Predominantly Singles Players: At what AGE Did you Hit The Wall???

[asimple]

Why not shorten those rallies? 15-20balls is a LOT. I'm 27, and I'm already shortening points whenever and wherever I can.

I am (wishfully) thinking to maintain my current capabilities all the way until I'm 50, and not lose a step.

I actually remember being slightly older than you getting beaten in open tournaments, but being competitive with some of the stronger 35+ players, and thinking when I'm over 35 I am going to do well. A wife, couple of kids, 80 pounds and a 10 years later and I realize there is no chance I can compete.

I think the issue is only partially physical. My 30s can lead to some big changes with work and family. In my case I didn't have time and quit tennis. Frankly even if I didn't, my abilities would have dropped and I would have been beaten at 35+ just like I was in the open bracket. I do wish I would have continued to play though and hope it works out for you.

 

[Say Chi Sin Lo]

I actually remember being slightly older than you getting beaten in open tournaments, but being competitive with some of the stronger 35+ players, and thinking when I'm over 35 I am going to do well. A wife, couple of kids, 80 pounds and a 10 years later and I realize there is no chance I can compete.

I think the issue is only partially physical. My 30s can lead to some big changes with work and family. In my case I didn't have time and quit tennis. Frankly even if I didn't, my abilities would have dropped and I would have been beaten at 35+ just like I was in the open bracket. I do wish I would have continued to play though and hope it works out for you.

When I was younger, as a teenager, my body was a wreck. Call them growing pains or what have you, I was injured a LOT. Between two shoulder surgeries and misc. injuries, I had a lot of off-time. Those surgeries really humbled me as far as training and my approach of the game.

I'm managing my playing time as well. I know my body can play until the sun goes down, but I'd have nothing left in my later years. I've seen how 40-50year old men moves (sorry!), and I want no part of that if I can do anything about it. I sprinkle in adequate rests in between days:
One week of the month, I would play 7days nonstop, just so I can still do it. Then on those 3 other weeks, I try not to play/train more that 5days a week.
Halfway through the year, I take an break of maybe ~2weeks. Just to rest and refresh my mind of the game.
In December, I usually take that month off because of the Holidays and it usually rains a lot.

Now however, I just started a new career and back in graduate school, it's throwing my nifty/comfortable schedule wayyyy off.

 

[rufus_smith]

if you stay real skinny, and keep up your cardio level, and stay out of serious injury, there isn't much of an age "wall", imo . Unfortunately, this is easier said than done for almost everybody.

 

[floridatennisdude]

Reading through these posts, I still stand by my 20 year shelf life theory. Most talk about a time 10 years ago when they were fitter or played more.

I think there is only so much you can do until the bell curve of life catches up with you athletically. At first, you get more skilled and improve rapidly, then you learn mental aspects and continue to make strides, but at a certain point you just peak. Age slows you and weakens you naturally.

I don't think there is a player in the world that has played 20 years and still feels their game is on the upswing. And if there is someone thinkin that, they are dillusional.

 

[Timbo's hopeless slice]

Ouch. That's a wall. A cylinder block, cement filled wall. Sucks, man.

it wasn't physical, though, I just went to pieces!

in fairness, he started getting his (big!) serve in and I lost a few mph on mine, but still...

 

[Say Chi Sin Lo]

Reading through these posts, I still stand by my 20 year shelf life theory. Most talk about a time 10 years ago when they were fitter or played more.

I think there is only so much you can do until the bell curve of life catches up with you athletically. At first, you get more skilled and improve rapidly, then you learn mental aspects and continue to make strides, but at a certain point you just peak. Age slows you and weakens you naturally.

I don't think there is a player in the world that has played 20 years and still feels their game is on the upswing. And if there is someone thinkin that, they are dillusional.

Or maybe they just don't have a weak and hater's mentality, and they seek improvement and a better understanding of the game each time they step onto the court.

 

[asimple]

I've seen how 40-50year old men moves (sorry!), and I want no part of that if I can do anything about it.

I don't either but unfortunately I am one of those old guys. I am also overweight but in my case there are 2 issues. One is that I am in pretty much constant minor joint pain, and two I am always worried about pulling something by moving too fast. I still have a 3rd gear as I have used it on rare occasions, but am very reluctant to use it.

I don't recommend overdoing it or playing through injuries, but I would recommend enjoying your playing now and not saving anything for old age. You never know what's going to happen

 

[Say Chi Sin Lo]

I don't either but unfortunately I am one of those old guys. I am also overweight but in my case there are 2 issues. One is that I am in pretty much constant minor joint pain, and two I am always worried about pulling something by moving too fast. I still have a 3rd gear as I have used it on rare occasions, but am very reluctant to use it.

I don't recommend overdoing it or playing through injuries, but I would recommend enjoying your playing now and not saving anything for old age. You never know what's going to happen

Trust me, when I'm playing, I don't save anything for the return for the return trip.

But I also know when to rest and heal up minor pains, those minor pains are what leads to chronic injuries.

 

[floridatennisdude]

Or maybe they just don't have a weak and hater's mentality, and they seek improvement and a better understanding of the game each time they step onto the court.

I do as well. I'm just realistic.

 

[Fearsome Forehand]

Depends on who you are playing. A fat, out of shape 60 year old can hang with another fat, out of shape 60 year old but not with an in shape 25 year old.

On the men's pro tour, 30 is ancient. Makes Fed's career all the more amazing but he is now losing regularly to the top younger players like Joker, Murray, Nadal.

A skilled old guy who is in good shape and is a smart player can hang with younger players especially if he has a developed game.

Court coverage is never going to be as good at 50 as it is at 20. But, mentally, the older player should have an advantage.

 

[Angle Queen]

Reading through these posts, I still stand by my 20 year shelf life theory. Most talk about a time 10 years ago when they were fitter or played more.

I think there is only so much you can do until the bell curve of life catches up with you athletically. At first, you get more skilled and improve rapidly, then you learn mental aspects and continue to make strides, but at a certain point you just peak. Age slows you and weakens you naturally.

I don't think there is a player in the world that has played 20 years and still feels their game is on the upswing. And if there is someone thinkin that, they are dillusional.

Hmmm....in general, I want to believe as you do. But as I look at my own "life," I have to wonder when do/did I start this time clock.

I "played" in HS (read: a PE class turned into a Title IX/Diversity "team")...but then dropped it just two years later in college.

Picked it up again at ~35, didn't play real competitive stuff for another 2 years.

Then, at 40, proceeded to take ~4 years "off" to have two kiddies.

I'll tell ya, I was probably at my physical peak maybe 2 years ago, at 45. Healthy diet, chasing (and lifting!) two babies/toddlers...there wasn't much 2 Aleves, a glass of chocolate milk and a good night's sleep couldn't solve. But I wasn't playing multi-match/per day tourneys or staying up til double-digits hours.

Tennis-wise, however, I still feel like there's a little bit left to learn, a few more tools to stash in the toybox (a better serve variety, a bit more spin...both top and slice, and a better acumen to handle and dish out pace). And now that those kiddies are set to head off to school, I'll have a few more hours to hit the courts, either for lessons, self-drills or matches.

After many years of mostly doubles, I've actually gotten back into singles. And while I don't love it like I do the doubles, it has its own exhilaration. I have mixed it up, one-on-one, with those younger and older than me...and, quite frankly, have less issues with the younger set. The ones that can literally power me off the court, a tip-o-hat to 'em...but they're few and far between in the USTA set. No, it's the just slightly older ones, who play those big points super big, that are my nemeses. Still, I've tried to cultivate a playing atmosphere that they've enjoyed, at least enough to wanna give it a go again with me...be it USTA sanctioned or not.

So, is there a wall? Eh, only in our minds. And the older I get, the better I think...the older guys get. Gray hair or bald, if they're fit...and/or trying...they get my vote.

 

[Moz]

I'm managing my playing time as well. I know my body can play until the sun goes down, but I'd have nothing left in my later years. I've seen how 40-50year old men moves (sorry!), and I want no part of that if I can do anything about it. I sprinkle in adequate rests in between days:

Said as a true 27 year old!

 

[floridatennisdude]

Hmmm....in general, I want to believe as you do. But as I look at my own "life," I have to wonder when do/did I start this time clock.

I "played" in HS (read: a PE class turned into a Title IX/Diversity "team")...but then dropped it just two years later in college.

Picked it up again at ~35, didn't play real competitive stuff for another 2 years.

Then, at 40, proceeded to take ~4 years "off" to have two kiddies.

I'll tell ya, I was probably at my physical peak maybe 2 years ago, at 45. Healthy diet, chasing (and lifting!) two babies/toddlers...there wasn't much 2 Aleves, a glass of chocolate milk and a good night's sleep couldn't solve. But I wasn't playing multi-match/per day tourneys or staying up til double-digits hours.

Tennis-wise, however, I still feel like there's a little bit left to learn, a few more tools to stash in the toybox (a better serve variety, a bit more spin...both top and slice, and a better acumen to handle and dish out pace). And now that those kiddies are set to head off to school, I'll have a few more hours to hit the courts, either for lessons, self-drills or matches.

After many years of mostly doubles, I've actually gotten back into singles. And while I don't love it like I do the doubles, it has its own exhilaration. I have mixed it up, one-on-one, with those younger and older than me...and, quite frankly, have less issues with the younger set. The ones that can literally power me off the court, a tip-o-hat to 'em...but they're few and far between in the USTA set. No, it's the just slightly older ones, who play those big points super big, that are my nemeses. Still, I've tried to cultivate a playing atmosphere that they've enjoyed, at least enough to wanna give it a go again with me...be it USTA sanctioned or not.

So, is there a wall? Eh, only in our minds. And the older I get, the better I think...the older guys get. Gray hair or bald, if they're fit...and/or trying...they get my vote.

Kind of tough to figure out how many years you've put in. Seems like you are under 10 with all the gaps. After another 10, re-think it. You won't understand it until then.

 

[rkelley]

50 and still improving.

I've generally played my whole life. I was a decent player in my 20's, 3.5 to 4.0. I was ranked in C doubles in Northern California for a year. I hit hard, but consistency was an issue. I hardly played at all in my 30's to mid 40's because of kids, work, family. I wasn't in fantastic shape cardio wise during that time, but did keep off the weight and lifted a few weights here and there. I weighed the same at 45 as I did when I was 18, and it was more or less in the same places. Returned to playing a lot around 45.

I can honestly say I'm a vastly superior player now than when I was 25. I hit with a guy who played 5.0 tournaments and I do OK. I've hit with an 18 year old once who plays 18 open and mens open tournaments and won games (though not sets).

The biggest difference for me is when I go out and hit hard for +2 hours I really need a recovery day. Things just ache. I've had some wrist pain and currently my shoulder is a tad tender. I'm not quite as fast I used to be, but I still move pretty well. I play with two other guys regularly who are around my age and they have high level strokes: they hit hard, with spin and angles, and they can run.

I'd say keep the weight off and with a little luck on injuries I think that developing and maintaining high level skills, and practice time are bigger issues than age.

 

[rkelley]

Reading through these posts, I still stand by my 20 year shelf life theory. Most talk about a time 10 years ago when they were fitter or played more.

I think there is only so much you can do until the bell curve of life catches up with you athletically. At first, you get more skilled and improve rapidly, then you learn mental aspects and continue to make strides, but at a certain point you just peak. Age slows you and weakens you naturally.

I don't think there is a player in the world that has played 20 years and still feels their game is on the upswing. And if there is someone thinkin that, they are dillusional.

Well, I guess I'm dillusional. I played low varsity in high school. At 19 I was good enough to beat a female player at the local junior college, though not good enough to be on the men's team. In my mid 20's I was ranked in Northern California in C doubles. In my late 20's I was playing B level club singles and playing almost every day (grad school). So I was a decent player, not great, but I didn't suck.

See my other post, but at 50 I would crush my 29 year old self. The difference in my abilities is not subtle and has happened over the last few years from practice and analysis of my strokes. It didn't just happen because I was playing more. Now clearly I wasn't a great player before, but I improved, a lot, in through my late 40's. I'm not done yet either.

So you can get better even at the advanced age of 50, even if you've been playing for most of your life, and even if you were at least an OK player already.

 

[floridatennisdude]

Well, I guess I'm dillusional. I played low varsity in high school. At 19 I was good enough to beat a female player at the local junior college, though not good enough to be on the men's team. In my mid 20's I was ranked in Northern California in C doubles. In my late 20's I was playing B level club singles and playing almost every day (grad school). So I was a decent player, not great, but I didn't suck.

See my other post, but at 50 I would crush my 29 year old self. The difference in my abilities is not subtle and has happened over the last few years from practice and analysis of my strokes. It didn't just happen because I was playing more. Now clearly I wasn't a great player before, but I improved, a lot, in through my late 40's. I'm not done yet either.

So you can get better even at the advanced age of 50, even if you've been playing for most of your life, and even if you were at least an OK player already.

In my experience, there are far more outliers to my theories on the Internet than there are on the tennis courts.

 

[dlk]

Obviously I was in better shape as a 25y/o (could run two miles in twelve minutes, do 90 push-ups & sit-ups in two minutes), but my 44y/o self can crush my 25 y/o self in tennis

So what does tat mean? Tennis ability relies alot on experience/practice/craftyness? But would like to have today's ability, with my 25y/o body.

 

[rkelley]

In my experience, there are far more outliers to my theories on the Internet than there are on the tennis courts.

When I read through the posts I see a lot of people, who are by definition on the internet, agreeing with you. FWIW I think your observations do have merit.

My point was that it's not preordained. I don't think that age related decline is the biggest factor in preventing people from improving as they get older. Most people never have and never will get good enough at tennis that the physical decline that you experience at being 50 means that you can't improve from when you were 20. I think lack of acquiring higher level skills is the number one issue that prevents people from improving from my non-scientific observations, not age. If your backhand sucked at 20 and you've done nothing to correct the stroke, then it will likely suck at 50, probably a bit more. But if you'v worked on the stroke, improved the form, and practiced it (finding the time is another issue), there's no reason why it can't be better. The fact the most people don't do this doesn't mean they can't.

Now if being 50 means that you're 30 lbs overweight, or have a heart condition, or have blown out your knee, then you might have an issue the truly prevents you from improving at a later age. Those things are more likely at 50, but they don't have to happen. So assuming that you've kept the weight off mostly and that everything still mostly works, I think 50 is an excuse, not a reason why you can't improve.

 

[floridatennisdude]

Obviously I was in better shape as a 25y/o (could run two miles in twelve minutes, do 90 push-ups & sit-ups in two minutes), but my 44y/o self can crush my 25 y/o self in tennis

So what does tat mean? Tennis ability relies alot on experience/practice/craftyness? But would like to have today's ability, with my 25y/o body.

My 35 y/o self could also crush my 25 y/o self

However, my 35 y/o self would get beat by my 33 y/o self

It takes a considerable amount of time and energy to maintain a skill. Even more to improve a skill.

Read Chuck Kriese's book and pay attention to the "improvement curve" in the first few pages. Chuck explains it better than me.

 

[rkelley]

Tennis ability relies alot on experience/practice/craftyness? But would like to have today's ability, with my 25y/o body.

Sign me up for that. Even if you keep yourself in good shape yadda yadda, 25 year old me had more upside potential than 50 year old me without a doubt. But with a high skill sport like tennis it's so hard to really be limited by your fundamental physical abilities. It's the skills, or lack there of, that are really setting your level.

 

[escii_35]

37 for singles... body started breaking.

I figure there are still possible upticks in my doubles game until I'm 50. I stink that bad in the pairs game.


edit: Naproxin has become my second fav drug.

 

[Surecatch]

About 42 I noticed that age was starting to take hold. Make no mistake... Time stops for no one. I noticed that everything was starting to get harder and that I always was much more sore after a strenuous match. Before forties, I never thought of age issues...now there is no escaping it. Not as fast, not as flexible, not as willing to be reckless, and not as able to recover quickly.

It catches up to everyone sooner or later.