The best backhand ever?

hoodjem

hoodjem

G.O.A.T.
Lendl did have a very versatile backhand (topspin point-ender, skidding slice, chip, flat power drive, even a lob), also with lots of pace when he wanted it, and very high consistency.

1. Laver
2. Rosewall
3. Connors
4. Budge
5. Nalbandian
6. Edberg
7. Agassi
8. Lendl
9. Borg
10. Lacoste
11 Kuerten
12. Nadal
13. Ashe
14. Safin
15. Vilas
16. Kovacs
17. Rios
18. Mancini
19. Mecir
20. Tilden
21. Kodes
22. Wilander
23. Kafelnikov
24. Orantes
25. Korda
26. Stich
27. Becker
28. Gasquet
29. Federer
30. Almagro
 
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pc1

pc1

G.O.A.T.
hoodjem said:
You'll have to help me out here. Hoad was a titanic player, but I've never heard any thing special or particular about his backhand.
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Hoodjem,

From what I understand Hoad's backhand could be very erratic. He could hit winners from all over the place but he could miss the easiest shot. His forehand was considered the stronger side.

I've never seen Hoad's backhand on lists of greatest backhands.

Of the two Magic Twins (Rosewall and Hoad) Rosewall was considered to have clearly the better backhand.

Laver tried to model his backhand after Hoad but he made some changes to it and developed a much more consistent backhand than Hoad. Hoad was the one guy however who could hit with the same versatility as Laver on the backhand side and that's saying a lot.
 
pc1

pc1

G.O.A.T.
I think, while Hoad's backhand may have been as spectacular as anyone's, it was too prone for errors to rank with the all time great backhands. That was the Hoad style. I understand that his reflexes were so good he could take Pancho Gonzalez's first serve off backhand and forehand inside the baseline and put it away when he was "on" his game.
 
L

Limpinhitter

G.O.A.T.
pc1 said:
Hoodjem,

From what I understand Hoad's backhand could be very erratic. He could hit winners from all over the place but he could miss the easiest shot. His forehand was considered the stronger side.

I've never seen Hoad's backhand on lists of greatest backhands.

Of the two Magic Twins (Rosewall and Hoad) Rosewall was considered to have clearly the better backhand.

Laver tried to model his backhand after Hoad but he made some changes to it and developed a much more consistent backhand than Hoad. Hoad was the one guy however who could hit with the same versatility as Laver on the backhand side and that's saying a lot.
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Just the opposite. Hoad was Laver's idol. Like many of his era, Hoad's backhand was his stronger side and was a lethal weapon. His heavy topspin, continental, wrist flick forehand (that Laver copied), coul be a bit erratic by comparison, as was Laver's.
 
P

President of Serve/Volley

Semi-Pro
pjonesy said:
I think Agassi's 2HBH crosscourt is the best in history. He could take the ball earlier and handle pace easily. Down the line, they are about even. Nalbandian hits the 2 hander on the run better than Agassi.
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Yes, I agree aobut on the run, Andre is step back, but not much.


Andre's backhand was a lovely stroke to watch.
 
P

pjonesy

Professional
dak95_00 said:
I liked Courier's BH. He was #1 for awhile and he would move around his forehand to smash that 2hbh.
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I think he gets a lot of criticism because his grip was so far over (frying pan grip). It was very effective and he hit some great spin and sharp angles with his backhand. Courier also held the ball pretty well off that side.
 
D

Datacipher

Banned
pjonesy said:
I think Agassi's 2HBH crosscourt is the best in history. He could take the ball earlier and handle pace easily. Down the line, they are about even. Nalbandian hits the 2 hander on the run better than Agassi.
Click to expand...

He certainly does compared to older Andre...the young Andre could really do some amazing things on the run though.....so much quicker then....he'd fly over the BH side, and RIP the 2 hander
 
pc1

pc1

G.O.A.T.
Limpinhitter said:
Just the opposite. Hoad was Laver's idol. Like many of his era, Hoad's backhand was his stronger side and was a lethal weapon. His heavy topspin, continental, wrist flick forehand (that Laver copied), coul be a bit erratic by comparison, as was Laver's.
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With all due respect I disagree. I will preface this by writing that I never saw Hoad in person and I have only seen him in numerous videos. However I have read in a number of accounts that Hoad's steadier side and stronger side was his forehand. However that's besides the point because I don't think his backhand is among the greatest.

Rosewall, in his description of Hoad's game hints that Hoad's forehand was the better side-"His forehand was always good and as he grew in confidence and experience his backhand became almost better."

Here's description from Ellsworth Vines' excellent book "Tennis Myth and Method." Overwhelming, sometimes erratic court dynamo, whose career was cut short by back injury. Uses Australian grip on all shots. Crushing first serve. Wrist of steel lets him hit shots beyond the capacity of the normal human being. Forehand steadiest side, but backhand equally severe. Amazing strength, acceleration, and moves. Rarely varies pace and gives to lapses of concentration."

Here's a quote from Kramer's book "The Game." Hoad had the loosest game of any good kid I ever saw. There was absolutely no pattern to his game. I'd marvel at the shots he could think of. He was the only player I ever saw who could stand six or seven feet behind the baseline and snap the ball back hard, crosscourt. He'd try for winners off everything, off great serves off tricky short ball, off low volleys. He hit hard overspin drives, and there was no way you could ever get him to temporize on important points. Segura went crazy just trying to get him to lob a little more."

I never see Hoad's backhand or forehand among those discussed by experts as among the greatest strokes and I think the reason is clear. While Hoad could do virtually anything with either shot, he was just too erratic on both sides for either groundstroke to be ranked with the best ever.

He had too loose a game although he did tighten it up somewhat in the Pros.

However I do think it's possible that you could say that Hoad's backhand or forehand, when he was on his game may have been the most dangerous groundstrokes in history.
 
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P

pjonesy

Professional
Datacipher said:
He certainly does compared to older Andre...the young Andre could really do some amazing things on the run though.....so much quicker then....he'd fly over the BH side, and RIP the 2 hander
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Yeah, Andre was very quick in those days. I never thought he was one of the fastest (from point A to point B) guys on the tour. However, he had quick feet and hands and could get set quickly to hit the ball.
 
CyBorg

CyBorg

Legend
drakulie said:
Oh brother. Hoad and Rosewall again? :roll: Guys who were supposedly hitting 80+ mph slices?? LMAO
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iwish.png
 
B

bluetrain4

G.O.A.T.
Nellie said:
Too bad he had the worst forehand ever (and I am a big Edberg fan)
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I'd say worst looking, but not worst. Not a huge weapon, but he knew its limitations and knew how to use it to set up the rest of his game. It wasn't a huge weakness.
 
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hoodjem

hoodjem

G.O.A.T.
Edberg's FH was kind of odd-looking, but it was an adequate shot more than a definite liability or a weakness.

The rest of his game made it okay, IMO.
 
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thejuice

thejuice

Hall of Fame
I didn't read through every page but I only saw comments about the male competitors. What about the ladies?

Gabby Sabatini had a beautiful 1hbh.

Fed and Edberg have the nicest of the men IMO.

Agassi had the nicest 2hbh.
 
The-Champ

The-Champ

Legend
thejuice said:
I didn't read through every page but I only saw comments about the male competitors. What about the ladies?

Gabby Sabatini had a beautiful 1hbh.

Fed and Edberg have the nicest of the men IMO.

Agassi had the nicest 2hbh.
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Federer has a great one-handed backhand but, IMO both Stich and Becker had superior 1 handed backhand to Edberg's. Kuerten's one-hander is probably superior to anyone's. I grew up watching Edberg, but never felt his bh was imposing. Maybe, its greatness was clouded by him always camping at the net.
 
pc1

pc1

G.O.A.T.
The-Champ said:
Federer has a great one-handed backhand but, IMO both Stich and Becker had superior 1 handed backhand to Edberg's. Kuerten's one-hander is probably superior to anyone's. I grew up watching Edberg, but never felt his bh was imposing. Maybe, its greatness was clouded by him always camping at the net.
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Edberg's backhand to me was almost boringly terrific. It was very efficient, he would easily pass with it and rally from the baseline and it was a great approach shot. It definitely didn't seem as spectacular as Kuerten's backhand on clay.

His backhand was like Edberg in general, smooth and efficient, with the possible exception of his forehand.
 
abmk

abmk

Bionic Poster
The-Champ said:
Federer has a great one-handed backhand but, IMO both Stich and Becker had superior 1 handed backhand to Edberg's. Kuerten's one-hander is probably superior to anyone's. I grew up watching Edberg, but never felt his bh was imposing. Maybe, its greatness was clouded by him always camping at the net.
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becker himself said edberg had a better 1-H BH than him ... edberg also had a better 1-H BH than stich IMO ...

kuerten's BH was terrific on clay ( the best 1-H BH on clay ) , but on faster surfaces , it wasn't that good
 
L

Limpinhitter

G.O.A.T.
thejuice said:
I didn't read through every page but I only saw comments about the male competitors. What about the ladies?

Gabby Sabatini had a beautiful 1hbh.

Fed and Edberg have the nicest of the men IMO.

Agassi had the nicest 2hbh.
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Maria Bueno, Margaret Court, BJK, and Evonne Goolagong all had beautiful and effective 1hb's. But, Chris Evert's 2h'er was better than any of theirs. JMHO, of course!
 
S

SusanDK

Semi-Pro
thejuice said:
I didn't read through every page but I only saw comments about the male competitors. What about the ladies?

Gabby Sabatini had a beautiful 1hbh.
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Catarina Lindqvist also had a beautiful 1hbh. I remember being amused that most of the Swedish men at the time (except Edberg, of course) used 2hbh, but that the top female player used a 1hbh. I wish I could find a clip of her on youtube, but can't.

I have a DVD somewhere from a men's match in the 80's (either USO or Wimbledon) where they cut to another court - as was so irritatingly usual of the US television stations at that time - where Catarina is playing Martina, I think, and hits that fantastic backhand.
 
TJfederer16

TJfederer16

Hall of Fame
The best 2hbh i have ever seen is Nalbandian's and Safin's, the best 1hbh i have ever seen is probably gasquet's, Fed has the best slice i have ever seen and most beautiful 1hbh.
 
kiki

kiki

Banned
pc1 said:
Hoodjem,

No doubt Budge had a great backhand but I've read he was often aced on the service return which means to me that while he hit a lot of winners on the return, he paid for it. The other thing was that I heard he couldn't chip the ball well on the backhand at all and the means to me a lack of touch. That's a couple of negatives to me that I don't feel Rosewall and Laver had.

I read some people stating that Rosewall's backhand was semi-flat and they indicate he couldn't do what some backhands could do. I've seen a lot of Rosewall in person and on video and trust me when I say that the man was almost never aced and almost always got his racket on the ball to return it. Dennis Ralston wrote an article on the service return and he stated that at the time he wrote the article that Rosewall had not missed a backhand return of serve in two weeks. That's astounding!

Rosewall generally hit the ball back low against serve and volleyers but he could also drive the ball back with great power passing the volleyer. He could hit sharp angles plus he had a great lob on the backhand side. He also had an excellent drop shot on the backhand side and it was one of the most consistent backhands ever, along with Borg.

There was really nothing Rosewall didn't have an answer to on the backhand side. I read he could hit topspin in practice but why do it if you already have a backhand that has the answer to all situations.

Arthur Ashe ranked Rosewall's and Laver's backhand as the best he had ever seen. He wrote this in the late 1979's when Borg and Connors were in their prime. It's not as if Ashe didn't respect Borg and Connors at that point. Ashe wrote at that point that he felt Borg was the GOAT and yet he still ranked Rosewall's and Laver's backhand the best he had ever seen.
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of all bachand strokes I´ve seen, Laver had the most complete and versatile, but Connors and Agassi the most flashier.

of all backhand strokes that I ´ve listened to, Rosewall produced the nicest music, a beautiful, flawless flop.watching ken´s backhand is wonderful, but listening to it, is just heaven.
 
kiki

kiki

Banned
hoodjem said:
Latest version:

1. Connors
2. Rosewall
3. Laver
4. Budge
5. Edberg
6. Agassi
7. Kuerten
8. Borg
9. Lendl
10. Vilas
11. Rios
12. Becker
13. Lacoste
14. Ashe
15. Nalbandian
16. Kovacs
17. Mancini
18. Safin
19. Mecir
20. Kodes
21. Gasquet
22. Haas
23. Nadal
Click to expand...

I agree, a good list but I also mention Orantes, a super classy player at the mid 70´s and even if not his best shot, Mc Enroe was very versatile and complete stroke
 
kiki

kiki

Banned
pc1 said:
Here's is a quote from Marty Riessen's book "Match Point" on Rosewall's backhand--"If you are looking for perfection in tennis, watch how many times Rosewall clears the net by no more than an inch off his backhand. He keeps the ball lower and hits closer to the line in a higher percentage of shots than any other player I have seen, and that is as near perfection as one is going to get on a tennis court."
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To master a shot like that you must be a genious.I ve seen Rosewall over 45 years and still dashed every opponent with that cloutch, low, fast sliced stroke.it seemed to me the easiest thing to do but only Muscless did it
 
L

Limpinhitter

G.O.A.T.
kiki said:
To master a shot like that you must be a genious.I ve seen Rosewall over 45 years and still dashed every opponent with that cloutch, low, fast sliced stroke.it seemed to me the easiest thing to do but only Muscless did it
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IMO, a lot of players could do it. For example, Laver, Emerson and Roche had amazing slice and topspin backhands. But, no one ever hit the drive-slice with the power, consistency and pin-point accuracy that Rosewall did. I've also read that Rosewall was a natural lefty. Imagine that!
 
drakulie

drakulie

Talk Tennis Guru
I've read that Rosweall hit 80+ mph slice backhands, Tilden could hit 163 mph serves, and Gonzales 100 mph groundies. :shock:

and they say the powerful equipment today has ruined the game. :roll:
 
L

Limpinhitter

G.O.A.T.
drakulie said:
I've read that Rosweall hit 80+ mph slice backhands, Tilden could hit 163 mph serves, and Gonzales 100 mph groundies. :shock:

and they say the powerful equipment today has ruined the game. :roll:
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Schmukulie has over 20,000 posts! At an average of 2 minutes per post, that's 667 hours. The average work year is 2,000 hours. That means that Scmukulie has spent the equivalent of a full time job for 1/3 of a year posting messages on TT.
 
Blk&Gld

Blk&Gld

New User
drakulie, the speeds you are listing are subjective estimates not objective results. Radar guns are a relatively new phenomena with usage starting in the early 80's.
 
drakulie

drakulie

Talk Tennis Guru
Blk&Gld said:
drakulie, the speeds you are listing are subjective estimates not objective results. Radar guns are a relatively new phenomena with usage starting in the early 80's.
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yeah but I'm really excited to see an 80+ mph slice backhand. aren't you??
 
drakulie

drakulie

Talk Tennis Guru
Limpinhitter said:
Schmukulie has over 20,000 posts! At an average of 2 minutes per post, that's 667 hours. The average work year is 2,000 hours. That means that Scmukulie has spent the equivalent of a full time job for 1/3 of a year posting messages on TT.
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you average over 15 posts a day. I average less than 9 a day.

do the math, and while you are at it, could you please share with us a video of Rosewall hitting 80+mph slice backhands? PLEASE!!!!!????
 
D

dmt

Hall of Fame
Agassi for the men, Safin a close second for me. Its hard to pick between them, both had fantastic BH.

I am not sure though of who has/had the best single handed one.
 
Y

ywk999

Rookie
I don't really know who had the best backhand ever. But I think Stefan Edberg is a top candidate at least in the one-handed category. Edberg was ranked no. 1 in both singles and doubles, and won 6 grand slam singles titles and 3 grand slam doubles titles.

In this category, I think we are looking for the most reliable, adaptable, versatile and effective shot, and thus you are should be graded on all aspects from that side (e.g., offense, defense, transition, fast, slow, power, touch, finesse, mechanic, strength, coordination, timing, power, control, balance, variation, spin, penetration, angle, bounce, accuracy, topspin, slice, flat, drop, block, lob, rally, return, reliability, execution, big point, etc.). It should've been through pressure cookers and wringers, and against the best from the other side of the net, and still come out intact. So one-dimensionals or go-for-brokes or flashs-in-the-pan or wannabes need not apply.

Here are some videos of Stefan Edberg hitting his backhands starting from his early career. His backhand did get better and more reliable along with his career progression. But this shows he already had all the shots from the beginning.

Stefan Edberg Backhand Series
Part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zpZnZlXWxQw
Part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OD6k2kpkKZQ
Part 3 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qoDFcHnWZR0
Part 4 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXB4msX1oYo
Part 5 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wug_MvShZ94
Part 6 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8u2gfExT3Vk
Part 7 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POj7i0ngs2w
Part 8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RO-2GlceRO8
 
S

SusanDK

Semi-Pro
ywk999 said:
I don't really know who had the best backhand ever. But I think Stefan Edberg is a top candidate at least in the one-handed category.
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Absolutely agree with you.

ywk999 said:
Here are some videos of Stefan Edberg hitting his backhands starting from his early career.
Click to expand...

Is that your youtube channel by any chance? (If so, good one - but what happened to the '87 USO doubles final that was posted a couple of weeks ago - it seems to have disappeared?)
 
basil J

basil J

Hall of Fame
My favorites for a 1HBH in no particular order:
Andrei Pavel
Tommy Haas
Alex Coretta
Guga Kuerten
Edberg
Gaudio
All solid and effortless 1 handers.
 
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