Plane Passenger's Obessue - right in calling out the elephant(s) in the room?

Sum Buddy Ells

Hall of Fame
‘At least they’ll keep me warm’: Fat-shaming passenger fumes about being seated between ‘pigs’

Ignoring outraged groans and complaints from other passengers, the woman on the phone continued her loud, fat-shaming tirade as if the body mass index of the people seated next to her meant they couldn’t hear her or weren’t entitled to respect.

The video from the United Airlines flight — posted by one of the tirade’s targets, Norma Rodgers, an award-winning nurse and advocate against gun violence — starts with the middle-seat passenger fuming on the phone.

The woman laments that she had flown with frequent-flier miles and did not have a say in the seat assignment that had placed her between two passengers she loudly referred to as “pigs.”

“I don’t know how I’m going to do this the next four hours … because they’re squishing me,” she says into her phone.

“But at least they’ll keep me warm,” she jokes.

One of the passengers she was mocking can be seen in the frame a few inches away, sitting silently.

Other passengers attempt to defuse the situation, saying there are open seats in other parts of the plane. But ultimately, they become fed up.

“You should be ashamed of yourself,” one man tells the woman. “What you’re doing is so terrible.”

“I can’t breathe,” she responds. “I’m so squished. I eat salad, okay?”

In a statement, a United Airlines spokeswoman told The Washington Post that the disruptive passenger was ultimately removed from the flight.

“United flight attendants care about the safety and well-being of all of our customers which is why they acted quickly to find a different seat for the disruptive customer,” the spokeswoman, Maddie King, said. “When it became clear that this passenger’s behavior was likely to be problematic on this flight, she was provided alternate travel arrangements first thing the next morning.”

But in a flash, the outburst became the latest example of what can happen when tense travelers are crammed into tiny seats with recirculated air and not enough decorum to go around.

In 2017, an airport employee punched an infant-carrying easyJet passenger in the face as tensions flared after a nightmarish 13-hour delay in France. The incident was immortalized in photos and videos shot outside the gate.

Other incidents have included racist and politically charged rants, smashed wine bottles and a passenger who tried to bite a flight attendant. Families have been booted from flights over a birthday cakeand a toddler kicking a passenger’s seat. Over the summer, one flight was delayed for so long that passengers trapped on the plane rationed food.

But even before buckling her seat belt, Rodgers had stumbled into a controversy that sparks usually silent anger in some fliers while causing others to worry about being publicly fat-shamed by a stranger. Debates have raged about whether larger passengers should have to buy a second seat or even whether people should be weighed before walking down the jet bridge.

Peter Singer, a professor of bioethics at Princeton and a well-known animal rights activist, has become a figurehead for the Weigh More Pay More movement, which says fat fliers should pay more because airlines and fellow passengers incur additional costs and discomfort. People on the other side of the issue say airlines should find a way to both turn a profit and treat larger passengers with respect.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/tran...g-seated-between-pigs/?utm_term=.b4da5207d55d


Don't in any way justify the woman's "two big pigs" comment, but I also know that fat is fat. Obese is obese. Normal is normal. And the reality is plane seats are designed for the normal. Shouldn't it be mandatory for you to 'fit' in the actual seating space you paid for?
 
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TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Happened to me once. NYC-SF.

Was a bit uncomfortable to have his fat pressing into me for 5 hours. But he was a nice man and we talked a lot. So all good in the end.
 
passenger-shaming-wtf.jpg
 

Sudacafan

Bionic Poster

Don't in any way justify the woman's "two big pigs" comment, but I also know that fat is fat. Obese is obese. Normal is normal. And the reality is plane seats are designed for the normal. Shouldn't it be mandatory for you to 'fit' in the actual seating space you paid for?
Not only talking about obese, but big frame people. What if you were seated together with Shaquille O'Neal, if someday Shaq could not fly first class.
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
I pay for early boarding privileges and sit with my skinny family. BTW, you should read the "skinny female" threads on these discussions. It looks like all of the large travelers look to sit next to the skinny female.
 

Kevin T

Hall of Fame
Fat AND rude people on a plane?

Wow, this is news.

Happened to me once in your neck of the woods. On my way back to the salt of the Earth in SoCal, when that nasty inversion kept us grounded in SLC. We had just started taxiing on the runway when the 'no take offs' announcement was made and you know what that means...spend the next 4 hours just sitting on the runway. I was in the window seat of a 2 seats per side Embraer, smashed in by a 300+ lb gentle lady of size, as they say. She was perfectly nice and pleasant the entire time but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't feeling a little claustrophobic (and I'm not claustrophobic). A lot of people became very rude very fast. I just curled up in the fetal position and sucked my thumb like Jim Carrey in 'Dumb and Dumber'. Oh yeah, apparently our flight crew had been on duty too long, so we then go back to the gate to find substitute flights. Once able to get off the plane, most other delayed passengers had beaten me to the punch and the next flight out wasn't available until 5 pm. I spent the next 7 hours wandering the halls of SLC and drinking watered down beer. :) US Air did put me on first class though, where I commenced to drink at least 5 IPAs on the less than 2 hour flight. My wife was thrilled to pick me up after that one. The good old days! :)
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Happened to me once in your neck of the woods. On my way back to the salt of the Earth in SoCal, when that nasty inversion kept us grounded in SLC. We had just started taxiing on the runway when the 'no take offs' announcement was made and you know what that means...spend the next 4 hours just sitting on the runway. I was in the window seat of a 2 seats per side Embraer, smashed in by a 300+ lb gentle lady of size, as they say. She was perfectly nice and pleasant the entire time but I'd be lying if I said I wasn't feeling a little claustrophobic (and I'm not claustrophobic). A lot of people became very rude very fast. I just curled up in the fetal position and sucked my thumb like Jim Carrey in 'Dumb and Dumber'. Oh yeah, apparently our flight crew had been on duty too long, so we then go back to the gate to find substitute flights. Once able to get off the plane, most other delayed passengers had beaten me to the punch and the next flight out wasn't available until 5 pm. I spent the next 7 hours wandering the halls of SLC and drinking watered down beer. :) US Air did put me on first class though, where I commenced to drink at least 5 IPAs on the less than 2 hour flight. My wife was thrilled to pick me up after that one. The good old days! :)

I always check the equipment on flights and look for 737s, 757s, 767s and 777s. I hope that the MDs have been retired. I haven't been on a turboprop or other small plane in decades.
 

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
Happened to me once in your neck of the woods. On my way back to the salt of the Earth in SoCal, when that nasty inversion kept us grounded in SLC. We had just started taxiing on the runway when the 'no take offs' announcement was made and you know what that means...spend the next 4 hours just sitting on the runway. :)

Why not let passengers deboard? 4 hours on the runway???
 

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
Airlines keep cramming people into smaller spaces and Americans keep getting larger. Something has to give.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...ats-get-smaller-editorials-debates/397083002/

It’s not a good situation for anyone least of all the obese person.

https://medium.com/@thefatshadow/wh...sitting-next-to-you-on-the-plane-85006e263778

IMO, you are entitled to the full seat of the already small seat you paid for without having to sit with someone else’s body parts jamming into you. If a passenger doesn’t fit in the seat they bought then it’s the airlines problem to rectify the situation whether imposing the cost on such passenger or by absorbing it, or something in-between.

https://www.smartertravel.com/airline-obesity-policies/

I suspect from anecdotal reports that many airlines ignore their own rules and make passengers deal with it.
 
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Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
And the other side of the equation. (Though I mostly put it on the airlines trying to squeeze more and more capacity.)

https://www.publichealth.org/public-awareness/obesity/

Airlines need to maximize their profits but yet the public waistline is expanding while seats are shrinking. I am fine with them cutting costs by restricting luggage, cutting meals, etc.

But there needs to be a moratorium on seat shrinkage. If anything, seats need to be larger. That woman in the middle seat was complaining of being squished but I'm sure the two heavy passengers were not comfortable either.:(
 

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
Airlines need to maximize their profits but yet the public waistline is expanding while seats are shrinking. I am fine with them cutting costs by restricting luggage, cutting meals, etc.

But there needs to be a moratorium on seat shrinkage...

I agree and I don’t care whether airlines maximize their profits.
 

Kevin T

Hall of Fame
Why not let passengers deboard? 4 hours on the runway???

Called off take off when we were 2nd in line. Inversion in Salt Lake City can get thick and visibility was poor. We actually lined up to take off a few times and cancelled each time. Then there was no open jetway/terminal spot. Then staff had been on duty and back to terminal when a spot open. This happened just as planes were starting to take off, which was a real kick in the pants. Even better news when no available flights until the evening. I was actually in town skiing with friends from back east and was on my way to an academic meeting in Phoenix that morning-work and pleasure trip. Ended up missing the meeting and got first class back to San Diego.


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Kevin T

Hall of Fame
I always check the equipment on flights and look for 737s, 757s, 767s and 777s. I hope that the MDs have been retired. I haven't been on a turboprop or other small plane in decades.

Agreed and hate small planes myself. It was my only option to Phoenix that early, so I took it. I have 4 kids and will drive the extra couple of hours to San Fran or LA when in San Diego to get the non-stops back east to visit family. Too many nights spent in airports with 4 young kids-I’m looking at you ATL and MINNEAPOLIS [emoji3]


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TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Airlines keep cramming people into smaller spaces and Americans keep getting larger. Something has to give.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opin...ats-get-smaller-editorials-debates/397083002/

It’s not a good situation for anyone least of all the obese person.

https://medium.com/@thefatshadow/wh...sitting-next-to-you-on-the-plane-85006e263778

IMO, you are entitled to the full seat of the already small seat you paid for without having to sit with someone else’s body parts jamming into you. If a passenger doesn’t fit in the seat they bought then it’s the airlines problem to rectify the situation whether imposing the cost on such passenger or by absorbing it, or something in-between.

https://www.smartertravel.com/airline-obesity-policies/

I suspect from anecdotal reports that many airlines ignore their own rules and make passengers deal with it.
The small space in US plains isn’t only a problem for fat people, but for us w long legs as well. I’ve used US airlines twice and never again if I don’t have to.
 

TheGhostOfAgassi

Talk Tennis Guru
Agreed and hate small planes myself. It was my only option to Phoenix that early, so I took it. I have 4 kids and will drive the extra couple of hours to San Fran or LA when in San Diego to get the non-stops back east to visit family. Too many nights spent in airports with 4 young kids-I’m looking at you ATL and MINNEAPOLIS [emoji3]


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I lived in SF and sometimes went to LA. First time going there the plain was delayed and the whole trip took longer time door to door than if had had driven. It’s a nice drive over the mountain. So every trip to LA after that I drove :) (have to avoid LA rush hours though as that’s the most insane traffic I’ve encountered, worse than India even)
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Do you inspect the engine too?

No. But I do keep an eye on recalls and accidents. I've only flown Southwest for the last six years and they do provide a pretty good flying experience. I see far more complaints from United, Delta, USAir, etc. I'd probably go business class if I had to fly the less friendly skies.
 

Ironwood

Professional
I had an uneasy flight a few years ago to London. My wife and I were seated next to the window with me in the middle seat and a 12 or 13 year old girl next to us by the aisle. Evidently her mother was several rows back. I got up to use the facilities and her mother came and sat in my seat in the middle and when I returned wrapped her arms around her daughter, and in broken English said I should take her seat back a few rows. I called the stewardess but the woman still holding her daughter wouldn't budge. The stewardess said she would try to seat the two of us elsewhere, but never returned. The flight was packed so I took the seat she abandoned and we persevered the 5 hour flight with my wife having to sit next to mother and daughter who were not too accommodating letting her out mid flight to use the ladies room. We complained to the airline after we got back, but nothing was done, and we just let it go. I can't remember if we paid extra for seat selection to sit together.
 

Rattler

Hall of Fame

Don't in any way justify the woman's "two big pigs" comment, but I also know that fat is fat. Obese is obese. Normal is normal. And the reality is plane seats are designed for the normal. Shouldn't it be mandatory for you to 'fit' in the actual seating space you paid for?

Wow...what an ugly person...she has a choice...get off the flight. No reason for her to trample over someone else’s feelings...ugly, ugly, ugly. She should be ashamed.
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
I had an uneasy flight a few years ago to London. My wife and I were seated next to the window with me in the middle seat and a 12 or 13 year old girl next to us by the aisle. Evidently her mother was several rows back. I got up to use the facilities and her mother came and sat in my seat in the middle and when I returned wrapped her arms around her daughter, and in broken English said I should take her seat back a few rows. I called the stewardess but the woman still holding her daughter wouldn't budge. The stewardess said she would try to seat the two of us elsewhere, but never returned. The flight was packed so I took the seat she abandoned and we persevered the 5 hour flight with my wife having to sit next to mother and daughter who were not too accommodating letting her out mid flight to use the ladies room. We complained to the airline after we got back, but nothing was done, and we just let it go. I can't remember if we paid extra for seat selection to sit together.

You might try complaining on social media. A lot of businesses have employees monitoring social media and staff to deal with complaints. You're just telling us on a tennis board. If it's on Twitter, a lot more people will see it. Your case isn't extreme but some of these kinds of issues attract press attention and no airline wants that kind of negative attention.
 

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
Wow...what an ugly person...she has a choice...get off the flight. No reason for her to trample over someone else’s feelings...ugly, ugly, ugly. She should be ashamed.

She's a very mean ugly nasty vile person. Still upset about losing. :(

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Ironwood

Professional
You might try complaining on social media. A lot of businesses have employees monitoring social media and staff to deal with complaints. You're just telling us on a tennis board. If it's on Twitter, a lot more people will see it. Your case isn't extreme but some of these kinds of issues attract press attention and no airline wants that kind of negative attention.
You are right! It wasn't the end of the world, we didn't know the mother/daughter story and I think we had booked months in advance, selected our seats without paying extra, we had no issues on the return flight with the same airline, so we just let it go!
 

Kevin T

Hall of Fame
No. But I do keep an eye on recalls and accidents. I've only flown Southwest for the last six years and they do provide a pretty good flying experience. I see far more complaints from United, Delta, USAir, etc. I'd probably go business class if I had to fly the less friendly skies.

Love the price and convenience of Southwest here in Cali-usually 8-10 non-stops to every airport in the LA area, San Diego and other west coast/southwest cities. Absolutely hate the cattle call boarding process, particularly with kids. People trying to save seats for their 'C' boarding friends/families. No food available on cross country flights. No charger at your seat. It's truly the fast food of flying.

I'm a big fan of Alaska Airlines and use them any chance I get. Good food and drink selection, great entertainment choices and their planes just seem nicer/cleaner. Now that they have a non-stop from SFO to Raleigh, NC, I choose to fly them and drive the 2.5 hours to see my mother on the east coast. It's worth it.
 

r2473

G.O.A.T.
I was in the window seat of a 2 seats per side Embraer, smashed in by a 300+ lb gentle lady of size, as they say.
Aren't you something like 6' 4" 250 lbs?

I always feel sorry for the poor b@stards that have to sit next to me. I'm only 6' 1" or so, but I'm all legs. And I'm in the 210 - 220 range. True, I'm good looking and charming, so most people fight to sit next to me. But I still take up some space.
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Love the price and convenience of Southwest here in Cali-usually 8-10 non-stops to every airport in the LA area, San Diego and other west coast/southwest cities. Absolutely hate the cattle call boarding process, particularly with kids. People trying to save seats for their 'C' boarding friends/families. No food available on cross country flights. No charger at your seat. It's truly the fast food of flying.

I'm a big fan of Alaska Airlines and use them any chance I get. Good food and drink selection, great entertainment choices and their planes just seem nicer/cleaner. Now that they have a non-stop from SFO to Raleigh, NC, I choose to fly them and drive the 2.5 hours to see my mother on the east coast. It's worth it.

I always get EarlyBird boarding and we usually buy food at the airport to bring onboard or pick up stuff at Trader Joes to bring aboard.

My wife has to travel to Asia from time to time and I usually put her on Singapore Airlines - I think that their coach is like US business class. Her relatives are impressed that she flies Singapore Air too. I think that most people fly United.
 

r2473

G.O.A.T.
we usually buy food at the airport to bring onboard .
Hoping it's "Panda Express" or "Burger King". Or maybe some "stinky feet cheese".

These are my favorite people to sit by on the plane. Best case is if they have a family of 12 scattered about the plane and they all need to share the "feast".
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Hoping it's "Panda Express" or "Burger King". Or maybe some "stinky feet cheese".

These are my favorite people to sit by on the plane. Best case is if they have a family of 12 scattered about the plane and they all need to share the "feast".

We get EarlyBird seating so we all sit together, usually in the front of the plane.
 

Kevin T

Hall of Fame
Aren't you something like 6' 4" 250 lbs?

I always feel sorry for the poor b@stards that have to sit next to me. I'm only 6' 1" or so, but I'm all legs. And I'm in the 210 - 220 range. True, I'm good looking and charming, so most people fight to sit next to me. But I still take up some space.

I probably am approaching 250 lb these days. :) I'm taking the under at ~235 lb. :) I'm heavier than I appear, per most people. It seems like people always guess I'm around 215 lb but it's actually 20 lb more. I guess I'm dense in more ways than one.

Like you, my physical attraction is like a babe magnet, so no worries there. Actually, when flying alone, I tend to take the seat next to a Mom and baby. People generally run from this assignment but it's usually a guarantee of an open middle seat. Plus, I have 4 kids, work with kids and coach kids, so what's another 4-5 hours with a screaming kid? Babies absolutely love me, and I can keep them cooing and giggling vs screaming all flight. This also makes all the women on the plane find me even more desirable. If my wife croaks early, watch out! I view it as public service. You're welcome, America.
 
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Kevin T

Hall of Fame
Hoping it's "Panda Express" or "Burger King". Or maybe some "stinky feet cheese".

These are my favorite people to sit by on the plane. Best case is if they have a family of 12 scattered about the plane and they all need to share the "feast".

Yeah, nothing like the dude that brings a Whopper with fries and plops down next to you. How about just eating in the airport and having free hands on the plane? No cross country flight is more than ~5 hours. You can't make it 5 hours without a meal? I do it every day. You'll get a couple of snacks and drinks along the way, for Pete's sake.

How about the window shade slammers? Up. Down. Up. Down. Up. Down. Make up your *****' mind.

I still have some young seat kickers in my family, so we typically sit 3 and 3 in 2 rows with the young ones kicking the older ones all the way. :)
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Yeah, nothing like the dude that brings a Whopper with fries and plops down next to you. How about just eating in the airport and having free hands on the plane? No cross country flight is more than ~5 hours. You can't make it 5 hours without a meal? I do it every day. You'll get a couple of snacks and drinks along the way, for Pete's sake.

How about the window shade slammers? Up. Down. Up. Down. Up. Down. Make up your *****' mind.

I still have some young seat kickers in my family, so we typically sit 3 and 3 in 2 rows with the young ones kicking the older ones all the way. :)

The disadvantage of eating before a flight is that you may have to go to the bathroom during the flight.

I had an ileostomy last year and food takes much less time to make it into the bag as it only has to go through the small intestine. I usually go into a flight somewhat dehydrated as well for the same reason and carry water on the plane with me. These days, I'd probably have to fast for two days before taking a flight. There can be a variety of medical reasons for when people plan eating.
 

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
BTW, you should read the "skinny female" threads on these discussions. It looks like all of the large travelers look to sit next to the skinny female.


Many are accusing these two x-large friends, who were travelling together, of intentionally booking the end seats, hoping for an empty seat in the middle. Or a skinny squished middle seat victim. Essentially getting three seats for price of two. :unsure:

Pretty clever.
 
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Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
Yeah, nothing like the dude that brings a Whopper with fries and plops down next to you. How about just eating in the airport and having free hands on the plane? No cross country flight is more than ~5 hours. You can't make it 5 hours without a meal? I do it every day. You'll get a couple of snacks and drinks along the way, for Pete's sake.

5 hours without a meal? Impossible!

VKOocnc.jpg
 

r2473

G.O.A.T.
I wonder if the lady in the OP enjoys sitting next to passengers that talk loudly on their cell phones on planes (or in movie theatres or anywhere else), ignoring the glares from other people?

We have an interesting relationship with "rules", whether those rules are formal and codified or informal and social.

1) We all know the rules
2) This is evidenced by the fact that, when someone breaks a rule, we are quick to point it out (or at least get indignantly angry)
3) We "expect" others to follow the rules. If not, see 2 above.
4) We don't hold ourselves to the same standard. We break the rules freely (if enforcement isn't adequate). And when we do, it's always "justified"

You might say this is irrational, but it's not. It's exactly what the Prisoners Dilemma predicts. And when we perceive others aren't holding up to their end of the bargain, we aren't likely to be satisfied with the "suckers payoff" (following the rules when others break them). So we quickly move into "tit-for-tat" strategies.

This pattern of action is quite predictable and quite rational, but produces less than optimal outcomes. Such is the reality of the situation.

The disadvantage of eating before a flight is that you may have to go to the bathroom during the flight.

I had an ileostomy last year and food takes much less time to make it into the bag as it only has to go through the small intestine. I usually go into a flight somewhat dehydrated as well for the same reason and carry water on the plane with me. These days, I'd probably have to fast for two days before taking a flight. There can be a variety of medical reasons for when people plan eating.
Just at a guess, I'd say the number of people that have a medical need to eat on the plane is roughly equivalent to the number of people with a medical need to have a companion dog with them when they fly.

And even if a person has a medical need, it doesn't follow that they are then required to bring on a Whopper and fries. They certainly could choose food that had a low chance of offending other passengers. But the Prisoners Dilemma predicts people will follow their self-interest and break the "rules" when it suits them. It also predicts that if this very same person is sitting next to someone else that brings stinky food on the next flight, they will be angry at having their rights violated.
 
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movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Many are accusing these two x-large friends, who were travelling together, of intentionally booking the end seats, hoping for an empty seat in the middle. Or a skinny squished middle seat victim. Essentially getting three seats for price of two. :unsure:

Pretty clever.

Anyone big looks to sit next to someone small.
 

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
I wonder if the lady in the OP enjoys sitting next to passengers that talk loudly on their cell phones on planes (or in movie theatres or anywhere else), ignoring the glares from other people?

We have an interesting relationship with "rules", whether those rules are formal and codified or informal and social.

1) We all know the rules
2) This is evidenced by the fact that, when someone breaks a rule, we are quick to point it out (or at least get indignantly angry)
3) We "expect" others to follow the rules. If not, see 2 above.
4) We don't hold ourselves to the same standard. We break the rules freely (if enforcement isn't adequate). And when we do, it's always "justified"

You might say this is irrational, but it's not. It's exactly what the Prisoners Dilemma predicts. And when we perceive others aren't holding up to their end of the bargain, we aren't likely to be satisfied with the "suckers payoff" (following the rules when others break them). So we quickly move into "tit-for-tat" strategies.

This pattern of action is quite predictable and quite rational, but produces less than optimal outcomes. Such is the reality of the situation.


Just at a guess, I'd say the number of people that have a medical need to eat on the plane is roughly equivalent to the number of people with a medical need to have a companion dog with them when they fly.

And even if a person has a medical need, it doesn't follow that they are then required to bring on a Whopper and fries. They certainly could choose food that had a low chance of offending other passengers. But the Prisoners Dilemma predicts people will follow their self-interest and break the "rules" when it suits them. It also predicts that if this very same person is sitting next to someone else that brings stinky food on the next flight, they will be angry at having their rights violated.

We get EarlyBoard boarding so we're able to grab a row of seats to ourselves.
 

Kevin T

Hall of Fame
5 hours without a meal? Impossible!

VKOocnc.jpg

Amazing, huh? Eat bfast at 6 am before heading to work. Lunch at noon. Dinner around 6pm. Nothing in between except coffee, water and tea...same things I’ll get on a plane. Eat bfast in SFO at 6am, 5 hr flight to east coast and grab lunch. My usual schedule.


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