Best Technique
- Thread starter TeamOB
- Start date
bigred1910
Rookie
i agree. but then again i do just love watching him
favourite to watch second is dolgopoliv.downdaline
Professional
I would also add Tomas Berdych to the list.
His strokes are textbook and he makes very clean contact with the ball.
His strokes are textbook and he makes very clean contact with the ball.
Say Chi Sin Lo
G.O.A.T.
Second that!
N
Nathaniel_Near
Guest
Live, Federer's backhand looks a touch flaky and precarious -- one gets an extra appreciation for why the stroke goes through periods of fallibility.
In a way, it seems to not always quite be wholly connected.
In a way, it seems to not always quite be wholly connected.
captainbryce
Hall of Fame
If it was just ONE player to demonstrate all shots, Roger Federer! However, ideally I'd pick different players to demonstrate all the various shots.
1. First Serve - John Isner
2. Second Serve - Pete Sampras
3. First Serve Return - Novak Djokovic
4. Second Serve Return - Andre Agassi
5. Crosscourt Forehand - Roger Federer
6. Inside Out Forehand - Juan Martin Del Potro
7. One-Handed Backhand - Stanislas Wawenrka
8. Two-Handed Backhand - David Nalbandian
9. Net Volley - Stefan Edberg
10. Half Volley - Roger Federer
11. Drop Volley - Jo-Wilfried Tsonga
12. Dive Volley - Boris Becker
13. Dropshot - Andre Agassi
14. Topspin Lob - Lleyton Hewitt
15. Overhead Smash - Pete Sampras
1. First Serve - John Isner
2. Second Serve - Pete Sampras
3. First Serve Return - Novak Djokovic
4. Second Serve Return - Andre Agassi
5. Crosscourt Forehand - Roger Federer
6. Inside Out Forehand - Juan Martin Del Potro
7. One-Handed Backhand - Stanislas Wawenrka
8. Two-Handed Backhand - David Nalbandian
9. Net Volley - Stefan Edberg
10. Half Volley - Roger Federer
11. Drop Volley - Jo-Wilfried Tsonga
12. Dive Volley - Boris Becker
13. Dropshot - Andre Agassi
14. Topspin Lob - Lleyton Hewitt
15. Overhead Smash - Pete Sampras
bigred1910
Rookie
ive changed a few to be where i think they should be.
I think marat safins backhand is just the most beautiful piece of artwork i have ever seen. it is just stunning. his forehand is technically very sound aswell the only thing he didnt have working for him is his mentality on court it was rather shaky.
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MichaelNadal
Bionic Poster
Agassi.
10Char
10Char
Sid_Vicious
G.O.A.T.
What exactly is the definition of textbook? I don't see how Federer's forehand and backhand are even remotely close to being textbook. Especially the forehand with all that wrist movement and vicious racquet head speed. Its a brilliant stroke, but it is a complex stroke.
In comparison, someone like Agassi deserves the title for being the most "textbook" player of all time. He just took the racquet back and swung from both sides; no huge takeback, no extreme knee bend, not wristy etc.
Bobby Jr
G.O.A.T.
Sid_Vicious
G.O.A.T.
You don't think so? I haven't seen anyone hit forehands like Federer did. I remember during the 2003 Wimblddon SF, Federer used nothing but wrist to crush a forehand over the highest part of the net from inside the surface box. His racquet head acceleration was so incredible that he could hit shots like that comfortably. The only guy who I have seen hit shots like that is Nadal. I think of Federers forehand like a signature shot of his.
So with plenty of great multiple slam champion volleyers (volliers?) from the 80's/90's, you instead pick a ball basher whop redominantly plays from the baseline and has never won anything significant as the person with the best drop volley.
The-Champ
Legend
yepp, those two would be my picks as well, specially on slices, volleys, overheads.
The-Champ
Legend
Shots that I think look perfect:
Serve, both 1st and 2nd - Pete Sampras
FH - Agassi (Today we see Fedal hit their fh and we say WOW! I wonder if we still would have said WOW had they played 25 years ago).
BH - Agassi
Return - Agassi
Volley (BH) - Edberg
Volley (FH) - Mac
Slice - Federer
Lobs - Nadal (People would say Hewitt, but Nadal is better IMO. Nobody can execute a slice bh lob with precision as this guy when on defense).
Serve, both 1st and 2nd - Pete Sampras
FH - Agassi (Today we see Fedal hit their fh and we say WOW! I wonder if we still would have said WOW had they played 25 years ago).
BH - Agassi
Return - Agassi
Volley (BH) - Edberg
Volley (FH) - Mac
Slice - Federer
Lobs - Nadal (People would say Hewitt, but Nadal is better IMO. Nobody can execute a slice bh lob with precision as this guy when on defense).
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N
Nathaniel_Near
Guest
Nadal has a great slice backhand lob on the run and decent lobs in general, but I find that to be an odd choice. Djokovic has a better general lob than Nadal and also does well with defensive lobs stretched wide. Guys like Hewitt and Lendl had generally superior lobs that they used much more frequently.. more road tested.
Nadal best lobs around.. hmmm..
Nadal best lobs around.. hmmm..
N
Nathaniel_Near
Guest
If Nadal is going to be picked for best technique on a particular stroke which can be emulated unlike say his forehand which is very idiosyncratic, why not his forehand overhead -- it's supreme.
captainbryce
Hall of Fame
I don't base my decisions on playing style or career milestones, only on the shot itself. Can you name an active player that has a better drop volley than Tsonga?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJSpOvozUhI
If anything, I'd say that because he's a baseline player, that tends to make the shot even more effective (people aren't expecting him to do it).
captainbryce
Hall of Fame
I agree. In fact, Nadal wouldn't even be in my top 3 of best lobs among active players, let alone of all time.
Among active players, the best lobs are:
1. Lleyton Hewitt
2. Andy Murray
3. Roger Federer
4. Novak Djokovic
5. Rafael Nadal
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5PyPDCCAaE
Among best players of all time:
1. Lleyton Hewitt
2. Andre Agassi
3. Michael Chang
4. Pete Sampras
5. Jimmy Conners
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OM9GKm9M6no
Bobby Jr
G.O.A.T.
No really imo. We never saw anyone hit a serve like Sampras's or a 2hbh like Agassi's either if you get specific with technique.
Federer's forehand is quite lacking in unnecessary movements compared to most imo. It's also not wristy most of the time, it just appears so because of how laid back it is. The wrist is passive during the contact phase generally. Being able to crush forehands from inside the service box is technique but also sheer self-confidence (and, to be fair, the benefit of strings which offer miles more spin than the majority of rec players can fathom).
Insofar as others having similar forehands I'm not sure that is a deal breaker for deciding whether someone is 'textbook'. Textbooks get rewritten all the time and his for a long, long time has been a benchmark of effortlessness (a prerequisite for being textbook imo), effective in all circumstances and with a broader than most ability to vary the shot (pace/spin). It may not be the last iteration of excellence but there are few which could make a better claim. I can't think of one.
President
Legend
His technique is more easily replicable than Federer's though IMO, more solid overall. Federer's technique has a lot of moving parts (and yes, IMO his forehand is a very complicated shot if you really break it down) and that backhand is not ideal, there are better one handers to imitate. Nalbandian's technique on every shot (his volleys are/were better technically than Federer too IMO) was completely solid. And the backhand was better than Agassi, Djokovic, or Murray. The extra spin creates possibilities that aren't available to most, but doesn't make the shot less solid IMO.
Sid_Vicious
G.O.A.T.
Nalbandian's forehand was no more ideal to copy than Federer's backhand; I can name 10 guys who have a better forehand.That shot was either a winner or unforced error machine. I was watching him his match against Agassi from 2003 the other day and it was ridiculous how much more solid Agassi's forehand was than his. Nalbandian was shanking and hitting loopers to deal with Agassi's depth on forehand shots.
And we have heard it all before. Hewitt, Nadal, Murray and about 12 others guys on the ATP have better volleys than Federer technically, but too bad it doesn't do jack for their games and Federer has proven himself to be a far better net player than all of them.
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Bobby Jr
G.O.A.T.
Being 2m tall probably has something to do with how effortless he makes it look.
President
Legend
Being a great net player (in terms of actual execution) not what this thread is about though, as I understand it. I think Nalbandian's technique on both his forehand and volleys would be great to put in a tennis "textbook", that he could sometimes execute poorly (as do many players) doesn't mean that the technique was bad. That forehand was a standard, simple, and solid shot IMO. Federer's shots are generally more complicated and not suitable for imitation (mostly the backhand and volleys). I'm not saying he is a worse player than Nalbandian by any means! That would be ridiculous.
Sid_Vicious
G.O.A.T.
Federer's volleys are unique and Mcenroe and Henman have mentioned that he likes to get too crafty with them which leads to horrific errors. I could see Nalbandian being more textbook in his volleys, but I wouldn't say he has better volleys. I have never seen Nalbandian volley as well as Federer (when he is in form) consistently in a match. And I'm not talking about kodak moments, even Roddick hit some impeccable volleys in his time, I'm talking about matches like Wimbledon 2012 where Federer was hitting sick drop and drive volleys the whole match.
And Nalbandian's forehand might be good, but like Federer's backhand, there are better versions of the same shot to imitate. Agassi, for example, had a much better and cleaner looking forehand than Nalbandian did. Berdych as well, if you are using standard, simple, and solid as your criteria.
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PhrygianDominant
Hall of Fame
I will offer a counter argument. Federer does have some idiosyncracies to his volley technique that make him less than an ideal copy. He has his shoulders too open at contact on the forehand volley. He slices his backhand volley a bit too much. I am speaking "in general" or "on average". It would take you 5 minutes to find an example of him doing it properly, but he has a tendency to do it wrong which makes him a less than perfect example for volleys.
I feel the same way about his backhand and how he straightens his arm too late.
If I had to pick one player I would probably pick Agassi. Nalbandian's serve is the problem for me, everything else is fine. Federer is still a great example on the forehand because he gets such good extension with a WW motion.
If you can pick individual players for individual strokes, then all hell breaks lose. Do we differentiate slice lobs and topspin lobs? How about different serves? Flat/aggressive vs. Topspin/defensive forehands? Need I go on?
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Russeljones
Talk Tennis Guru
It's odd that, for someone who comes across as a knowledgeable poster, you sometimes seem to have amnesia when it comes to Federer's ability displayed in his period of peak dominance.
Sid_Vicious
G.O.A.T.
It is a totally legitimate statement. Even in Federer's prime, his backhand did break down every now and then. For proof, just rewatch the 2005 USO SF and Final against Hewitt and Agassi, respectively. Prime Federer shanked about 50 or more backhands in that match. It was no secret. Everyone knew that Federer's backhand was much weaker throughout his entire career. Agassi even recollected Federer's erratic shots of the backhand in his autobiography which he credited it for letting him back in the match.
I was watching the 2005 AO SF recently and Federer couldn't touch Safin in backhand to backhand rallies. He always was the first one to lose ground and promptly threw in quality slices, which more than made up for his topspin backhand.
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Maximagq
Banned
The man with the perfect game. The king of tennis. The king of Melbourne Park.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQV6xGj43JU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQV6xGj43JU
Sid_Vicious
G.O.A.T.
Technique on the backhand and forehand is fantastic. He can hit a huge ball with either, but volley's, slice and overheads? :shock:
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