Pushers are you having fun?

[cha cha]

Anyone else hears Man on the moon by REM reading the title of this thread? ... Pushers, are you having fun?

 

[anarosevoli]

Made it to the quarters of my club's end of year tourney only to face the bossman of pushers. Not a hyperbole when I say these moonballs were 3-4 stories high. Followed by a blocked/chip short shot, rinse and repeat. I mean very effective at his game but this wasn't fun, I didn't have fun. It's not enjoyable tennis for me, partly because I struggle with that gamestyle, (and partly because I don't personally don't think moonballing is tennis)

But I wanted to know for you pushers out there with those insane moonballs, are you actually having fun? Do you purposely practice those shots with intention?

Your shots are not good enough and you are not fit enough. He at least is fit, possibly he can even hit when he has an opponent... but it's not necessary at your level at all because pushing is the safe win against helpless persons like you.

 

[jered]

Yes, pushers are having fun. Winning is fun. They don't see themselves as pushers, nobody does. They are defensive specialists. Moonballers are delighting in your frustration and their ability to hit ridiculously high balls and land them with accuracy on the baseline.

Personally I love going up against moonballers. Once I see someone is a lobber, I'm pretty sure I'm going to win unless they change their strategy. However, one of my strengths is overheads and swinging volleys from no man's land. I eat up moonballers. Low, skidding, no-pace junk balls on the other hand... my kryptonite. Those shots frustrate me to no end.

 

[Kavala]

Made it to the quarters of my club's end of year tourney only to face the bossman of pushers. Not a hyperbole when I say these moonballs were 3-4 stories high. Followed by a blocked/chip short shot, rinse and repeat. I mean very effective at his game but this wasn't fun, I didn't have fun. It's not enjoyable tennis for me, partly because I struggle with that gamestyle, (and partly because I don't personally don't think moonballing is tennis)

But I wanted to know for you pushers out there with those insane moonballs, are you actually having fun? Do you purposely practice those shots with intention?

Of course they practice them. People also practice hitting topspin shots that drop immediately after crossing the net. All the advise about always hitting deep or whatever if useless if its becomes obvious. The moonballers are on to whatever you are doing precisely because that moonball gives them all kinds of time to get back to safe position and they are gambling that you will let it bounce and telegraph what you are doing. Change your game: learn to move them with acute angle; cutting slice approach; high lob; learn to vary your spins and pace; hit short topspin repeatedly until they anticipate and move in -then deep. They like to be able to anticipate. Learn to hit overheads and swinging volleys. Dont be afraid.

 

[Kavala]

Do not feel that you have to hit an overhead. These shots present many opportunities to hit swinging volleys. I'm guessing that overheads are not easy for you, bc if they were you'ld be using them. Practice them, but there is this other option. Good luck, and I would suggest do not practice with them; they will keep you from working on your strokes and timing.

 

[Kavala]

Yes, pushers are having fun. Winning is fun. They don't see themselves as pushers, nobody does. They are defensive specialists. Moonballers are delighting in your frustration and their ability to hit ridiculously high balls and land them with accuracy on the baseline.

Personally I love going up against moonballers. Once I see someone is a lobber, I'm pretty sure I'm going to win unless they change their strategy. However, one of my strengths is overheads and swinging volleys from no man's land. I eat up moonballers. Low, skidding, no-pace junk balls on the other hand... my kryptonite. Those shots frustrate me to no end.

Yes, the OP should learn to be comfortable up to 2 meters inside the baseline, often considered no man's land. This is not no man's land against pushers; it's Park Avenue.

 

[ubercat]

Agree When you get old your going to need to hang out in NML often.. Legs get slower and evil people love to dropshot old guys. Defensive players often use short angle slices as their goto defensive shots off the BH wing. So if you're going with the usual default tactic of pounding the BH your going to see a lot of these shots. They don't mind you taking the net as lobs are their bread n butter.

 

[RatedPG]

I don’t understand the hate against pushers

I’ve played singles matches before and when I lose the first hit being a counter puncher, I change my tactics to lobs to change it up.

There was one match back in 2017, where I lost the first set 3:6. We had good rallies. But, he loved pace and hit more winners than me. In the second set, I changed it up and used lobs. After leading 3:2, he verbally attacked me on the bench during the changeover and told me that this isn’t tennis and that I should play like a man, etc. So, that shook me up. I then, went back to the strategy of the first set and he won the next two games to lead 3:4. I then told myself internally during the changeover, why am I playing the type of tennis he wants? Hitting deep and hard to his hitting zone, This is a tournament and I’m in no way indebted to play a certain way. So, I went back to lobs and he was livid and I could tell was losing his patience, as I wasn’t listening to his instructions. I then went to lead 5:4 and during the changeover again was told “what did I tell you about lobs?, etc..” The only thing I said, was that I’m trying to, but, sometimes, I just hit topspin forehands and when I don’t do it right, they turn to lobs and I apologized, but, deep down, I was grinning and I told myself I guess I know what to do now….. lob everything deep and throw slices. He won the next game to tie it up 5:5. In the next game, he was cursing after hitting a shot 2 feet long trying to end the rally quickly and I won the next next point and he was cursing and in the changeover,started talking to his camp, that this isn’t tennis and he can’t believe he payed to play this type of tennis. I smiled calmly and had to actually fight off laughing. I was having so much fun. I knew if I won the next game, that he only have a whole set of “pushing” tennis to deal with in the third set. Well, we played the last game out and he started pushing, as well. But, I ended up winning 7:5 with a beautiful backhand winner down the line…. Not a pushing shot. I hit a lob and then he lobbed a shot that didn’t go deep, but, rather, into middle of the court so I ended up playing attacking tennis in the last game with two winners (one was a volley winner set up by an attacking shot).

I was looking forward to playing the third set, but, he stormed off with his tennis bag and said he didn’t want to be tortured anymore and left. So, I won with a default. But, is it fun playing pushing tennis? Not all the time. I don’t think you develop as much with this type of tennis. But, I have fun in tennis in general. Nowadays, I just play doubles and it is so much fun playing recreational tennis at the club with an assortment of different players. I love utilizing lobs in tennis, especially, against the impatient players who go for winners, but, are too inconsistent.

 

[travlerajm]

I don’t understand the hate against pushers

I’ve played singles matches before and when I lose the first hit being a counter puncher, I change my tactics to lobs to change it up.

There was one match back in 2017, where I lost the first set 3:6. We had good rallies. But, he loved pace and hit more winners than me. In the second set, I changed it up and used lobs. After leading 3:2, he verbally attacked me on the bench during the changeover and told me that this isn’t tennis and that I should play like a man, etc. So, that shook me up. I then, went back to the strategy of the first set and he won the next two games to lead 3:4. I then told myself internally during the changeover, why am I playing the type of tennis he wants? Hitting deep and hard to his hitting zone, This is a tournament and I’m in no way indebted to play a certain way. So, I went back to lobs and he was livid and I could tell was losing his patience, as I wasn’t listening to his instructions. I then went to lead 5:4 and during the changeover again was told “what did I tell you about lobs?, etc..” The only thing I said, was that I’m trying to, but, sometimes, I just hit topspin forehands and when I don’t do it right, they turn to lobs and I apologized, but, deep down, I was grinning and I told myself I guess I know what to do now….. lob everything deep and throw slices. He won the next game to tie it up 5:5. In the next game, he was cursing after hitting a shot 2 feet long trying to end the rally quickly and I won the next next point and he was cursing and in the changeover,started talking to his camp, that this isn’t tennis and he can’t believe he payed to play this type of tennis. I smiled calmly and had to actually fight off laughing. I was having so much fun. I knew if I won the next game, that he only have a whole set of “pushing” tennis to with in the third set. Well, we played the last game out and he started pushing, as well. But, I ended up winning 7:5 with a beautiful backhand winner down the line…. Not a pushing shot. I hit alob and then he lobbed a shot that didn’t go deep into middle of the court so I ended up playing attacking tennis in tat last game with two winners

I was looking forward to playing the third set, but, he stormed off with his tennis bag and said he didn’t want to be tortured any more and left. So, I won with a default. But, it is fun playing pushing tennis. Nowadays, I just play doubles and it is so much fun playing recreational tennis at the club with an assortment of different players. I love utilizing lobs in tennis, especially, against the impatient players who go for winners, but, are too inconsistent.

The funny part about this story is that everyone who’s ever won a match by pushing has seen an opponent react exactly like that.

 

[Topspin Shot]

Ordinarily pushing isn't that fun. But against an opponent who clearly hates it, well that is kinda fun.

 

[FiddlerDog]

There was one match back in 2017,

I would pay $250 to watch a video of this match, if it was mic'd up like Ian's videos.
Great story. Thanks for sharing! Was this 3.5 level?

 

[bitcoinoperated]

They delight in your failure

and then giggle their way to work where they have roles in quality and contracts.

 

[ubercat]

I got told off by my tennis partner for hitting too many moon balls and short balls couple of days ago. This was my first time on court after 4 months lockdown in Melbourne the world capital of the lockdown. she was lucky I could hit anything.

 

[FuzzyYellowBalls]

Yes, they are, but their idea of fun would also be vanilla ice cream and missionary every third tuesday of the month. Push push push it good.

 

[Rosstour]

They're having fun all right. Pushers are sadists. Big hitters are masochists.

 

[socallefty]

Yes, they are, but their idea of fun would also be vanilla ice cream and missionary every third tuesday of the month. Push push push it good.

Is there something wrong with me since I like vanilla icecream and the missionary position - more often than once a month though Strangely, I like to live on the wild side on-court and enjoy service and FH winners though. I like BH winners even more, but they are harder to come by.

 

[FuzzyYellowBalls]

Is there something wrong with me since I like vanilla icecream and the missionary position - more often than once a month though Strangely, I like to live on the wild side on-court and enjoy service and FH winners though.

Haha, no, nothing wrong with that, missionary is efficient and hey vanilla is probably the most popular flavor. Maybe tennis is where you let it all hang out.

 

[LuckyR]

They're having fun all right. Pushers are masochists. Big hitters are masochists.

Pushers are sadists. Fixed it for ya.

 

[FatHead250]

Made it to the quarters of my club's end of year tourney only to face the bossman of pushers. Not a hyperbole when I say these moonballs were 3-4 stories high. Followed by a blocked/chip short shot, rinse and repeat. I mean very effective at his game but this wasn't fun, I didn't have fun. It's not enjoyable tennis for me, partly because I struggle with that gamestyle, (and partly because I don't personally don't think moonballing is tennis)

But I wanted to know for you pushers out there with those insane moonballs, are you actually having fun? Do you purposely practice those shots with intention?

You're just bad. You do realise that all pro players are "pushers"? They hit with 95% accuracy and keep the ball in play, not trying to blast winners every shot like you do. In high-quality tennis every shot is hit with a margin for error, and that's what tennis is all about. It's just that as you improve, your pusher ball starts to resemble a good ball more and more. You'll never improve and keep losing against people playing proper tennis. And by proper tennis I mean tennis where you actually run and play the point out, not blast balls for fun like you and your buddies probably do.

What actually probably happened is that you just couldn't handle his baseline ball. Too much height on it, and all your errors got exposed. Imagine what would happen to your baseline game if the ball not only had height, but spin as well. There is absolutely no problem at stepping back and hitting a spinny moonball back. And if as you say, your strokes are better than his, youre gonna win that way. If you dont have the legs to run, then you shouldnt have won anyhow

 

[vex]

Made it to the quarters of my club's end of year tourney only to face the bossman of pushers. Not a hyperbole when I say these moonballs were 3-4 stories high. Followed by a blocked/chip short shot, rinse and repeat. I mean very effective at his game but this wasn't fun, I didn't have fun. It's not enjoyable tennis for me, partly because I struggle with that gamestyle, (and partly because I don't personally don't think moonballing is tennis)

But I wanted to know for you pushers out there with those insane moonballs, are you actually having fun? Do you purposely practice those shots with intention?

1) You’re serving to them. If they’re hitting a perfect moonball off your serve it’s cause your serve is weak.
2) they have to serve non-moonballs to you. If they’re hitting a perfect moonball off your return it’s cause your return is weak.
3) short of PERFECT moonballs that bounce near the baseline (and you can counter-moonball those as @FatHead250 explained) why aren’t you over heading away the less than perfect moonballs. You don’t see moonballs at higher levels because they’re just overhead practice.
4) if they aren’t actually lob type shots but instead are heavy Nadal type topspin loopy FHs… then you’re just facing someone with better groundstrokes than you.

To sum up, to beat the moonball pusher - don’t hit shots to him that let him set up clean, deep lobs. If he hits a perfect lob, lob him back. Eventually he’ll hit a shorter lob… move in and smash it cross court from him and prepare to volley/overhead again if he gets a racket on your smash.

 

[vex]

If your opponent is able to hit moonballs, it means your own shots are weak garbage sitters than he can do anything with.

Bingo

 

[vex]

My answer is don't play singles in competition. Never have to face pushers and junkballers that way. Play singles with folks you like to play singles with. Save competition for doubles where goofy shots go to die thanks to the presence of a net player.

Just learn to hit over heads both from the mid court and from the baseline. Then no one can annoy you in doubles anymore.

And to the OP:
Word of advice. You will only face vitriol on these boards if you suggest that any sort of shot that lands in the court is "not tennis". There is no rule in tennis that limits the type of shots that must come off the opponent's racket. So while hitting back moonballs may not be fun, it is certainly "tennis". Personally I've never faced a 3 storey high moonballer, but I can't imagine a ball hit that high couldn't be struck back with an over head like a serve. Would have been excellent OH practice.

And every good player I know just hits swinging volleys against the average moonballer.

So many good posts in this thread.

For a long long time I focused exclusively on honing my FH/BH/serve. And they’re all weapons. But guess what? I still would get wrecked by moonballers/dropshot/slicey pusher types. Why? Because I had zero skill at hitting volleys/overheads. Got pulled into doubles because my serve was a monster and slowly learned the hard way 1) how to hit volleys/overheads (by actually practicing them from all over the court), 2) how to control my baseline aggression (knowing when to go for a winner and when not) and 3) how to play desperation “pusher” defense by accurately lobbing when the situation calls for it. I’m a dramatically improved player because of it and now pusher types are just a fun practice for me.

 

[Rosstour]

Pushers are sadists. Fixed it for ya.

Sorry, brain fart.

 

[Power Player]

I don’t understand the hate against pushers

I’ve played singles matches before and when I lose the first hit being a counter puncher, I change my tactics to lobs to change it up.

There was one match back in 2017, where I lost the first set 3:6. We had good rallies. But, he loved pace and hit more winners than me. In the second set, I changed it up and used lobs. After leading 3:2, he verbally attacked me on the bench during the changeover and told me that this isn’t tennis and that I should play like a man, etc. So, that shook me up. I then, went back to the strategy of the first set and he won the next two games to lead 3:4. I then told myself internally during the changeover, why am I playing the type of tennis he wants? Hitting deep and hard to his hitting zone, This is a tournament and I’m in no way indebted to play a certain way. So, I went back to lobs and he was livid and I could tell was losing his patience, as I wasn’t listening to his instructions. I then went to lead 5:4 and during the changeover again was told “what did I tell you about lobs?, etc..” The only thing I said, was that I’m trying to, but, sometimes, I just hit topspin forehands and when I don’t do it right, they turn to lobs and I apologized, but, deep down, I was grinning and I told myself I guess I know what to do now….. lob everything deep and throw slices. He won the next game to tie it up 5:5. In the next game, he was cursing after hitting a shot 2 feet long trying to end the rally quickly and I won the next next point and he was cursing and in the changeover,started talking to his camp, that this isn’t tennis and he can’t believe he payed to play this type of tennis. I smiled calmly and had to actually fight off laughing. I was having so much fun. I knew if I won the next game, that he only have a whole set of “pushing” tennis to deal with in the third set. Well, we played the last game out and he started pushing, as well. But, I ended up winning 7:5 with a beautiful backhand winner down the line…. Not a pushing shot. I hit a lob and then he lobbed a shot that didn’t go deep, but, rather, into middle of the court so I ended up playing attacking tennis in the last game with two winners (one was a volley winner set up by an attacking shot).

I was looking forward to playing the third set, but, he stormed off with his tennis bag and said he didn’t want to be tortured anymore and left. So, I won with a default. But, is it fun playing pushing tennis? Not all the time. I don’t think you develop as much with this type of tennis. But, I have fun in tennis in general. Nowadays, I just play doubles and it is so much fun playing recreational tennis at the club with an assortment of different players. I love utilizing lobs in tennis, especially, against the impatient players who go for winners, but, are too inconsistent.

If someone ever tells you to play tennis like a man, you are winning the match. Just keep doing the same thing over and over and enjoy the win while drinking his salty tears.

I have nothing but respect for guys who use strategy on the court to beat me, personally.