Diadem - Quality Control Top Notch

[Delouie9154]

Hi all,

New to the forums, but I have express my happiness with Diadem right now. I got my hands on 3 Elevate FS Tours, and I have to say.....it has been a while since 3 of my sticks actually matched in weight.

Elevate FS Tour 1: 315.0g unstrung, 330.0g strung
Elevate FS Tour 2: 315.0g unstrung, 330.0g strung
Elevate FS Tour 3: 314.8g unstrung, 329.9g strung (dont know why its not 329.8g as I am using the same strings maybe I cut off a little less on the tie offs, but it read 329.9g per my scale with strings. I won't feel the difference anyways )

My 2 Wilson N Blades and 2 BLX Blades are +/- 4 grams in difference. The finance guy in me sometimes just could not swallow it.

I have 5 VCORE 95Ds that are +/- 1 gram. When I switched to the 2020 EZONE 98s they were about +/- about 1.5 grams. Very good in terms of QC for a big brand when comparing to other folks like wilson or babolat.

Bravo to the Diadem team on their internal controls. Finally found a 16x20 stick that reminds me of the Orange/black Pure Storm Team from 2005/2006. Love it!

 

[abarth20]

Had a Nova that was way out of spec. Sent it back in they replaced it with in Spec.

 

[snoflewis]

I guess you shouldn't measure swingweight if you dont want to be disappointed. Cant say my batch of 3 elevate tour fs were that close. Ended up sending them all back

 

[zus_greg]

I guess you shouldn't measure swingweight if you dont want to be disappointed. Cant say my batch of 3 elevate tour fs were that close. Ended up sending them all back

so they matched the weight, but could not match the swingweight?

 

[Automatix]

For reference...
Diadem Elevate (1st gen, grip 2) - weight, swingweight, balance.
1. 310.9 284.0 31.6
2. 310.4 287.5 31.7
3. 306.7 279.5 31.7
4. 307.3 278.0 31.6
5. 310.7 290.0 31.9
6. 311.6 285.0 31.8

SD for:
weight ca 2g
sw ca 4.2 kg/cm^2
balance 0.1 cm

 

[Trip]

Not to take the wind out of anyone's sails here, and nothing against Diadem (in fact, the EFS is one of the best frames I've played in recent memory), but there's probably not much unique happening in the way of quality control other than Diadem's higher-than-average willingness to throw away more out-of-spec frames than the next guy, maybe in an accordance with building brand equity and market presence (in exchange for however much short-term loss their stakeholders are willing to tolerate). The perceived "higher quality", then, comes simply from a thinner herd. That's it. Don't get me wrong, it's quite generous of them to do this on our (and their) behalf, but eventually, I see them falling back into line with most others, for the sake of balanced books if nothing else.

On that note, Diadem appears to use the same OEM as Prince (and I'm sure several others), if for no other reason than the proof-of-authenticity stickers are almost identical -- same inner throat location, die-cut, security foil, bar coding and serial stamper. Even the number sequencing and quartets are the same (lol - gotta love it). Here's a comparison photo of a Synergy 98 and an Elevate FS to illustrate:

​

That said, the actual product and the design engineering behind it is pretty darn good -- very solid feel for such a light static weight; definitely some of my favorite sticks, for sure.

 

[Automatix]

Not to take the wind out of anyone's sails here, and nothing against Diadem (in fact, the EFS is one of the best frames I've played in recent memory), but there's really nothing unique happening in the way of quality control other than Diadem's higher-than-average willingness to throw away more out-of-spec frames than the next guy, maybe in an accordance with building brand equity and market presence (in exchange for however much short-term loss their stakeholders are willing to tolerate). The perceived "higher quality", then, comes simply from a thinner herd. That's it. Don't get me wrong, it's quite generous of them to do this on our (and their) behalf, but eventually, I see them falling back into line with most others, for the sake of balanced books if nothing else.

It's all about money. China doesn't equal poor quality. Poor quality is due to cheapness. If you're willing to pay, China will deliver.
On a slightly different but similar note, people love certain strings but have no idea they are often developed and produced by different entities.

 

[Trip]

@Automatix - I wouldn't debate that for a second. Investment in the right places will output a better widget more often, for sure. And I certainly wasn't looking to insinuate that made-in-China equaled poor quality on its own. I've personally got plenty of products that mostly prove that wrong. China is more often the body of the snake than the head, at least in the case of supply chains.

A bit off-topic but still related, is Hambini on YouTube, where an engineer exposes (excessive cussing notwithstanding) certain quality pitfalls in the cycling industry. This is somewhat analogous to tennis frames, albeit bicycles of course add cost and complexity. Obviously, it's easy to take pot shots at these companies somewhat anonymously from a forum, but the point still remains, much improvement could be made.

 

[Delouie9154]

I guess you shouldn't measure swingweight if you dont want to be disappointed. Cant say my batch of 3 elevate tour fs were that close. Ended up sending them all back

Wish I could measure that. I will just let my mind hope since I may have gotten lucky with my batch in which the SW is hopefully on par too.

@Trip @Automatix - I was hopeful that I was not just a lucky fella, but Diadem is actually putting more spent cost into their QC. But based on everyone responses, I should buy a lotto ticket.

 

[Trip]

@Delouie9154 - I hear ya, and let's be fair, too. I would think Diadem has only the best of intent around quality, even if the bulk of what they do about it may only take place after the frames hit the warehouses. That's still better than certain companies...

On a side note, imagine if a brand were to include things like actual measured and calibrated swing weights, even ultrasound scans of the frame (to verify against abnormalities). Obviously, real-world limitations make that a fantasy, at least up until now, but at least we can dream!

 

[Automatix]

@Delouie9154 - I hear ya, and let's be fair, too. I would think Diadem has only the best of intent around quality, even if the bulk of what they do about it may only take place after the frames hit the warehouses. That's still better than certain companies...

On a side note, imagine if a brand were to include things like actual measured and calibrated swing weights, even ultrasound scans of the frame (to verify against abnormalities). Obviously, real-world limitations make that a fantasy, at least up until now, but at least we can dream!

Certain methods used in defectoscopy are so ruthless that manufacturers go with those that give a higher pass rate but still guarantee safety - shipbuilding.

 

[abhi_trip]

@Trip , I can't help but notice that you're holding a Diadem Elevate FS alongside the Synergy 98. I don't want to digress from the topic of Diadem's quality control, but how does the Elevate FS compare to the Synergy 98 ?

 

[Trip]

EDIT: Cleaned up the text blob into a categorized list.

@abhi_trip - Synergy 98 vs Elevate FS vs EFS Tour:

• Overall - Synergy somewhat of a player frame, leaning more towards a control/spin/power tweener; the EFS/Tour more of a control/spin player frame, less so a power tweener.
• Control - Synergy has slightly better control with the 18x18, softest flex and noticeably longer dwell time. EFS/Tour gets its control less so from frame pocketing or pattern, and more from maneuverability.
• Spin - EFS/Tour offers about 20-25% more spin (all other variables held equal), from a more open pattern and also lower torsional inertia (ie. lower twist weight).
• Power - Synergy > EFS Tour > EFS, with the EFS/Tour somewhere between a VC95/Prestige and a Speed Pro/MP, and Synergy in there, too, but closer to the Speed (high) end.
• Launch Angle - Synergy med-low - similar to an open 18x20 or tighter 16x19. EFS/Tour medium to med-high, higher than a VCore 95, a bit lower than a 16x18 TT100 310.
• Plow - In stock form: Synergy >= EFS Tour > EFS. Both Syn and EFS Tour are very playable without hoop lead. The EFS is a toss-up; some w/ better mechanics that rely on faster RHS can get away with it stock, others might want to consider 1-2g of lead at 12, perhaps also at 9 & 3 (or my preferred 4 & 8, to better equalize the weighting around the hoop circumference).
• Stability - EFS Tour > EFS = or slightly > Synergy. All three med to high stability, somewhat dependent on string bed type/weight. EFS/Tour has lower twist weight, but higher lateral stiffness (from internal carbon trusses and foam fill), so it gets it stability more so from that. Synergy's comes mostly from the wider beam; with a more conventional layup, it displaces/flutters more on off-center hits. Not a lot more, but a bit.
• Flex - Synergy > EFS > EFS Tour. Syn has that classic Prince flex from throat to mid-hoop (a progressive, slightly dampened "give-and-return" type of feel), with a somewhat more rigid upper hoop. The EFS/Tour have more of a constantly solid, somewhat rigid, minimal flexing on contact: the EFS leaning more towards airy/pingy Babolat-esque, the EFS Tour more towards thuddy VCP 97D / Pure Strike Tour 3rd Gen territory.
• Feel - Synergy is more lively, more slingshot-y, less dampened. EFS/Tour are moderately muted, similar to a '21 VCP, so its noticeable, but not excessive.
• Strings - Synergy will do well with a wider range of string on the lively-to-muted scale. EFS/Tour usually best off with more lively (S7T, crisp syn gut, etc). For gauge, Synergy will bias lower (perhaps 1.10-1.25), EFS/Tour higher (1.20 - 1.35).

Hope that helps.

 

[zus_greg]

Not to take the wind out of anyone's sails here, and nothing against Diadem (in fact, the EFS is one of the best frames I've played in recent memory), but there's probably not much unique happening in the way of quality control other than Diadem's higher-than-average willingness to throw away more out-of-spec frames than the next guy, maybe in an accordance with building brand equity and market presence (in exchange for however much short-term loss their stakeholders are willing to tolerate). The perceived "higher quality", then, comes simply from a thinner herd. That's it. Don't get me wrong, it's quite generous of them to do this on our (and their) behalf, but eventually, I see them falling back into line with most others, for the sake of balanced books if nothing else.

On that note, Diadem appears to use the same OEM as Prince (and I'm sure several others), if for no other reason than the proof-of-authenticity stickers are almost identical -- same inner throat location, die-cut, security foil, bar coding and serial stamper. Even the number sequencing and quartets are the same (lol - gotta love it). Here's a comparison photo of a Synergy 98 and an Elevate FS to illustrate:

​

That said, the actual product and the design engineering behind it is pretty darn good -- very solid feel for such a light static weight; definitely some of my favorite sticks, for sure.

thanks for the interesting analysis, I've never hit with the sticks, I'm actually curious, but they sure are doing a great job in marketing.

 

[abhi_trip]

@abhi_trip - Comparatively, the Synergy feels softer and flexes more at impact, yet also has a bit more power in its wider beam, so it makes for a bit more of a "slingshot" effect overall -- more give, but also more launch. Plow is a bit lower on the regular EFS played stock, while similar between the Synergy and Elevate FS Tour. Elevates are more crisp (even the regular EFS at ~61/62 RA) -- most likely owed to the internal carbon trusses and foam filling. That also gives them very good lateral stability, despite the somewhat lower twist weights I've measured; several under 13 with strings via Briffidi SW1. So they're very maneuverable and spin-friendly, yet also torsionally stiff for balance that impresses given their weight (especially the regular EFS). In terms of launch angle and spin-friendliness, the Synergy has a launch angle somewhere between a typical 18x20 and most 16x20/16x19 frames, yet is still spin-friendly. The Elevates both have a more open 16x20 pattern, and are a bit better suited for players with a more windshield-wiper-like groundstroke and quick RHS on serve. Both string patterns have very square string intersections with good uniformity across the string bed. In terms of weight customization, both the Synergy and EFS Tour play well stock. The regular Elevate can be played stock just fine, but could also stand to have swing weight brought up a bit. Lastly, strings -- I'd say the Synergy plays well with more varieties than the Elevates, mostly due less dampening in the Synergy. The Elevates are ever so slightly dampened, and seem to prefer a bit more crisp strings (my current favorite right now is 17G Tourns Silver 7 Tour mains crossed with 16G Gosen AK Pro CX).

Sorry for the text blob, but hope that helps.

Thank you for the detailed comparison @Trip .I think it's pure coincidence that my favourite setup in the Synergy is also Silver 7 Tour mains with Gosen OGSM crosses.

 

[beltsman]

EDIT: Cleaned up the text blob into a categorized list.

@abhi_trip - Synergy 98 vs Elevate FS vs EFS Tour:

• Overall - Synergy somewhat of a player frame, leaning more towards a control/spin/power tweener; the EFS/Tour more of a control/spin player frame, less so a power tweener.
• Control - Synergy has slightly better control with the 18x18, softest flex and noticeably longer dwell time. EFS/Tour gets its control less so from frame pocketing or pattern, and more from maneuverability.
• Spin - EFS/Tour offers about 20-25% more spin (all other variables held equal), from a more open pattern and also lower torsional inertia (ie. lower twist weight).
• Power - Synergy > EFS Tour > EFS, with the EFS/Tour somewhere between a VC95/Prestige and a Speed Pro/MP, and Synergy in there, too, but closer to the Speed (high) end.
• Launch Angle - Synergy med-low - similar to an open 18x20 or tighter 16x19. EFS/Tour medium to med-high, higher than a VCore 95, a bit lower than a 16x18 TT100 310.
• Plow - In stock form: Synergy >= EFS Tour > EFS. Both Syn and EFS Tour are very playable without hoop lead. The EFS is a toss-up; some w/ better mechanics that rely on faster RHS can get away with it stock, others might want to consider 1-2g of lead at 12, perhaps also at 9 & 3 (or my preferred 4 & 8, to better equalize the weighting around the hoop circumference).
• Stability - EFS Tour > EFS = or slightly > Synergy. All three med to high stability, somewhat dependent on string bed type/weight. EFS/Tour has lower twist weight, but higher lateral stiffness (from internal carbon trusses and foam fill), so it gets it stability more so from that. Synergy's comes mostly from the wider beam; with a more conventional layup, it displaces/flutters more on off-center hits. Not a lot more, but a bit.
• Flex - Synergy > EFS > EFS Tour. Syn has that classic Prince flex from throat to mid-hoop (a progressive, slightly dampened "give-and-return" type of feel), with a somewhat more rigid upper hoop. The EFS/Tour have more of a constantly solid, somewhat rigid, minimal flexing on contact: the EFS leaning more towards airy/pingy Babolat-esque, the EFS Tour more towards thuddy VCP 97D / Pure Strike Tour 3rd Gen territory.
• Feel - Synergy is more lively, more slingshot-y, less dampened. EFS/Tour are moderately muted, similar to a '21 VCP, so its noticeable, but not excessive.
• Strings - Synergy will do well with a wider range of string on the lively-to-muted scale. EFS/Tour usually best off with more lively (S7T, crisp syn gut, etc). For gauge, Synergy will bias lower (perhaps 1.10-1.25), EFS/Tour higher (1.20 - 1.35).

Hope that helps.

What a fantastic post!

 

[abhi_trip]

EDIT: Cleaned up the text blob into a categorized list.

@abhi_trip - Synergy 98 vs Elevate FS vs EFS Tour:

• Overall - Synergy somewhat of a player frame, leaning more towards a control/spin/power tweener; the EFS/Tour more of a control/spin player frame, less so a power tweener.
• Control - Synergy has slightly better control with the 18x18, softest flex and noticeably longer dwell time. EFS/Tour gets its control less so from frame pocketing or pattern, and more from maneuverability.
• Spin - EFS/Tour offers about 20-25% more spin (all other variables held equal), from a more open pattern and also lower torsional inertia (ie. lower twist weight).
• Power - Synergy > EFS Tour > EFS, with the EFS/Tour somewhere between a VC95/Prestige and a Speed Pro/MP, and Synergy in there, too, but closer to the Speed (high) end.
• Launch Angle - Synergy med-low - similar to an open 18x20 or tighter 16x19. EFS/Tour medium to med-high, higher than a VCore 95, a bit lower than a 16x18 TT100 310.
• Plow - In stock form: Synergy >= EFS Tour > EFS. Both Syn and EFS Tour are very playable without hoop lead. The EFS is a toss-up; some w/ better mechanics that rely on faster RHS can get away with it stock, others might want to consider 1-2g of lead at 12, perhaps also at 9 & 3 (or my preferred 4 & 8, to better equalize the weighting around the hoop circumference).
• Stability - EFS Tour > EFS = or slightly > Synergy. All three med to high stability, somewhat dependent on string bed type/weight. EFS/Tour has lower twist weight, but higher lateral stiffness (from internal carbon trusses and foam fill), so it gets it stability more so from that. Synergy's comes mostly from the wider beam; with a more conventional layup, it displaces/flutters more on off-center hits. Not a lot more, but a bit.
• Flex - Synergy > EFS > EFS Tour. Syn has that classic Prince flex from throat to mid-hoop (a progressive, slightly dampened "give-and-return" type of feel), with a somewhat more rigid upper hoop. The EFS/Tour have more of a constantly solid, somewhat rigid, minimal flexing on contact: the EFS leaning more towards airy/pingy Babolat-esque, the EFS Tour more towards thuddy VCP 97D / Pure Strike Tour 3rd Gen territory.
• Feel - Synergy is more lively, more slingshot-y, less dampened. EFS/Tour are moderately muted, similar to a '21 VCP, so its noticeable, but not excessive.
• Strings - Synergy will do well with a wider range of string on the lively-to-muted scale. EFS/Tour usually best off with more lively (S7T, crisp syn gut, etc). For gauge, Synergy will bias lower (perhaps 1.10-1.25), EFS/Tour higher (1.20 - 1.35).

Hope that helps.

@Trip , I can't thank you enough for this brilliant review

 

[Trip]

@beltsman & @abhi_trip - Very welcome, glad you found it useful. Of the three, the EFS Tour has become my favorite when my fitness is on and I'm facing harder-hitting singles opponents, but in all fairness I haven't quite dialed in the strings on the Synergy, so conclusions are still a bit premature.

Getting back to Diadem quality control, if/when I buy more frames, I'll be sure to test unstrung swing weights on my Briffidi SW1 and post results here.

 

[Delouie9154]

I might have to eat my own words. Recently got a 4th stick from the TW classifieds. Unstrung weight came in at 325grams, +10 grams from their standard specs of 315 grams. I can say then my other 3 sticks are pure luck.

From what I can see, the undergrips look different. My sticks came with the Vintage feel hybrid undergr, while this one looks like it has the Comfort Max Replacement grip on it instead. Seller told me they did not change the undergrip. I would never think under grips would cause a 10 gram difference in weight.

 

[SlowTiger]

I might have to eat my own words. Recently got a 4th stick from the TW classifieds. Unstrung weight came in at 325grams, +10 grams from their standard specs of 315 grams. I can say then my other 3 sticks are pure luck.

From what I can see, the undergrips look different. My sticks came with the Vintage feel hybrid undergr, while this one looks like it has the Comfort Max Replacement grip on it instead. Seller told me they did not change the undergrip. I would never think under grips would cause a 10 gram difference in weight.

Grips can and do cause a difference and I'd think the vintage one weighs more but question, are you measuring it with the overgrips on. I'm just asking since you said undergrip

 

[Delouie9154]

Grips can and do cause a difference and I'd think the vintage one weighs more but question, are you measuring it with the overgrips on. I'm just asking since you said undergrip

No overgrips or strings. Just the base/under grip.

 

[EggSalad]

I might have to eat my own words. Recently got a 4th stick from the TW classifieds. Unstrung weight came in at 325grams, +10 grams from their standard specs of 315 grams. I can say then my other 3 sticks are pure luck.

From what I can see, the undergrips look different. My sticks came with the Vintage feel hybrid undergr, while this one looks like it has the Comfort Max Replacement grip on it instead. Seller told me they did not change the undergrip. I would never think under grips would cause a 10 gram difference in weight.

You should open up the butt cap and see if there is any additional weight that has been added. Also, when you get the racquet restrung, ask your stringer to look for lead under the head cap. You might also look under the grip to see if there is lead tape there as well (when or if you put a new base grip on)

Based on the grip, I’m wondering if you are the third owner, as that hyrbid synthetic/leather is the standard grip that comes on Elevates.

 

[Delouie9154]

You should open up the butt cap and see if there is any additional weight that has been added. Also, when you get the racquet restrung, ask your stringer to look for lead under the head cap. You might also look under the grip to see if there is lead tape there as well (when or if you put a new base grip on)

Based on the grip, I’m wondering if you are the third owner, as that hyrbid synthetic/leather is the standard grip that comes on Elevates.

Before stringing it up, I took a look under the head caps, undergrip, and inside the handle. I see nothing additional in terms of weight.

Did a play test of it last night. The grip does not feel like a L4 (4 1/2) at all to me. It feels slightly larger with a single overgrip on it than my other sticks. Compared it to my Yonex RDS 001 in L5 (4 5/8), this feels almost as large with an overgrip. this is odd to me since its all wood under the under the original grip. Other than the perceived grip size being larger, they play the same as my other 3 sticks (which is relieving). Will just keep it away from the scales for now on ;P.