How do you control gut???

beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
Okay I'm coming from full poly for years (FireWire Boost the latest) and I string at 48/46 with poly. I tried gut/Cream at 56/51 in my Speed MP and the power is crazy hard to control! So much power!

I am an offensive baseline who uses a SW grip. I rely on topspin to open angles and hit winners. I am not a net player.

How do you control the gut power??? I need a flawless stroke to get it, and then it really ZIPS with spin and pace, but if I'm a little off it sprays long, wide, wherever. And I'm normally very consistent with my poly strings. Am I swinging too fast? Too low to high? Does it require perfect mechanics?
 
E

eah123

Professional
When I got tennis elbow, I switch from poly/syngut hybrid to full-bed multifilament. It was a big adjustment moving from generating power/depth with forward motion, to focusing on using a brushing motion with only very slight forward motion to "allow" the strings to create just the right amount of power.

My advice is to start by focusing on ONLY generating spin. The faster you "spin", the more power the strings will provide on their own.
 
socallefty

socallefty

G.O.A.T.
It is tough to adjust your swing if you developed it to a decent level with full poly. You might need even higher tensions than what you are using for the gut hybrid. Why are you going away from full poly? Better to stick with full poly and restring every 10-15 hours if you want comfort.
 
n8dawg6

n8dawg6

Legend
its a challenge bc if youre used to poly, and you have anything but poly in the mains, youre gonna need to string tighter to control it. thats gonna make it feel like a slick board, whereas you feel like youre getting bite and pocketing with the poly. anyway, i dont have a solution, i just feel your pain
 
fundrazer

fundrazer

G.O.A.T.
What level are you and can give you a bit more detail about your swing style? Are you going for a big loopy swing with lots of arc on the ball?
 
esgee48

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
What were the gauges of the NG and Cream? Aside from that data, to tame the power of NG, use either a 15 Ga NG and 15L/15 Ga poly or Nylon. The mains provide most of the feel so do not worry about poly crosses. Just make sure you use a pre stretched poly otw you will waste the longevity inherent with NG. Thick gauges mitigate the deflection of the stringbed. If you want a more controlled response, use 16 Ga NG and the thick crosses to restrict the movement of the NG even more..
 
beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
socallefty said:
It is tough to adjust your swing if you developed it to a decent level with full poly. You might need even higher tensions than what you are using for the gut hybrid. Why are you going away from full poly? Better to stick with full poly and restring every 10-15 hours if you want comfort.
Click to expand...

I am going away from full poly because:
- Trying something new for the heck of it
- No TE yet, but I want to make sure I protect my body as I get older
- Probably more cost effective in the long run if I don't break it
- I like the increased feel
 
beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
esgee48 said:
What were the gauges of the NG and Cream? Aside from that data, to tame the power of NG, use either a 15 Ga NG and 15L/15 Ga poly or Nylon. The mains provide most of the feel so do not worry about poly crosses. Just make sure you use a pre stretched poly otw you will waste the longevity inherent with NG. Thick gauges mitigate the deflection of the stringbed. If you want a more controlled response, use 16 Ga NG and the thick crosses to restrict the movement of the NG even more..
Click to expand...

16 G Klip Legend, 17 G Cream
 
socallefty

socallefty

G.O.A.T.
beltsman said:
I am going away from full poly because:
- Trying something new for the heck of it
- No TE yet, but I want to make sure I protect my body as I get older
- Probably more cost effective in the long run if I don't break it
- I like the increased feel
Click to expand...
None of your reasons seem related to improving your on-court performance or ability to win matches. So, hard for someone else to help. Just keep experimenting until you reach your goals.
 
beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
socallefty said:
None of your reasons seem related to improving your on-court performance or ability to win matches. So, hard for someone else to help. Just keep experimenting until you reach your goals.
Click to expand...

Well, that's correct. I am doing just fine with full poly. But I was looking to go more arm-friendly with the future in mind.
 
socallefty

socallefty

G.O.A.T.
beltsman said:
Well, that's correct. I am doing just fine with full poly. But I was looking to go more arm-friendly with the future in mind.
Click to expand...
If you become a good player, you can play with full poly your whole life - just restring often. The guy in your avatar is not going to switch from full poly when he turns 50 or 60 years old (and he is a good player irrespective of what Fedfans think).
 
beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
socallefty said:
If you become a good player, you can play with full poly your whole life - just restring often. The guy in your avatar is not going to switch from full poly when he turns 50 or 60 years old (and he is a good player irrespective of what Fedfans think).
Click to expand...

Yeah, but I don't want to restring that often. It's expensive. I don't string myself (anymore).
 
F

FIRETennis

Professional
Are you sure the stringer did a good job on the gut? Ping the string bed with an app like RacquetTune to make sure...
String the gut 57+
Cream might be too soft/elastic for control...
Try Luxilon 4G Soft, Luxilon Element, Max Power, Yonex Poly Tour Fire, Tourna Black Zone... as crosses.
 
beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
Louis33 said:
Kirschbaum Max Power
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'll have to try it. Is it soft enough to avoid any stiffness?

Dartagnan64 said:
Just up the tensions to 58lbs on the gut and 55 lbs on the cream and you’ll have all the control you need.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I'll try it. Next time I string.

gebruikershaes said:
You need a fluid full stroke. If you hold back just a little the ball will go long. Playing with gut makes tennis so much more effortless.
Click to expand...

Yes, this seems to be the case. A full fluid stroke. Makes it difficult! Poly lets met get away with all kinds of strokes to keep the ball in play.

aaron_h27 said:
You strung gut too low and why the 5 pound cross difference? That's why you can't control it.
Click to expand...

Yes, perhaps. I'll try 58/55 as someone said above. Or what do you recommend?

FIRETennis said:
Are you sure the stringer did a good job on the gut? Ping the string bed with an app like RacquetTune to make sure...
String the gut 57+
Cream might be too soft/elastic for control...
Try Luxilon 4G Soft, Luxilon Element, Max Power, Yonex Poly Tour Fire, Tourna Black Zone... as crosses.
Click to expand...

Good point, I will check.

struggle said:
Higher tension.
Click to expand...

What would you recommend?
 
S

struggle

Legend
beltsman said:
What would you recommend?
Click to expand...

I play (mostly) Klip Legend 17g/Pros Pro Red Devil 1.19 (17L/18g) in a 16x20 at 60/56 (10% prestretch/constant pull).

It's plenty powerful. Racket is PK Ki5 320. (more power than your Speed). You need to stay high at first with the NG
then if you can control it ok, maybe drop it some. The NG will hold it's tension unlike what you are used to.

FWIW, i'm a mid-upper 4.0 with moderate topspin, play mostly dubs.

Borg strung his tiny wood Donnay racquets with gut at ~80, yet Mac strung his midsize (Max200g) at ~40, both with NG, so........ it depends.
 
Last edited:
L

Louis33

Semi-Pro
beltsman said:
Thanks, I'll have to try it. Is it soft enough to avoid any stiffness?
Click to expand...
It’s a stiff poly that plays crisp and has great tension maintenance and control. With gut in the mains it will still be plenty comfortable if you normally play full poly.
 
P

paulwal

New User
Simple. Raise the NG tension. Try 60/52. Also pre-stretch the NG so it doesn't lose as much tension in the first 24 hours. If your NG wasn't pre-stretched then your 55 lbs went way down really quickly. It will take some trial and error to find the tension you like. It will play stiffer the first day but should level out after that. I recommend a thicker gauge NG (1.30 or 1.35 mm) so it doesn't notch as quickly and lockup your string bed.
 
S

stapletonj

Hall of Fame
btw...... I am a 64 yr. old and am stringing my gut mains at 64 lbs., feels nice and solid, but with excellent pocketing, etc.
I am a flattish hitting doubles player, not a western grip baseline slinger though....
 
beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
FIRETennis said:
Are you sure the stringer did a good job on the gut? Ping the string bed with an app like RacquetTune to make sure...
String the gut 57+
Cream might be too soft/elastic for control...
Try Luxilon 4G Soft, Luxilon Element, Max Power, Yonex Poly Tour Fire, Tourna Black Zone... as crosses.
Click to expand...

Racquet tune says 45
 
F

FIRETennis

Professional
beltsman said:
Racquet tune says 45
Click to expand...

Few questions to clarify:
How many hours approximately did you hit with this frame after stringing?
In the "String" settings in RacquetTune did you use Hybrid? If so, which is the String Factor number for the strings...
How many "hertz" is the reading on the display when you 'ping' the string bed?
 
beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
FIRETennis said:
Few questions to clarify:
How many hours approximately did you hit with this frame after stringing?
In the "String" settings in RacquetTune did you use Hybrid? If so, which is the String Factor number for the strings...
How many "hertz" is the reading on the display when you 'ping' the string bed?
Click to expand...

Only hit about 3 hours
Yes hybrid - 1.8 string factor
Not sure, difficulty getting a reading again


I just restrung it again myself tonight at 60/52 with Ghostwire 16 instead of cream 17
 
BillKid

BillKid

Hall of Fame
beltsman said:
Well, that's correct. I am doing just fine with full poly. But I was looking to go more arm-friendly with the future in mind.
Click to expand...
I think poly are OK if strung at low tension + « soft » poly + not too stiff racquet.
And most often TE are caused at first by poor technique. That’s why it occurs more frequently in low level / club players than ATP players who play much more often and hit much harder (of course they are also in good shape).
 
beltsman

beltsman

G.O.A.T.
BillKid said:
I think poly are OK if strung at low tension + « soft » poly + not too stiff racquet.
And most often TE are caused at first by poor technique. That’s why it occurs more frequently in low level / club players than ATP players who play much more often and hit much harder (of course they are also in good shape).
Click to expand...

The one piece of technique that is always in my mind is to hit my 1HBH with a straight arm and out in front of me!
 
F

FIRETennis

Professional
beltsman said:
Only hit about 3 hours
Yes hybrid - 1.8 string factor
Not sure, difficulty getting a reading again


I just restrung it again myself tonight at 60/52 with Ghostwire 16 instead of cream 17
Click to expand...

I also use 1.80 as a 'standard' string factor for gut/poly.
16 gauge gut with 1.25 poly (element usually) pings off the stringer around 585Hz for me ~24kg in a 97" 16x19.
After 3h hitting it's about a 8-10% drop to ~555Hz 22kg and stays there until it breaks 15-25h depending on conditions.
So I think 45 is way too low after 3h for gut mains. I tried once the Nishikori setup with ~45lbs and it was just way too powerful.
 
Last edited:
Dartagnan64

Dartagnan64

G.O.A.T.
BillKid said:
I think poly are OK if strung at low tension + « soft » poly + not too stiff racquet.
And most often TE are caused at first by poor technique. That’s why it occurs more frequently in low level / club players than ATP players who play much more often and hit much harder (of course they are also in good shape).
Click to expand...

They are also much younger than the average rec tennis player. Aging tendons is probably the biggest issue in TE, followed by technique (timing and consistency more than anything). But since age and technique are very hard to alter, it behooves the TE sufferer to adjust equipment as needed to reduce harsh impacts.
 
LOBALOT

LOBALOT

Hall of Fame
beltsman said:
Only hit about 3 hours
Yes hybrid - 1.8 string factor
Not sure, difficulty getting a reading again


I just restrung it again myself tonight at 60/52 with Ghostwire 16 instead of cream 17
Click to expand...

What kind of machine, crank, drop weight, eCP?

If you are using a crank/LO I would go up even higher.
 
Purestriker

Purestriker

Legend
beltsman said:
Okay I'm coming from full poly for years (FireWire Boost the latest) and I string at 48/46 with poly. I tried gut/Cream at 56/51 in my Speed MP and the power is crazy hard to control! So much power!

I am an offensive baseline who uses a SW grip. I rely on topspin to open angles and hit winners. I am not a net player.

How do you control the gut power??? I need a flawless stroke to get it, and then it really ZIPS with spin and pace, but if I'm a little off it sprays long, wide, wherever. And I'm normally very consistent with my poly strings. Am I swinging too fast? Too low to high? Does it require perfect mechanics?
Click to expand...
Do you have the gut in the mains or crosses?
 
Purestriker

Purestriker

Legend
beltsman said:
I feel like I may as well put a multi or syn gut in the crosses in that case
Click to expand...
The comfort is great, not as plush as gut in mains but not far off. I use RPM and VS. Have also used "Champions Choice". The spin potential is really good, I think TW has test data on them.
 
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