Silent Partner Scoop Series - buying new or demo units

[ajk38]

What was your experience purchasing a used or demo unit from silent partner?

As you may know, silent partner sells "used" and "demo" units on the online auction website that everyone knows about with a 1 year warranty. I just purchased one, but leading up to the purchase I had a hard time finding any research on what, exactly, is a used or demo units.

Silent partner sells their demo units for more than used units (see price schedule below). The only difference in the item description is demo units are used less than 10 hours, or 10 hours or less (depending on the listing), and used units are used less than 25 hours or approximately 25 hours.

I purchased the quest ac/dc demo unit; advertised as having less than 10 hours of use. It arrived ups ground on the 7th day after payment (yesterday), with signature required. I was expecting to get a unit with signs of light use from being leased out to prospective customers in Toronto. The unit I received was as far as I can tell brand new. No evidence of use inside or out. In fact, the plastic hopper still had a fine coating of white dust from the manufacturing process (cutting/sanding the plastic to shape), and the wheels and interior show no signs of use either (not a single stray piece of tennis felt), so I feel safe to say my unit was not a unit that was used as a demo. The boxes for the AC adaptor, and the smart charger, looked like they had been sat on, but the chargers seemed unused.

Instead, and the reason why I suspect my unit was sold as a "demo" unit, is my unit has a number of minor manufacturing imperfections, primarily cosmetic as far as I can tell (I haven't used it yet, just arrived yesterday). For example, one of the wheels is not round and was not molded correctly - there is a 1 inch clump of rubber that was deformed sticking out the side and caught between the inner tire and the rim. Also, the green plastic unit has imperfections, and the best way I can describe it is think of what happens if you fold a piece of plastic sideways just enough to a create a white crease, then push it back into shape. So I have 3 or 4 white lines like that on the body of the green plastic on the base of the unit. But the box was in good shape (and the hopper which goes over the green tub didn’t have damage) so I don’t think it was UPS. Also, the smart charger plug fits EXTREMELY loose, and slips out of the charging port very easily. Now, if I were leasing out a demo to my prospective customers, it wouldn’t make sense to me to lease them a unit highlighting manufacturing imperfections, especially if you’re asking $1 - $2K for the product. I’m guessing they set aside imperfect parts during the manufacturing process and then slap them on some of the “demo” units to sell for a discount. Now, don't get me wrong, if I were given a choice between a unit used 10 times as a demo, and a brand new unit with purely cosmetic blemishes, I would still have chosen this unit so I'm not complaining.

I thought it might help prospective buyers (and satisfy my own curiosity) to know what other people experienced when buying a used or demo unit? Maybe other people would choose differently? Or maybe used machines are an even better deal?

CUSTOMER SERVICE.

As far as my thoughts on the customer service which so many people rave about, they respond professionally; however, I wouldn’t say they go out of their way to earn top marks. I emailed them about 5 times and called twice. They responded to all but one of my emails; however, both times I called it went to an answering machine saying the office was closed for the day (I called around Noon, and 3pm their time). In their defense, their website was down that day so maybe they were having technical issues.

What brought the quality of their customer service down in my mind was when I inquired about the cost/ possibility of upgrading my purchase from a Quest AC/DC to a Smart AC/DC (before paying for the item). I also noted a used Smart AC unit that they were unable to sell and asked if it could be converted to AC/DC, then I’d pay the extra amount to upgrade my purchase to that unit. Steve responded and said they could sell me the used smart ac unit and convert to AC/DC, but it would cost $150 to convert from AC to AC/DC, plus 3 hours of labor at $35/hour; grand total of $1,705. I said I’d pay at most $1600 or maybe $1625. Since that didn’t work out, I went ahead and paid for my unit ($1350), which was shipped out later that day. 12 hours, Silent Partner listed a used smart AC/DC for $1,575 buy it now, with a reserve of $1,500 (note - both prices for less than what I had offered to pay). So I saw this and it brought down the quality of their customer service in my mind at least.

OTHER BALL MACHINES.

I briefly considered the spinshot plus – but when I emailed spinshot, they said their machines do not have the ability for full vertical oscillation – the machine only offers 2 point vertical oscillation (unlike the quest/smart, which has all court coverage). Spinshot does have full horizontal coverage along two vertical points (baseline or halfcourt).

I looked at the playmate volley, but it only had random 2 point horizontal, and 2 line horizontal, oscillation.

The machine which I thought best is the lobster V and IV, which not only has full court coverage, but it also has a button to randomly vary the spin and speed of the shots (which quest/smart cannot do). However, the remote is an additional $300 - and I can’t live without a remote – so the comparable price for a lobster IV with a remote was not justified in my opinion.

Also, ball machine manufacturers do not offer warranty transfer, so I didn’t really consider buying a used item (except for one sold directly by the manufacturer with a warranty, which only silent partner offers).

FINAL THOUGHTS.

Getting the quest probably worked out for the best for me, because I downloaded both instruction manuals smart/quest, and the match play, programmable width oscillation, and programmable shot sequences of the smart seem more complicated than I the effort I would want to expend using those features.

The one thing which surprised me was the size and weight of the silent partner. The shipping weight was 60 pounds, and the machine makes my German shepherd look small. The machine is BIG and NOT LIGHT. The UPS driver needed a dolly to deliver it; the box was too big and heavy for him. If my only mode of transportation was a coupe and I intended to use this with two or more people, I would have had to reconsider my purchase. It seems improbable to me that a ball hopper, 80ish balls, rackets and bag, Gatorade bottles, plus this machine would fit in the truck of a standard coupe/sedan (not to mention the standard collection of bags/hats/shoes/other useless junk your typical wife/girlfriend stores in the trunk that you’re not allowed to dump). Also, the AC power supply is a brick. No, really, it’s the size of two bricks side by side. Finally, the AC cable is pretty short and you’ll probably need an extension cable if you use it on a court. Plus, you’ll have to lug around the two-brick sized AC cable. The lobster is smaller and trunk material, so in that sense more portable.

SCOOP SERIES - PRICE LIST

If helpful for other people considering a purchase, I asked and they said the price ranges for used/demo haven’t changed in a long time. This was the price list that I compiled while doing my research (purchased July 2015).

The first price is the opening minimum reserve selling price, the minimum amount for which they will sell it to you. The second is the price you have to pay to purchase immediately. A lot of purchasers take this option, especially for the higher end models. I only considered the Scoop Series of silent partner.

There seems to be a fairly steady supply of used/demo ball machines. The DC ones sell fast, and the buy it now price isn’t much more than the minimum selling price so it may be a good deal. But if you’re buying AC only, lots of these seem to go unsold, so if you want to save $50 - $75, I don’t think there’s any need to use the buy it now feature for an AC only machine.

RIVAL PRICES:

RIVAL AC USED -$950 ($1,025 buy it now)
RIVAL DC USED -$775 ($850 buy it now)

RIVAL AC DEMO -$1,050 ($1,125 buy it now)
RIVAL DC DEMO - $850 ($970 buy it now)

RIVAL AC/DC - not sold with this option
RIVAL AC NEW - $1449 ($1499 msrp)
RIVAL DC NEW - $1349 ($1399 msrp)

QUEST PRICES:

QUEST AC/DC USED -$1250 ($1325 buy it now)
QUEST AC USED - $1100 ($1175 buy it now)
QUEST DC USED - $1000 ($1075 buy it now)

QUEST AC/DC DEMO - $1350 ($1400 buy it now)
QUEST AC DEMO - $1200 ($1280 buy it now)
QUEST DC DEMO - $1100 ($1220 buy it now)

QUEST AC/DC NEW- $1849 ($2049 msrp)
QUEST AC NEW- $1699 ($1899 msrp)
QUEST DC NEW- $1599 ($1799 msrp)

SMART PRICES:

SMART AC/DC USED - $1500 ($1575 buy it now)
SMART AC USED - $1450 ($1525 buy it now)
SMART DC USED - $1300 ($1375 buy it now)

SMART AC/DC DEMO - $1600 ($1675 buy it now)
SMART AC DEMO - $1550 ($1625 buy it now)
SMART DC DEMO - $1400 ($1475 buy it now)

SMART AC/DC NEW $2149** ($2549 msrp)
SMART AC NEW $1999** ($2399 msrp)
SMART DC NEW $1899** ($2299 msrp)

**I’d note that silent partner always seems to have a sale for new machines going on. During the timeframe I was shopping for a silent partner, the sale prices changed (they went up about $100 - $150 across the board for quest/smart). The price went up around 7/23/15. This is the current new pricing. As a comparison, before July 23, 2015, the Smart ac/dc new was $1,999. Now it is $2149.

 

[Tony1233]

I just got a Quest as well. Chose it over the Lobsters, the Playmate and the TT Plus because of the value offered over the others. They just cannot compete with the Quest. The machine is awesome - love the remote. I guess the weight is relative. I think it is much lighter than I was expecting.

 

[frank52]

If your charger fits loosely into the charging port I would request a new charging port from Silent Partner. Or buy and install on your own. They are only a few bucks and easy to install. Also note that it's not too complicated to convert an AC machine to battery operated.

 

[nycjsw]

What was your experience purchasing a used or demo unit from silent partner?

As you may know, silent partner sells "used" and "demo" units on the online auction website that everyone knows about with a 1 year warranty. I just purchased one, but leading up to the purchase I had a hard time finding any research on what, exactly, is a used or demo units.

Silent partner sells their demo units for more than used units (see price schedule below). The only difference in the item description is demo units are used less than 10 hours, or 10 hours or less (depending on the listing), and used units are used less than 25 hours or approximately 25 hours.

I purchased the quest ac/dc demo unit; advertised as having less than 10 hours of use. It arrived ups ground on the 7th day after payment (yesterday), with signature required. I was expecting to get a unit with signs of light use from being leased out to prospective customers in Toronto. The unit I received was as far as I can tell brand new. No evidence of use inside or out. In fact, the plastic hopper still had a fine coating of white dust from the manufacturing process (cutting/sanding the plastic to shape), and the wheels and interior show no signs of use either (not a single stray piece of tennis felt), so I feel safe to say my unit was not a unit that was used as a demo. The boxes for the AC adaptor, and the smart charger, looked like they had been sat on, but the chargers seemed unused.

Instead, and the reason why I suspect my unit was sold as a "demo" unit, is my unit has a number of minor manufacturing imperfections, primarily cosmetic as far as I can tell (I haven't used it yet, just arrived yesterday). For example, one of the wheels is not round and was not molded correctly - there is a 1 inch clump of rubber that was deformed sticking out the side and caught between the inner tire and the rim. Also, the green plastic unit has imperfections, and the best way I can describe it is think of what happens if you fold a piece of plastic sideways just enough to a create a white crease, then push it back into shape. So I have 3 or 4 white lines like that on the body of the green plastic on the base of the unit. But the box was in good shape (and the hopper which goes over the green tub didn’t have damage) so I don’t think it was UPS. Also, the smart charger plug fits EXTREMELY loose, and slips out of the charging port very easily. Now, if I were leasing out a demo to my prospective customers, it wouldn’t make sense to me to lease them a unit highlighting manufacturing imperfections, especially if you’re asking $1 - $2K for the product. I’m guessing they set aside imperfect parts during the manufacturing process and then slap them on some of the “demo” units to sell for a discount. Now, don't get me wrong, if I were given a choice between a unit used 10 times as a demo, and a brand new unit with purely cosmetic blemishes, I would still have chosen this unit so I'm not complaining.

I thought it might help prospective buyers (and satisfy my own curiosity) to know what other people experienced when buying a used or demo unit? Maybe other people would choose differently? Or maybe used machines are an even better deal?

CUSTOMER SERVICE.

As far as my thoughts on the customer service which so many people rave about, they respond professionally; however, I wouldn’t say they go out of their way to earn top marks. I emailed them about 5 times and called twice. They responded to all but one of my emails; however, both times I called it went to an answering machine saying the office was closed for the day (I called around Noon, and 3pm their time). In their defense, their website was down that day so maybe they were having technical issues.

What brought the quality of their customer service down in my mind was when I inquired about the cost/ possibility of upgrading my purchase from a Quest AC/DC to a Smart AC/DC (before paying for the item). I also noted a used Smart AC unit that they were unable to sell and asked if it could be converted to AC/DC, then I’d pay the extra amount to upgrade my purchase to that unit. Steve responded and said they could sell me the used smart ac unit and convert to AC/DC, but it would cost $150 to convert from AC to AC/DC, plus 3 hours of labor at $35/hour; grand total of $1,705. I said I’d pay at most $1600 or maybe $1625. Since that didn’t work out, I went ahead and paid for my unit ($1350), which was shipped out later that day. 12 hours, Silent Partner listed a used smart AC/DC for $1,575 buy it now, with a reserve of $1,500 (note - both prices for less than what I had offered to pay). So I saw this and it brought down the quality of their customer service in my mind at least.

OTHER BALL MACHINES.

I briefly considered the spinshot plus – but when I emailed spinshot, they said their machines do not have the ability for full vertical oscillation – the machine only offers 2 point vertical oscillation (unlike the quest/smart, which has all court coverage). Spinshot does have full horizontal coverage along two vertical points (baseline or halfcourt).

I looked at the playmate volley, but it only had random 2 point horizontal, and 2 line horizontal, oscillation.

The machine which I thought best is the lobster V and IV, which not only has full court coverage, but it also has a button to randomly vary the spin and speed of the shots (which quest/smart cannot do). However, the remote is an additional $300 - and I can’t live without a remote – so the comparable price for a lobster IV with a remote was not justified in my opinion.

Also, ball machine manufacturers do not offer warranty transfer, so I didn’t really consider buying a used item (except for one sold directly by the manufacturer with a warranty, which only silent partner offers).

FINAL THOUGHTS.

Getting the quest probably worked out for the best for me, because I downloaded both instruction manuals smart/quest, and the match play, programmable width oscillation, and programmable shot sequences of the smart seem more complicated than I the effort I would want to expend using those features.

The one thing which surprised me was the size and weight of the silent partner. The shipping weight was 60 pounds, and the machine makes my German shepherd look small. The machine is BIG and NOT LIGHT. The UPS driver needed a dolly to deliver it; the box was too big and heavy for him. If my only mode of transportation was a coupe and I intended to use this with two or more people, I would have had to reconsider my purchase. It seems improbable to me that a ball hopper, 80ish balls, rackets and bag, Gatorade bottles, plus this machine would fit in the truck of a standard coupe/sedan (not to mention the standard collection of bags/hats/shoes/other useless junk your typical wife/girlfriend stores in the trunk that you’re not allowed to dump). Also, the AC power supply is a brick. No, really, it’s the size of two bricks side by side. Finally, the AC cable is pretty short and you’ll probably need an extension cable if you use it on a court. Plus, you’ll have to lug around the two-brick sized AC cable. The lobster is smaller and trunk material, so in that sense more portable.

SCOOP SERIES - PRICE LIST

If helpful for other people considering a purchase, I asked and they said the price ranges for used/demo haven’t changed in a long time. This was the price list that I compiled while doing my research (purchased July 2015).

The first price is the opening minimum reserve selling price, the minimum amount for which they will sell it to you. The second is the price you have to pay to purchase immediately. A lot of purchasers take this option, especially for the higher end models. I only considered the Scoop Series of silent partner.

There seems to be a fairly steady supply of used/demo ball machines. The DC ones sell fast, and the buy it now price isn’t much more than the minimum selling price so it may be a good deal. But if you’re buying AC only, lots of these seem to go unsold, so if you want to save $50 - $75, I don’t think there’s any need to use the buy it now feature for an AC only machine.

RIVAL PRICES:

RIVAL AC USED -$950 ($1,025 buy it now)
RIVAL DC USED -$775 ($850 buy it now)

RIVAL AC DEMO -$1,050 ($1,125 buy it now)
RIVAL DC DEMO - $850 ($970 buy it now)

RIVAL AC/DC - not sold with this option
RIVAL AC NEW - $1449 ($1499 msrp)
RIVAL DC NEW - $1349 ($1399 msrp)

QUEST PRICES:

QUEST AC/DC USED -$1250 ($1325 buy it now)
QUEST AC USED - $1100 ($1175 buy it now)
QUEST DC USED - $1000 ($1075 buy it now)

QUEST AC/DC DEMO - $1350 ($1400 buy it now)
QUEST AC DEMO - $1200 ($1280 buy it now)
QUEST DC DEMO - $1100 ($1220 buy it now)

QUEST AC/DC NEW- $1849 ($2049 msrp)
QUEST AC NEW- $1699 ($1899 msrp)
QUEST DC NEW- $1599 ($1799 msrp)

SMART PRICES:

SMART AC/DC USED - $1500 ($1575 buy it now)
SMART AC USED - $1450 ($1525 buy it now)
SMART DC USED - $1300 ($1375 buy it now)

SMART AC/DC DEMO - $1600 ($1675 buy it now)
SMART AC DEMO - $1550 ($1625 buy it now)
SMART DC DEMO - $1400 ($1475 buy it now)

SMART AC/DC NEW $2149** ($2549 msrp)
SMART AC NEW $1999** ($2399 msrp)
SMART DC NEW $1899** ($2299 msrp)

**I’d note that silent partner always seems to have a sale for new machines going on. During the timeframe I was shopping for a silent partner, the sale prices changed (they went up about $100 - $150 across the board for quest/smart). The price went up around 7/23/15. This is the current new pricing. As a comparison, before July 23, 2015, the Smart ac/dc new was $1,999. Now it is $2149.

I bought a SP Smart battery power only using the buy it now function. If my memory serves me correct

 

[nycjsw]

Per above - I don't think I new the reserve or just didn't want to risk losing the machine I wanted. I don't remember any obvious cosmetic issues and has no issues you mentioned. I thought my remote looked like it had been used. If your machine is not working right you should call Steve. Are you the poster who was asking ordering a SP a few weeks ago? If so, I thought you got a Smart?

 

[Hmnnn]

OP, thanks for the detailed post about your experience. Helped me tremendously in deciding what machine to buy. I ended up buying a used SP Quest DC model from their **** store for $1075. I can't wait to try it out. I'll post a review to the boards once I get some time in with it.

 

[Chotobaka]

OP, thanks for the detailed post about your experience. Helped me tremendously in deciding what machine to buy. I ended up buying a used SP Quest DC model from their **** store for $1075. I can't wait to try it out. I'll post a review to the boards once I get some time in with it.

That is a whole lot of machine for the money -- I spent close to $1Grrrr 5-6 years ago for my Edge Star. I am certain you are going to enjoy it.

 

[TorontoTennis]

It appears to me that Silent Partner's retail prices mean nothing as they are perpetually on sale. However it does give the casual buyer the impression they are currently getting a deal.

 

[Allan Kharsyntiew]

I have been researching Tennis Ball machines for a while and I have landed on the Spinshot Player Model(http://spinshotsports.com/Spinshot-player.html).
I compared this model with the "Spinfire Pro"(http://www.mambatennis.com/spinfire-pro-2/?revpage=2#reviews) and the "Silent Partner Smart" (http://www.sptennis.com/products/scoop-series-smart) Series.
This particular model is the latest line of products from Spinshot with the distinct features that its fully programmable from your smartphone.
For the Price range of these two models I think the Spinshot Player Model has better features. Looking at future proof your purchase, all they have to do is add software update to their app and you can easily change features. At the moment they do not have a Randomize function, however its acheivable in future with just an app update. This will remove Predictability of the machine.
There are no control knobs or display screens on the unit itself, but all the functions are controlled via your smartphone. The unit has a built in Wifi Access point. You will need to install the App (DrillMaker) from the Sphinshot Website. Turn on the Unit and start the app and your phone will automatically connect to the Ball machine. I did not have any issues connecting but be aware that when you turn on the machine it will make a sound during its initialization phase and when its done you will need to line up the unit with the center of the baseline. The only way to turn off the sound is by Pressing the "START" button on the unit itself. During this time it will start shooting the balls so you will need to Press "STOP" immediately after that. There are 12 Drills that you can customize with varying Spins, height, speed and feed rate individually.
This particular model has good features for the Price you pay. I think its comparable to the very high end Club machines. If you look at the Other Ball machines, "silent Partner" can store only 3 drills, while I did not see the programmable drill feature on the "SPinfire" model. This Unit is very compact and its dimensions is 20"x18"x12" and it weighs just about "47" lbs, fits in my car very well. Has Sturdy wheels so that you can Pull alongside to the Tennis courts. Its comes with a Programmable charger for the Battery. Once the battery is charged, the LED indicator on the Charger turns green. The Machine and Battery were shipped separately. To install the battery into the machine, all you have to do is remove one of the wheels near the battery cover and you can insert the Battery into the battery compartment.
When I contacted customer service they were very helpful in explaining about the new model. They answered all the questions and made the buying experience very smooth.
Overall so far I am very impressed with this Small Portable Tennis Ball Machine. If you would like to see the Manual for the new model follow the link below (http://spinshotsports.com/UM.html)

 

[alancalan]

I have a Quest and love it. It was dormant for a few years because of a few reasons and needed a bettery. I got one for about, I don't remember, I think it was $30 but that sounds too cheap. I have to check that. Steve sent me the install instructions and was very helpful.

There are some things about the Quest that are upgradable. I think you make it into a Smart with a board change. I wonder if you can change a DC to an AC/DC. We have electrical outlets here on my condo courts. I'm not sure how important this is but it might be nice to do if not too expensive. Anyone know? I can call Steve at Silent Partner but I'm here for the first time in a long time.

Alan

 

[TorontoTennis]

It sure seems like you are working for Spinshot with the long shill advertisement you just posted as your very first post!

Any actual customers of this machine? It hardly seems comparable at all in terms of design and quality to the Spinfire Pro or probably the Silent Partner for that matter.

 

[unclenimrod]

Fwiw...I have played with several brands of ball machines and there are definitely machines that do things better than silent partners until you compare value...there seems to always be a silent partner at a better price that does the necessary things well or better.

I used to own a silent partner sport and I will soon own a member of the quest series. They are far and above the highest quality machines at each price range. I owned mine for 3 years before selling it for only $100 less than I paid. You don't need internal oscillation...you need a silent partner ball machine that oscillates "actually at random". Much better. Plus, the machines are often if not always lightest in their class!

 

[TorontoTennis]

Fwiw...I have played with several brands of ball machines and there are definitely machines that do things better than silent partners until you compare value...there seems to always be a silent partner at a better price that does the necessary things well or better.

I used to own a silent partner sport and I will soon own a member of the quest series. They are far and above the highest quality machines at each price range. I owned mine for 3 years before selling it for only $100 less than I paid. You don't need internal oscillation...you need a silent partner ball machine that oscillates "actually at random". Much better. Plus, the machines are often if not always lightest in their class!

Actually, not true about the weight at all. The Lobster Elite 3, which compares favourably with the SP Smart and the Spinfire Pro 2, weighs only 44lbs compared to the Quest's 48 lbs, the Smart's 50 lbs and the Spinfire Pro 2's 52lbs. However, Spinfire recently introduced the ability to have an external battery, unlike any of the SP machines for which you must have the internal battery or AC and the Lobster which you can use an external battery with but only if you also have an internal battery installed. I have the external battery version of the Spinfire which means that I don't have to lug the entire 52 lb unit out of the car and into the house or garage. I just take the 12 lb battery out of the trunk to charge and leave the machine in there. With Spinfire another bonus is that if you already have a machine with an internal battery it can be retrofitted to one with an external battery, either yourself or by sending it back. All you would have to order is the battery bag and a cable. No one else offers this external battery capability except for the Playmate. A big advantage not having to lift 50 lbs out of the trunk.

Without the internal battery the Spinfire Pro 2 weighs only 40 lbs which is 8 lbs less than the Quest, 10 less than the Smart and 12 lbs less than the Lobster Elite. I only have to lift a 40lb unit out of the trunk now when at the court and then just sling the battery bag over my shoulder.

As for resale, I was trying to buy a used machine and but have only ever seen 1 Spinire Pro 2 for sale on 'Cragslist' and not one on' eeBay'. SIlent Partner is constantly selling 'demo' or 'refurbished' units on that Bay place at a discount and also they are perpetually on sale on their website which all begs the question of what the real price is. Looks like people like to hang on to their Spinfires.

As for internal oscillation, I really beg to differ. I've used both machines and I always know where the ball is coming from on the Silent Partner. I almost never do with the Spinfire. It makes a huge difference.

 

[nn]

Without the internal battery the Spinfire Pro 2 weighs only 40 lbs which is 8 lbs less than the Quest, 10 less than the Smart and 12 lbs less than the Lobster Elite. I only have to lift a 40lb unit out of the trunk now when at the court and then just sling the battery bag over my shoulder.

As for resale, I was trying to buy a used machine and but have only ever seen 1 Spinire Pro 2 for sale on 'Cragslist' and not one on' eeBay'. SIlent Partner is constantly selling 'demo' or 'refurbished' units on that Bay place at a discount and also they are perpetually on sale on their website which all begs the question of what the real price is. Looks like people like to hang on to their Spinfires.

As for internal oscillation, I really beg to differ. I've used both machines and I always know where the ball is coming from on the Silent Partner. I almost never do with the Spinfire. It makes a huge difference.

totally agree with you on spinfire pro2 (being owner)

 

[frank52]

I have a Quest and love it. It was dormant for a few years because of a few reasons and needed a bettery. I got one for about, I don't remember, I think it was $30 but that sounds too cheap. I have to check that. Steve sent me the install instructions and was very helpful.

There are some things about the Quest that are upgradable. I think you make it into a Smart with a board change. I wonder if you can change a DC to an AC/DC. We have electrical outlets here on my condo courts. I'm not sure how important this is but it might be nice to do if not too expensive. Anyone know? I can call Steve at Silent Partner but I'm here for the first time in a long time.

Alan

You can add AC if you are willing to tinker just a small bit. You can buy a 12 volt 30 amp DC power supply ($25 AmZon) and wire it inside the machine. You also need to add a switch to go back-forth from AC to battery. Search this forum for threads on this subject.

I would just stay with battery power if only using the ball machine a couple times per week. Consider investing in a nice battery charger to ensure long battery life. I like the BatteryMinder 1500 with SAE connectors for $50. Because most battery chargers do not come with a 2.1 mm power plug used by ball machines, you need to make a cable. Purchase a 2.1 mm male power plug ("2.1 x 5.5 mm DC Power Pigtail" at AmZon -- pack of 10 is under $10). Purchase an SAE connector such as "Allstar Performance ALL76232 Universal Two Wire Connector with 12" Loop" for $5 fromAmZon. Splice the SAE connector to the Power Plug pigtail and you have a 2.1 mm power cable that can connect to any charger with an SAE connector.

 

[unclenimrod]

Actually, not true about the weight at all. The Lobster Elite 3, which compares favourably with the SP Smart and the Spinfire Pro 2, weighs only 44lbs compared to the Quest's 48 lbs, the Smart's 50 lbs and the Spinfire Pro 2's 52lbs. However, Spinfire recently introduced the ability to have an external battery, unlike any of the SP machines for which you must have the internal battery or AC and the Lobster which you can use an external battery with but only if you also have an internal battery installed. I have the external battery version of the Spinfire which means that I don't have to lug the entire 52 lb unit out of the car and into the house or garage. I just take the 12 lb battery out of the trunk to charge and leave the machine in there. With Spinfire another bonus is that if you already have a machine with an internal battery it can be retrofitted to one with an external battery, either yourself or by sending it back. All you would have to order is the battery bag and a cable. No one else offers this external battery capability except for the Playmate. A big advantage not having to lift 50 lbs out of the trunk.

Without the internal battery the Spinfire Pro 2 weighs only 40 lbs which is 8 lbs less than the Quest, 10 less than the Smart and 12 lbs less than the Lobster Elite. I only have to lift a 40lb unit out of the trunk now when at the court and then just sling the battery bag over my shoulder.

As for resale, I was trying to buy a used machine and but have only ever seen 1 Spinire Pro 2 for sale on 'Cragslist' and not one on' eeBay'. SIlent Partner is constantly selling 'demo' or 'refurbished' units on that Bay place at a discount and also they are perpetually on sale on their website which all begs the question of what the real price is. Looks like people like to hang on to their Spinfires.

As for internal oscillation, I really beg to differ. I've used both machines and I always know where the ball is coming from on the Silent Partner. I almost never do with the Spinfire. It makes a huge difference.

We can agree to disagree on the comparable values, but regardless, comparing an externally powered machine's weight to an internal battery isn't really apples to apples.

However, I have never used a spinfire pro 2 and it looks like a pretty awesome machine. It isn't as established a brand (therefore many less sold and many less will appear on the used market), but it's features list is pretty exhaustive.

Internal oscillation is a bizarre concept to me. It isn't as if you can't see a tennis player loading up for a shot until just when the ball is struck. It seems superfluous and even counterintuitive to hide the ball until that moment. I Dont get the benefits.

 

[TorontoTennis]

Don't get me wrong. I was not trying to suggest comparing an internal battery machine to an external battery machine is apples to apples in terms of weight. It's the flexibility it provides.

However, that does not take away from the fact that Silent Partner and Lobster owners have the disadvantage of having to lug the entire machine out of the car and into their house or garage and a ball machine isn't exactly small and is pretty obvious sitting there plugged in your hallway or living room, whereas I just carry the small much lighter battery in. Silent Partner does not even give you the option of an external battery. Lobster does, but with the caveat that you still have to have the internal one present so there is no lighter weight advantage. With the Spinfire I am getting the best of both worlds: lightest ball machine of all 3 to lift in and out of the trunk at the court and only having to bring in the battery to charge.

Not being as 'established' a brand does not appear to have affected Spinfire at all in terms of quality, service, support, features or design. The reviews are pretty well uniform in their praise of the product.

Not everyone but I would say the vast majority of people see the benefits of internal oscillation and my conclusions after having used the machine a few times a week now for a few months are the total opposite of yours. However, given you do not appear to have used a machine with internal oscillation it might be a unfair for you reach your conclusion. I have used both the Spinfire and the Silent Partner. Even though you see a tennis player 'loading up for a shot' does the ball always go in the direction you expect it to based on your observation of the other player hitting? I highly doubt it. However, the orientation of an externally oscillating machine certainly does strongly suggest where the ball is going to go and for me I found that just a bit too easy.

 

[TorontoTennis]

You can add AC if you are willing to tinker just a small bit. You can buy a 12 volt 30 amp DC power supply ($25 AmZon) and wire it inside the machine. You also need to add a switch to go back-forth from AC to battery. Search this forum for threads on this subject.

I would just stay with battery power if only using the ball machine a couple times per week. Consider investing in a nice battery charger to ensure long battery life. I like the BatteryMinder 1500 with SAE connectors for $50. Because most battery chargers do not come with a 2.1 mm power plug used by ball machines, you need to make a cable. Purchase a 2.1 mm male power plug ("2.1 x 5.5 mm DC Power Pigtail" at AmZon -- pack of 10 is under $10). Purchase an SAE connector such as "Allstar Performance ALL76232 Universal Two Wire Connector with 12" Loop" for $5 fromAmZon. Splice the SAE connector to the Power Plug pigtail and you have a 2.1 mm power cable that can connect to any charger with an SAE connector.

That's another thing about Spinfire that I like. You don't have to tinker. If you want AC you just buy the cable later and turn the switch on the bottom to a different position and it works whether or not you have an internal battery present. The Silent Partner is less flexible as you are forced to order it Battery, AC or Battery/AC.

Yes I guess you can tell I am a big fan of Spinfire! I just like great design.

 

[tennissavvy]

Don't get me wrong. I was not trying to suggest comparing an internal battery machine to an external battery machine is apples to apples in terms of weight. It's the flexibility it provides.

However, that does not take away from the fact that Silent Partner and Lobster owners have the disadvantage of having to lug the entire machine out of the car and into their house or garage and a ball machine isn't exactly small and is pretty obvious sitting there plugged in your hallway or living room, whereas I just carry the small much lighter battery in. Silent Partner does not even give you the option of an external battery. Lobster does, but with the caveat that you still have to have the internal one present so there is no lighter weight advantage. With the Spinfire I am getting the best of both worlds: lightest ball machine of all 3 to lift in and out of the trunk at the court and only having to bring in the battery to charge.

Not being as 'established' a brand does not appear to have affected Spinfire at all in terms of quality, service, support, features or design. The reviews are pretty well uniform in their praise of the product.

Not everyone but I would say the vast majority of people see the benefits of internal oscillation and my conclusions after having used the machine a few times a week now for a few months are the total opposite of yours. However, given you do not appear to have used a machine with internal oscillation it might be a unfair for you reach your conclusion. I have used both the Spinfire and the Silent Partner. Even though you see a tennis player 'loading up for a shot' does the ball always go in the direction you expect it to based on your observation of the other player hitting? I highly doubt it. However, the orientation of an externally oscillating machine certainly does strongly suggest where the ball is going to go and for me I found that just a bit too easy.

you nail it to perfection about internal oscillation part...I had same points but people argue with you for no reason...you must try both before come to conclusion.

junior player can make out where lobster is going to throw next ball vs spinfire he has to be alert more for next one... money worth on that line for pro2

 

[unclenimrod]

Who said I haven't tried both? I certainly never did. There are other brands that use internal oscillation

 

[TorontoTennis]

You are right. There are other brands provide internal oscillation but the pickings are very slim. When I was looking for a machine with internal oscillation this is all I found:

Playmate Volley (& lesser-featured Half-Volley) - $1,999 - Slightly more expensive than the Spinfire Pro 2 but with far fewer features. A solid workhorse machine made of metal that is therefore typically seen at tennis clubs where it will get a lot of use. Being very bulky it is one of the least portable machines. The remote just has on/off while Spinfire's pretty well does everything you can do at the machine control panel.

Tennis Tutor Shotmaker - $3,499 (with remote) - Almost double the price of the Spinfire Pro 2. I haven't looked at it in detail but it better have a lot more programmability than the Spinfire Pro 2 at that price.

Supercoach V2 - $10,450 - At more than 5X the price of the Spinfire and Playmate Volley it is not a consideration for most. It sure better have a lot of features!

So, unless you want to spend a lot more money the Playmate is really the only contender. I didn't go with it because it was too bulky for me, not to mention even with the battery it is 6 lbs heavier than the Spinfire. Also, for that money I wanted more features than it has. So, for me the only option was the Spinfire Pro 2. They seem to have the market all to themselves for that price range and features.

Does anyone know of any other machines that provide internal oscillation? I suspect it's a bit more difficult to engineer which is why you don't see it as much. If it was easy to do I am sure other manufacturers would offer it. I couldn't live without it now.

 

[unclenimrod]

You are right. There are other brands provide internal oscillation but the pickings are very slim. When I was looking for a machine with internal oscillation this is all I found:

Playmate Volley (& lesser-featured Half-Volley) - $1,999 - Slightly more expensive than the Spinfire Pro 2 but with far fewer features. A solid workhorse machine made of metal that is therefore typically seen at tennis clubs where it will get a lot of use. Being very bulky it is one of the least portable machines. The remote just has on/off while Spinfire's pretty well does everything you can do at the machine control panel.

Tennis Tutor Shotmaker - $3,499 (with remote) - Almost double the price of the Spinfire Pro 2. I haven't looked at it in detail but it better have a lot more programmability than the Spinfire Pro 2 at that price.

Supercoach V2 - $10,450 - At more than 5X the price of the Spinfire and Playmate Volley it is not a consideration for most. It sure better have a lot of features!

So, unless you want to spend a lot more money the Playmate is really the only contender. I didn't go with it because it was too bulky for me, not to mention even with the battery it is 6 lbs heavier than the Spinfire. Also, for that money I wanted more features than it has. So, for me the only option was the Spinfire Pro 2. They seem to have the market all to themselves for that price range and features.

Does anyone know of any other machines that provide internal oscillation? I suspect it's a bit more difficult to engineer which is why you don't see it as much. If it was easy to do I am sure other manufacturers would offer it. I couldn't live without it now.

Thanks for all the research but I simply meant I have played on internal oscillation machines before. You can rent them at clubs. It was different and certainly challenging, but if you've been on court with a fast feed rate on a high powered machine you get a heck of a workout and you don't have the frustration of the machine throwing ten percent of the balls completely out of range out of nowhere. If you've got the feed rate and speed set to low I could see the benefits tho. I hope spinfire is paying you well.

 

[TorontoTennis]

Thanks for all the research but I simply meant I have played on internal oscillation machines before. You can rent them at clubs. It was different and certainly challenging, but if you've been on court with a fast feed rate on a high powered machine you get a heck of a workout and you don't have the frustration of the machine throwing ten percent of the balls completely out of range out of nowhere. If you've got the feed rate and speed set to low I could see the benefits tho. I hope spinfire is paying you well.

 

[TorontoTennis]

The Spinfire does not throw balls out of range.at all. At least mine does not.

 

[dangros]

It appears to me that Silent Partner's retail prices mean nothing as they are perpetually on sale. However it does give the casual buyer the impression they are currently getting a deal.

Or gives the sucker that bought a used machine for only a few bucks off the feeling they got ripped off.

 

[dak95_00]

Internal oscillation??? I take this to mean that the entire machine doesn't move and the balls are being thrown at random.

Find me an opponent that does this! They don't. Your opponents are predictable as long as you keep the ball deep in the court with pace. It's when you hit a weak shot in the service box that your opponent should pounce and put the ball away against you in no more than two more shots.

I'm a long time ball machine owner and I've always hated the oddity of having the ball always coming back from the middle of the court no matter where I placed the previous shot. Anyone who's using a ball machine as a player simulation IS DOING IT WRONG! There's no such thing unless it moves back and forth like a real player.

 

[TorontoTennis]

Internal oscillation??? I take this to mean that the entire machine doesn't move and the balls are being thrown at random.

Find me an opponent that does this! They don't. Your opponents are predictable as long as you keep the ball deep in the court with pace. It's when you hit a weak shot in the service box that your opponent should pounce and put the ball away against you in no more than two more shots.

I'm a long time ball machine owner and I've always hated the oddity of having the ball always coming back from the middle of the court no matter where I placed the previous shot. Anyone who's using a ball machine as a player simulation IS DOING IT WRONG! There's no such thing unless it moves back and forth like a real player.

I totally disagree with you. Having the entire machine turn defeats the whole purpose. You have the best of both world's with the Spinfire because you can set the machine so you know where the ball is going or so you don't. If I want to know where the ball is going then I turn on single line or 2-line drill on my Spinfire and the latter has narrow medium and wide settings with and without vertical oscillation. Apparently Spinfire's sales are going through the roof because of the internal oscillation feature and some other stuff they have that Lobster doesn't. I guess people vote with their wallet. Yeah, call me a Spinfire fanboy if you want but I'm not the only one. Read some of the reviews.