Serve at 15 seconds

[kayak4water]

I'm concerned that I've got a transient waiters tray serve. The video I am linking to was recorded with coach's eye app and shared to a browser at the coach's eye website. If you can view this video using that app, you see a normal practice swing beginning at 11.8 seconds and a serve at 15.8 seconds. On the serve I can see myself bringing the racket head over my own head in a high arc with the transition through a waiter's tray position at 17.4 seconds.

I don't believe I'll have to rip an arm off to fix this, but is this transient waiters tray affecting my serve?

Odd thing #2: at 17.9 seconds, My racket hand finishes in the court with the elbow bent, but by 18.8 seconds my arm has moved out towards the doubles lane. What in the world?

Thank you!

 

[snoflewis]

it would be nice if i didn't have to lay across my desk to watch the video

edit: seems like an issue only on a computer and not on mobile

 

[princemidplus]

What are you trying to accomplish by halting your swing once you have stuck the ball? There is no follow through and no weight transfer to the front foot.

 

[kayak4water]

it would be nice if i didn't have to lay across my desk to watch the video

you're so right! those of us viewing on anything but a desktop computer have the luxury of just turning our devices 90 degrees

What are you trying to accomplish by halting your swing once you have stuck the ball? There is no follow through and no weight transfer to the front foot.

Halting the swing, per Jeff Salzenstein (How to Finish on the Kick Serve on YouTube) gives better kick or keeps me from swinging into the court as I would for a slice or flat serve--maybe both, I wish my memory would work better.
This is supposed to be a kick serve (haha). On weight transfer for kick serve, good point. Maybe I'd do better if I didn't fear my arthritic left hip telling me, most unkindly, DON'T!! I suppose I should serve left handed to see if I transfer weight (I got a brand new right hip in June that doesn't mind weight transfers)

 

[princemidplus]

you're so right! those of us viewing on anything but a desktop computer have the luxury of just turning our devices 90 degrees

Halting the swing, per Jeff Salzenstein (How to Finish on the Kick Serve on YouTube) gives better kick or keeps me from swinging into the court as I would for a slice or flat serve--maybe both, I wish my memory would work better.
This is supposed to be a kick serve (haha). On weight transfer for kick serve, good point. Maybe I'd do better if I didn't fear my arthritic left hip telling me, most unkindly, DON'T!! I suppose I should serve left handed to see if I transfer weight (I got a brand new right hip in June that doesn't mind weight transfers)

Eish. Ok. That explains your weight transfer issues.

I still think you are prematurely trying to halt your swing to turn it into a kick serve rather than following a natural path. This means you aren't hitting with the racquet speed you need to produce the spin required to make the ball kick.

Why do you want a kick serve? With the issue with your hips you will more likely get better serves and improvement putting time into a slice serve where the weight transfer wont be as much of a hindrance.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

Did not watch the video at a slower speed but, at normal speed, I am not seeing much evidence of a significant WTE (waiter's tray error). Frankly, I would not worry about the WTE. You have actual / real issues that should be addressed.

Your right elbow, during your trophy phase, is even higher than this. You drop it slightly from its high position, but not enough. A high elbow position, such as this, can eventually result in a shoulder impingement in a few years or more. Stan W, himself, has been dealing with shoulder pain. In the past decade, he's been out five or six times with shoulder issues.

Since your R elbow goes higher than this, you may develop an even more serious shoulder issue. This high elbow position might be happening in a misguided effort to "scratch the back". Do not try to scratch your back. Instead, rotate the shoulder (with the elbow bent at 90°) as if you are executing a "comb the hair" motion. I can provide a video for this if you don't know what I mean.

Here is the proper elbow alignment:

Note that the R elbow is also pulled back ("elbow the enemy") so that there is a bit of a stretch in the R pec and shoulder. You appear to lack this stretch.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

Did you say which hip was replaced? For right-handed players it is the Right hip more often than the Left hip.

You are staying "side on" pretty much, as you should, for a top spin or kick serve. But, subsequently, you turn and land inconsistently and often improperly. Trying to drive your body and racket upward and then forward. Land on the ball of your L foot so that it is pointing, more or less, in the direction of your serve. Also try to land a little bit forward of the baseline.

Sometimes you land on your L heel. Other times, your foot is pointed off to the R or waaay off to the L. This does not promote an upward and (then) forward drive.

The other side of the coin of this L leg action and landing is the motion of your R leg. It moves awkwardly & waaay off to the R. You might see elite servers with a slight tenancy to kick to the R on kick serves. However, the action of your R leg / foot should be primarily backward toward the camera. This should help with your drive upward and forward toward your target area.

Note the L foot orientation and R leg position in the 2 images in the next post

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

Hopefully these two images on the serve landing from TennisGate will not disappear

 

[kayak4water]

Did not watch the video at a slower speed but, at normal speed, I am not seeing much evidence of a significant WTE (waiter's tray error). Frankly, I would not worry about the WTE. You have actual / real issues that should be addressed.

Your right elbow, during your trophy phase, is even higher than this. You drop it slightly from its high position, but not enough. A high elbow position, such as this, can eventually result in a shoulder impingement in a few years or more. Stan W, himself, has been dealing with shoulder pain. In the past decade, he's been out five or six times with shoulder issues.

Since your R elbow goes higher than this, you may develop an even more serious shoulder issue. This high elbow position might be happening in a misguided effort to "scratch the back". Do not try to scratch your back. Instead, rotate the shoulder (with the elbow bent at 90°) as if you are executing a "comb the hair" motion. I can provide a video for this if you don't know what I mean.

Here is the proper elbow alignment:

Note that the R elbow is also pulled back ("elbow the enemy") so that there is a bit of a stretch in the R pec and shoulder. You a pair to like this stretch.

A million thanks for your astute observations that my beginners eye would never have made.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

A million thanks for your astute observations that my beginners eye would never have made.

Just noticed that the last line in my post that you quoted did not make any sense. I dictated part of that post and did not realize that the SR software did not interpret it correctly. I just fixed it

 

[Mungo]

The one part of this that caught my attention was the intentional abbreviation to your swing. If anything you want to halt the rotation of your body (at a certain point late in the process) which causes additional acceleration of other parts of the chain. I have my own issues I’m working through so kudos to you for filming and sharing here.

 

[SystemicAnomaly]

A million thanks for your astute observations that my beginners eye would never have made.

Here's a video of Roger's kick serve. Take a look at the first 12 seconds or so and notice how he lands on his L foot. He does not jump into the court as much as other elite players do but he is jumping into the court quite a bit more than you are. Sometimes your toe is on the line and sometimes your whole foot ends up behind the BL.

Note also that he lands on the ball of his foot and his heel comes down later. Sometimes you land flat-footed. Other times you appear to be landing heal first.

The orientation of his L foot is approx in the direction of his served when he lands. And his R leg kicks mostly straight back (to the right in this video) and not away from the camera.