Caroline Wozniacki rejects apology from Maria Sharapova's agent
- Thread starter THUNDERVOLLEY
- Start date
Sentinel
Bionic Poster
That too a private email. Quite an irony considering that Maria never read her emails
Sentinel
Bionic Poster
LOL, not being extended a red carpet amounts to further punishment.
cc0509
Talk Tennis Guru
How will additional negative incidents or comments hurt Sharapova more than a drug ban did? Plus, IMO what her agent said about Wozniacki and Radwanska was dead on even if it wasn't nice. Have either of those women won any slams?
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
No one reads all of their emails nor all of your posts, so where is the irony in that?
That too a private email. Quite an irony considering that Maria never read her emails
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Red carpet? Wildcards belong to tournaments, not to Sharapova. They are theirs to give to Sharapova, as the Head of the WTA made clear, if they so choose.
Sentinel
Bionic Poster
So then how is it further punishment if they have a choice.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
It is further punishment when the head of the FO makes the suspension itself the reason for his decision, and who then suggested his hands were tied by the rules when they were not - as the head of the WTA made clear.
Here's the paradox: It's hard to actually deny Sharapova a wild card given that the only reason not to - the suspension - is one that you really shouldn't invoke as it involves further punishment.
I've looked at the wild cards given - and one was given to a suspended gambler and another one to someone who has since engaged in sexual assault - and none of them match the quality of Sharapova.
Here's the paradox: It's hard to actually deny Sharapova a wild card given that the only reason not to - the suspension - is one that you really shouldn't invoke as it involves further punishment.
I've looked at the wild cards given - and one was given to a suspended gambler and another one to someone who has since engaged in sexual assault - and none of them match the quality of Sharapova.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
So if you haven't won a Slam does that make you "a journeyman"? Wozniacki is at least a former world #1.
Very true!
People for some reason fail to recognize that you can say whatever you please, but have still have to deal with the consequences if you are being an a-hole.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
It was a tit-for-tat insult. The agent then sued for peace and despite being the instigator of the feud, Wozniack rejected peace.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
Hardly. Wozniacki was commentating on whether Sharapova should receive wildcards, not disparaging her record as a player.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
When you are attacking/insulting someone you pick on their weakness: in Sharapova's case the suspension and in Wozniacki's case her relative failure after great early promise.
Insulting someone does not follow the rules of strict argumentation, as you should know judging from what goes on around here.
Insulting someone does not follow the rules of strict argumentation, as you should know judging from what goes on around here.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
You might argue Ferrer is a journeyman, for example, even if that vastly understates his achievements, so it is a very mild slight.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
In which case the guy representing Sharapova has clearly lost his case since he failed to address the issue Wozniacki had raised and merely chose to insult her personally.
Jackuar
Hall of Fame
There's a difference between "consistent No.4 for 5-7 years" vs "No.1 for 6 month and no where seen in next 6 years". Just because she reached No.1 for a brief period doesn't make her a pro forever.
In that sense, I'd even say Tommy Haas is right now a Journeyman. The term is not about "what it means to a player's status"; its rather about "what his current position is". Nothing less prestigious in getting called a journeyman, if afterall, that's how your career is turning out to be with ridiculous losses to nobody and everybody. Nothing wrong in calling a spade a spade.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Wozniacki did not raise an issue. She joined the lynch mob demanding more punishment. Eisenberg responded in kind, unwisely. in any event, they are not arguing about anything.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
I'm happy to call Wozniacki a flash in the pan rather than a journeyman, but she has made it back to 12 in the world so I was generous.
Jackuar
Hall of Fame
Yeah, agreed. That fits better, sure. But I stick with my thought. Even journeyman is not "wrong"; sure, its less fitting, but not "wrong" to such an extent that one should apologise, get reprimanded etc.
The world needs to move away from being way too 'politically right' (or what ever else right, geographically, racially, emotionally, demographically, culturally, blah blah) every single time.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
But he didn't respond in kind. He failed to address the issue under discussion and had to resort to lobbying personal insults.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
I think you meant 'lobbing'. And there was no issue under discussion. Sharapova served her suspension and Wozniacki failed to move on and instead engaged in 'lobbying' for further punishment.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
I probably did although I suspect this guy may have been 'lobbying' for Wozniacki to be termed " a journeyman". If he had merely pointed out that Sharapova had already been sufficiently punished, he would have made a good case for his client but, instead, he actually undermined it by indulging in the diversionary and irrelevent tactic of personal insults. Sharapova should tell this guy to shut the **** up pronto or publicly repudiate his right to speak on her behalf.
xFullCourtTenniSx
Hall of Fame
Clearly, the problem here was that he was assuming genders. When will people learn? Don't assume genders. "Journeyperson", or better yet "Journeyer", would've been the safe route to go. (Soon enough, you won't be able to assume species either! I identify as a turkey.)
Is that why you're a Djokovic fan? I can respect that. Sometimes you want someone to do well when everyone is giving them more sh*t than they deserve, just to shut up the haters. At the same time, I could almost never do that for Djokovic. I understand now that an unfair chunk of my dislike towards him is a result of his family. I've come to fully respect his abilities on the tennis court for a while though. There's only so many "dgaf lucky" return winners you can hit in a row before you have to admit it's not lucky. But I just can't bring myself to like the guy.
cc0509
Talk Tennis Guru
Meh. They're(Wozniacki and Radwanska) nothing more than very good journeymen/women, let's be honest. Their achievements pale compared to Sharapova's.
Indeed, most people have no idea anymore what Freedom of Speech even means.2017: Freedom of speech is quickly becoming a hollow phrase!
Some people even seem to think that it means you can say whatever you want and people shouldn't be allowed to call you out for it.
Sentinel
Bionic Poster
Ah, so he should have been denied a WC for actions he later committed !
You have no problems calling a kiss and a hug "sexual assault", but meldonium ain't a PED for you.
every7
Hall of Fame
That too a private email. Quite an irony considering that Maria never read her emails
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
I didn't argue that at all, but if you care to glance at his twitter feed you'll see he endorses the idea that the West has undergone a 'devirilisation'.
So why you are excusing a thug is beyond me.
And you will also see that his twitter feed is awash with comments that might even make Margaret Court blush, so the French don't really know much about their players.
So why you are excusing a thug is beyond me.
And you will also see that his twitter feed is awash with comments that might even make Margaret Court blush, so the French don't really know much about their players.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Who says that he would have rejected offering a public apology if Wozniacki asked for one, which she did not.
If the Poles want to take on the Russian's agent for rubbing their nose in the dirt for not winning a slam then that's their choice.
They are the ones who joined the lynch mob trying to get a de facto extension of the Russian's suspension in the first place.
It's a petty squabble, in any event. What Hamou did, on the other hand, borders on the barbaric.
If the Poles want to take on the Russian's agent for rubbing their nose in the dirt for not winning a slam then that's their choice.
They are the ones who joined the lynch mob trying to get a de facto extension of the Russian's suspension in the first place.
It's a petty squabble, in any event. What Hamou did, on the other hand, borders on the barbaric.
newpball
Legend
It is not about not calling someone out, that's fine, counter it if you disagree!
But what some people want is to punish people for legally speaking their mind simply because they do not agree with their speech.
Gary Duane
G.O.A.T.
What is your definition of journeymen/women?
No majors?
Only one?
Where is the line?
I'm asking because I'm curious.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
The only agency stopping free speech is the state ... and now the communications companies that are being advised to censor their platforms.
It is not about not calling someone out, that's fine, counter it if you disagree!
But what some people want is to punish people for legally speaking their mind simply because they do not agree with their speech.
Thriller
Hall of Fame
She hid what she was taking for 10 years. When you take a drugs test you are required to list all the medication that you are taking whether banned or not. She never listed Meldonium.
Doping control forms require players to inform testers of any drugs taken in the previous seven days. Between October 2014 and January 2016 Sharapova signed seven such forms and did not once disclose that she had been taking Mildronate, although she did list other substances.
However, Sharapova told the tribunal that she had taken Mildronate before each of her matches at the Australian Open. It was subsequently revealed that she also failed tests for Meldonium in 2015 at Wimbledon and at the WTA Finals and Fed Cup final later in the year.
However, Sharapova told the tribunal that she had taken Mildronate before each of her matches at the Australian Open. It was subsequently revealed that she also failed tests for Meldonium in 2015 at Wimbledon and at the WTA Finals and Fed Cup final later in the year.
Read the whole article to understand the full scale of her undercover meldonium usage.
http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...n-meldonium-story-doesnt-add-up-a7071881.html
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
Meldonium is not a PED, in any event, but yes she did not disclose so a fine was in order.
The Independent is owned by a former Russian oligarch who fell out with Putin.
Needless to say, they run the FO and MI6 line with gusto.
In any event, the Tribunal's findings were for the most part rejected by CAS, which is a genuinely independent legal tribunal, so it's pointless to quote the Tribunal of first instance.
The Independent is owned by a former Russian oligarch who fell out with Putin.
Needless to say, they run the FO and MI6 line with gusto.
In any event, the Tribunal's findings were for the most part rejected by CAS, which is a genuinely independent legal tribunal, so it's pointless to quote the Tribunal of first instance.
ArcspacE
G.O.A.T.
Log off once and for all, you utter mug
Gary Duane
G.O.A.T.
I'm not hater of Sharapova, but why do you think she neglected to mention the drug?
When I go to a doctor and I'm asked to write down anything I take, I don't leave anything off the list unless I'm trying to hide something, which in my case I am not.
I'm not saying that other players list everything, but the fact that she never mentioned it certainly seems suspicious.
C
Chadillac
Guest
Sharapova didnt send it herself, she doesnt care about woz. Her agent may
hugobosstachini
Professional
LOL his reasoning is just stupid just like many of the irrational people here who probably don't even know what it is to wake up in the morning and do a days work for only recompense another person saying that you worth nothing.
From the Wozniacki point of view, she has all the right to feel hurt. These people are professionals and this is their jobs. Regardless if they did not win a slam or not, they provide the efforts, training and at least try to do something out there. Sometimes, if not most of the times, it happens that there are a group of players or even a single player who is just plain better than you. In this particular case, the common denominator is Williams who denied both Wozniacki and Radwanska's potential for a slam title.
There are about a 1000 players on the tour in which more than half cannot even break even in order to live with their passion. I'm just not sure how it is respectful from somebody in the industry to call people worthless when they're fighting for their daily bread and do not benefit from the Sharapova 'white blond' privilege.
And yes. Not everyone can benefit from the superior infrastructures of the Western society who did well all these years to suck all developing country's riches for their own wellbeing. Not everyone can pay a $500 000 per year to enter an elite so called tennis academy to get top notch training. Not everyone is white and blond with long legs and can get people's money by just crossing her legs in front of 35-40+ yo. white EU/US urban males winning at least $30k+ a year [since this the recurring tennis demographic as per marketing studies].
I am the last to like Wozniacki or Radwanska in terms of their games but this remark from Einsetc was as misplaced as it could be. Nothing surprising after all where many people say that in this world the elite and privileged or so called always make sure to keep the people down and that's where the anger against Sharapova comes from. It comes from a feeling of injustice and most of these players are better placed than the commentators to know about their situation.
Because, let's be frank there for one second...
Without the 1000 players, tennis would never exists. No one would watch ATP or WTA with just four players alone in a draw or just Sharapova against herself. But the thing is, tennis is also certainly one of the most unjust sports out there in terms of how the money is distributed.
To deny the problematic raised by the Sharapova privilege is being stupid. Tennis is at a crossroads and the ITF also knows that. That's also the reason why they engaged a serious reform of the tour. There is a serious case of injustice in the sport and they need to start thinking on more modern techniques to resolve the situation. They need greater diversity. They need better money distribution. They need to control the WC and MTO problematic... and staying on traditions created in prehistory to run a sport in this century is not going to cut it.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
She did have a story prepared about the reasons for not listing it but I can't remember it.
It would indeed be interesting to see whether all athletes are honest about their forms.
I'd be embarrassed if I took that many pills, but the fact is that it was not illegal to do so.
It would indeed be interesting to see whether all athletes are honest about their forms.
I'd be embarrassed if I took that many pills, but the fact is that it was not illegal to do so.
zagor
Bionic Poster
No, Vince Spadea is a journeyman (even then it's probably borderline). Wozniacki reached #1 and two slam finals, earned 20+ millions in prize money etc. I certainly don't have a high opinion of her game but a journey(wo)man she ain't.
Bartelby
Bionic Poster
My sentiments exactly, but no one seems to agree with this position.
So this will go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on.
So this will go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on.