Guess What Guys? 6-0, 6-0 Counts towards your Rating

[Kostas]

Just had a player DQ'd at 3.5.

First time playing spring. Matches as follows:

Singles Loss: 6-4, 7-6
Doubles Win: 6-3, 6-4
Doubles Win: 6-0, 6-1 (vs. two computer rate 3.0s)
Singles Win: 6-0, 6-0
Singles Win: 6-0, 6-0

I got the letter this morning. The ONLY way he could have generated a DQ with that record is if the 0 & 0 matches counted. Oh and for what it's worth, the double bagels were both against weak 3.5s who usually play doubles. My guy is probably the 3rd or 4th best singles player in the league, however, he's the strongest self-rated 3.5. It's all about the rating type.

Just an FYI.

 

[NoSkillzAndy]

I don't think those results prove your theory, sorry. Your close singles loss could have very likely been the first strike.

 

[Kostas]

I don't think those results prove your theory, sorry. Your close singles loss could have very likely been the first strike.

Really? So you think a 6-4, 7-6 Singles Loss and a 6-3, 6-4 doubles win would generate strikes? No way.

 

[Kostas]

By the way...the first doubles win was against a 3.0 and a newly minted 3.5 (3.0 last spring)

 

[Cindysphinx]

Really? So you think a 6-4, 7-6 Singles Loss and a 6-3, 6-4 doubles win would generate strikes? No way.

The computer doesn't care about Ws and Ls. It cares about games. Those scores are competitive, so if the opponents were solid and/or the player's partner was weak, you can get a strike.

 

[Cindysphinx]

BTW, the idea that double-bagels don't count could apply only to calculating the rating of computer-rated players for purposes of moving folks up or down in November. Perhaps double bagels do count for three strikes. I've never thought about it, but they should. Otherwise Nadal could self-rate at 2.5 and never get a strike!

 

[Kostas]

BTW, the idea that double-bagels don't count could apply only to calculating the rating of computer-rated players for purposes of moving folks up or down in November. Perhaps double bagels do count for three strikes. I've never thought about it, but they should. Otherwise Nadal could self-rate at 2.5 and never get a strike!

I just confirmed exactly this with our state level coordinator. The 0 & 0's don't count for year end calculations but do generate strikes. As such he received a strike for both double bagels and one for the last doubles match 0 & 1. She said that it may not have mattered that the last match was against two 3.0s. His dynamic rating could have been so far over the threshold it was going to strike no matter who he played.

It's good information to know.

Live and learn.

 

[gameboy]

That makes a lot of sense...

 

[kylebarendrick]

It is worth noting that when a player is DQ'd, they are informed which matches produced the strikes. I've seen the letters received by teamates that had been DQ'd. Kostas' story is therefore credible to me.

 

[jonnyjack]

When your DQ'ed player receives the letter stating which matches generated strikes, please report back. Thanks!

 

[NLBwell]

I'm not qute understanding this. If you beat someone 0 and 0, it doesn't count toward bumping you up, but if you beat someone 0 and 1 it does?
So if I want to get bumped up (which really should be everyone's goal) I have to remember to give the opponent at least one game?

 

[NoSkillzAndy]

Thanks for the information, Kostas. I stand corrected and now I'm wondering why the hell I double bageled my opponents last weekend

 

[J_R_B]

I'm not qute understanding this. If you beat someone 0 and 0, it doesn't count toward bumping you up, but if you beat someone 0 and 1 it does?
So if I want to get bumped up (which really should be everyone's goal) I have to remember to give the opponent at least one game?

Yes. This is one of the more asinine flaws in the algorithm, it can't "process" a 6-0 6-0 score. My guess is that it produces division by zero somewhere in the algorithm, but the USTA would never admit to designing an algorithm that stupid, so instead they say they can't differentiate the difference in levels when the score is that lopsided.

 

[polski]

I'm not qute understanding this. If you beat someone 0 and 0, it doesn't count toward bumping you up, but if you beat someone 0 and 1 it does?
So if I want to get bumped up (which really should be everyone's goal) I have to remember to give the opponent at least one game?

I've heard this 0 & 0 dynamic stuff for a while now and I don't get it either. I understand that defaults shouldn't be counted, but if you destroy someone in your rating 0 & 0 you are clearly the superior player. If it is true that bagels don't go into year end DNTRP calculations, it is a shame.

However, the last time I played a self rate, I found myself down 0-6, 0-3. This DNTRP theory was what motivated me to win some games at the end and not give up. I am hopeful that the match not only counted towards a midseason DQ, but also towards a rating bump in December.

 

[Kostas]

When your DQ'ed player receives the letter stating which matches generated strikes, please report back. Thanks!

I confirmed it was the two double bagels and the final match this past Saturday which was the doubles win against the two 3.0s, 6-0, 6-1. When I asked about this she said that it was likely the first two double bagels likely pushed his rating so high it wouldn't have mattered who he played in his final match, it was going to generate that third strike.