrs a week and made the exact same amount. In the field of coaching, there are different avenues to make your life what it is.

I'll end with this: If coaching a sport vs having a corporate job can only be compared by the amount of money someone makes then that's not really a conversation I would talk about much. There are motives and reasons why people choose their careers, sometimes by choice, sometimes necessity and many times, we have no idea why. To me, financial stability is what you make of it. Each person may have a "set amount" they deem as getting by, making a living or whatever they want to call it. If people are happy and living a healthy lifestyle, to each their own.

Thanks for your thoughtful response.

Regarding the money, we all know people that make more than us and barely get by. They just have more "nice" junk!

A former college team mate of mine has his masters and coached for around 15 years, grad asst. Pwr 6, then head coach mid-major (had a player from that school make ATP top 50) then on to a larger mid-major where he is now in their HoF and retired from college coaching now. He has a sales job and coaches a HS team. During his last college coaching job and for 11 years, he and his wife lived in different cities due to her executive corp job. He's happy to be together with his family and in his sales role and still involved in tennis.

Your wrap with "If people are happy and living a healthy lifestyle, to each their own" really is great advise.

If you don't mind DM me, I'd like to follow your team.