Rafa and Roger's responses to Agassi meth confession.

[sureshs]

i see.. so you think it's ok to take blows at a person with emotional problems...

nice!

hopefully you are not a teacher...

No, I don't think it is OK. But I think this is really not the case of the mentally ill homeless man hanging near the gas station. That guy will not write a book and time the leaks to maximize the money. Sorry, I am not buying the Agassi as victim line of thought. The same guys would be screaming for "law enforcement" and "zero tolerance" if this was a different guy, of a different demographic, for example.

 

[sureshs]

I havent read anyone saying doing drugs is "cool", an no one has "glorified" Agassi´s crystal meth use. I do think its very brave from him to come out and speak of such things...he might as well keep quiet about it and no one would have ever knew about it.

Problem with Nadal is that he is way to quick on lashing out judgement and asking for punishment. I have no idea what Agassi went through those years, neither does Nadal.

You don't follow - it is not about what Agassi did in those years, it is about what he has done now.

 

[Deleted member 21996]

No, I don't think it is OK. But I think this is really not the case of the mentally ill homeless man hanging near the gas station. That guy will not write a book and time the leaks to maximize the money. Sorry, I am not buying the Agassi as victim line of thought. The same guys would be screaming for "law enforcement" and "zero tolerance" if this was a different guy, of a different demographic, for example.

im not sure but did you just pull the race card?

pathetic to say the least...

 

[edmondsm]

No, Nadal speaks the truth while Fed has calculated he might need Agassi's support for post-retirement activities. You know, share a Netjet, open a tennis resort in Vegas, that sort of thing. Nadal doesn't care about these things - only about whipping Agassi and Fed asses on the court, which he has done very well. He comes from a secure family background (at least till recently) and not a dysfunctional one like the Agassis.

Wow, another Nadal fan that can see into the brains of athletes. I am amazed that you guys have this ability. Is that how you could tell Nadal was going to win the 2009 USO.....:-?

Contrary to what you may think, doing drugs is not cool and is not a "phase" in everyone's life. It is a sign of cowardice and weakness and should not be glorified. It shows mental instability, often arising from poor upbringing.

I don't know how Agassi is glorifying drug use. I do know that ignorant judgmental people are often the product of a poor upbringing.

 

[Cesc Fabregas]

I gurantee if this wasn't Agassi people would be critising him, please people use the same standards for everyone.

 

[edmondsm]

No, I don't think it is OK. But I think this is really not the case of the mentally ill homeless man hanging near the gas station. That guy will not write a book and time the leaks to maximize the money. Sorry, I am not buying the Agassi as victim line of thought. The same guys would be screaming for "law enforcement" and "zero tolerance" if this was a different guy, of a different demographic, for example.

As incoherent as you are, I think I hear you saying that people would want to throw a homeless person into prison for admitting to using drugs 10 years ago. Yeah, good point.:-?

You don't follow - it is not about what Agassi did in those years, it is about what he has done now.

What has he done now? Got something off his chest, pointed out flaws in the ATP, made a little money. These are negatives?

 

[Deleted member 21996]

I gurantee if this wasn't Agassi people would be critising him, please people use the same standards for everyone.

you are the only guy i know that contradicts himself in the same sentence...

 

[edmondsm]

I gurantee if this wasn't Agassi people would be critising him, please people use the same standards for everyone.

People are criticizing him. What are you doing right now?

 

[sureshs]

As incoherent as you are, I think I hear you saying that people would want to throw a homeless person into prison for admitting to using drugs 10 years ago. Yeah, good point.:-?



What has he done now? Got something off his chest, pointed out flaws in the ATP, made a little money. These are negatives?

You sound as if someone wants to arrest him now.

He writes the book, participates in the leaks, points fingers at others thru himself - he is inviting people to read and comment. So what is the harm in commenting (since I will not spend money on the book)?

 

[mandy01]

No, I don't think it is OK. But I think this is really not the case of the mentally ill homeless man hanging near the gas station. That guy will not write a book and time the leaks to maximize the money. Sorry, I am not buying the Agassi as victim line of thought. The same guys would be screaming for "law enforcement" and "zero tolerance" if this was a different guy, of a different demographic, for example.

One simply cannot condone what Agassi did.No ones saying it wasnt wrong.
But really ,he's taken it like once.I hate to think how rampant the use of recreational drugs would've been in the 80s when even today quite a few people are resorting to it.
So compared to that Agassi's was nothing..especially considering he had a rough childhood.He could've gone off way worse and the pressures of such a high level competition can only make matters worse.
Its not so much the fact that he took it but the fact that ATP shamelessly covered up for it.
And really,Andre was a superstar..his book would've gained a huge response anyway.People love him so much that most were going to buy it anyway.

 

[drakulie]

What the hell is Nadal talking about? Man, get that kid some ESL classes or get the microphone out of his face. It would be much better if he just spoke Spanish and then I typed his quote into an online translator. As poor as those online translators are, it would be more coherent then that babble.

I can't believe that Nadal has the nerve to pass judgment like that. People make mistakes, use drugs, this is life. Nadal is obviously very naive. I think in 10 years he will regret making those comments. Is it possible that he felt he had to deride Agassi for using drugs because of the past accusations of Nadal's doping?

It is plain as day who is older and more mature here. Federer shows that he can see the large picture, while Nadal, well, sounds like a clueless little boy who has never seen the world for what it really is.

agreed.

Curiously, he supports Gasquet, and condemns, Agassi, while he continues to lie about his involvment with EPO/The Spanish Doctor/ and the issues surrounding why the "List" has never been revealed to the public.

Why isn't he attacking the Spanish Government for not releasing the list of athletes who were using EPO?? (cyclist/soccer players/TENNIS PLAYERS)

 

[amx13]

Im not sure, but wasnt Nadal the one that reacted against the ATP for wanting to change the drug testing rules a few months ago?

 

[drakulie]

^^He is always complaining about the testing policy, and procedure.

 

[ksbh]

I can't blame Agassi for the ACP's failure to enforce the rules.

However, it's laughable that some are claiming Agassi made the confession to come clean. Funny how he decided to come clean just at the time of releasing his book! He is one smart cookie!

 

[djones]

What exactly has taking meth to do with tennis?

Nothing.
And that's why people should just shut their mouths regarding these issues.

 

[mandy01]

I can't blame Agassi for the ACP's failure to enforce the rules.

However, it's laughable that some are claiming Agassi made the confession to come clean. Funny how he decided to come clean just at the time of releasing his book! He is one smart cookie!

confessing to the media- persons directly would've been harder IMO.Anyway,there's really nothing too surprising about his confession..just that the ATP officials were being asses ,thats it.

 

[ksbh]

Yes, I agree that the ACP officials are being 'asses' and I'm glad Agassi is exposing them for the jokers that they are.

But Andre is no saint either and let's not pretend he is. He found the smartest way to promote his book and I can't fault him for that!

confessing to the media- persons directly would've been harder IMO.Anyway,there's really nothing too surprising about his confession..just that the ATP officials were being asses ,thats it.

 

[kishnabe]

Agassi did the right thing and I believe millions of people will download his eBook just to have a better flaming war on his life. Crystal Meth and Tennis were not related. He didn't use it in his matches and it did not enhance his ablilities.

 

[srinrajesh]

Strange how Federer feels the need to be protective towards Agassi. He didn't feel that way about Canas.

Interview after his loss to Canas Indian Wells 2007

Give me some thoughts when he was suspended for 15 months, whether he'd ever come back again? Are you kind of surprised he's been able to do what he's done?

ROGER FEDERER: Well, you know, I'm really -- I don't know how the whole process of how something like that happens. They always fight for it anyway, everybody that was tested positive, you know. That's, for me, just not understandable, you know. Everybody who gets caught always says, "I didn't do anything," so...
It's just not right, you know.
It depends on how long the suspension is. In the end, they always cut them short, you know. So I'm definitely not surprised to see him back, you know.

only goes to show the double standards Federer has towards "great" players in the past and lesser stars...

 

[Mick]

well, guys, agassi confessed when he knew there's nothing the atp could do to penalize him. it's fine that he confessed but there's nothing heroic about it.

 

[Baikalic]

What the hell is Nadal talking about? Man, get that kid some ESL classes or get the microphone out of his face. It would be much better if he just spoke Spanish and then I typed his quote into an online translator. As poor as those online translators are, it would be more coherent then that babble.

I can't believe that Nadal has the nerve to pass judgment like that. People make mistakes, use drugs, this is life. Nadal is obviously very naive. I think in 10 years he will regret making those comments. Is it possible that he felt he had to deride Agassi for using drugs because of the past accusations of Nadal's doping?

It is plain as day who is older and more mature here. Federer shows that he can see the large picture, while Nadal, well, sounds like a clueless little boy who has never seen the world for what it really is.

Based on what I've read in this thread, it seems that all of the sources to Rafa's comments are translations from Spanish. Not that a translated version doesn't give one a gist of what he is saying, and I agree that his statement comes off as overly judgemental.

 

[srinrajesh]

agreed.

Curiously, he supports Gasquet, and condemns, Agassi, while he continues to lie about his involvment with EPO/The Spanish Doctor/ and the issues surrounding why the "List" has never been revealed to the public.

Why isn't he attacking the Spanish Government for not releasing the list of athletes who were using EPO?? (cyclist/soccer players/TENNIS PLAYERS)

he never supported gasquet as such.. he only said he believed gasquet was telling the truth when he said he didnt take cocaine intentionally...

Also regarding agassi he only said "The cheaters must be punished and if Agassi was a cheater in his day should have been punished".. He didnt call agassi a cheater outright..
However i would say Agassi was definitely a cheater becos he lied about taking the drug to the ATP and avoided a minimum 3 month ban.

We wouldnt know how he could have coped with the ban and its mental factor. Maybe he would never have won so many grand slams or reached no.1ranking again. Its a disgrace to the tour that this high profile offender was let off.. like serena was at the USO

 

[salsainglesa]

selfrightgeous and judgemental to the bone...
just as me writing this!
those basterds!

now with spelling edit!

 

[NamRanger]

Yes, I agree that the ACP officials are being 'asses' and I'm glad Agassi is exposing them for the jokers that they are.

But Andre is no saint either and let's not pretend he is. He found the smartest way to promote his book and I can't fault him for that!

Yes, the intent behind it probably wasn't right, that doesn't mean it wasn't the right thing to do though. Everyonoe knows that Jose Canseco's intent in his book was to sell and make money. However, without that book, who knows how long steroids would have gone on in baseball.

 

[Rataplan]

Gasquet's story is hardly believable and still he was declared innocent.Who is to say the ATP didnt believe as much of Agassi especially considering how important a star he was?
To put it simply-The ATP and ITF dont seem to be having well-defined grounds for banning a player.
And really,Gasquet's story isnt far off from Agassi's.
What the ATP went wrong in was that they covered up the fact that Agassi had failed the tests.This is where the 'reputation' kicked in.

The main issue is not really the recreational drugs but the way it came out.

Gasquet's cocaine use was made public, he was temporarily banned and he had to defend himself.
Hingis's cocaine use was made public as well and she received a 2 year ban.
Agassi's meth use was covered up.

So, in that sense, it's two different ways of dealing with a similar situation.

As far as the rest when talking about Nadal and doping: this forum is so much into a Nadal bashing mode with just a few defenders who get bashed for it as well and a couple of other posters who are reasonable. It's unreal.
However, a lot of posters are selling fiction as fact: he was injured this year and there's medical proof for it, there's no proof that he was told to stop playing tennis for a bit as some sort of secret ban this year and it's just a ludicrous theory from haters, there's no proof that he has been tested positive,... the list goes on and on.
The so-called Fuentes list: this was not only denied by the Spanish authorities but also by international authorities (not linked with tennis). It was clearly stated that Nadal was not on the list. I don't care one bit that it was written about in the media or that some posters here claim to know a person who knows a person who has inside info in an effort to come across as believable. It's fiction.

That's not saying that Nadal is 100% clean but let's wait until we have FACTS before nailing him to the cross...no, wait, that would be spoiling the "let's bash the hell out of Nadal" fest.


Personally, I think that the tennis authorities should only penalize performance improving doping and leave the punishment of recreational drugs over to the usual authorities who deal with that.

 

[NamRanger]

The main issue is not really the recreational drugs but the way it came out.

Gasquet's cocaine use was made public, he was temporarily banned and he had to defend himself.
Hingis's cocaine use was made public as well and she received a 2 year ban.
Agassi's meth use was covered up.

So, in that sense, it's two different ways of dealing with a similar situation.

As far as the rest when talking about Nadal and doping: this forum is so much into a Nadal bashing mode with just a few defenders who get bashed for it as well and a couple of other posters who are reasonable. It's unreal.
However, a lot of posters are selling fiction as fact: he was injured this year and there's medical proof for it, there's no proof that he was told to stop playing tennis for a bit as some sort of secret ban this year and it's just a ludicrous theory from haters, there's no proof that he has been tested positive,... the list goes on and on.
The so-called Fuentes list: this was not only denied by the Spanish authorities but also by international authorities (not linked with tennis). It was clearly stated that Nadal was not on the list. I don't care one bit that it was written about in the media or that some posters here claim to know a person who knows a person who has inside info in an effort to come across as believable. It's fiction.

That's not saying that Nadal is 100% clean but let's wait until we have FACTS before nailing him to the cross...no, wait, that would be spoiling the "let's bash the hell out of Nadal" fest.


Personally, I think that the tennis authorities should only penalize performance improving doping and leave the punishment of recreational drugs over to the usual authorities who deal with that.

How is it fiction when Fuentes himself admits to helping tennis players? How is it fiction when the list is never released? How come only 40-50 names have been released from a list of 200+? Don't be naive, they are not showing anything because Nadal's name is obviously on that list.

 

[ohplease]

The main issue is not really the recreational drugs but the way it came out.

Gasquet's cocaine use was made public, he was temporarily banned and he had to defend himself.
Hingis's cocaine use was made public as well and she received a 2 year ban.
Agassi's meth use was covered up.

The independent body used by the ATP responsible for drug testing didn't do what they were supposed to do. It's not like Andre said "what are you guys going to do? I'm Andre Agassi." It's not like the ATP said "hide the bodies - this is Andre we're talking about." There's no conspiracy, here.

And, in fact, even if there was the worst kind of conspiracy, with both the ATP and Andre cackling diabolically while doing both the drugs and the cover-up, I say who cares. Why? 1) This was recreational drug use and shouldn't be subject to testing in the first place. It's just not our business. 2) On balance, letting Andre slide had real, tangible positive effects on both his philanthropic efforts and the people those efforts have helped.

The world isn't a fair place. Andre wasn't (and isn't) subject to the same treatment as Hingis or Gasquet - but those two haven't had the same positive effect on tennis and the world outside of tennis, either.

 

[NamRanger]

The independent body used by the ATP responsible for drug testing didn't do what they were supposed to do. It's not like Andre said "what are you guys going to do? I'm Andre Agassi." It's not like the ATP said "hide the bodies - this is Andre we're talking about." There's no conspiracy, here.

And, in fact, even if there was the worst kind of conspiracy, with both the ATP and Andre cackling diabolically while doing both the drugs and the cover-up, I say who cares. Why? 1) This was recreational drug use and shouldn't be subject to testing in the first place. It's just not our business. 2) On balance, letting Andre slide had real, tangible positive effects on both his philanthropic efforts and the people those efforts have helped.

The world isn't a fair place. Andre wasn't (and isn't) subject to the same treatment as Hingis or Gasquet - but those two haven't had the same positive effect on tennis and the world outside of tennis, either.

Are you serious? Do you think the world #532 could have pulled what Andre did? You have got to be kidding me.

 

[sureshs]

only goes to show the double standards Federer has towards "great" players in the past and lesser stars...

The reasons are ego, and the desire to hang with the rich and famous.

I see that a whole slew of US names are lining up behind Agassi, including Roddick and Mary Jo Fernandes. You have no post-tennis career in the US if you antagonize Agassi or the McEnroes. Again, the only person with balls is Navratilova.

 

[sureshs]

The independent body used by the ATP responsible for drug testing didn't do what they were supposed to do. It's not like Andre said "what are you guys going to do? I'm Andre Agassi." It's not like the ATP said "hide the bodies - this is Andre we're talking about." There's no conspiracy, here.

And, in fact, even if there was the worst kind of conspiracy, with both the ATP and Andre cackling diabolically while doing both the drugs and the cover-up, I say who cares. Why? 1) This was recreational drug use and shouldn't be subject to testing in the first place. It's just not our business. 2) On balance, letting Andre slide had real, tangible positive effects on both his philanthropic efforts and the people those efforts have helped.

The world isn't a fair place. Andre wasn't (and isn't) subject to the same treatment as Hingis or Gasquet - but those two haven't had the same positive effect on tennis and the world outside of tennis, either.

You nailed it. The conspiracy theorists who are trying to link this with Nadal don't realize that 1997 was eons ago in scientific terms, the suspension was only for 3 months in any case, and the rigid zero-tolerance policies of today were just being crafted. Just like people, societies and associations also grow and learn. The pendulum swings way to one side, and then back to the other.

 

[veroniquem]

I can't blame Agassi for the ACP's failure to enforce the rules.

However, it's laughable that some are claiming Agassi made the confession to come clean. Funny how he decided to come clean just at the time of releasing his book! He is one smart cookie!

He's not coming clean at the time of releasing his book. He's coming clean IN his book. What's so hard to understand about that?

 

[sureshs]

He's not coming clean at the time of releasing his book. He's coming clean IN his book. What's so hard to understand about that?

No, he came clean before the book was released thru leaks.

 

[Bud]

No, he came clean before the book was released thru leaks.

Intentional leaks to generate interest and increased sales

 

[35ft6]

^ Come on, he's obviously coming clean for personal reasons. Agassi needs book sale royalties like Bill Gates needs to return empties.

Placed the book on hold.

 

[Bhagi Katbamna]

No, he came clean before the book was released thru leaks.

Not leaks. Agassi sold rights to excerpts from his books. He's making money off of the "leaks" too.

 

[zagor]

only goes to show the double standards Federer has towards "great" players in the past and lesser stars...

You do realize there's a world of difference between using recreational drug that doesn't enhance your performance on court and doping? Agassi's and Canas's cases aren't comparable at all here.

 

[sureshs]

^ Come on, he's obviously coming clean for personal reasons. Agassi needs book sale royalties like Bill Gates needs to return empties.

Placed the book on hold.

That is not how it works. The publishers need the money. They expect him to help them.

 

[sureshs]

Not leaks. Agassi sold rights to excerpts from his books. He's making money off of the "leaks" too.

And people say he does not care about money.

There is no such thing as enough money. It is only a concept which the middle class use to brighten their pathetic existence.

 

[IvanisevicServe]

Federer just didn't want to offend Agassi. After all, he's the one who presented him with the French Open trophy.

 

[TheTruth]

The reasons are ego, and the desire to hang with the rich and famous.

I see that a whole slew of US names are lining up behind Agassi, including Roddick and Mary Jo Fernandes. You have no post-tennis career in the US if you antagonize Agassi or the McEnroes. Again, the only person with balls is Navratilova.

This statement is as clear as rain.

Also, makes me give props to Martina and Nadal for not colluding. Punish this one, not that one, just ain't right!

 

[TheTruth]

What? Agassi did drugs lied about it, and has admitted over 10 years later to help sell his new book, which has put a black hole over tennis. Nadal has every bloody right to question why Agassi has said this.

Exactly! I guess it falls under the "But I like him" category. To go along with the corrupt officials at the time, and then later on expose those who tried to salvage his legacy is pathetic. There's no honor here, folks.

And him building a school? How about a massive dose of guilt for all he's been able to get away with?

And JMac and crew? Guess they didn't know about any of this while they were constantly putting him up as a hero.

He lied.
The ATP is corrupt.
And those who tell the truth about the situation are the ones who should be crucified?

Not understanding the logic.

 

[drakulie]

he never supported gasquet as such.. he only said he believed gasquet was telling the truth when he said he didnt take cocaine intentionally...

Try again. he supported him and continuously condemns the drug testing policy/procedure, and is extremely outspoken about it.

Also regarding agassi he only said "The cheaters must be punished and if Agassi was a cheater in his day should have been punished".. He didnt call agassi a cheater outright..

Really?? Then I suppose nadal feels he should be punished every time he CHEATS by violating the time rule?? which is like,,, every time he serves?? Right?? :roll:

However i would say Agassi was definitely a cheater becos he lied about taking the drug to the ATP and avoided a minimum 3 month ban.

Get your facts straight. The ATP caught him and decided to sweep it under the rug (same way they did with nadal this year at Wimbledon)

 

[veroniquem]

No, he came clean before the book was released thru leaks.

The leaks are FROM the book. Don't start splitting hairs now. And it's other people who singled out that piece of info from the book, not Agassi himself.

 

[veroniquem]

They caught Nadal at W with what: excruciating knee pain? That's illegal? :shock:

 

[drakulie]

They caught Nadal at W with what: excruciating knee pain? That's illegal? :shock:

Uhmmmm, NO. He had no knee pain. If he did, he wouldn't have played 20+ matches with it, and wouldn't be practicing for DC a few days after withdrawing from Wimbledon.

 

[veroniquem]

Exactly! I guess it falls under the "But I like him" category. To go along with the corrupt officials at the time, and then later on expose those who tried to salvage his legacy is pathetic. There's no honor here, folks.

And him building a school? How about a massive dose of guilt for all he's been able to get away with?

And JMac and crew? Guess they didn't know about any of this while they were constantly putting him up as a hero.

He lied.
The ATP is corrupt.
And those who tell the truth about the situation are the ones who should be crucified?


I'm sorry but the only one telling the truth at the moment is Agassi. And unsurprisingly he's getting crucified for it.

 

[veroniquem]

Uhmmmm, NO. He had no knee pain. If he did, he wouldn't have played 20+ matches with it, and wouldn't be practicing for DC a few days after withdrawing from Wimbledon.

What DC? He didn't play DC... God knows what you're on but it seems a little bit stronger than meth... hallucinogenic mushrooms perhaps?

 

[drakulie]

What DC? He didn't play DC... God knows what you're on but it seems a little bit stronger than meth... hallucinogenic mushrooms perhaps?

Show me where I say he "played DC".

Looks like the one who is on something stronger than Meth is you.

 

[veroniquem]

Show me where I say he "played DC".

Looks like the one who is on something stronger than Meth is you.

Why would you practise for something you're not playing big genius? Rafa didn't play for several weeks after W but yeah at some point he picked up a racket again. There's a huge difference between some gentle practice and competition matches.

 

[drakulie]

Why would you practise for something you're not playing big genius?

Not sure. Why don't you ask Nadal why he played two exos on grass, which he claims he played to practice and "see where he was at" for Wimbledon, yet didn't play Wimbledon and defend his title.

Momo.