Club pro told me something in mid match......it changed everything.

[Vanhalen]

So I've been playing many years. Went to the MTM Wegnar method around 2012. In practice, I do great. I play 4.0 USTA singles.

My issue....in matches, I still get nervous and find myself swinging so early. And with the MTM method is not good, the racquet face will be too closed if you start way too early. You need to wait on the ball and......I just can't!

So, in a match Sunday I was nervous as always, never wanting to loose or look bad. Down 0-3 and dumping some important forehands into the net. Our club pro walks over and tells me to forget everything about technique and relax. Just focus on the ball and think only of where I want to hit it to. Quit trying to hit winners on every shot, just focus on where I want the ball to land. No mechanics at all!

It wasn't easy, but after a while I was able to let go and just think about where I wanted the ball to go. I lost the first set 5-7. Won the second 6-2. And we play a tie breaker if we split sets....I won the tie break.

I played again tonight in the same way. No more swing mechanics, just forgetting everything and focusing on where I want the ball to go and its trajectory. Tonight was just a pro set to 12. I won and the guy I've played against many times said......I see you have changed your stroke. I know it feels different, he said my wrist isn't as laid back, I don't look stiff, and I am looser.

No more mechanics for me for a while. I'm on a little roll and it is freeing!

 

[LeeD]

It's called paralysis from too much analysis.
Don't think, hit.

 

[NuBas]

Well as humans, we think and process a lot in our brains so of course everyone will struggle with that initially but I believe any skill, whether tennis or another sport, its meant to feel effortless and natural.

You goal is to win matches so although you may not look like Federer, you met your goals and sounds like things have clicked. Its a great feeling when things click.

 

[user92626]

Your problem at this point is nerve. So much that the mechanics make minimal impact. When you have overcome nerve, then the ceiling is the mechanics and strength.

I am playing matches with stakes quite regularly. I don't get nerve. During the match I just try to keep mental focus, perform the mechanics as best as I can and exert strength.

 

[Surion]

As long as your general stroke mechanics are decent, this advise is very helpful.

But if your strokes are crap, then this tip will make things worse.

 

[NuBas]

As long as your general stroke mechanics are decent, this advise is very helpful.

But if your strokes are crap, then this tip will make things worse.

Well actually the pro said to forget everything and focus on where you want your shots to land and the trajectory it will travel. That alone in my mind creates a brushing and driving through the ball image.

Sounds about right.

 

[user92626]

As long as your general stroke mechanics are decent, this advise is very helpful.

But if your strokes are crap, then this tip will make things worse.

But decent or crap, his stroke is evidently good enough for his 4.0 level.

It's clearly nerve that's masking his stroke. The coach's advice was right on. After the OP has overcome nerve and maxed out at 4.0, he'll need to revisit the mechanics if he wants to move up.

 

[Bobby Jr]

So I've been playing many years. Went to the MTM Wegnar method around 2012.

From what I understand if you're using the Wegner method then you need to "pull back" more as you swing. Also, try combining that with swinging really slowly until immediately before contact and then massively accelerating the racquet head while pulling across the ball sideways.

This applies to any technical issue when you are using the Wegner method.

*Apparently*

 

[dominikk1985]

the Thing is that Forget about mechanics only works if you have automated good strokes. if a random hack "just focusses on the ball" he won't make good strokes.

however at some Point your strokes do Need to become automated, in learning that is called going from concious competence to unconcious competence. unless you reach that stage of unconcious competence (not thinking about mechanics while hitting but doing it "naturally") you can't Play at a high Level but before there is unconcious competence there has to be concious competence, you can't skip that step. to gain unconcious competence you Need to do at least several thousand concious swings with correct mechanics.

 

[2forehands]

Great advice and one that is supported by the research of Gabriele Wulf (constrained-action hypothesis) who has shown that an external focus of attention helps even novices perform better and learn more quickly (this research goes against some of the opinions here). The trick is to focus on the outcome of the movement which could be far (the ball) or near (the racket). Personally I prefer to use the ball when playing and coaching. Very few coaches I come across use this approach (predominately) which is a real shame as a strong effect has been shown across a wide range of sports and motor skills. Interestingly, she did publish some work that suggests that even 100% feedback on every trial is the best way to coach (as long as it is external feedback) which again flies in the face of motor learning theory.

 

[heninfan99]

 

[Limpinhitter]

So I've been playing many years. Went to the MTM Wegnar method around 2012. In practice, I do great. I play 4.0 USTA singles.

My issue....in matches, I still get nervous and find myself swinging so early. And with the MTM method is not good, the racquet face will be too closed if you start way too early. You need to wait on the ball and......I just can't!

So, in a match Sunday I was nervous as always, never wanting to loose or look bad. Down 0-3 and dumping some important forehands into the net. Our club pro walks over and tells me to forget everything about technique and relax. Just focus on the ball and think only of where I want to hit it to. Quit trying to hit winners on every shot, just focus on where I want the ball to land. No mechanics at all!

It wasn't easy, but after a while I was able to let go and just think about where I wanted the ball to go. I lost the first set 5-7. Won the second 6-2. And we play a tie breaker if we split sets....I won the tie break.

I played again tonight in the same way. No more swing mechanics, just forgetting everything and focusing on where I want the ball to go and its trajectory. Tonight was just a pro set to 12. I won and the guy I've played against many times said......I see you have changed your stroke. I know it feels different, he said my wrist isn't as laid back, I don't look stiff, and I am looser.

No more mechanics for me for a while. I'm on a little roll and it is freeing!

I am a big fan of the Jimmy Connors approach to match play. Focus on executing your shots, one shot at a time, and executing your gameplan one point at a time, and the outcome will take care of itself.

 

[Deleted member 23235]

Adding to everyone else's good advice:

In general I don't think about any swing mechanics when I'm playing (save that for practice).
My only focus is just the contact point... basically I'm either waiting for the ball to get into my contact, or I'm moving my contact zone to the ball.
The only adjustments I'm thinking about are usually:
* "Hit higher, deeper" (which might be a cue to get under the ball more)
* "Hit more in the center" (eg. cc slice)

If I were in an in between state where I am still thinking about mechanics (ie. when I went through a grip change), then just chose high % targets, and just thought about the 1-2 mechanics I was working, and my only "game" was to see how many times I could repeat the stroke... I would "win" if I could execute to a high frequency, regardless of the score... i would "lose" (even if I won the point), if I found myself reverting back to an old mechanic.

The "universal truth" behind this that is applicable everywhere, is to embrace the process of improvement, don't worry about winning/losing (which will ultimately stunt my growth).

 

[moonballs]

As long as your general stroke mechanics are decent, this advise is very helpful.

But if your strokes are crap, then this tip will make things worse.

I think at all levels the focus shouldn't be on techniques in match plays. Maybe the serve is the exception. Now I learned to focus on two things, first the ball all the way to a good contact on the sweet spot, second keep the athletic stance and the feet light.

Funny that I only improved no. 1 recently after I had a two months layoff due to TE. The fear of pain helped. As a result my game level actually didn't dip even I can't confidently use backhand slice and backhand volley.

 

[10isMaestro]

No more mechanics for me for a while. I'm on a little roll and it is freeing!

You should understand that your ability to pay attention is limited. If you focus on technical details during matches, you have to take part of the focus you were using to actually execute tennis movements away from that execution in order to also consider said technical details. That ultimately affects your ability to play tennis. However, there is a proper time to think about mechanics -- during practice. When you practice to improve your ability to execute specific movements, you should bother about how you do things more than about just trying to make it happen. The point there is to ingrain proper habits, which is why drills and many types of practice session tips try to simplify things and make them structured -- it makes it easier to play so you can concentrate more on your methods.

 

[10isMaestro]

the Thing is that Forget about mechanics only works if you have automated good strokes.

Your brain is like a computer in that respect: there are only so many tasks you can carry out at once and if one of them is watching bits and pieces of technical advice you pay the price somewhere else. To the simple question "can we truly multitask," the Atkinson-Shifrrin model of memory has a simple answer: if you add more things to do, you have to split your focus on more things and each of them will tend to be done less appropriately. In that framework, learning to hit a forehand means getting increasingly larger bits of the stroke to be considered as single tasks until you finally can only think "cross-court forehand, deep, etc." as one single object. That frees up space to think about others things -- like where's my opponent and what type of ball is coming at me. Getting things to feel "automated" as you say means getting sequences of movements to treated as one thing to do and not many.

If you have ingrained ball striking habits, depending on well they are ingrained, you have less to focus on technique-wise. If you barely ever struck a ball, you have a lot to think about, but that doesn't erase the fundamental problem -- it just means you might not even be able to afford thinking about picking targets and flight paths or about where your opponent is standing.

 

[robok9]

Go read The Inner Game of Tennis by Timothy Gallway. That's basically what the whole book is about. It covers 1. fighting with your mental side to keep your focus and 2. learning technique in a more natural way.

 

[pnw_hardcourt]

I so often get stuck in the technique trap, trying to hit winners or produce a heavy ball. The advice you were given though is absolutely right. A simple, clear intention on where you want the ball to land is paramount. I learned this a while back but still forget it often!

Feel Tennis is my favorite online resource for this kind of advice. Here's the video on this concept.

 

[Limpinhitter]

I so often get stuck in the technique trap, trying to hit winners or produce a heavy ball. The advice you were given though is absolutely right. A simple, clear intention on where you want the ball to land is paramount. I learned this a while back but still forget it often!

Feel Tennis is my favorite online resource for this kind of advice. Here's the video on this concept.

This is a good lesson, but, an important element is missing. Tennis is a percentage game. My shot selection is based on high percentage tennis. As such, my intention is clear in my mind, and, I already know where I'm going to hit the ball, in almost every situation, before I step on the court.

 

[TnsGuru]

The book "Inner game of tennis" talks about this way to play tennis and that is to not think just let it flow. First, the book breaks down the Self into Self 1, which is basically your thinking brain (always analyzing and judging), and Self 2, which is your "feeling and doing" brain. Brain 1 and Brain 2 are always in conflict and that is why we play badly sometimes. In your instance when you stopped thinking about mechanics and judgement of yourself you were able to unleash the second brain and that was to play instinctively and subconsciously.

You did the right thing by just focusing on the target and not mechanics because believe it or not with all the hitting you do and feel you have acquired over the years the muscle memory is all there in the old noggin. The body knows what to do to get that ball to your target, just don't try to manipulate your stroke or think about mechanics of how to get it there...Inner game of tennis, a good read if you haven't read it.

 

[5263]

So I've been playing many years. Went to the MTM Wegnar method around 2012. In practice, I do great. I play 4.0 USTA singles.

I played again tonight in the same way. No more swing mechanics, just forgetting everything and focusing on where I want the ball to go and its trajectory. Tonight was just a pro set to 12. I won and the guy I've played against many times said......I see you have changed your stroke. I know it feels different, he said my wrist isn't as laid back, I don't look stiff, and I am looser.

No more mechanics for me for a while. I'm on a little roll and it is freeing!

This is a freedom you should have been seeking all along. You don't really have developed technique if you are still having to think about it when the ball is coming in a match. On the other hand, if you don't take some practice time to keep your technique sharp every so often, it will likely start to fail you. It's a continual cycle of doing some working strokes, then taking some time to use what you learned, but with your focus on intent for the shot. My son and I just won a club doubles championship tonite and I didn't think once about technique during our matches, but tomorrow when we go to the court to train, we will both spend some time on the mechanics to keep them sharp even though my Fh gave me zero problems and my son's was a monster.

Another thing to note is that I also expressly don't try to reach some "ideal" technique, but instead just try to trend that way when we work mechanics. Last fall some friends pointed out that I didn't lay the wrist back as much as they thought was optimal, which is odd since I teach dragging the racket as an important aspect of the swing. I thought about it some and decided that it is likely more about a lack of flexibility and years of hitting traditional. So maybe I often dont lag the racket as well as some? But my Fh is very versatile, effective and stronger than the other folks pointing it out to me. I'm not going to force any big change on one of my best shots that I win matches with, but I will still tinker at times with using more lag when working mechanics. So the point is you have "Dual Objectives " with your shots. One is to improve the stroke over time with adjustments and the other is what you discovered. The other is to get out and play with your focus on locating and shaping your shot according to your intent....with no thought of how.....just do it with what you gained via your preparations when you train using what you have developed confidence in.

 

[Mr.Lob]

The time to think about mechanics is during practice. Match play put the mechanics on auto-pilot and just play.

 

[Fintft]

But decent or crap, his stroke is evidently good enough for his 4.0 level.

It's clearly nerve that's masking his stroke. The coach's advice was right on. After the OP has overcome nerve and maxed out at 4.0, he'll need to revisit the mechanics if he wants to move up.

The coach's advice comes obviously from the Inner game of tennis.