Are Medvedev Tsitsipas and Zverev the unluckiest generation ever ? First the Big 3 era and now the Alcaraz/Sinner dynasty ? No time to breathe

Unluckier generation in tennis ?


  • Total voters
    77

TsitsiBH

Rookie
People always say that Murray Delpo Tsonga Berdych and players like that peaked in the strongest era ever with Djokovic Federer and Nadal winning everything...

But now imagine for a second being Tsitsipas Medvedev Zverev Ruud Rublev or Fritz ! Just as the Big 3 is finally about to leave the tour you have 2 new freaks who come out of nowhere and start dominating !
 

nolefam_2024

Talk Tennis Guru
Tsitsipas Medvedev Zverev Ruud Rublev Fritz lost zero matches vs Federer in grand slam.

You are giving FEDERER, a retired pro athlete, unnecessary credit.

Tsitsipas beat Nadal in slam once and Nadal beat him in a slam once. Tsitsipas didn't have huge issue because of Nadal.
Ruud Fritz Rublev don't belong in the conversation.

Only Meddy and Zverev left.
 

nolefam_2024

Talk Tennis Guru
When you say big 3, you nowadays have to check if it is really big 3 or just Djokovic.
In nadal's case, he has robbed Medvedev from 2 slam chances. He counts vs Medvedev and Zverev.
 
Hana Mandlikova spent much of the first half of the 1980s as the #3 behind Evert and Navratilova, who are to my mind the two greatest women players of the last 50 years. By the time they started fading, Graf emerged as a new dominant player, and before Mandlikova was 30, Seles was around, too. Mind you, Mandlikova actually started fading much earlier than Navratilova did and around the same time as Evert but much more quickly - it's tough being a perpetual #3.

Mandlikova is almost five and a half years younger than Navratilova and just over seven years younger than Evert.
 

Kralingen

Talk Tennis Guru
The era seems just fine for them until they go 2 sets up in a Slam. Yeah the era was just fine and dandy for Med, Zverev, and Tsitsipas when they went 2 sets up in their Slam Finals. Then it suddenly got hard again and that’s why they became weeping bottlejobs who pissed their pants at winning time?
 

clayqueen

Talk Tennis Guru
No, because Rafa became Roger's only rival before the Big 4 including Djokovic and Murray emerged and stayed as the top 4 best players for a decade when all the people Roger used to beat for fun in his TMF days were still playing.
 

Sputnik Bulgorov

Professional
It's actually been the best era for them so it's their problem that they only managed 1 slam in total.
They are at least 8 years younger than Djokovic and 14 years younger than Federer. In the meantime, they had about 5 to 6 prime years before Alcaraz and Sinner became a consistent threat, but they still couldn’t capitalize. Too busy blowing 2 sets to 0 leads in slam finals. What a sick joke!
 

tennis3

Hall of Fame
People always say that Murray Delpo Tsonga Berdych and players like that peaked in the strongest era ever with Djokovic Federer and Nadal winning everything...

But now imagine for a second being Tsitsipas Medvedev Zverev Ruud Rublev or Fritz ! Just as the Big 3 is finally about to leave the tour you have 2 new freaks who come out of nowhere and start dominating !
Everyone that played in the Big 3 (extended) era was unlucky. Those guys simply won EVERYTHING and beat EVERYONE.

Alcaraz and Sinner are just "normal" top talents for their generation. Every generation has a few.
 

BeatlesFan

Bionic Poster
Since when do Alcaraz and Sinner have a "dynasty?" One of them has one slam, that's not remotely close to "dynasty" level.

Hilarious hyperbole.

Med, Tsitsipas and Zedrot simply aren't that good, especially the Greek and Abuserev. Med might actually win another slam, the other two won't even do that. These guys aren't even close to Roddick level and never were.
 
The true big 3 era was from 2004 to 2016 and between 2008-2012 when all 3 were at their strongest on aggregate.

Since the pandemic Fed has been essentially retired and Nadal was the threat at RG and a had some decent AO runs.

Djoko managed 3 Slams + 1 Final seasons aged 34 and 36, which is still stupid put in retrospect given he only did that in 2015 back in his prime.

If anything, Med gen played in the biggest transitional period in the Open Era except for maybe 1998-2002, that still had much stronger versions of Pete and Andre.
 

Razer

Legend
1990s Gen failed to produce 1 player amongst them who could dominate their own generation.

This is the proof of them being horrible players overall, if you cannot even stand out in your own generation then how will you defeat established players of previous 1980s gen or hold off the next 2000s gen ?
 

Krish872007

Talk Tennis Guru
I don't think it's even close to being a debate. The first group of guys were right there with the Big 3 from 2006/7 all the way through to 2017 - contesting Slams where each member of the Big 3 was in their mid / late 20s up to early / mid 30s. Doesn't get much tougher than that considering the calibre of players around them for the last 25 years.

As for Medvedev, Zverev, Tsitsipas, Ruud, Rublev, Fritz group - they haven't been good enough to fully capitalise on older, more depleted versions of those greats. Fed played these guys a combined 3 times in Slams (all of those meetings in 2019, winning 2 of them, when he was 37+). Didn't play much in the last 5 years and has been formally retired for 1.5 years. Nadal - stopped Medvedev & Zverev enough times - even he has barely played in 1.5-2 years. So it's pretty much come down to just Djokovic who dealt with them as he saw fit - and even he wasn't able to play everything in that 2020-22 period.

Let's see what Alcaraz / Sinner go on to achieve - they haven't reached that absurd level of dominance and consistency yet.
 

Jonas78

Legend
They are at least 8 years younger than Djokovic and 14 years younger than Federer. In the meantime, they had about 5 to 6 prime years before Alcaraz and Sinner became a consistent threat, but they still couldn’t capitalize. Too busy blowing 2 sets to 0 leads in slam finals. What a sick joke!
This! If anything, Big3 was lucky, with no ATGs chasing them post Djokodal...
 

socallefty

G.O.A.T.
Funny how unlucky you become when you have big holes in your game that you don’t improve over a 5-7 year stretch - while older and younger guys winning Slams clearly improved many aspects of their game.

Luck is when preparation meets opportunity” - Roman philosopher Seneca
 
Last edited:

The Guru

Legend
The true big 3 era was from 2004 to 2016 and between 2008-2012 when all 3 were at their strongest on aggregate.

Since the pandemic Fed has been essentially retired and Nadal was the threat at RG and a had some decent AO runs.

Djoko managed 3 Slams + 1 Final seasons aged 34 and 36, which is still stupid put in retrospect given he only did that in 2015 back in his prime.

If anything, Med gen played in the biggest transitional period in the Open Era except for maybe 1998-2002, that still had much stronger versions of Pete and Andre.
I'd say it went through 2019 at least since they won every slam in 2017-2019 and were top 3 in the world at the end of 2019. If 2004 is Big 3 era then I'd say it went through 2022.
 

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
Funny how unlucky you become when you have big holes in your game that you don’t improve over a 5-7 year stretch - while older and younger guys winning Slams clearly improved many aspects of their game.

Luck is when preparation meets opportunity” - Roman Tennis philosopher Seneca Tsitsicrates

I think this quote is actually from Tsitsicrates. Specifically his influential treatise “On Pro Tennis With No Backhand.” (Forward by Ivo Karlovic). Though he may have lifted it. :sneaky:

giphy.gif
 
Last edited:

dking68

Legend
Since when do Alcaraz and Sinner have a "dynasty?" One of them has one slam, that's not remotely close to "dynasty" level.

Hilarious hyperbole.

Med, Tsitsipas and Zedrot simply aren't that good, especially the Greek and Abuserev. Med might actually win another slam, the other two won't even do that. These guys aren't even close to Roddick level and never were.
You actually need to keep quiet. Your favorite player is nautical miles away from a slam and is highly overrated and doesn’t have the talent level or desire to become a number one player
 

Poisoned Slice

Bionic Poster
The era seems just fine for them until they go 2 sets up in a Slam. Yeah the era was just fine and dandy for Med, Zverev, and Tsitsipas when they went 2 sets up in their Slam Finals. Then it suddenly got hard again and that’s why they became weeping bottlejobs who pissed their pants at winning time?
''Results have conspired to make them barely functional at times.''

Plot twist. I'm not talking about Med, Zverev and Tsitsipas. I'm talking about the Brazilian football team.
 
A

ALCARAZWON

Guest
Sinner isn't part of a dynasty, considering he needed a 6hr advantage just to overcome a 2-sets-to-love deficit vs. Medvedev in the AO Final.
There's a good chance Sinner won't be winning anymore slams this year, based on that.
 

Razer

Legend
Sinner isn't part of a dynasty, considering he needed a 6hr advantage just to overcome a 2-sets-to-love deficit vs. Medvedev in the AO Final.
There's a good chance Sinner won't be winning anymore slams this year, based on that.

Sinner defeated Djokovic at the Aus Open while Medvedev has always surrendered to Djokovic at the AO, Med even surrendered to some bad version of Nadal from 2 sets up, the ultimate BETA this Medvedev is.
 

fedfan24

Hall of Fame
I'd say it went through 2019 at least since they won every slam in 2017-2019 and were top 3 in the world at the end of 2019. If 2004 is Big 3 era then I'd say it went through 2022.
2005-2019 seems appropriate. Mid 2007-2012 the peak of big 3.
 

RF-18

Talk Tennis Guru
Yes Medvedev at least, he wins 4-5 HC slams in normal circumstances. He still managed to grab a slam however. Would have won AO this year if he hadn't spent most time on court out of any player in the history of a GS tournament. I don't think he stops at one slam though, he will give himself chances to grab a couple in the next few years.

Zverev on the other hand doubtful cause he can't handle his nerves in big moments. Tsitsipas doubtful as well, but at his best he is GS calibre.
 
They just aren’t very good. (Med, tstsi, Zverev) At thejr age they should be dominating now as sinner and alcaraz aren’t peak form yet. . Mid-late 20s is peak tennis. The fact they have one slam between them is pathetic

Roddick was unlucky. Agassi was unlucky. Hewitt was unlucky. Not those three schlubs



Del Potro, Murray were unlucky. Tsonga wasn’t all that great
 

fedfan24

Hall of Fame
Yes Medvedev at least, he wins 4-5 HC slams in normal circumstances. He still managed to grab a slam however. Would have won AO this year if he hadn't spent most time on court out of any player in the history of a GS tournament. I don't think he stops at one slam though, he will give himself chances to grab a couple in the next few years.

Zverev on the other hand doubtful cause he can't handle his nerves in big moments. Tsitsipas doubtful as well, but at his best he is GS calibre.
Which years do you reckon he would be a 4-5 HC slam winner? 2004-2019, can’t see any openings. Perhaps an outside chance of 2014 USO.

2001-2003, maybe he could grab one.
 

fedfan24

Hall of Fame
They just aren’t very good. (Med, tstsi, Zverev) At thejr age they should be dominating now as sinner and alcaraz aren’t peak form yet. . Mid-late 20s is peak tennis. The fact they have one slam between them is pathetic

Roddick was unlucky. Agassi was unlucky. Hewitt was unlucky. Not those three schlubs



Del Potro, Murray were unlucky. Tsonga wasn’t all that great
03-05 Agassi would be licking his lips at some of the recent HC slams.
 

Razer

Legend
Yes Medvedev at least, he wins 4-5 HC slams in normal circumstances. He still managed to grab a slam however. Would have won AO this year if he hadn't spent most time on court out of any player in the history of a GS tournament.

The fact that he has to spend so much time on court suggests that his game is dull and inefficient.

Medvedev doesn't win 4-5 HC Slams in any era, there are only 6 ATGs in the history of Tennis who have scored 5 or more HC Slams, even the likes of Mcenroe don't have 5 HC Slams

This Medvedev is a better version of Davydenko, thats it, he is very lucky to even win 1 slam.... damn loser at his absolute peak surrendered 2 sets to 0 lead against a 10 years older geratric Nadal... yuck... really average player this Med is, just because your Nole sh1t in his pants due to CYGS Pressure and Olympics baggage this Med even has 1 slam......
 

fedfan24

Hall of Fame
The fact that he has to spend so much time on court suggests that his game is dull and inefficient.

Medvedev doesn't win 4-5 HC Slams in any era, there are only 6 ATGs in the history of Tennis who have scored 5 or more HC Slams, even the likes of Mcenroe don't have 5 HC Slams

This Medvedev is a better version of Davydenko, thats it, he is very lucky to even win 1 slam.... damn loser at his absolute peak surrendered 2 sets to 0 lead against a 10 years older geratric Nadal... yuck... really average player this Med is, just because your Nole sh1t in his pants due to CYGS Pressure and Olympics baggage this Med even has 1 slam......
Struggling to think of an era where Medvedev wins 4-5 HC slams. Certainly not 2000-2003, Agassi, Pete, Hewitt, Roddick, Nalbandian, Safin knocking around? Not sure he even wins 1. Maybe 2002 AO.
 
Nothing was stopping the med/tstsipas/zverev from winning the last 16 slams at least. Djokers been past his best level quite a few years now. Rafa has been past it for even longer (2013 or so). Nothing is stopping them now. Alcaraz and Sinner 2-3 years from peak level. That’s 8-11 slams. The fact they aren’t capitalizing is their own fault
 

Jonas78

Legend
The fact that he has to spend so much time on court suggests that his game is dull and inefficient.

Medvedev doesn't win 4-5 HC Slams in any era, there are only 6 ATGs in the history of Tennis who have scored 5 or more HC Slams, even the likes of Mcenroe don't have 5 HC Slams

This Medvedev is a better version of Davydenko, thats it, he is very lucky to even win 1 slam.... damn loser at his absolute peak surrendered 2 sets to 0 lead against a 10 years older geratric Nadal... yuck... really average player this Med is, just because your Nole sh1t in his pants due to CYGS Pressure and Olympics baggage this Med even has 1 slam......
Meddy is probably done winning slams, he had his chances in the years when Big3 had declined but before the rise of Sinner & Alcaraz, but still only managed to win one.
 

NatF

Bionic Poster
Yes Medvedev at least, he wins 4-5 HC slams in normal circumstances. He still managed to grab a slam however. Would have won AO this year if he hadn't spent most time on court out of any player in the history of a GS tournament. I don't think he stops at one slam though, he will give himself chances to grab a couple in the next few years.

Zverev on the other hand doubtful cause he can't handle his nerves in big moments. Tsitsipas doubtful as well, but at his best he is GS calibre.
Lol
 

RaulRamirez

Legend
My immediate reaction is "no", and let's see what Alcaraz and Sinner go on to achieve.
One unlucky player is Thiem who was becoming a tertfic HC plaryer before his injury.
...
Let's leave Murray and Stan aside.
How would you (anyone) compare Tsonga, Berdych and Ferrer with Med, Tsit and Z?

I'd say (in the aggregate) the first three were steadier, more consistent competitors but not sure if much better all-around players.
 
Last edited:

Razer

Legend
Struggling to think of an era where Medvedev wins 4-5 HC slams. Certainly not 2000-2003, Agassi, Pete, Hewitt, Roddick, Nalbandian, Safin knocking around? Not sure he even wins 1. Maybe 2002 AO.

Yeah, Medvedev doesn't win 4-5 HC in any era, you need the entire top 5-6 ranked players removed to maybe Med to win like that, the guy is highly overrated by Djokovic fans.

Meddy is probably done winning slams, he had his chances in the years when Big3 had declined but before the rise of Sinner & Alcaraz, but still only managed to win one.

Yes, he is done winning slams. He is a 1 trick pony, a hard courter who is bad on other 2 surfaces. Sinner and Alcaraz will not allow him to win, and for whats its worth Djokovic himself won't let this fellow win if its is upto him.
 

TsitsiBH

Rookie
My immediate reaction is "no", and let's see what Alcaraz and Sinner go on to achieve.
One unlucky player is Thiem who was becoming a tertific HC player before his injury.
...
Let's leave Murray and Stan aside.
How would you (anyone) compare Tsonga, Berdych and Ferrer with Med, Tsit and Z?

I'd say (in the aggregate) the first three were steadier, more consistent competitors but not sure if much better all-around players.
Tsonga Berdych Ferrer > Tsitsipas Zverev Medvedev I think sadly (I'm a Stef fan)

Better on all surfaces and better in best of 5
 

Razer

Legend
Yeah I guess if 2004 should count so should 2023

Big 3 era is only 2017-2022
2008-2016 was Big 4 era
2003-2007 was Federer's era

This is how it was, we are now retconning the past by revising eras of Big 3 from mid 2000s till now but it wasn't the case.
 

Sputnik Bulgorov

Professional
Damn you owned me and the whole point of my thread
I mean it’s not about “owning” you or your thread, just about telling the truth. Still a good thread to open up discussions. I do think the 8 year gap should have been enough to bypass most of Djokovic and Nadal’s prime, definitely Federer’s prime, that they could capitalize on. We’ve seen Hewitt and Safin do fine against Sampras and Agassi with a similar youth advantage.
 

Musterrific

Hall of Fame
It does seem that this cohort of players is destined to be eclipsed by the generations that came both before and after them. How frustrating that must be.
 
Top