rofl_copter3
Professional
Ferrer is more likely to win one that raonic... Honestly raonic will have the same problems Isner faces unless he learns to play some defense and increase his ground stroke consistancy
Raonic, clearly the next guy to break through and win a slam.
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Clarky21
Banned
If he's going to do it he's going to have to beat Fed and Cvac,and I just do not see that happening right now,especially when it comes to beating Cvac. He is also going to have to prove he can beat the top 3 in a slam,which is a lot more difficult to do than beating them in best of 3. Those guys are going to be his biggest obstacles. He has the ability to beat everyone else.
Sid_Vicious
G.O.A.T.
Tomic needs to get his head in the game. He is almost 2 years younger than Raonic yet he has managed to reach the QFs of a slam unlike Raonic. I was impressed at how nicely he was getting under Djokovic's skin during the 2011 Wimbledon QF, since then he has been mugging it up.
Smasher08
Legend
Um, has he even played Gumby yet? As for his h2h with Fed, it's nothing to be sneezed at when you consider the fact that he's been taking sets off of FedEx.
In any event, Gumby has declined half a notch from the player he was in 2011. Federer is deservedly the world #1, but hangs on to it by a whisker. Nadal's knees may never recover sufficiently to let him play like he did even just four months ago.
The Big 4 won't be around forever, and the Canadian Cannon sure seems to have a lot of upside.
Tomic has a strange style. He is a junkballer who is slow around the court. His forehand can create no spin, which is why Roddick was easily approaching that side with slice approaches.
His only chance to really break through would be to get a good serve and be super aggressive.
winstonplum
Hall of Fame
No one breaks through until they become spectacular movers like the top four. And Raonic has to shrink about three inches, because that extra height, while helping his serve, hurts his movement.
Rozroz
G.O.A.T.
syc23
Professional
Murray didn't get spanked. He gave it away.
Slamray just wanted more time to prepare for Shanghai. The Scot's focus is on slams nowadays anyway. If the servebot plays Murray again in any slams, the result will be the same as the one at USO.
I can still taste the sweet taste of that bagel
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
Murray didn't get spanked. He gave it away.
Slamray just wanted more time to prepare for Shanghai. The Scot's focus is on slams nowadays anyway. If the servebot plays Murray again in any slams, the result will be the same as the one at USO.
I can still taste the sweet taste of that bagel
I think that Murray ups his level a notch in majors these days (just compare his results to the Masters) but Raonic's win yesterday was 100 % legit. I don't think a guy can give a match away and scream his lungs out in anguish after easy misses if he doesn't care. He wanted to win that match but Raonic just took it to him.
syc23
Professional
The win is legit but he utterly fail to back it up the next match.
With Lendl around in slams, you'll see the same Andy back to how he was at USO. Plus, energy wouldn't be wasted playing doubles in slams so Raonic will not be so lucky facing a 100% Murray (with a sore back) next time.
Raonic's previous two matches showed significant progress, but today's have shown that he's still got a way to go.
Murray did want to win yesterday, and he played well for a lot of it, but he wasn't super-focused, and he was the much more tired player, so the victory needs to be kept in context. Impressive, and a nice feather in his cap, but not the trumpet of a new dawn.
Today, Raonic was the more tired player, and he struggled. If he is to become a regular in the quarters, semis and finals of big competitions, he's going to be this tired a lot more often.
Nevertheless, none of his immediate peers are looking like obvious slam winners, and someone is going to have to win them. In a few years time, Federer will be retired, and possibly Nadal too, so it will be down to whether or not Djokovic and Murray can maintain their own levels and enthusiasm against the challengers.
Raonic is still in good stead to be the "next guy" to break through, but I think it will be another two or three years before he can become s a serious challenger.
Murray did want to win yesterday, and he played well for a lot of it, but he wasn't super-focused, and he was the much more tired player, so the victory needs to be kept in context. Impressive, and a nice feather in his cap, but not the trumpet of a new dawn.
Today, Raonic was the more tired player, and he struggled. If he is to become a regular in the quarters, semis and finals of big competitions, he's going to be this tired a lot more often.
Nevertheless, none of his immediate peers are looking like obvious slam winners, and someone is going to have to win them. In a few years time, Federer will be retired, and possibly Nadal too, so it will be down to whether or not Djokovic and Murray can maintain their own levels and enthusiasm against the challengers.
Raonic is still in good stead to be the "next guy" to break through, but I think it will be another two or three years before he can become s a serious challenger.
batz
G.O.A.T.
What a great post- agree 100% with your analysis.
batz
G.O.A.T.
Murray said yesterday that Mr Lendl will next make an appearance 'the week before the WTF'. I found it revealing that he used these words rather than saying he would be back for Paris.
Russeljones
Talk Tennis Guru
What was Murray tired from?
syc23
Professional
I think he should skip Paris (e.g tank early) after Shanghai and focus on WTF. I know he's not played enough matches on the tour yet to be given the option to skip a Masters but he should focus on giving a real go at defending Shanghai then focus all of his efforts to make sure he doesn't burn out before London.
batz
G.O.A.T.
He was playing dubs this week - played until after 7pm on Friday night after playing Stan in the morning. Semi started at 1200 the next day. I dare say there is also some residual tiredness/general fatigue that all the guys who have played a lot of matches feel.
Not an excuse for losing though - big fella won fair and square. Same as Kei did today - but I'm pretty sure yesterday's events would have had some bearing on the outcome of the 3rd set today.
batz
G.O.A.T.
Agree completely. I said a couple of weeks ago that you can expect Murray to have a 'back/fatigue problem' that will see him have to pull out of Paris after playing Basel.
Anyhoo - we seem to have hijacked a Milos thread. Apologies.
Excuses. :lol:
Russeljones
Talk Tennis Guru
I thought that sucking outside the Slams during most of the year afforded Murray a lot of rest. But I'll take your point about the doubles, it's admirable that he's so engaged.
batz
G.O.A.T.
Yep. The BH UE on match point 2 was a bit of a head scratcher. Them's the breaks though - you can' win them all (unless it's 2011 and your name is Novak).
tennis_pro
Bionic Poster
You sound very bitter. Maybe because it took it 6-3 6-7 7-6 to beat Murray (saving 2 match point as well as saving match points in the previous round) Raonic was drained mentally for his next match? How many times you see someone upset one of the top 4 and lose their next match? That's not utter fail. The definition of utter fail is when you lose 6-0 6-0 6-0 to Donald Young at the French Open, not when you go down to an on-fire Nishikori in the final of the Japan Open in 3 sets.
And not the excuses again. A sore back my a**. I've seen Murray hold his back numerous times after he loses a point (usually when he's getting owned like in the 2010 AO final). I guess that's natural for him to look for excuses.
:? Remember when he lost 2 tiebreaks to Federer in one match alone? :lol:
Unless this is some weird attempt to be cute.
He had 2 matchpoints on Raonic's serve.
How the hell is losing a point on Raonic's serve a sign of mental weakness.
Sometimes I wonder if the people here are thinking straight.
Carsomyr
Legend
Carsomyr
Legend
The GS fate of a 21 year old rests on the final of a 500 event?
The Bawss
Banned
Well, Kei has won a 500 event. How many 500s has clownic won? How about slam QFs? Come on, the guy is 6ft5 of pure joke.
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Russeljones
Talk Tennis Guru
President
Legend
LOL Raonic has the serve but Nishikori is better in every other area of the game. Great return of serve and overall amazing baseline game. He should be top 10 pretty soon.
Marius_Hancu
Talk Tennis Guru
Just like in Barcelona? Choking
tacou
G.O.A.T.
it rested on a semi final win, why not a final loss?
Not really. I wasn't explaining away why he didn't win today, as I think Kei won fair and square with excellent tennis.
It's more a case of trying to gauge where he is with his overall game and what's getting in his way. Today's score to me makes it look like he ran out of gas, and people are saying that's because of a couple of tough three-setters. If he is to progress, he can't be worn out by a couple of tough three-setters in a 500.
If he is to get the wins to be a regular in the top ten he'll be playing more matches, and tougher matches. Everyone was getting excited that he was moving around the court more than ever before, but with improved court coverage comes increased energy expenditure.
In that respect, his fitness/stamina may be the next thing he has to work on if he hopes to play to his potential when he makes it to his next final.
I watched the match, he simply missed too many BHs and Nishikori was returning his serve like a boss. Not to mention his backhand and his passing shots.
syc23
Professional
64 64 62 USO baby
Murray won the important match between them this year. Anyway, Andy was playing with a dodgy back...on his worst surface.
What was Raonic's excuse when he was spanked in front of the world on AA?
I'm not sure Raonic will ever be a slam winner, but what I am certain about is that he isn't a "joke" or a "doofus". The guy is 15th in the world and was in the final of a 500 event that went 3 sets. Maybe we're all spoiled by the likes of Nadal and Federer and Djokovic but that is quite an accomplishment.
I don't get why this needs to get personal and childish. "Mugonic", "Clownic", really? Are we back in the second grade here?
That said, kudos to Kei Nishikori. Great win in front of the home crowd. I only caught the first set but he looked good. He has a bright future as well.
I don't get why this needs to get personal and childish. "Mugonic", "Clownic", really? Are we back in the second grade here?
That said, kudos to Kei Nishikori. Great win in front of the home crowd. I only caught the first set but he looked good. He has a bright future as well.
Marius_Hancu
Talk Tennis Guru
He was a lord, went to Murray and congratulated him. And smiled.
Compare with the poor, poor show Murray did in their last match.
And remember: it's 2-1, and the last was won by Raonic. He's beating him on all surfaces. Showing him who's boss.
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Fedex
Legend
Clarky21
Banned
Mainad
Bionic Poster
He'll need to beat him at the really big events ie. Slams and Masters before he can stake a claim to being 'his boss'.
He deserved his win against Murray yesterday but it has to be said that Murray probably should have won it. It is highly unusual for him to squander a 4-1 lead in the final set of a match and then miss a fairly straightforward backhand return on the second match point.
Nevertheless, he has re-established himself as one of only 4 top players to have a positive H2H v Murray (the others being Nadal,Djokovic and Berdych) and the only lesser ranked player to do so along with Berdych. Kudos to him for that.
batz
G.O.A.T.
I think Kohly is 'a top player' - he's certainly top 20. He also has a positive H2H with Murray.
cc0509
Talk Tennis Guru
Let's not get carried away. I am a Raonic fan but he has a long way to go to be the boss of Murray. He will have to beat Murray in a slam for it to really mean a lot. With that said it was a great win over Murray but then he went and blew it and lost the match to Nishikori to win the tournament. Raonic's problem is he can get a big win or two but then he can't go the distance and beat the next top guy to win the tournament. He is going to have to change that pattern if he wants to really get somewhere.
Mainad
Bionic Poster
Forgot about him. They only ever played the one match though didn't they?
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