Nadal's 2017, WTFs and YE #1

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peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
octobrina10 said:
Most of the normal people around the world know what the Olympic Games are, but they have no clue about the ATP's ranking system.
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Olympics are more famous than grand slams or the entire sport of tennis. Lol by that logic guess Murray is the tennis GOAT and Phelps the ultimate athlete

Davis Cup, Laver cup, Hopman cup, olympics all have meaning but are not ATP and are side shows

Let’s imagine a world where Olympics are really important. Firstly Murray is now the GOAT but anyway even if that works existed for nadal the rest of his achievements don’t put him anywhere on the GOAT discussion apart from solely on one surface and associated 1 slam and 3 mini tournaments associated with that slam. All his GOAT claims are on that one slam and 3 associated tournaments.
 
octobrina10

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
peakin11mugs said:
Olympics are more famous than grand slams or the entire sport of tennis. Lol by that logic guess Murray is the tennis GOAT and Phelps the ultimate athlete

Davis Cup, Laver cup, Hopman cup, olympics all have meaning but are not ATP and are side shows

Let’s imagine a world where Olympics are really important. Firstly Murray is now the GOAT but anyway even if that works existed for nadal the rest of his achievements don’t put him anywhere on the GOAT discussion apart from solely on one surface and associated 1 slam and 3 mini tournaments associated with that slam. All his GOAT claims are on that one slam and 3 associated tournaments.
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You are correct that Davis Cup, Laver cup, Hopman cup, Oympics are not the ATP events. The Davis Cup & Hopman cup & Oympics are the ITF events.
The Laver Cup is not a pro tennis circuit event.
GS tournaments, also, are not the ATP events, they are the ITF events.

As for the 'GOAT discussion', it has been the obsession of Fedfans, nothing else.
 
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P

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
octobrina10 said:
You are correct that Davis Cup, Laver cup, Hopman cup, Oympics are not the ATP events. The Davis Cup & Hopman cup & Oympics are the ITF events.
The Laver Cup is not a pro tennis circuit event.

As for the 'GOAT discussion', it has been the obsession of Fedfans, nothing else.
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Yes they are all sideshows or lumped into miscellaneous. Once fed or nadal or joker etc won Davis Cup it is literally never mentioned ever again. Olympics has some sideshow value like Davis cup. Players will like it as it is a unique opportunity to get a gold medal for their country which they don’t get with slams etc. It is not a slam or WTF though. It’s a sentimental novelty like the Davis Cup with no prize money, or points. No bearing on legacy.

It is important to win it for players though and fed is missing out a little with only a silver and a gold. He has a gold medal for Switzerland though and that is the main novelty of otherwise pointless, cashless Olympics
 
pame

pame

Hall of Fame
octobrina10 said:
You are correct that Davis Cup, Laver cup, Hopman cup, Oympics are not the ATP events. The Davis Cup & Hopman cup & Oympics are the ITF events.
The Laver Cup is not a pro tennis circuit event.

As for the 'GOAT discussion', it has been the obsession of Fedfans, nothing else.
Click to expand...
Actually, the GOAT discussion started as an "obsession", if you will, of US commentators, as they counted down to Pete Sampras 14th slam, and as it became clear that Federer was looking like he would pass that number of slams, Internet Samprastards initiated the "weak era" meme as a way of validating Sampras' record which had been expected to last considerably longer.

cf BBC 606 tennis forum if you can find their archives. mediter was the chief protagonist of that brigade
 
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octobrina10

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
Polvorin said:
Do you have any real opinions or just claim to believe things that will boost Rafa? Nobody but the biggest fanatic would claim the Olympics are somehow more significant than a M1000 or WTF win
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Most of the normal people around the world know what the Olympic Games are the most significant...
 
D

Deleted member 688153

Guest
Gstaad 250 (with cow) > Federer hit for Haiti > Laver Cup > Hopman Cup > Gstaad (without cow) > Olympics >>>>> "Grand" slams.

Deal with it.
 
T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
octobrina10 said:
Most of the normal people around the world know what the Olympic Games are the most significant...
Click to expand...

This is the image of a trophy that cannot be won at the Olympics :

World-Cup.jpg
 
T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
octobrina10 said:
Most of the normal people around the world know that at the Olympic Games the winner, second and third-place competitors are given medals (gold, silver, bronze).
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And this has a relevance factor of exactly zero to the point that is being made which is that the presented trophy and the tournament that it is the award for, is the most significant in its sport and is not part of the Olympics.

Just like this trophy:

wimbledon-championship-trophy.jpg


and many more from the tennis world.

Are you one of the people that "know what (?) the Olympics are most significant"?

:cool:
 
P

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
octobrina10 said:
Most of the normal people around the world know what the Olympic Games are the most significant...
Click to expand...

What exactly is your point about nadals Olympics? We all know Murray is GOAT olympian tennis player. Yet another thing Nadal is second fiddle to. Nadal Is a GOAT at being no 2. Actually wait I think fed this year made a better no 2 season than nadal has ever had as no 2. So maybe not but nadal is still ATG at being no 2 then
 
octobrina10

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
P

peakin11mugs

Semi-Pro
Polvorin

Polvorin

Professional
peakin11mugs said:
What exactly is your point about nadals Olympics? We all know Murray is GOAT olympian tennis player. Yet another thing Nadal is second fiddle to. Nadal Is a GOAT at being no 2. Actually wait I think fed this year made a better no 2 season than nadal has ever had as no 2. So maybe not but nadal is still ATG at being no 2 then
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You are attempting to have a logical debate with octobrina. I don't know if you're brave or foolish, but I'd recommend not expecting it to go anywhere. Except in circles maybe, until you arrive at the conclusion that Rafa is the greatest on any surface, at any time, and has never lost except because of injuries.
 
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helterskelter

G.O.A.T.
Polvorin said:
You are attempting to have a logical debate with octobrina. I don't know if it's brave or foolish, but I'd recommend not expecting it to go anywhere. Except in circles maybe, until you arrive at the conclusion that Rafa is the greatest on any surface, at any time, and has never lost except because of injuries.
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I am not sure what you're complaining about. That conclusion is just objective fact. Don't let Nadal's extreme humility blind you to his invincibility.
 
P

PMChambers

Hall of Fame
Personally I'd rather he win AO, get double career Hrand Slam, it will look signifigantly better than any WTF. Given the number of FO wins a DCGS will make his resume more balance. Though given he's been in 4 AO, 10 FO, 5 Wim & 4 USO finals his ability across all surfaces should not be questioned. I don't think any sane person would claim him the GOAT at 3 of those Majors it does not diminish his resume and ability across all surfaces.
Theres something not right with the WFT since mid 90s, there are more prestigious and high value Masters. Could just be the BO3 on a small RR is meh. Or the best of the best meet so regularly that it's just another match. Or there's so much money in the big event that the WTF big prize isn't as important as it once was.
 
aditya123

aditya123

Hall of Fame
Polvorin said:
Do you have any real opinions or just claim to believe things that will boost Rafa? Nobody but the biggest fanatic would claim the Olympics are somehow more significant than a M1000 or WTF win
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Loll...why was the term Golden slam coined in the first place???? Your knowledge is very limited, dull and obnoxious, Go impove your knowledge first
 
aditya123

aditya123

Hall of Fame
Polvorin said:
Do you have any real opinions or just claim to believe things that will boost Rafa? Nobody but the biggest fanatic would claim the Olympics are somehow more significant than a M1000 or WTF win
Click to expand...
And what is your problem exactly that you called me a fanatic??? I have stated a few times that Fed is the Goat because of his 19 slams. That doesn't mean that I have to endorse each and every silly normal tournament that Roger wins. Also there is no harm in giving due credit to other great tournaments which Roger has not won .So you better stop behaving like a child. Grow up soon
 
Polvorin

Polvorin

Professional
aditya123 said:
And what is your problem exactly that you called me a fanatic??? I have stated a few times that Fed is the Goat because of his 19 slams. That doesn't mean that I have to endorse each and every silly normal tournament that Roger wins. Also there is no harm in giving due credit to other great tournaments which Roger has not won .So you better stop behaving like a child. Grow up soon
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The Tour Finals is not some "silly normal tournament." Players have to qualify for it by being the best of the best, therefore to win it is exceedingly difficult.

Though I am sure any tournament that Rafito hasn't won seems silly and normal to you. One thing for sure... you can't win the WTF without beating someone in the top 25 :oops:
 
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aditya123

aditya123

Hall of Fame
Polvorin said:
Probably media hype machine inventing accomplishments for Agassi and others if I had to guess
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I was right in stating that you have limited knowledge. Golden slam term was coined in 1988 way before Agassi won his first slam... Stop arguing without proper facts
 
aditya123

aditya123

Hall of Fame
Yes it is.. Davis cup has a lot of history than WTF, Many people across the countries are aware of Davis cup, whereas only a few follow WTF. Any ways it is pointless to argue with a person having limited knowledge and who posts wrong news like you
 
Polvorin

Polvorin

Professional
aditya123 said:
Yes it is.. Davis cup has a lot of history than WTF, Many people across the countries are aware of Davis cup, whereas only a few follow WTF. Any ways it is pointless to argue with a person having limited knowledge and who posts wrong news like you
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The majority of the worlds best players don't even play Davis Cup, or play only enough to keep their home country in the world group. You know that, right?

Hell, most of them play DC just to win it once so they can add it to their resumé and after that don't bother with it.

Please, keep sharing all your right news and limitless knowledge
 
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Benben245

Benben245

Banned
Any doctors care to speculate on Nadal's knees, the flare ups, and what it could be? I feel like for other sports someone with this type of knee trouble would have retired long ago and I cannot think of any other comparable athlete that takes time off and regains their form again and again with knee issues. Nadal is one of a kind. (No, I will not go there ;) )

(Grant hill? But was never the same after his first ankle injury)
 
Polvorin

Polvorin

Professional
Benben245 said:
Any doctors care to speculate on Nadal's knees, the flare ups, and what it could be? I feel like for other sports someone with this type of knee trouble would have retired long ago and I cannot think of any other comparable athlete that takes time off and regains their form again and again with knee issues. Nadal is one of a kind. (No, I will not go there ;) )

(Grant hill? But was never the same after his first ankle injury)
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Some have said he may have an allergy to fast playing conditions that always causes his knees to flare up this time of year. However, he made a valiant effort to fight through it this year because he is such a warrior

Not to worry, he'll be back to his unstoppable best during the next slow HC & clay seasons, like always
 
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Bender

Bender

G.O.A.T.
Not happening, although if he does win it somehow, this year will become more like the opposite of 2007
 
Vady_Vamos

Vady_Vamos

New User
Well, when it's between health plus a good preparation for AO and a WTF title, the latter loses its importance. Surely, the lack of WTF title is a hole in RAFA's career, but it's all relative. Iliterate tennis fans look at pure numbers, but I used to analyze things in depth. I admit RAFA's vulnerability at WTF, but at the same time I can't say I was impressed by the fact that Federer added a RG title to his resume, given how he has done it. Not only he took advantage of RAFA's burnout, but also wasn't able to take that golden opportunity like a man, struggling against Acasuso, Del Potro and being on verge against Haas. So, if RAFA didn't have to play Federer/Djokovic at 2010/2013 WTG, he would have won the title, but would it make him better? I'm not sure.
 
Mainad

Mainad

Bionic Poster
aditya123 said:
Fed was injured during 2016 Olympics I guess, He dint play any tournament further in 2016
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Well, his knee injury flared up during his semi-final match at Wimbledon when he fell on court. He called time on his season after that to ensure he recovered properly so it meant he couldn't play the Olympics.
 
Druss

Druss

Hall of Fame
Benben245 said:
Any doctors care to speculate on Nadal's knees, the flare ups, and what it could be? I feel like for other sports someone with this type of knee trouble would have retired long ago and I cannot think of any other comparable athlete that takes time off and regains their form again and again with knee issues. Nadal is one of a kind. (No, I will not go there ;) )

(Grant hill? But was never the same after his first ankle injury)
Click to expand...

How certain are we that ALL his supposedly injury claims are legit?
 
Polvorin

Polvorin

Professional
aditya123 said:
Hahaha, Golden slam term coined for Agassi
Great players have single or no Davis cup titles. If this is the the trumpet you want to blow, Ya am deaf. Your trumpet is full of f.....g s..t
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Any other brilliant insights? I said the golden slam thing was a guess. Do you know what a guess is, genius? I think it's "adivinacion" in Spanish if that helps.

That said, it wasn't far off. The golden slam is just an accomplishment manufactured by the media hype machine. It isn't significant in terms of real tennis achievements, especially with how much luck is involved.
 
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aditya123

aditya123

Hall of Fame
Meanwhile will some one enlighten some of the dull headed people here that McEnroe, Connors, Wilander, Edberg,Becker, Courier, Sampras, Agassi, Nadal have been the worlds best players at some point of time and they have multiple Davis cup titles
 
aditya123

aditya123

Hall of Fame
Djokovic and Murray would like to add a few more Davis cup titles but then there is too much burden on them and too little support from their team mates
 
Polvorin

Polvorin

Professional
aditya123 said:
Meanwhile will some one enlighten some of the dull headed people here that McEnroe, Connors, Wilander, Edberg,Becker, Courier, Sampras, Agassi, Nadal have been the worlds best players at some point of time and they have multiple Davis cup titles
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Yes and many top players skip Davis Cup because their rankings are more important. Including Rafito in 2017. http://www.**************.org/tenni...pril-the-claycourts-season-is-too-important-/
 
octobrina10

octobrina10

Talk Tennis Guru
peakin11mugs said:
Yeah I agree Murray is the ultimate tennis player as he has the most titles of the most prestigious event in tennis and stands alone. He is GOAT. Stands alone.

But why are you talking about nadal specifically? He hasn’t reached this greatness in the pinnacle of tennis - the Olympics. He should be cleaning Murray’s shoes
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About Rafa? I have not written about Rafa!

https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/nadals-2017-wtfs-and-ye-1.603188/#post-11765048
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...017-wtfs-and-ye-1.603188/page-2#post-11765935
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...017-wtfs-and-ye-1.603188/page-2#post-11766043
 
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