What does Nadal not do well vs Djokovic that he does effectively vs Federer and Murra

[roaringsound]

Over the years Nadal has generally dominated Federer and Murray. Sure he has had some losses here and there, including some big ones, but generally he has had the large upper hand in those matches. Yet he has so much trouble vs Novak Djokovic, performing very poorly in the matchup over the years. What does he not do well vs Djokovic that is not allowing him the kind of success he enjoys vs the other 2 main members of the big 4. Or what is so strong about Djokovic's game that Federer and Murray don't have that allows him to be such a thorn in Nadal's side in a way neither of the other two can be. Well Murray it could be easily explained that he is just not as great a player as the other 3 but most would agree Federer > Djokovic, but even prime Federer generally didn't do nearly as well vs Nadal as Djokovic has done vs Nadal. Since Djokovic reached his prime starting 2011 he has pretty much owned Nadal, while Nadal pretty much owned Federer from day 1.

 

[Vensai]

Well, for Federer it's the left topspin forehand to the one-handed backhand.

 

[roaringsound]

Well, for Federer it's the left topspin forehand to the one-handed backhand.

So Djokovic's far superior backhand is the key weapon that gives him the big advantage vs Nadal?

 

[roaringsound]

I think another difference is while Federer is an excellent defender, mover, and consistent rallyer, he still cant outdefend, outmove, or outlast Nadal even in Federer's peak. Same thing with Murray. While Djokovic is so great in those areas, he is the one person who has a chance to outdo even Nadal in those things, especialy an older, slowed down, and less patient Nadal he is a bit lucky to face, and Federer who is older than nadal never really faced.

 

[bullfan]

Over the years Nadal has generally dominated Federer and Murray. Sure he has had some losses here and there, including some big ones, but generally he has had the large upper hand in those matches. Yet he has so much trouble vs Novak Djokovic, performing very poorly in the matchup over the years. What does he not do well vs Djokovic that is not allowing him the kind of success he enjoys vs the other 2 main members of the big 4. Or what is so strong about Djokovic's game that Federer and Murray don't have that allows him to be such a thorn in Nadal's side in a way neither of the other two can be. Well Murray it could be easily explained that he is just not as great a player as the other 3 but most would agree Federer > Djokovic, but even prime Federer generally didn't do nearly as well vs Nadal as Djokovic has done vs Nadal. Since Djokovic reached his prime starting 2011 he has pretty much owned Nadal, while Nadal pretty much owned Federer from day 1.

Very pitiful post. Nadal pretty much owned Novak until 2011. Nadal has been declining. Novak has skills, and has been more consistent in non slam tournaments since AO 2012.

Nadal has always led the h2h against Fed, but it's only been since Feds decline that it has become completely skewed.

You are off the mark in Novaks Ownage of Nadal in GS since 2011.

Seems like a trolling post to me.

 

[roaringsound]

Very pitiful post. Nadal pretty much owned Novak until 2011. Nadal has been declining. Novak has skills, and has been more consistent in non slam tournaments since AO 2012.

Nadal has always led the h2h against Fed, but it's only been since Feds decline that it has become completely skewed.

You are off the mark in Novaks Ownage of Nadal in GS since 2011.

Seems like a trolling post to me.

The 2012 Australian Open match to me shows Djokovic's ownage of Nadal. Nadal played his absolute best, Djokovic played horrible, Djokovic choked when he should have finished it way sooner, and Djokovic still won. Total ownage. The 2013 French was almost as extreme. Nadal played his absolute best, Djokovic played horrible, and Djokovic still would have won without running into the net.

By contrast I have seen matches Federer has played his absolute best and still lost to below average Nadal (eg- Dubai and Rome 2006).

So as much as Nadal >>>> Federer in that matchup Djokovic >>> Nadal in theirs. The Djokovic-Nadal matches I referenced prove it.

 

[helloworld]

Nadal is 8-3 vs Djokovic in slam..

 

[bullfan]

The 2012 Australian Open match to me shows Djokovic's ownage of Nadal. Nadal played his absolute best, Djokovic played horrible, Djokovic choked when he should have finished it way sooner, and Djokovic still won. Total ownage. The 2013 French was almost as extreme. Nadal played his absolute best, Djokovic played horrible, and Djokovic still would have won without running into the net.

By contrast I have seen matches Federer has played his absolute best and still lost to below average Nadal (eg- Dubai and Rome 2006).

So as much as Nadal >>>> Federer in that matchup Djokovic >>> Nadal in theirs. The Djokovic-Nadal matches I referenced prove it.

Absurd... AO 2012 is less than equal to FO 2013. Nadal was as close to winning to Novak at FO 2013, yet, Nadal wasn't in great form at FO 2013. Both should have won in 4.

You don't have a leg to stand on.

 

[roaringsound]

Absurd... AO 2012 is less than equal to FO 2013. Nadal was as close to winning to Novak at FO 2013, yet, Nadal wasn't in great form at FO 2013. Both should have won in 4.

You don't have a leg to stand on.

Do you dispute the 2012 Australian Open was Nadal playing his absolute best and Djokovic not playing well. Do you dispute that Djokovic should have won in 4 sets and choked to even have it go 5 inspite of being off his game and Nadal playing out of his mind.

Do you dispute the 2013 French which Djokovic so nearly won (probably would have without a call from Pascal) was Nadal in great form and Djokovic in kind of ****** form, and Djokovic was still in winning position.

Given all that, it really sums up the matchup being strongly in Djokovic's favor, just as the Nadal-Federer is so strongly in Nadal's.

 

[ctoth666]

It's really the backhand, honestly. Because Federer is capable of hurting Nadal more in other facets of the game, and his defense at one point was excellent. Top notch. I look at this way: the vulnerability of his backhand changes the whole equation and effects other areas of the game. For instance, have you ever played someone who was able to break down your own backhand? I have, and what ends up happening is that you have to compensate. A big issue is feeling like you have to take more forehands, which usually leads to getting out of position. And then due to having to protect that side, you become vulnerable to being pulled out wide. The reality is that Nadal cannot hurt Djokovic on that side to the same extent that he can Federer, and so it causes him problems because it's pretty much his main tactic.

 

[tipsa...don'tlikehim!]

Given all that, it really sums up the matchup being strongly in Djokovic's favor, just as the Nadal-Federer is so strongly in Nadal's.

You are trolling

Like said above, Nadal is 8-3 against Djokovic in grand slams.

Do you remember the last 3 ?

French open 2013 : won in 5
US open 2013 : won in 4
French open 2014 : won in 4.

Djokovic still gives troubles to Nadal i agree, he's the man on the tour who beat him the most, but saying "the matchup being strongly in Djokovic's favor, just as the Nadal-Federer is so strongly in Nadal's" is absolute bullsh*t.

-

 

[tipsa...don'tlikehim!]

Djokovic doesn't mind Nadal forehand on his backhand, but Nadal adjusted his game, using more his sliced BH to Djokovic's BH and closing out more rallies with his uncrossed FH.

 

[victorcruz]

I had no idea being 3-8 vs someone in slams is owning someone :lol:

 

[BallsforTennis]

lol

I came back on the forum see if there were any non-nadal/federer threads and I hop across this thread with a poster asking the most dumb and banal question.

I'll head myself back out and yeah I won't hit my head on the way out.

 

[bullfan]

Do you dispute the 2012 Australian Open was Nadal playing his absolute best and Djokovic not playing well. Do you dispute that Djokovic should have won in 4 sets and choked to even have it go 5 inspite of being off his game and Nadal playing out of his mind.

Do you dispute the 2013 French which Djokovic so nearly won (probably would have without a call from Pascal) was Nadal in great form and Djokovic in kind of ****** form, and Djokovic was still in winning position.

Given all that, it really sums up the matchup being strongly in Djokovic's favor, just as the Nadal-Federer is so strongly in Nadal's.

Trolling. Pascal Maria didn't cost Novak FO 2013, only delusional fools believe that. Sadly, you are a "new" member that is making up stuff to suit your argument.

So sad.....

 

[ultradr]

angle shots.

it doesn't really work against djokovic. in fact, nadal often lose by trying that
against novak.

againt federer, whenever he is in trouble, he just pulls federer to his backhand
and put away to wide open court.

 

[Backspin1183]

You are trolling

Like said above, Nadal is 8-3 against Djokovic in grand slams.

Do you remember the last 3 ?

French open 2013 : won in 5
US open 2013 : won in 4
French open 2014 : won in 4.

Djokovic still gives troubles to Nadal i agree, he's the man on the tour who beat him the most, but saying "the matchup being strongly in Djokovic's favor, just as the Nadal-Federer is so strongly in Nadal's" is absolute bullsh*t.

-

Nadal is actually 9-3 in Slams vs Djokovic. 9-3! That's 3 times 3. VAMOS!

 

[helloworld]

Nadal is actually 9-3 in Slams vs Djokovic. 9-3! That's 3 times 3. VAMOS!

Well, that's even worse for Mr.Runner-up trophies collector.

 

[Mayonnaise]

Well, that's even worse for Mr.Runner-up trophies collector.

Well, 2 runner-up trophies at the French Open is better than none

 

[The_Mental_Giant]

Because nole is not only a great but an aggressive retourner, and it hurts the weakest part of rafa's game, which usually is the serve. When rafa plays more aggressive he usually blows nole away from the court, like in the USO 2010 final.

9-3, 9-2 and 7-2, not much of a difference, isnt it?

 

[puiacalin91]

nadal doesnt do well against djokovic?

 

[Deleted member 307496]

Nadal does well against all of the Big 4, he leads the H2H against all of them.

 

[jg153040]

Over the years Nadal has generally dominated Federer and Murray. Sure he has had some losses here and there, including some big ones, but generally he has had the large upper hand in those matches. Yet he has so much trouble vs Novak Djokovic, performing very poorly in the matchup over the years. What does he not do well vs Djokovic that is not allowing him the kind of success he enjoys vs the other 2 main members of the big 4. Or what is so strong about Djokovic's game that Federer and Murray don't have that allows him to be such a thorn in Nadal's side in a way neither of the other two can be. Well Murray it could be easily explained that he is just not as great a player as the other 3 but most would agree Federer > Djokovic, but even prime Federer generally didn't do nearly as well vs Nadal as Djokovic has done vs Nadal. Since Djokovic reached his prime starting 2011 he has pretty much owned Nadal, while Nadal pretty much owned Federer from day 1.

Because Nole is just better than Fed/Murray since 2011. So of course he does also better vs Rafa.

Also Nole is superior player than Rafa on HC/indoor. Leads in h2h and titles.

I think Nole is much better than his 6 GS titles say. I feel he got unlucky. He always had to play Murray/Fed/Rafa deep at GS. Sometimes he had to beat two of the top 4 to win a GS title.

So, there is no surprise Nole does so well vs Rafa, since Nole is better than Murray/Fed since 2011.

We can argue that Nole is as good as Nadal since 2011. Maybe even slightly better. Both won 5 GS titles. I don't know how many masters they won, but Nole also won WTF twice.

So, since 2011 they seem pretty even. Nadal does better in bigger matches, but Nole leads the h2h in non GS.

But what Nadal did before 2011 sets him apart from Nole overall.

So, there is your answer. Nole is a different player since 2011, better than Murray, Fed. So of course he does better vs Rafa.

 

[castiron]

I don't have hard numbers to back this up, but I suspect a part of it is that Nole takes rafas shots just a bit earlier, giving him a 'structural' advantage

 

[TennisCJC]

I find it hard to believe the OP cannot figure this out. This could be a fishing expedition.

Federer 1 HBH is not as good against Nadal's heavy spin as Djokovic's 2 HBH. Same thing with return of serve on Nadal's wide slice serve.

Murray is too passive and plays into Nadal's hands because Nadal likes the grind baseline game. Nadal doesn't like players who attack from the baseline. Djokovic is far better than Murray at hitting aggressive baseline shots. Watch Murray against Nadal in the Rome tournament this year. Murray would have won easily if he did not make so many errors when attacking short balls. Djokovic will not make that many errors.

There is that simple enough for you.