Did really Connors and Mac hate each other?

G

goldenera

Semi-Pro
Not at all on personal basis..too similarities but yet there isca very neat social status upraising
The tale of the two americas, redcand blue, rural and metropolitan was never ever best exemplified
Please,watch the interview on court after that torrid Wembley final in 81 and their last final in Toulouse 89
Worst foes usually get to be the closest folks
 
J

jrepac

Hall of Fame
"Hate" maybe is a bit too strong. But, they were not 'buddies'. I think they reached an understanding in later years....that, plus neither one of them was overly fond of Lendl, a common 'enemy.'
 
G

goldenera

Semi-Pro
Inner america vs cosmpolitan america
Connors was the archetype of Reps even if he had catholic ties..mac was the perfect Dem..and irish¡
 
W

WCT

Professional
They had periods where they got along alright. Times they practiced together a bit. But there were certainly times where they pretty much couldn't stand each other. Now they are fine, but they are fine with Lendl as well. There is no competition involved now.
 
socallefty

socallefty

G.O.A.T.
jrepac said:
Mac grew up in Forest Hills, his father was a lawyer. They were fairly affluent, by most standards.
That was not the case for Connors. I don't believe they were dirt poor (based on his book), but they were not wealthy.
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I don’t know what your response has to do with my reply stating that there was no rural vs metro difference between their backgrounds. In any case, Jimmy’s grandfather was the mayor of the town he grew up in and he learned tennis on a court in the backyard of his family’s house. It doesn’t sound like he was a poor kid either. There weren’t too many poor kids playing tennis in those days and probably not enough even today.

www.si.com

Raised By Women To Conquer Men: The journey of Jimmy Connors

Frank Deford's penetrating profile of legendary tennis champion Jimmy Connors is the latest submission in the SI 60.
www.si.com www.si.com
 
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G

goldenera

Semi-Pro
socallefty said:
I don’t know what your response has to do with my reply stating that there was no rural vs metro difference between their backgrounds. In any case, Jimmy’s grandfather was the mayor of the town he grew up in and he learned tennis on a court in the backyard of his family’s house. It doesn’t sound like he was a poor kid either. There weren’t too many poor kids playing tennis in those days and probably not enough even today.

www.si.com

Raised By Women To Conquer Men: The journey of Jimmy Connors

Frank Deford's penetrating profile of legendary tennis champion Jimmy Connors is the latest submission in the SI 60.
www.si.com www.si.com
Click to expand...
No..he played in public parks as he usually mentioned
Mac went to that rich academy where Gerulaitis also went
That background still influences..do you imagine Connors an arts merchant like Mac is?
Both also had very complicated relatiobs with women
 
G

goldenera

Semi-Pro
I think they made some approaches to each other
But I imagine that when one tryied to get a bit close,the other authomatically would think ..this guy tries to get into my mind
I also think that Connors was a loner by own decision...while Mac got along really well with Borg,who was a crazy liberal soft mellow guy.
In a way Jimbo rassembled more,muuch more Ivan Lendl..Jimmy was a colorful Lendl .
 
G

goldenera

Semi-Pro
RiverRat said:
But both were a**holes on the court. It's incomprehensible they didn't become better friends. ;)
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Nastase was the guy Connors grew up with professionally..looked like his elder bro
He needed to depend on few people
Mpm
Granmom
Riordan
Segura
Nastase
Mac was possibly the most mature young man EVER in tennis since Open Era..never needed a coach,always traveled by himself
His socializing was through doubles
 
J

jrepac

Hall of Fame
socallefty said:
I don’t know what your response has to do with my reply stating that there was no rural vs metro difference between their backgrounds. In any case, Jimmy’s grandfather was the mayor of the town he grew up in and he learned tennis on a court in the backyard of his family’s house. It doesn’t sound like he was a poor kid either. There weren’t too many poor kids playing tennis in those days and probably not enough even today.

www.si.com

Raised By Women To Conquer Men: The journey of Jimmy Connors

Frank Deford's penetrating profile of legendary tennis champion Jimmy Connors is the latest submission in the SI 60.
www.si.com www.si.com
Click to expand...
Perhaps I misunderstood your post....I don't agree....Mac's family was wealthy. Connors was playing on public courts with his Mother and Grandmother as coaches. I don't believe he was impoverished, mind you, but being a local mayor is not the same as a corporate lawyer.
 
J

jrepac

Hall of Fame
goldenera said:
I think they made some approaches to each other
But I imagine that when one tryied to get a bit close,the other authomatically would think ..this guy tries to get into my mind
I also think that Connors was a loner by own decision...while Mac got along really well with Borg,who was a crazy liberal soft mellow guy.
In a way Jimbo rassembled more,muuch more Ivan Lendl..Jimmy was a colorful Lendl .
Click to expand...

Interesting....never thought of the Lendl analogy. I suspect Connors was very guarded/mistrustful. That's how he comes across in his biography. Yet, you can see he had some close relationships...just not a lot. The part about Vitas, I thought was very insightful. Mac and Jimmy were way too competitive to be pals during their heyday. Kind of like Martina and Chris...Martina had to distance herself from Chrissie to become the on-court killer in their match ups. But, those two wound up being pretty good friends in the end.
 
E

encylopedia

Professional
goldenera said:
Mac went to that rich academy where Gerulaitis also went
That background still influences..do you imagine Connors an arts merchant like Mac is?
Click to expand...

My memory may not be correct, but I believe Mac is only into art because of Vitas. He had zero interest but somebody - I believe Vitas - dragged him to a gallery or art show (no doubt for Vitas to make the scene as they used to say), and it sparked Mac's interest!
 
J

jrepac

Hall of Fame
WCT said:
They had periods where they got along alright. Times they practiced together a bit. But there were certainly times where they pretty much couldn't stand each other. Now they are fine, but they are fine with Lendl as well. There is no competition involved now.
Click to expand...
Funny you mention that. In the mid 80's (?) at the USO, there was a sneaky secret re: the main show court (Armstrong). When all of the matches were over (late day), some of the top guys would come out to play/practice. I always remember getting to see Mac and Connors practicing together...that was pretty wild! Most people would scour the practice courts at the time, but the best view was in Armstrong!
 
Tshooter

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
jrepac said:
Mac grew up in Forest Hills, his father was a lawyer. They were fairly affluent, by most standards.
That was not the case for Connors. I don't believe they were dirt poor (based on his book), but they were not wealthy.
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Mac grew up in Douglaston not Forest Hills. As a kid he played in Glen Cove where he was taught by Tony Palafax and also at the storied Port Washington Tennis Academy where Vitas also played.

His father was a partner at Paul Weiss.
 
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G

goldenera

Semi-Pro
jrepac said:
Interesting....never thought of the Lendl analogy. I suspect Connors was very guarded/mistrustful. That's how he comes across in his biography. Yet, you can see he had some close relationships...just not a lot. The part about Vitas, I thought was very insightful. Mac and Jimmy were way too competitive to be pals during their heyday. Kind of like Martina and Chris...Martina had to distance herself from Chrissie to become the on-court killer in their match ups. But, those two wound up being pretty good friends in the end.
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Good post..nice insights
Connors had that atittude of blue neck
You know ..they are on the sunny side of street
He eanted bucks because he knew how is to live without them..mc never had that problem
 
W

WCT

Professional
jrepac said:
Funny you mention that. In the mid 80's (?) at the USO, there was a sneaky secret re: the main show court (Armstrong). When all of the matches were over (late day), some of the top guys would come out to play/practice. I always remember getting to see Mac and Connors practicing together...that was pretty wild! Most people would scour the practice courts at the time, but the best view was in Armstrong!
Click to expand...


They practiced some in 1982 and Mcenroe thought it helped Connors read his game. Read/heard that a couple times. Then one or the other would do something and they disliked each other again. During the 84 Davis Cup run I've read they were anything but chummy.
 
G

goldenera

Semi-Pro
While Mac,the New Yorker was proud to represent the US in DC play and was very instrumental even for the survival of the competion itself ( in those.big money events years, Davis Cup was close to dissapear as almost no top.player bothered to enter it except Mac,Gerulaitis or Tanner,Vilas and Clerc)..Connors,the Deep America prototype showed how uncomfortable he felt under the US flag.
None of this was more blattantly obvious than in the 1984 Goteborg final
 
J

JW10S

Hall of Fame
I remember one day a long time ago I went to my local tennis center and there was a bit of a buzz. On the 1st court were two women hitting. I finally found out they were Jimmy Connor's mother and grandmother. His mother was a very smooth hitter of the ball, beautiful strokes. Grandma was a bit limited in her movement but what struck me was that even though they were just rallying they were absolutely focused. Every ball was hit with purpose. So I can see where he got his intensity.

I do think there was a time when you could say McEnroe and Connors 'hated' each other. But later that turned to respect as it often does. I think they both now appreciate what they brought out of each other.
 
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galain

galain

Hall of Fame
McEnroe has stated that in his playing days things were considerably better between himself and Lendl than they were between him and Connors. IIRC it was someone asking him about the time his car broke down and Lendl gave him a ride.

In Connor's book he also states that he respected Lendl a lot. I'm not sure if he said he liked him, but it didn't sound like he had any beef with him.
 
Tshooter

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
goldenera said:
...Mac went to that rich academy where Gerulaitis also went...
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B

big ted

Legend
WCT said:
During the 84 Davis Cup run I've read they were anything but chummy.
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in the swedish DC final jimmy arias said they wouldnt practice with each other so he had to practice
with each one separately and it wore him out playing 4-6 hours a day lol..
 
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T

Thetouch

Professional
encylopedia said:
My memory may not be correct, but I believe Mac is only into art because of Vitas. He had zero interest but somebody - I believe Vitas - dragged him to a gallery or art show (no doubt for Vitas to make the scene as they used to say), and it sparked Mac's interest!
Click to expand...

It was actually Mary Carillo who dragged him into a gallery when they played doubles in Paris I believe. That's according to Mac himself.
 
J

jrepac

Hall of Fame
WCT said:
They practiced some in 1982 and Mcenroe thought it helped Connors read his game. Read/heard that a couple times. Then one or the other would do something and they disliked each other again. During the 84 Davis Cup run I've read they were anything but chummy.
Click to expand...
'84 Davis Cup was a hot mess...really, Connors might've been better off skipping the final.....based on what Mac described in his book.
 
J

jrepac

Hall of Fame
WCT said:
I remember the message Connors left in the clay for Ashe. **** you, Artie.
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craziness....I mean seriously...guess Arias got in some good practice that week...that whole final was a nightmare, starting with the court itself.
 
Tshooter

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
ollinger said:
He never lived in Forest Hills. Grew up in Douglaston, Queens, after living very briefly in Flushing, Queens.
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Later the family moved to Cove Neck. Down the block from Teddy Roosevelt’s place. :cool: Jmac used to hit in Cove Neck with Fleming before USO matches. One time they cut the ride from Cove Neck to the NTC too close...
 
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NicoMK

NicoMK

Hall of Fame
WCT said:
They practiced some in 1982 and Mcenroe thought it helped Connors read his game.
Click to expand...

Really? lol that's crazy from Mac, even if I can understand his point of view. They were both already champions in 1982 anyway.

WCT said:
Then one or the other would do something and they disliked each other again. During the 84 Davis Cup run I've read they were anything but chummy.
Click to expand...

Yes, they barely talked to each other, poor Arthur! It is often said that the Mac-Connors discord explains the 1984 Davis Cup final debacle against Sweden (1-4).
 
G

goldenera

Semi-Pro
NicoMK said:
Really? lol that's crazy from Mac, even if I can understand his point of view. They were both already champions in 1982 anyway.



Yes, they barely talked to each other, poor Arthur! It is often said that the Mac-Connors discord explains the 1984 Davis Cup final debacle against Sweden (1-4).
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In 82?? Jjjjjj
 
T

Thetouch

Professional
goldenera said:
In 77??
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I believe so.

I read Mac's book in 2009 maybe but I can't remember what that whole Davis Cup '84 debacle was all about. I know Mac said something that he didn't talk to Arthur at all (maybe for years?) and there was some beef with Connors but I simply can't remember anything about it. I also wonder why Connors didn't like playing the DC, maybe he thought it didn't fit his schedule or wasn't a priority to him
 
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