How to find neutral ball when playing up

[johnmccabe]

When you play against opponents better than you, how do you find the neutral ball at baseline reasonably quick in a match? Let's say ntrp 0.5 level difference.

I struggle with this a lot in doubles. If I try to play safe and control, I get punished by the net player. If I try to hit harder, more errors. Even though I don't actually get poached every shot or miss every hard shot, my mind seems to exaggerate the negative results.

Is there some kind of check list or protocol that you go through to help you get into the grove of neutral rally quickly? Technical or mental.

 

[Rattler]

When you play opponents better than you, how do you find the neutral ball at baseline reasonably quick in a match? Let's say ntrp 0.5 level difference.

I struggle with this a lot in doubles. If I try to play safe and control, I get punished by the net player. If I try to hit harder, more errors. Even though I don't actually get poached every shot or miss every hard shot, my mind seems to exaggerate the negative results.

Is there some kind of check list or protocol that you go through to help you get into the grove of neutral rally quickly? Technical or mental.

Everyone does this, it’s natural. The key is recognizing this and any of the expected mental agitation that comes with it. Try to remain calm and relax. You may getting rushed by your opponents, but this is different that being rushed by feelings, your perception of the the game and how you’re playing it. Does that make sense?

 

[esgee48]

Just note what their relative weaknesses are. Then pick on that when needed. Crowd the net? Don’t bend knees for low balls? Slices give them issues? Of course this is predicated on a ~0.5 Ntrp difference. If you’re a 4.0 playing 5.0’s, nothing will work consistently throughout the match. Top of level ntrp level are a lot better than bottom of level ntrp and you’re not expected to win many games or points.

 

[johnmccabe]

Everyone does this, it’s natural. The key is recognizing this and any of the expected mental agitation that comes with it. Try to remain calm and relax. You may getting rushed by your opponents, but this is different that being rushed by feelings, your perception of the the game and how you’re playing it. Does that make sense?

Being rushed by feeling is definitely a factor. There is probably also a technical component to this problem.

 

[ngoster]

If you're not doing so, train yourself to identify the type of ball spin and trajectory coming from the hitter. This will help you predict where the ball is going to land and how it will behave (skid, kick up or go sideways). Eventually, you'll be able to read the pace of the shot as well. Being able to do these things will help you identify offensive, neutral and defensive shots.

If being able to do all three things individually is too overwhelming, start with generally predicting where the ball will land relative to depth. Will it land short inside the service line, mid-court between the service line and halfway to the baseline or deep in the second half of the baseline? Typically, anything mid-court should be considered a neutral ball.

 

[chuckersthenut]

To me footwork and anticipation can sometimes create neutral balls.

 

[johnmccabe]

To me footwork and anticipation can sometimes create neutral balls.

I can definitely ramp up footwork intensity, but anticipation when playing up is tough for me.

 

[chuckersthenut]

I can definitely ramp up footwork intensity, but anticipation when playing up is tough for me.

Yes it takes years and a natural feel for the game. Just have to keep playing up. Getting humbled. Then one day...you might still suck ha. Tough game.

Edit:
Honestly. Try to get some hitting sessions set up where you can practice getting the meat in place rather than stroke mechanics. Get a hitting partner that can give you time. Just when you feel you're ready to hit the shot take an extra half step. Keep your feet working.

 

[Bagumbawalla]

When I was first learning to play, returning serve was stressful, there were too many options,
left, right, spinning, flat into the body, I felt rushed... and in doubles- the net man narrowed my choices
to either hitting long or into the net.
Then one day when the serve landed a bit long and wide. With no pressure, I easily and
gracefully sent the ball back to a perfect placement.
Once I knew I could do it, it became easier... I began to relax.

 

[johnmccabe]

When I was first learning to play, returning serve was stressful, there were too many options,
left, right, spinning, flat into the body, I felt rushed... and in doubles- the net man narrowed my choices
to either hitting long or into the net.
Then one day when the serve landed a bit long and wide. With no pressure, I easily and
gracefully sent the ball back to a perfect placement.
Once I knew I could do it, it became easier... I began to relax.

Maybe I'll get there in a few years...

 

[johnmccabe]

Then one day...you might still suck ha. Tough game.

Taylor Fritz probably feels the same way playing against Djokovic

 

[Injured Again]

When you play opponents better than you, how do you find the neutral ball at baseline reasonably quick in a match? Let's say ntrp 0.5 level difference.

I struggle with this a lot in doubles. If I try to play safe and control, I get punished by the net player. If I try to hit harder, more errors. Even though I don't actually get poached every shot or miss every hard shot, my mind seems to exaggerate the negative results.

Is there some kind of check list or protocol that you go through to help you get into the grove of neutral rally quickly? Technical or mental.

I’m not quite sure what you’re asking. Are you looking for the fastest ways to get on even terms with your opponent? If so, that usually doesn’t happen when there is a 0.5 or greater NTRP gap.

I’ve played (and gotten pummeled) numerous times by better opponents. Against relatively equal opponents, the one who gets to do what they prefer to do most often usually wins. The battle often becomes who can force the other to hit shots or to try to win points in ways they do not prefer.

Against a better opponent, this is even more important. You are not going to be competitive by trying (or needing) to play other than with your best patterns of play. So you need to be very clear about what your strengths are, and how you want to win points. If you aren’t clear on this, then getting pummeled is a typical result.

So how do you want to win points against a relatively equal opponent? What is your first and second fallback pattern of play in case that doesn’t work? What do you do most poorly?

As an example, I want to win by hitting the ball hard off the ground and forcing errors or getting weak balls that I can put away or take out of the air for volley winners. If I can’t do that, I can also hit relatively high rates of topspin and underspin to create difficult bounces to again get weaker balls to attack. I don’t have another fallback so if someone is not affected by these things or can neutralize my ability to do them, a beating is coming my way. I also am worst at playing defense. If someone forces me to be on the defense, a pummeling is also coming my way.

You?

 

[mikej]

When you play opponents better than you, how do you find the neutral ball at baseline reasonably quick in a match? Let's say ntrp 0.5 level difference.

I struggle with this a lot in doubles. If I try to play safe and control, I get punished by the net player. If I try to hit harder, more errors. Even though I don't actually get poached every shot or miss every hard shot, my mind seems to exaggerate the negative results.

Is there some kind of check list or protocol that you go through to help you get into the grove of neutral rally quickly? Technical or mental.

well, if the goal is to be able to faceoff more reliably in a XC doubles rally where both partners are at the net, without making errors / giving the net man easy poach opportunities, here are four of many possible suggestions:
1) don't give up too much court positioning - easier to poach off someone 5 ft behind baseline than 1 ft behind baseline, more time to close after contact
2) don't choose the same target you would in singles, aim to curl the ball wider and shorter such that it's landing close to the corner of the service box rather than a deeper ball near the baseline - farther for net man to travel to poach
3) learn to hit a reliable DTL lob to keep the net man off balance / from closing super aggressively
4) learn to hit a XC slice approach shot especially for those XC matchups where you simply find you're the worse baseline player and it's not working 1-up vs 1-up, approach and turn it into 2-up vs their baseliner

 

[johnmccabe]

well, if the goal is to be able to faceoff more reliably in a XC doubles rally where both partners are at the net, without making errors / giving the net man easy poach opportunities, here are four of many possible suggestions:
1) don't give up too much court positioning - easier to poach off someone 5 ft behind baseline than 1 ft behind baseline, more time to close after contact
2) don't choose the same target you would in singles, aim to curl the ball wider and shorter such that it's landing close to the corner of the service box rather than a deeper ball near the baseline - farther for net man to travel to poach
3) learn to hit a reliable DTL lob to keep the net man off balance / from closing super aggressively
4) learn to hit a XC slice approach shot especially for those XC matchups where you simply find you're the worse baseline player and it's not working 1-up vs 1-up, approach and turn it into 2-up vs their baseliner

Very practical suggestions!

 

[ChaelAZ]

When you play against opponents better than you, how do you find the neutral ball at baseline reasonably quick in a match? Let's say ntrp 0.5 level difference.

I struggle with this a lot in doubles. If I try to play safe and control, I get punished by the net player. If I try to hit harder, more errors. Even though I don't actually get poached every shot or miss every hard shot, my mind seems to exaggerate the negative results.

Is there some kind of check list or protocol that you go through to help you get into the grove of neutral rally quickly? Technical or mental.

To me you are describing what actually makes the .5 difference, that they can do almost everything just that little bit better. I played D1 for our 3.5, and as I got experience I learned to dominate the middle more. Then started playing D1 for 4.0 and found my level of "domination" wasn't so dominating, and that higher level opponents now had ways to move me out of position and take over. As I progress in 4.0, maybe someday getting towards the top, the 4.5's will have their way.

That said, there are always things to try and look to expose any bit of weakness, like finding weaker wings or types of balls you can give, like deep loopy or short balls. Or look to get at an opponents fitness, if your fitness is better that is. Or focusing on high percentage serves and service returns to at least get in every point possible and play it out.