Beginner Demos 8 Player Racquets

[whoster69]

Recently I decided to buy a new racquet, so I started by asking people here their opinions on which ones to demo. You can view that thread at: http://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/showthread.php?t=124650

Anyway, I decided to demo the following eight racquets:

(Note: I had to demo them in groups of four)

First Set of Four:
Fischer M Speed Pro #1 MP 98
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCFISCHER-FMSR.html

Head MicroGEL Extreme
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCHEAD-HMGX.html

Head Flexpoint Prestige Mid Plus
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCHEAD-FXPP.html

Wilson K Factor KSix-One Tour 90
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCWILSON-K61T90.html

Second Set of Four:
Yonex RDS 001 MP
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCYONEX-RDS001.html

Wilson nBlade nCode
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCWILSON-NBLD.html

Babolat AeroPro Drive
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCBAB-BAPD.html

Babolat Pure Storm Team
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCBAB-PSTRM.html

Let me start by saying I've been playing since September 2006, so I'm a beginner and lack the experience to appreciate the subtleties of these racquets. I will try my best to describe my experiences with these racquets but please take into account that even though I've improved very quickly and beaten most of the intermediate players in my class, I'm still a beginner at tennis and I'm still learning a lot. I spent about 15 hours over the last week playing with these racquets before I had to send them back this evening. I originally got them because I wanted a racquet that had more control than my current Head Liquidmetal Radical MP.

Anyway, here's my thoughts on the racquets that I demoed for what it's worth...

Fischer M Speed Pro #1 MP 98
The Fischer was the first to be cut. It was the easiest to eliminate. I didn't like the way it hit (not enough response). It had a lot of power (something that doesn't interest me) and the least control for me.

Babolat AeroPro Drive
This racquet hit very solidly but had no feeling for me. It felt dead. It had a forgiving sweet-spot and some power, but didn't have as much control as some of the other racquets. I liked this racquet, but it didn't make the final cut.

Wilson nBlade nCode
This racquet in many ways felt and played the most like my old racquet (a Head Liquidmetal Radical Mid Plus). It had a bit of vibration compared to some other the other racquets when I mis-hit that I didn't like. Overall, it had a pretty decent feel and decent ball placement for me. A bit more power than I wanted though.

Head MicroGEL Extreme
This racquet was in the middle of the pack. It had a pretty good feel to it, nice control, and a good sweet spot, but it had more power than I was looking for. It reminded me a lot of the Babolats (particularly the Pure Storm Team). I liked the look of the new MicroGEL, (even if it is a bit flashy -and not that it matters at all to me). It didn't have as much of that shock feeling when hitting off center (which I liked).

The above are the racquets that didn't make the second cut. I really liked all of the others and had a much harder time choosing between them.

Babolat Pure Storm Team
This racquet had the best strings of any of the racquets I demoed. They were much better about gripping the ball and provided a lot more spin. Unlike the other Babolat that I looked at, this one had much better control and good feel. It felt solid when you hit the ball and didn't torque too much when I mis-hit. I liked this racquet a lot. A friend of mine that helped me test these racquets out picked this as his favorite (he's a 4.5 level player).

Yonex RDS 001 MP
The Yonex I originally included because of it's different shape (and specs too). I wanted to see what it felt like to play with this kind of a racquet. It was both good and bad. In some ways it was my favorite. I really liked the way it hit the ball when you hit the sweet-spot. It felt really good to hit it well. Unfortunately it felt terrible with a lot of vibration when I mis-hit. I could imagine developing tennis elbow with this racquet. Still, I really liked it. It had very nice control. I thought I could place the ball well with it.

Wilson K Factor KSix-One Tour 90
This was the biggest surprise of all. The first day I tried this racquet out I hated it. I had the most mis-hits with this racquet of any of them. It seemed too head light to me compared to the others and racquets I had used before. The head was smaller and I found it harder to hit the sweet-spot. I almost eliminated it right away. I'm glad I didn't. The second day, I began to see the potential of this racquet. When I hit well with it I hit very well with it. It had better control than any other racquet I demoed. It also had the least power (which I didn't mind at all since I have a long swing and like to hit the ball hard). It had a damned small sweet-spot and punished me every time I was off. I hated the cheap sticky feeling leather grip (it is leather right? It feels like cardboard). What is this junk doing on this fine racquet! I would definitely change it if I bought this racquet. Anyway, I really wanted to pick this racquet, but I came to the conclusion that this racquet was just way too far beyond my abilities presently. I loved the way it's light head made it feel like a sword slicing through the air. It's an amazing racquet and one I would strongly recommend really good players to try, but it's too much for me at present sadly (maybe someday!)

Head Flexpoint Prestige Mid Plus
I finally settled on the Prestige as being the best racquet for me. It had the right combination of control (second only to the K90) and feel. It was much more forgiving for mis-hits than the K90 was, but it felt clumsy next to the precision of the K90 (as did all of the other racquets). I thought it had some of the best spin too (maybe even the best if you take into account the great strings on the PureStorm). With this racquet more than any other, I was able to rip balls that had a lot of power and spin yet would make it in. After playing with it for awhile I could feel my confidence rise about getting balls into corners instead of wide or long. It may be that I liked this racquet because I've only owned Head racquets up to this point and felt more comfortable with their style too.

I've decided not to buy any racquet yet. I wish I'd tried the Head Flexpoint Radical to see what it was like compared to the Flexpoint Prestige. I think I'll wait until the Microgel Radical and Prestige come out and then demo them with the two Flexpoints. I'm not in a big hurry to get a new racquet and I've got a lot to learn yet. Anyway, I hope people found this at least somewhat useful. I can't review racquets with the same expertise many people here can, but I wanted to share my thoughts in case it was helpful to some. One thing I can say, all of these racquets felt better than my old one. After going back to it, I can really see some differences and it's a great racquet!

One last thing I should mention. I didn't test these racquets at all for serving. My serve is pathetic. It's something I will be working on to improve soon. It's by far the worst part of my game, but I thought it was worth mentioning since I didn't test them at all for serving.

Feel free to post your thoughts.

 

[LarougeNY]

You must either be pretty strong, pretty talented, or really misguided. I'm gonna say that you're a combination of strong and talented though, if you say you only started playing 7 months ago and you can already handle the k61 tour and the fxp prestige MP, then kudos to you man. good luck with that prestige.

 

[TheSnowMan]

Ugh.. I absolutely hated the Flexpoint Prestige Midplus. It felt like a club on my backhand. I couldn't get anything in.

 

[LarougeNY]

Ugh.. I absolutely hated the Flexpoint Prestige Midplus. It felt like a club on my backhand. I couldn't get anything in.

Felt stiff and clubby to me too. It is very string sensitive though.
Serving was alright, volleys were excellent, backhands for me (2hander) were pretty good, everything else was dreadful.

Whooster, what made the fxp prestige better than the Mspeed or the Pure Storm, in your opinion?

 

[vinnier6]

man i must really suck, or you do...either way, i have been playing tennis for over 10 years, and i have tried both prestiege and n61 90 and i was no way shape or form skilled enough to handle one of these racquets...

 

[esm]

tried a Flexpoint MP & it didnt work for me and im not a beginner. i have settled with a n6.1 95

for a beginner, i think a nBlade would do the trick.
my gf have only started to play tennis since late last year, and the nBlade (106, 10.4 oz) has been a good racquet for her.

 

[Mad iX]

[/FONT][/COLOR]Wilson K Factor KSix-One Tour 90
This was the biggest surprise of all. The first day I tried this racquet out I hated it. I had the most mis-hits with this racquet of any of them. It seemed too head light to me compared to the others and racquets I had used before. The head was smaller and I found it harder to hit the sweet-spot. I almost eliminated it right away. I'm glad I didn't. The second day, I began to see the potential of this racquet. When I hit well with it I hit very well with it. It had better control than any other racquet I demoed. It also had the least power (which I didn't mind at all since I have a long swing and like to hit the ball hard). It had a damned small sweet-spot and punished me every time I was off. I hated the cheap sticky feeling leather grip (it is leather right? It feels like cardboard). What is this junk doing on this fine racquet! I would definitely change it if I bought this racquet. Anyway, I really wanted to pick this racquet, but I came to the conclusion that this racquet was just way too far beyond my abilities presently. I loved the way it's light head made it feel like a sword slicing through the air. It's an amazing racquet and one I would strongly recommend really good players to try, but it's too much for me at present sadly (maybe someday!)

Wilson leather sucks, but I hate bare leather anyway. I'd recommend getting a grip size smaller and using an overgrip like supergrap.
Removing the leather because of its weight will change the balance of the racquet a fair bit.

man i must really suck, or you do...either way, i have been playing tennis for over 10 years, and i have tried both prestiege and n61 90 and i was no way shape or form skilled enough to handle one of these racquets...

I don't see that as a bad thing. It's all personal preference.
You could give the n90 to Nadal and he might suddenly suck, because it simply doesn't suit his style of play.

 

[Anton]

M speed 98? Too much power? you must be absolutely mad! (and not in the pissed off sort of way either)

It is one of the most underpowered racket on your entire list! I've hit with it today and with my full 170lb body stroke I had a big sweat of a time getting the ball to the baseline.

TW rates it 67 in power rating compared to 64 for Wilson K Factor KSix-One Tour 90 and 73 for RDS 001 MP.

I don't care what stringing that racket had there is absolutely no way anyone with ANY sort of consistent stroke would say that this racket is overpowered.

EDIT: I think most likely you tried the wrong racket.

THIS http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCFISCHER-FMSLR.html the UL version
and NOT http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/descpageRCFISCHER-FMSR.html

 

[AJK1]

This thread is a classic example of an inexperienced player demoing and commenting on advanced players frames. What a joke. these boards get worse and worse.

 

[Anton]

This thread is a classic example of an inexperienced player demoing and commenting on advanced players frames. What a joke. these boards get worse and worse.

now now, he did put in a disclaimer

 

[whoster69]

Whoster, what made the fxp prestige better than the Mspeed or the Pure Storm, in your opinion?

Control. I was able to put the ball where I wanted it more often with the Prestige. I also was able to put more spin on the ball with the Prestige.

As to whether or not I suck or am mad (as some others have asked), hell yes I suck. I've only been playing for eight months! How could I not suck after such a short time!

As to the mad part, possibly. I just wanted to try out some really control oriented racquets because each time I've used a new racquet and liked it, it was heavier, had less power, and more control, and I played better. Am I misunderstanding some of this and making mistakes? I'm sure I am. Like I said, I'm a beginner. I know that these racquets are better than my ability (by a mile at least). I play better with any of these than I do with my old racquet, so I view it as a step in the right direction.

 

[whoster69]

This thread is a classic example of an inexperienced player demoing and commenting on advanced players frames. What a joke. these boards get worse and worse.

The title stated I was a beginner demoing player racquets or did you miss that? I stated I was a beginner (several times in fact). I'm not trying to confuse anyone nor create a joke. I'm trying to share my experiences for whatever they are worth, learn, and try to give something back to a game I love and a community that I appreciate. Where's the joke in that?

 

[AJK1]

Yes, i know you stated what you were doing.
Why don't you demo frames that will help your game, not hinder it.
Also, other beginners would much more appreciate someone such as yourself demoing more suitable frames, so they can get a better idea of whats suitable for them.
That would alleviate a lot of the confusion with beginners on these boards, and probably save them a lot of wasted money buying frames that are totally wrong for them.

 

[fgs]

whoster69 made no secret about him being a beginner in the first place and i think that it's o.k. to demo any sort of racquet. any demoing session would basically be also an evaluation and there again i see nothing wrong in trying to share the impressions. there are some things i cannot understand, like the nblade haveing too much power, but after all everything is a matter of perception and we all know that thank god no two people are the same.
it looks like whoster69 is a rather athletic person with a high probability of developing a full and fast swingstyle, so again there should be no trouble with players racquets, even in this early stage (7 months). by players racquets i do not necessarily mean the k90, but if that's what he'll end up liking (second choice, after the prestige) then so be it - he has to play with it, it's his call. personally i would not recommend a k90 or a prestige to someone like whoster, but this would be a recommendation - it is neither an obligation to buy/follow the recommendation, nor is it an interdiction to go for something else. he should try out whatever he thinks he might like - eventually understanding from a hands-on experience why some people say some things about certain racquets, etc.

 

[vinnier6]

Yes, i know you stated what you were doing.
Why don't you demo frames that will help your game, not hinder it.
Also, other beginners would much more appreciate someone such as yourself demoing more suitable frames, so they can get a better idea of whats suitable for them.
That would alleviate a lot of the confusion with beginners on these boards, and probably save them a lot of wasted money buying frames that are totally wrong for them.

i couldnt agree more with both of your posts...

it doesnt seem to matter what the subject or sport is, beginners always want to skip the learning process and go right to being an expert using expert level equipment...

 

[Wilson6-1]

i couldnt agree more with both of your posts...

it doesnt seem to matter what the subject or sport is, beginners always want to skip the learning process and go right to being an expert using expert level equipment...

I hardly think a 98" headlight racquet at 12 oz would be considered "expert level equipment". The guy is 44 years old, I think he is old enough to determine if he can swing the weight; and the headsize at 98" is not tiny.

I think AJK1's comment is out of line and arrogant to say the least. There is a big difference in recreational tennis and tournament play. Why get so worked up over someone who asks friendly advice about racquets so he can hit a few with friends. Get over yourself, your not that important.

Also, I think these comments just exaggerate the elitist view held by many on this forum that only certain level of players should play with certain racquets. There is no definitive answer from players or professional coaches that requires beginner or intermediate players to play with a certain type of racquet over another. Although there are racquets that may wield better short term results over others, the opinions vary dramatically (along with racquet recommendations) over the best way to improve the game.

Lastly, I would understand some of these responses if the poster made some egregious statement; but hard for me to see him get flamed simply for providing feedback and soliciting advice?

 

[nickb]

I hardly think a 98" headlight racquet at 12 oz would be considered "expert level equipment". The guy is 44 years old, I think he is old enough to determine if he can swing the weight; and the headsize at 98" is not tiny.

Its classed as a players racket, which IMO is not going to do him any good when he is a beginner. Also why would you demo so many advanced frames if you are just starting out, seems a little strange....most beginners just buy a racket and play with it...its only when they become good they start getting picky about equipment.

I think AJK1's comment is out of line and arrogant to say the least.

You might think they were arrogant but they were true..

Lastly, I would understand some of these responses if the poster made some egregious statement; but hard for me to see him get flamed simply for providing feedback and soliciting advice?

Nobody really got flamed...people were just stating that this thread would encourage beginners to choose advanced frames which would hinder their games and potentially stop them reaching their potential.

Nick

 

[Noir]

Also, other beginners would much more appreciate someone such as yourself demoing more suitable frames, so they can get a better idea of whats suitable for them.

Could you describe why those frames aren't suitable and what kind of frames would be (and why)? I'm a beginner, and I'd much more appreciate that than you railing on the guy for his choice of demos.

 

[fgs]

nickb,
you might have overlooked the fact that whoster69 is playing a liquidmetal radical for the past 7 months since he started out with tennis. therefore, most of the racquets he tried out, are not so very far away from that.
also, prior to his decision to demo, whoster69 had a thread (link supplied) asking for advice on what to demo. the racquets he has picked have been recommended to him in that thread, so he didn't simply pick them up all by himself but has been partly influenced by the input he got in that thread.

 

[nickb]

If he wants to use a racket thats difficult to use for his skill level thats fine by me.......its a matter of opinion what rackets are best for people anyway and i just gave mine.

Nick

 

[Wilson6-1]

Its classed as a players racket, which IMO is not going to do him any good when he is a beginner. Also why would you demo so many advanced frames if you are just starting out, seems a little strange....most beginners just buy a racket and play with it...its only when they become good they start getting picky about equipment.

You might think they were arrogant but they were true..

Nobody really got flamed...people were just stating that this thread would encourage beginners to choose advanced frames which would hinder their games and potentially stop them reaching their potential.

Nick

First, I don’t buy into the notion of a “players” racquet, just different specifications and racquet types. Although some racquet specs will most likely produce worse results in the short term, it doesn’t mean that the racquet won’t suit the player as they develop. For recreational tennis players, I don’t understand why they should buy certain racquets for different stages of their development. Do you not understand the marketing campaigns aimed at this logic? If it is a solid racquet that doesn’t interfere with their mechanics or technique, they will grow into the racquet.

And, without watching him play, nobody knows if these racquets will hinder his long term development. In fact, that assertion is purely speculative and just reiterates the stereotyping of racquets for certain level of players.

In playing in a league, I meet many “self-proclaimed” 4.0/4.5+ players; or players that “played in college” and when they actually play in a 3.0 league, they struggle, especially in doubles. These players all have different issues and all use different racquets, so to claim that a player should use a certain racquet based on some ranking system seems foolish to me.

IMO, demo and pick the racquet that you like and that doesn’t interfere with your ability to develop basic technique. It really doesn't need to be more complicated than that.

 

[fgs]

nickb,
i mentioned earlier that some of the racquets whoster69 demoed would not have been on my recommend-list either.
but either i am missing out on something or you didn't recommend any sticks, you just said that these racquets are too demanding, which, i repeat myself, i partly agree with.

 

[Kevo]

I think if a beginner wanted to go get an old wood frame small headed racquet and hit with that they would be just fine. A lot of being a beginner is simply learning to hit the ball. I doubt he's expecting to go play some open level player's at the next tournament. My wife hit with my old RDX 500 mids that were weighted to 13oz., and she did just as good with those as she did with her normal 9.5 oz. oversize frame. Most of tennis is not about the racquet. It's about how well you move and prepare and shot selection and stroke production and anticipation, etc. So play with whatever stick you want and let others do the same.

 

[witit]

It's a personal choice I believe. But using a demanding racquet to me can be a good thing though. I just speak from my experience. I started tennis a year ago. I had no idea what racquet to use. I ended up with Volkl Quantum 10 Tour (98 sq. in. head, 11.5 oz, 18x20 pattern). Which is pretty demanding for a beginner. My friend who started at the same time picked a lighter racquet (Wilson Hyper Hammer 6.2, 110 sq. in., 9.6 oz). We both had no idea at that point. Anyhow, he was playing much better than me. A lot of pop from his racquet plus he didn't have to use a long swing. I was frustrated like crazy. I thought of changing racquet many times. They always made fun of me from using too heavy racquet. But I sticked with the Volkl.

I didn't realize I was developing my stroke so much using the Volkl. Now I know how to generate my own power and can beat my friend easily. Also I played with a 4.5 player few times and he said I have a very good form and can be considered a strong 3.5 to 4.0.

Anyway, long story short. The point is using a bit demanding racquet can be a good thing. Starting with a mid size which weights around 10-11 oz should help a beginner to develop better than an oversize with super power/technology. But going straight to the fed's racquet is a bit much. Many times I see a beginner on a court with K90 or n90, I really want to go and tell him to change a racquet.

Peace!

 

[chiru]

I think we all forget that the pros of the 90s and early 2000's were the children who played with wood on their local courts. doesn't get much more demanding than that for a kid does it?

 

[whoster69]

nickb,
you might have overlooked the fact that whoster69 is playing a liquidmetal radical for the past 7 months since he started out with tennis. therefore, most of the racquets he tried out, are not so very far away from that.
also, prior to his decision to demo, whoster69 had a thread (link supplied) asking for advice on what to demo. the racquets he has picked have been recommended to him in that thread, so he didn't simply pick them up all by himself but has been partly influenced by the input he got in that thread.

That's correct. I started with a Head Titanium Supreme S1. While practicing my serve I dropped it and it broke after a few months of use (it fell out of my hand on the downward swing). While I liked this racquet, I had problems hitting the ball long a lot and didn't have much control. A friend of mine that is a 4.5 level player was using a Head Liquidmetal Instinct L3 if I remember correctly. As many of you know that are familiar with Head racquets they use a labeling system for their racquets. An L3 was more of a control racquet than my S1 was. I played much better with his L3 than I did my S1, so I started getting more interested in control racquets. I demoed some based on his advice and found that the Head Liquidmetal Radical MP was the one that I played best with. I have used this racquet for about 4 - 5 months now. My wife was looking for something to get me for my birthday and since I was intrigued by more control oriented racquets, I asked people here for their opinions on what some great control racquets would be. This is how I made up my list for the eight racquets that I demoed. I hope that clears up any confusion...

I didn't mean to start something regarding what a beginning player has used or people think should use. I simply wanted to give feedback to the forum that has been helpful to me and provide something, however limited by my beginner's understanding, that might help others. I didn't want to create a problem. I appreciate the people who are posting their thoughts about these same racquets. Definitely feel free to chime in and disagree/agree or point out things I may have overlooked or messed up.

Those of you who say these racquets are going to mess up my game and I should be using other racquets, please explain. I'd like to know more. For instance, why would they mess up my game? Each time I've picked a new racquet, I've picked it by trying it out and I thought I played better with it. If you have other ideas of what a player at my experience level (or lack of experience level) should be using, please post some examples. This would be helpful. Maybe if I demo some of those racquets I'll have a better understanding of what you're taking about. Right now though, the Prestige is the best racquet I have tried and what I'm leaning toward getting based on my experiences with it.

Thank you.

 

[hadoken]

In playing in a league, I meet many “self-proclaimed” 4.0/4.5+ players; or players that “played in college” and when they actually play in a 3.0 league, they struggle, especially in doubles.

That's because leagues are NOTORIOUS for people who sandbag their skill level. Anyone who played on a solid Div 3 college team or better is no worse than a 5.0 and I hear people with those skills routinely play sub 5 league.

Back to the question at hand. There are basically two schools of thought on newbies and advanced racquets: (i) use whatever you like including an advanced frame; and (ii) using an advanced frame is a waste of time and is foolish. I agree with the latter. In principle I understand the former's argument but it's bad advice because newbies will most certainly bias their opinion of what they *want* to like. The fact that they want to try these advanced frames proves the point. There's no "good" reason why they should demo them in the 1st place and choose a player frame over a tweener. If anything, having immature strokes indicates that you don't have the skill to pick out what you want. It's somewhat like driving - a good parent shoud pick out what makes sense for a new teen driver because they don't have the experience to pick out what is best for them. The teen can certainly pick a car based on an emotional attachment, but that's not the best course of action.

 

[fgs]

whoster69,
i very well understand that you did not want to start any debate but a discussion. don't be afraid to communicate as you already did because basically this is what it's all about. also don't be afraid regarding your level of expertise - you're honest and that is the most important issue.
general "wisdom" has it, that it will be difficult for a beginner to pick up the skills and have fun with a "players" racquet. the reason for this is quite simple - these sticks are usually low powered, therefore to have success and fun, a player should have developed a somewhat decent swing for otherwise the ball won't really make it properly over the net. there are however "exceptions" to this rule, in the sense that if someone has rather good motor abilities (for instance has practiced a ball sport before picking up tennis), is rather athletically build and has good eye-hand coordination, in my opinion at least, there would be no need to go the "game improvement racquets" (high powered rocket launchers which for these persons i'd rather call "game destruction racquets" because they will keep them from taking a full and healthy swing at the ball in the attempt to keep the ball in). this is the reason why i started my wife a year ago with an ntour two - of course it's lighter and rather a medium powered racquet, but still a "players" racquet. i think that you would rather fall into these "exceptions" as well.
the point is, or better said my point is, that a heavy racquet by todays standards, as the k90 or the prestige (around 350g static weight), would eventually keep you from developing racquet head speed, which you will need in order to hit a decent topspin stroke. if the rally is in a rather higher tempo, it is possible that you will not go for a smooth swing but that you will end up muscling the ball, and that is definitely not the proper skill acquisition you should be going for. now, i want to stress the fact that it is possible - it is not certain! this is something that you will best find out by carefully monitoring your strokes towards the end of the hitting sessions - are you still swinging fast but smooth after 1.5hrs on court? if yes, everything is o.k., no matter what whoever tells you on this board. you have to feel comfortable and make sure that the racquet of your choice is not limiting you towards the end of the hitting sessions. you should have fun and enjoy this wonderful sport up to your last minute on court - that's the only way to progress. have fun and keep sharing your impressions.

 

[ChaseD13]

Hi i read these forums often (but don't really post, as i consider myself a beginner- im 16 and have been playing most my life, but not really seriously, but i am pretty skilled) i would say i would be around a 4.0 mab better on a good day.

This poor guy is being flamed on the notion that he is using racquets far above his ability.

This is a terrible assumption imo. My friends ARE NOT tennis players, but once a year head down to the courts to mess around and play "tennis" which often consists of games "to ten" as they dont know the scoring.

Now, you would say most of the 16 year olds who have played tennis under 20 hours total are beginners, right?

well, they all played far better with my lm rad than any oversize or "beginner" racquet that they had.

They are strong and cordinated enough to take a swipe at the ball: why not give them some feel and control?
In fact, besides hitting the sweet spot/stroke consistancy, the most trouble they have is keeping the ball from going long, and the rad solved this for most of them.


Not sure if my story makes much sense, but imo anyone with some strength, athleticism and coordination would probably play better with a "players" racquet (i know the rad isnt really a hardcore players racquet, but it isnt a beginner racquet either) than some OS or tweener because they dont need help with power, but rather control.


don't get mad at this guy for giving his opinion on more "advanced" racquets, he said he was a beginner, and maybe he doesnt like idea that every time he takes a real swipe at the ball it goes into the fence.

 

[whoster69]

Chase, you nailed it. That's exactly what my problem is. In fact I'm still doing it too often even with the better racquets. I like to hit the ball hard and I need to focus on placement and form so I can still hit it hard but get it in.

Hadoken, you could be right about wanting to like one of these. At my ability level I don't think I can discern the subtleties well enough to judge racquets purely on their merits. This is definitely a problem for beginners like me in my opinion. I don't understand how some tweener racquet will help though when these launch the ball like artillery. I've tried some and didn't like them at all.

Regarding sandbagging their skill, isn't this pretty stupid to do? I've always thought it was better to play with people who were a little better than I am; that way I'll improve more rapidly. Isn't that true? Aren't these guys handicapping themselves by sandbagging their skill level?

I really see what you mean fgs. That gives me something to consider. Thank you. I'll keep an eye on how I'm playing next time, particularly toward the end of my game and see if I'm still swinging fast and smooth. That really helps put it in perspective. I appreciate your comments greatly.

 

[gn8]

Whoster, I think you should continue to work with the player's racquets.
IMO you will be better off in the end learning with a good racquet that is the heaviest that you can comfortably handle. And as fgs pointed out, this can be judged by how it feels at the end of a long match or hitting session. Are you taking lessons to work on your technique? Especially creating top spin with a low to high motion. That is what will keep those long balls in. Good luck!

 

[whoster69]

Yes, that's exactly what I'm doing.

Thanks for the input gn8!

 

[jasoncho92]

If you can use those racquets well then you shouldnt really consider yourself that much of a beginner. Those racquets are for people who are pretty advanced and not for beginners. But if they work for you then nice lol

 

[need2paint]

Back to the question at hand. There are basically two schools of thought on newbies and advanced racquets: (i) use whatever you like including an advanced frame; and (ii) using an advanced frame is a waste of time and is foolish. I agree with the latter. In principle I understand the former's argument but it's bad advice because newbies will most certainly bias their opinion of what they *want* to like. The fact that they want to try these advanced frames proves the point. There's no "good" reason why they should demo them in the 1st place and choose a player frame over a tweener. If anything, having immature strokes indicates that you don't have the skill to pick out what you want. It's somewhat like driving - a good parent shoud pick out what makes sense for a new teen driver because they don't have the experience to pick out what is best for them. The teen can certainly pick a car based on an emotional attachment, but that's not the best course of action.

If Shaquille O'Neal wanted a tennis racquet would you recommend a granny stick?

It is not a question of performance. It is a question of strength. A grown adult man can handle a 12 oz. racquet with no problem. Children used to play with 13 oz. woodies. A heavier raquet is safer for your arm, and the lower power is generally easier to play with if you are a strong beginner.

Many beginners actually play better with "player's racquets" because it allows them to hit out without fear of hitting the back fence. If you add to that the additional comfort and safety of a player's racquet, it's a no-brainer.

 

[lethalfang]

I myself have started playing tennis only about a year ago, and the only racquet that I have used for more than 1 week is the POG OS. Really, the reason I chose to use POG OS is the comfort. For all the other lightweight stiff racquets I've tried (e.g. those lightweight Head Titanium racquets), I hurt my wrist when I hit off center. The POG OS provided by far the best comfort level, and so it is the racquet I've used since I learned to play tennis.
I've developed decent forms in my strokes in a pretty short amount of time (like a month), and I think using a heavy racquet accelerated my development. I mean, did you think I could move that 12.5-oz stick around with these noob's no-backswing technique? The only way to play tennis with a heavy racquet like that is to play with the right techniques.
Oh yeah, for some of other people who learned to play tennis with i.S12 and are still using i.S12, I feel like I'm getting tennis elbow just by watching them "swinging" their 1HBH. Yes, some of them have already developed tennis elbow and they've played for only a year.

 

[hadoken]

If Shaquille O'Neal wanted a tennis racquet would you recommend a granny stick?

There is a HUGE difference between a granny stick and a tweener. I would recommend Shaq a TWEENER, not a granny stick. To me the Pure Drive is a tweener (and a very good one at that). If you are launching rockets with a Pure Drive to the back fence as a newbie, you are gonna do the same thing with a K90.

Also, again people confuse the weight question. I am well aware that people used to learn on 12+ oz frames...I am a child of the 1st generation widebody frames. It is not the weight in itself of the advanced player frames that makes them a bad choice it is the *total* construction - minimal power, tiny headed sweatspot, and yes the weight but that's because mfrs stopped making powerful 12+ oz frames when Wilson revolutionized with Sledghammer. If the 1st generation of widebodies came back on the market, they would be my #1 recommendation to new players.

So I stick to my point that a newbie has no reason to choose a player frame over a TWEENER. There are a ton of tweenish frames to choose from that can aid a newbie's game even if they are "strong".

 

[caesar66]

I think you should buy another liquidmetal radical mp. After only playing so long, you won't, as you said, have as good a grasp on the subtleties of racquets. get a backup for what you're using right now and keep practicing til you have some more experience with technique/etc and some more time under your belt to really develop a style. The LM Rad. is no slouch in power or control, and while it may not end up being what your "holy grail" is, its a good stick that plays well and will allow you to learn well. Screw the debate over whether you should get a newbie frame to learn on or a heavy player's racquet or wood racquet to learn on. The racquet you have right now is just about in the middle of that spectrum, and will be fine for you to learn on. If you get a backup, then if you break strings on it you're not switching to a completely different frame to play with. You'll appreciate it more because you wont have to change your strokes (that you're still learning) mid stream. Trust me, get a backup, save some money, or maybe spend the extra money on strings and stringjobs to experiment w/ tensions/types for power/control, rather than spending lots of money on a new racquet taht might hamper your development.

 

[Anton]

Hi i read these forums often (but don't really post, as i consider myself a beginner- im 16 and have been playing most my life, but not really seriously, but i am pretty skilled) i would say i would be around a 4.0 mab better on a good day.

This poor guy is being flamed on the notion that he is using racquets far above his ability.

This is a terrible assumption imo. My friends ARE NOT tennis players, but once a year head down to the courts to mess around and play "tennis" which often consists of games "to ten" as they dont know the scoring.

Now, you would say most of the 16 year olds who have played tennis under 20 hours total are beginners, right?

well, they all played far better with my lm rad than any oversize or "beginner" racquet that they had.

They are strong and cordinated enough to take a swipe at the ball: why not give them some feel and control?
In fact, besides hitting the sweet spot/stroke consistancy, the most trouble they have is keeping the ball from going long, and the rad solved this for most of them.


Not sure if my story makes much sense, but imo anyone with some strength, athleticism and coordination would probably play better with a "players" racquet (i know the rad isnt really a hardcore players racquet, but it isnt a beginner racquet either) than some OS or tweener because they dont need help with power, but rather control.


don't get mad at this guy for giving his opinion on more "advanced" racquets, he said he was a beginner, and maybe he doesnt like idea that every time he takes a real swipe at the ball it goes into the fence.

I started playing with 9oz Prince Thundercloud (110 sq.in)
then switched to 12+ OZ 6.1 Classic after about 3 months
Then after about 2 months I came to understand that 12 OZ will be too much for me no matter how much I improve in the next year - my strokes were strong and fairly accurate, just hitting around, but in a match last second motions where difficult to make successful. So I was switching between 11oz PDR (1 month), 10.5oz RQ7 (1 month), then 11.5oz Pro Tour Extreme FT - I liked the extreme, but could not make enough power out of it on the forehand, so I went with the regular Pro Tour FT for a few months and just a month ago picked up the extreme again - this time I had all the power I needed out of it and all of control and maneuverability (except maybe on a flat serve) .

Thats 6 rackets - so a road to that racket that is a great fit for you is sometimes a whole long story in itself.

The good news is that unless you get stuck playing with a grandma racket your game will be changing for the better. Now, after about a year I'm a 4.0 to 4.5 player.

 

[need2paint]

So I stick to my point that a newbie has no reason to choose a player frame over a TWEENER. There are a ton of tweenish frames to choose from that can aid a newbie's game even if they are "strong".

A player's frame, being heavier, and generally softer than a tweener, is safer for your arm.

I would not recommend a 90" head to a beginner, but there are many player's frames with MP head sizes and adequate sweetspots for a beginner.

Really the only thing a tweener has to offer over a player's racquet is more power, and if the beginning player finds the power level of his player's racquet adequate, then there is no need for a tweener.