ATP players who are 0-2 in slam finales. Rank them.

[UnderratedSlam]

Cedric Pioline lost Wimby and USO, both to Sampras, both in straight sets.

Philly Poussies lost Wimby and USO, in 3 and 4 sets, to Federer and Rafter.

Miloslav Mecir lost AO and USO to Lendl, both in very easy straight sets, got crushed basically both times, winning just 6 games per match.

Alex Corretja lost two FOs, to Kuerten and Moya, in 4 and 3 sets.

Kevin Anderson lost Wimby and USO, to Djokovic and Nadal, both in 3 sets.

Kevin Curren lost AO and Wimby, to Wilander and Becker, both in tough 4 sets.

Todd Martin lost AO and USO, to Sampras and Agassi, in 3 and 5 sets.

Robin Soderling lost two FOs, to Federer and Nadal, both in easy straight sets.

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Rank them in terms of ability/skill, or how much they deserved to win a slam given their entire careers. But state your criteria.

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And please, show some respect to Anderson...

Zoomers and millennials, try to curb your recency bias...

 

[BeatlesFan]

1. Mecir (far and away the best player on the list)
2. Soderling
3. Nobody... all the rest are about the same as choking bore fests.

 

[TheNachoMan]

Soderling is the best on that list imo. He retired early and has more match wins than Mecir, and only one less title. He was robbed.

 

[aldeayeah]

Fedal should give Todd Martin a couple of their slams for f**king up Djoker's serve for a couple years.

 

[junior74]

Tennis is constantly evolving. So this is merely a question of chronology.

Anderson would have won 10+ slams in any other era. I feel truly blessed having watch both of his slam finals.

 

[UnderratedSlam]

Soderling is the best on that list imo. He retired early and has more match wins than Mecir, and only one less title. He was robbed.

No. He was Robin.

Still is.

 

[Kralingen]

3. Nobody... all the rest are about the same as choking bore fests.

Curren beating Edberg, '85 McEnroe, and '85 Connors consecutively to reach a Wimbledon final is definitely what I think of, when I think 'choking borefest'

 

[Visionary]

Well, I guess Daniil Medvedev in Australian Closed to unvaccinated as he lost the final twice now; also, he lost a USO final ones (to Nadal). That, really makes Daniil overall effort not 0:3 but 1:3 now.

 

[Kralingen]

All much of a muchness really. The theme here is tall, powerful players who were able to get hot and upset top players to reach the final, but eventually were outclassed by ATGs.

Corretja would be the outlier, as he was mainly a clay specialist only and had poor Slam results everywhere else. I don't have a ton of view of his game, but he at least was world #2 and won the YEC so has more credentials than most career-wise.

 

[Third Serve]

Regardless of what criteria we're using (EDIT: that is listed in the OP), Mecir has to be the best by a significant margin.

He's got an Olympic Gold Medal in which he beat Edberg along the way and a WCT Finals win over McEnroe and Wilander.

In addition, he has the Miami 1987 win which was basically a Slam as far as the draw structure, the five-set rules, and the entry list go. He beat Curren, Edberg, Noah, and Lendl on the way to that win. One of the best players to have never won a Slam.

Not sure how to rate the others but I think Soderling and Corretja would probably rank highly while Anderson and Pioline would go lower. Just looking at careers, Anderson might be the weakest player on that list.

 

[TheNachoMan]

Regardless of what criteria we're using, Mecir has to be the best by a significant margin.

He's got an Olympic Gold Medal in which he beat Edberg along the way and a WCT Finals win over McEnroe and Wilander.

In addition, he has the Miami 1987 win which was basically a Slam as far as the draw structure, the five-set rules, and the entry list go. He beat Curren, Edberg, Noah, and Lendl on the way to that win. One of the best players to have never won a Slam.

Not sure how to rate the others but I think Soderling and Corretja would probably rank highly while Anderson and Pioline would go lower. Just looking at careers, Anderson might be the weakest player on that list.

I am not well versed on 80s tennis. I didn’t know most of this.

i offer the zoomer perspective

 

[Kralingen]

Regardless of what criteria we're using, Mecir has to be the best by a significant margin.

Except that if we used the criterion of how each player performed in their Slam finals, he would be the worst (creamed in straight sets in brutal beatdowns by Lendl). Well, maybe he wasn't as bad as Anderson.

 

[UnderratedSlam]

Except that if we used the criterion of how each player performed in their Slam finals, he would be the worst (creamed in straight sets in brutal beatdowns by Lendl). Well, maybe he wasn't as bad as Anderson.

Especially when we consider that Lendl has a negative slam tally, 8-11.

Most slam finales lost, tied with RF and Novak.

 

[ibbi]

1. Mecir (far and away the best player on the list)
2. Soderling
3. Nobody... all the rest are about the same as choking bore fests.

APOLOGIZE TO ALEX CORRETJA!

 

[Kralingen]

Especially when we consider that Lendl has a negative slam tally, 8-11.

Most slam finales lost, tied with RF and Novak.

Well, that was peak Lendl on hard courts both times, who in the late 80s was easily the best HC player in the world. Go look up his record from '85-87, dude was over 90% winning each season and won basically every big HC title from '85-87 as well (3 straight USOs AND Tour finals).

I think his level was comparable to the Sampras level Pioline faced, and likely even a little better than Nadal '17 or Djokovic '18.

 

[UnderratedSlam]

Well, that was peak Lendl on hard courts both times, who in the late 80s was easily the best HC player in the world. Go look up his record from '85-87, dude was over 90% winning each season and won basically every big HC title from '85-87 as well (3 straight USOs AND Tour finals).

I think his level was comparable to the Sampras level Pioline faced, and likely even a little better than Nadal '17 or Djokovic '18.

Mecir was peak too...

Yet he got clobbered the way a R1 opponent might.

 

[Third Serve]

Except that if we used the criterion of how each player performed in their Slam finals, he would be the worst (creamed in straight sets in brutal beatdowns by Lendl). Well, maybe he wasn't as bad as Anderson.

That's true. I was referring to the criteria directly listed in the OP.

Still, I'm not sure he'd be the absolute worst considering he has tough competition in Anderson, Soderling, and Pioline. Definitely not the best though.

It's worth noting that his performances before the finals were generally good, though: one included a five-set win over Becker and a four-set win over Wilander.

 

[FrontHeadlock]

Mecir was peak too...

Yet he got clobbered the way a R1 opponent might.

As to the '86 Open recall that the SF and F used to be on back to back days. Lendl had an easy win over Edberg while Mecir toughed out a 5-setter against Becker. Aside from Lendl being by far the best HC player at the time, he also played 2 fewer sets the day before.

 

[FrontHeadlock]

I will take a crack at this

1. Miloslav Mecir
2. Alex Corretja
3. Robin Soderling
4. Philly Poussies
5. Cedric Pioline
6. Todd Martin
7. Kevin Curren
8. Kevin Anderson.
   

 

[onefineday]

Too lazy to state criteria but:

Alex Corretja
Robin Soderling
Miloslav Mecir
Cedric Pioline
Todd Martin
Philly Poussies
Kevin Anderson
Kevin Curren

 

[jondice]

Whoever somehow makes me favorite Big 3er look the best.

 

[skaj]

Dementieva for the WTA.

 

[UnderratedSlam]

As to the '86 Open recall that the SF and F used to be on back to back days. Lendl had an easy win over Edberg while Mecir toughed out a 5-setter against Becker. Aside from Lendl being by far the best HC player at the time, he also played 2 fewer sets the day before.

Yes, but whose fault is that?

Edberg and Becker are roughly on par at USO. Hence both Czechs had very tough opponents.

One Czech defeated his 3-0, the other one barely.

Mecir could have saved energy by winning quickly. He couldn't do it. That's part of winning slams, part of being or not being a champ.

This argument could only work if Lendl had some lucky qualifier or journeyman in the semis. He had Edberg.

 

[FrontHeadlock]

Yes, but whose fault is that?

Edberg and Becker are roughly on par at USO. Hence both Czechs had very tough opponents.

One Czech defeated his 3-0, the other one barely.

Mecir could have saved energy by winning quickly. He couldn't do it. That's part of winning slams, part of being or not being a champ.

This argument could only work if Lendl had some lucky qualifier or journeyman in the semis. He had Edberg.

it’s also a function of having them on back to back days, which no other Major did (and for good reason imo — the USO did this purely for ratings and $$ purposes which is a terrible reason to make those types of decisions).

also let’s not forget sometimes guys have off days. If Edberg had an off day, the lack of a rest day creates an arbitrary advantage for Lendl regardless of his play vs Mecir’s play.

 

[UnderratedSlam]

1. it’s also a function of having them on back to back days, which no other Major did (and for good reason imo — the USO did this purely for ratings and $$ purposes which is a terrible reason to make those types of decisions).

2. also let’s not forget sometimes guys have off days. If Edberg had an off day, the lack of a rest day creates an arbitrary advantage for Lendl regardless of his play vs Mecir’s play.

1. USO having semis and finales in a row is a separate issue, one of THE dumbest things in tennis, until finally someone with a gram of sense changed this. It however applied to both players.

2. Now we're getting into conjecture, guess-work, what-ifs... Rafa AO 09... anyone?

3. Mecir had another chance to redeem himself: same surface, same opponent. What happened? He won only 6 games again... We gonna blame the schedule and other things again, or do we simply admit that Mecir was a mental midget in those two finales?

I mean the guy is infamous for SERVING UNDERHAND during the World Team Cup when he got so tense he could barely function.

 

[FrontHeadlock]

1. USO having semis and finales in a row is a separate issue, one of THE dumbest things in tennis, until finally someone with a gram of sense changed this. It however applied to both players.

2. Now we're getting into conjecture, guess-work, what-ifs... Rafa AO 09... anyone?

3. Mecir had another chance to redeem himself: same surface, same opponent. What happened? He won only 6 games again... We gonna blame the schedule and other things again, or do we simply admit that Mecir was a mental midget in those two finales?

I mean the guy is infamous for SERVING UNDERHAND during the World Team Cup when he got so tense he could barely function.

All fair points. Let’s just say the back-to-back SF/F didn’t help and could create arbitrary advantages, even if it wasn’t necessarily the only reason for his poor performance.

 

[mattennis]

Mecir was the most talented of that group. I remember Connors (or Lendl, or both) saying that Mecir hit angles that didn't exist.

It was such a pity that his bad back finished his career so young.

According to some stringers of that time, he played all his career with a very heavy all wood (just painted green to resemble the wood-graphite composite racquet he was endorsing at the end of the 80s).

If true, his US Open 86 and Australian Open 89 finals, were the last two occasions in which a player using an all-wood racquet reached the final of a Grand Slam tournament ( the previous one being Kevin Curren in the Australian Open 84 final, against graphite Wilander).

 

[UnderratedSlam]

All fair points. Let’s just say the back-to-back SF/F didn’t help and could create arbitrary advantages, even if it wasn’t necessarily the only reason for his poor performance.

Every single tennis tournament ever played created arbitrary advantages. Perfectly equal conditions for all players only exist perhaps in computer games.

It is the mark of a champion to overcome adversity and odds against him to win the big ones.

Besides, as I stated, both had the same tiny amount of time to prepare...

Edberg won USO 92 despite playing 3 5setters in a row (R4/QF/SF) - then beat Sampras in 4. With no day rest. A champ, unlike Mecir.

 

[Daniel Andrade]

Tennis is constantly evolving. So this is merely a question of chronology.

Anderson would have won 10+ slams in any other era. I feel truly blessed having watch both of his slam finals.

Are the Baghdatis ones a little less blessed?

 

[Mustard]

Miloslav Mecir at the top. In some ways, the greatest talent in tennis, like he already knew it all.

Kevin Curren was unbelievably good at 1985 Wimbledon, the way he defeated McEnroe and Connors, and a great final with Becker

Soderling, Corretja and Martin would probably be next on my list.

 

[UnderratedSlam]

I am not well versed on 80s tennis. I didn’t know most of this.

i offer the zoomer perspective

All perspectives are welcome - even zoomerian ones!

You need to study tennis history more!!!

Otherwise you'll get obliterated on TTW.