Checkmate
Legend
Djokovic's approaches sometimes make me miss Roddick.
2018 ATP Finals RR - (1.) Novak Djokovic vs. (3.) Alexander Zverev
- Thread starter Enceladus
- Start date
Djokovic's approaches sometimes make me miss Roddick.
Luka888
Professional
Nice clean hitting by Djokovic who still hasn't got over that cold. He was sniffing and coughing, using some Kleenex during the match. Although Zverev hit so many aces his second serve was bad, around 36% or so points won. Djokovic's both first and second serve were above or around 70% which is good. Djokovic didn't even serve that well or shall I say to his standards, had a few strange DF etc.
Anyway it was painful to watch Zverev who completely fall apart in the second set. I'm wondering where Zverev's heart is. You do not play against a player who's name is Novak Djokovic like that, you are supposed to give 100% and my impression is that Zverev simply self destructed and gave up if you wish. Where was Zverev's brain? His BH is a huge liability. He made so many UE from his BH side.
I'm very disappointed with Zverev's mentality. No wonder that some of you wonder why younger players are not winning majors and getting pretty much nowhere. Watch this match and you'll see why. IMHO, Djokovic was there for taking. He looked tired in the first set and he is obviously still stick with that cold. Yet, he did his part, played to the end ... That's how you define a heart of a champion. Never give up, never.
Anyway it was painful to watch Zverev who completely fall apart in the second set. I'm wondering where Zverev's heart is. You do not play against a player who's name is Novak Djokovic like that, you are supposed to give 100% and my impression is that Zverev simply self destructed and gave up if you wish. Where was Zverev's brain? His BH is a huge liability. He made so many UE from his BH side.
I'm very disappointed with Zverev's mentality. No wonder that some of you wonder why younger players are not winning majors and getting pretty much nowhere. Watch this match and you'll see why. IMHO, Djokovic was there for taking. He looked tired in the first set and he is obviously still stick with that cold. Yet, he did his part, played to the end ... That's how you define a heart of a champion. Never give up, never.
Don't worry, you are better off by being illiterate. You can't develop olfaction and cognition equally. You have to sacrifice one or the other.
mike danny
Bionic Poster
I missed the match thinking there is no way they won't put Djokovic in the evening session.
Who the heck wants to watch Cilic-Isner in the evening session?
Who the heck wants to watch Cilic-Isner in the evening session?
Red Rick
Bionic Poster
I don't think he's even officially qualified yet.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Yea Lendl improved Murray's forehand quite a bit. It was never his strongest shot but it was a lot better than earlier in his career and he should be able to do the same for Zverev. At least today, Zverev didn't net every other volley like he usually does but he definitely needs to improve up there. He's like a deer in headlights everytime he's up at net. From the baseline, on a medium court like this, Djokovic is just better and moves better. Zverev slowly unraveled because he was getting bested in all the longer rallies and then tried going for more and the errors started piling up. I think that's why he kept trying to come in because he knew he couldn't beat him from back there. He will get better though and 3 Masters wins already shows he has potential if he puts it all together.
alexio
G.O.A.T.
yes
Checkmate
Legend
lol wut.
Red Rick
Bionic Poster
Cilic beats Isner and DJokovic in straights and Zverev beats Isner in straights it's all equal in sets and it's about games.
DJoko basically needs to avoid the bakery product, which he smartly already does cause of the gluten allergy
alexio
G.O.A.T.
and in games djoko wins anyway..he lost too little games comparing with other guys
tennis4jags
Semi-Pro
Anybody read his lips share what he was trying to shout?Street has added the hand to the back to post loss of point routine
George Turner
Hall of Fame
Chanwan
G.O.A.T.
Not being a fan of either, I would have liked to see, what would have happened had Zverev broken at 4-all in the first. Would he have won the first? He was serving bullets in that set up until he failed to break. And Novak was pretty meh as he said afterwards.
I honestly don't think it was Novak's game that did Z in today (even though he will obviously beat him from the back court) as much as the complete lack of belief post the non-break for Z and the subsequent gifted break to Novak. He just unravelled. Much like pretty much every losing player has been doing this WTF.
Pheasant
Legend
Wow. Djoker is unplayable now. I fully-recognize that Djoker has a decent shot at shattering most of the important records. And it doesn't require the trashing of an all-time great(Federer) to boost this guy up.
I have said it before and I'll say it again. I think that Djoker is better now than he has ever been. And if that's the case, then his chance at shattering nearly all of the records are much better than I previously thought. And if I'm right, then that's another way he is quite unique from anybody else in history. He is playing the best old man tennis of anybody in history, except for Rod Laver(Calendar Slam during his age 31 season).
If Djoker is peaking like I think he is, then it's another example of why he might become the GOAT in a very short period of time. It actually helps his case. Djokovic can bail himself out of jams with his serves now. He didn't do that before. This Djoker can now win Cinci. And he can wins Masters without dropping a set. These are firsts for him. Djoker is now 33-2 in his last 35 matches. This includes 12 consecutive wins against the top 10. That is remarkable.
It is actually fun to watch a guy make history. A 31 year old winning 12 straight against the top 10 is insane. Let's see how far this guy can push it.
I obviously want Fed to win everything. But I also appreciate when another player is incredible. This Djokovic is insane. I have a feeling that if Fed doesn't step up and slow this monster down, then nobody will. Fed will need epic performances to prevent Djoker from becoming the GOAT. Fed better start with Kandy in his next match.
Congrats to Novak for a remarkable comeback. He is an insane player. I cannot believe any of this; I really can't.
I have said it before and I'll say it again. I think that Djoker is better now than he has ever been. And if that's the case, then his chance at shattering nearly all of the records are much better than I previously thought. And if I'm right, then that's another way he is quite unique from anybody else in history. He is playing the best old man tennis of anybody in history, except for Rod Laver(Calendar Slam during his age 31 season).
If Djoker is peaking like I think he is, then it's another example of why he might become the GOAT in a very short period of time. It actually helps his case. Djokovic can bail himself out of jams with his serves now. He didn't do that before. This Djoker can now win Cinci. And he can wins Masters without dropping a set. These are firsts for him. Djoker is now 33-2 in his last 35 matches. This includes 12 consecutive wins against the top 10. That is remarkable.
It is actually fun to watch a guy make history. A 31 year old winning 12 straight against the top 10 is insane. Let's see how far this guy can push it.
I obviously want Fed to win everything. But I also appreciate when another player is incredible. This Djokovic is insane. I have a feeling that if Fed doesn't step up and slow this monster down, then nobody will. Fed will need epic performances to prevent Djoker from becoming the GOAT. Fed better start with Kandy in his next match.
Congrats to Novak for a remarkable comeback. He is an insane player. I cannot believe any of this; I really can't.
Nostradamus
Bionic Poster
Sasha was injured. he should have taken this week off and rest to get ready for Aussie open. this is psychologically not good for him , but he is ready to destroy Novak in 2019
Red Rick
Bionic Poster
Zverev has what I like to call a chronical talent injury
Chanwan
G.O.A.T.
Is that a serious comment?
The guy's been beyond the 4th round 3 times in his career in a slam, yet he 'probably has a couple of majors without Fedovic around'??
Once, he got a complete calk walk to the US Open final and laid an egg.
Another time he beat a Fed who went awol after the first set and then Isner in Isner's very first semi final.
And in 2015, he got to the QF of the US Open after beating Muzz, before getting blizted by Stan in the QF.
There's no era, where Anderson wins a couple of majors. The only era where he makes a couple of finals is the current.
Guy has a 20,8 % winn percentage vs. top-10. To put that number into perspective, the 2nd and 3rd worst in the current top-10 (Cilic and Isner) in that stat are both between 29-30 percent.
The only top-20 players worse than Kandy in this stat are Fognini, Edmund, Medvedev, Schwartzman and Cecchinato - Medvedev might develop into something, but the others are not exactly slam-contenders.
He's been to the 4th round of a slam numerous times, but he's essentially spend his slam career losing between the 1st and the 4th round, yet he probably hass a couple of majors if not for Federer and Djokovic??
The dude has 1 ATP 500 title (won 2 weeks ago), precious few weeks in the top-10 and 4 250's and his RU's are mostly 250's as well (with the 2 slam RU's as notable exceptions).
He's failed to do squat for most of his career until the tour utterly sucked.
I honestly struggle to find a worse player than Kandy who's made 2 slam finals. And most one slam RU's have him easily beaten as well
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alexio
G.O.A.T.
healthy nadal has better chances to slow him down than 37-old fed
Can't you see that Anderson has massively improved in the last year? He is 10 times player he was few years ago. He will improve further and will be one of main contenders in the future.
Nostradamus
Bionic Poster
would you believe me if I told you that Sasha is actually more talented than Novak ? I seen Sasha play in person and it just seems like his mental approach was off. Mentally he doesn't focus every points, like every 3rd point, he loses focus. However his ball striking talent is better than Novak
Zverev (Khachanov) is the next step in tennis evolution. Combination of Karlovic and Djokovic. In my time, players of that size could not walk.
Nostradamus
Bionic Poster
Right, guys that size all moved around like Ivo. but now they move like Michael Chang. They will start winning majors, and Sasha is more talented than Karen. if you had to pick who is more talented
alexio
G.O.A.T.
Red Rick
Bionic Poster
I would believe that you believed that
I don't know. Khachanov seems to have better attitude and mentality. That is crucial. On the other hand, Zverev is so successful. He is very young for current standards and yet a serious contender.
Pheasant
Legend
I don't doubt your statement one bit. But I don't think Nadal will be enough by himself. And Nadal being healthy at this age is no guarantee either. Truthfully, I'm not counting on much help from Nadal, except on clay. Fed somehow beating Djokovic in the 2019 AO final would go a long ways towards fending Djoker off. I realize that this is a long shot. But this would really put a damper in Djoker's attempt to eclipse him. For one, that puts Federer ahead 7-6 in AO titles. And secondly, that puts him up 21-14 in slams. And I really believe that Federer will need to pull something like this off. Also, Federer will need to pull off a miracle at this 2018 WTF in order to prevent Djoker from tying his record of 6 titles.
I would love nothing more than for Fed to have one last miracle 12-13 month period starting right now. I want Fed to show the world that he won't let his records be broken quietly.
With all of that being said, I'll happily congratulate the people that break his records. And there won't be any lame excuses. If Nadal and Federer retired today, then I'd still congratulate Djoker for passing both of them. After all, you still have to be the best in the world to win tourneys. Anything besides getting the actual numbers doesn't matter. Excuses are for the birds and they don't work in the real world anyway. And nobody cares. You either have the records, or you don't.
This is Fed's wake up call. Djoker is there for the taking. Can Fed stop him? I hope so. But I wouldn't bet on it.
Fed plays to stop him. These 3 will play forever.
swordtennis
G.O.A.T.
He is a big server with a solid ground game. And mentally wants to win. He got to the us open final where the courts were litterally slower than some clay courts. Not his fault he had to play nadal and djokovic.
NoleFam
Bionic Poster
Yes he definitely unraveled there after getting broken, and mentally checked out.
Chanwan
G.O.A.T.
And who did he beat to get to meet Nadal? Querrey and clay courter PCB. You can't expect not to play Fed, Djoko or Rafa in a slam in the past 15 years. They're there.
If you look at his career, it's extremely surprising he's got 2 slam RU's compared to everything else he's done and not done. He had 2 good slam runs in his life and you think he should have multiple majors?
His win percentage vs. top-10 is telling as I wrote. It's usually a good indicator of how well a non Big-3 player is performing vs. the best of the best and Kevin's performance vs. top-10 is well below what you would expect for a 2 times slam RU and more akin to your average top-15 to top-25 player.
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George Turner
Hall of Fame
How has this thread turned into a debate about KAndyman?
As for today. Zverev showed in the first set his best game is as good as Djokovics. He just needs to reproduce it more often and improve the mentality.
As for today. Zverev showed in the first set his best game is as good as Djokovics. He just needs to reproduce it more often and improve the mentality.
abmk
Bionic Poster
gross exaggeration of the slowness of the USO courts in 17.
secondly he wants to win by laying an egg vs Nadal and Djokovic in those finals ?
definitely the worst player to get to 2 slam finals (in full majors) in the open era as Chanwan has clearly shown.
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
The prediction was one game away from the real score.
abmk
Bionic Poster
to elaborate...
Anderson returned like sh*t and played well below par from the ground in the USO 17 final compared to how he was doing before. serving was far too predictable.
celebrated like he had already won the USO after winning the semi vs PCB.
As far as Wim 18 final goes, he played like sh*t in the 1st 2 sets. If he had only played like he did in the 3rd set from the beginning, it could have been a competitive match.
Anderson returned like sh*t and played well below par from the ground in the USO 17 final compared to how he was doing before. serving was far too predictable.
celebrated like he had already won the USO after winning the semi vs PCB.
As far as Wim 18 final goes, he played like sh*t in the 1st 2 sets. If he had only played like he did in the 3rd set from the beginning, it could have been a competitive match.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
Disappointing end from Zverev. After narrowly losing the 1st set (had several break points to serve out for it) he folded like a cheap tent. Only managed 1 more game. It was like the fight had gone completely out of him after losing that 1st set where he had had chances.
I know Djokovic in Flight Mode can have that effect on his opponents but it's something a top player like Zverev has got to address and overcome. He can't just live in the hope that Djokovic will go away at some point (one day he will of course but that is likely to be a good few years down the road yet).
Can Uncle Ivan put some steel into his young pupil's backbone? I would have loved to be a fly on the wall at their post match debriefing!
I know Djokovic in Flight Mode can have that effect on his opponents but it's something a top player like Zverev has got to address and overcome. He can't just live in the hope that Djokovic will go away at some point (one day he will of course but that is likely to be a good few years down the road yet).
Can Uncle Ivan put some steel into his young pupil's backbone? I would have loved to be a fly on the wall at their post match debriefing!
George Turner
Hall of Fame
Not surprising, he's had a long season.
I'd like to see the season shortened by about a month, a few less matches would mean more quality tennis overall.
Does the tour really need Paris?
alexio
G.O.A.T.
pride is the most serious of the seven deadly sins..don't forgetThe prediction was one game away from the real score.
Meles
Bionic Poster
Enceladus
Legend
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