Ball Height?-Topspin/Kick serve

[acer]

I have researched some postings here and on other websites and I find some conflicting information on what the height of a ball toss should be on a Topspin or Kick serve. Note: I am not talking about ball location, i.e. toss more over your head at 11:00 to get topspin, etc. I am talking about the ball toss height. I have read that on a flat serve that the ball toss should be tossed to the tip of your extended racquet and a few inches more so that the ball makes contact in the sweetspot. Now, to do a topspin/kick serve some say that the ball toss (granted tossed more over your head) should be lower than a normal flat serve. Again, I am talking ball height not placement i.e. overhead at 11:00 for ex. Other sites say the ball toss on a topspin and kick serve should be higher than a normal flat serve. Do anyone have any info on this? P.S. every tidbit I find on a slice serve says that the toss should be lower than a flat serve so I find no conflicting info here.

Thanks

Acer

 

[mucat]

It is not the toss, it is the contact point. For topspin serve in general, the contact point will be lower than your flat serve contact point. The reason is, if you are hit the ball at full extension, it will be impossible to brush up at the ball and apply topspin (the same reason it is hard to hit a topspin groundies at high balls). So you have to lower the contact point to allow the brush up action to apply topspin to the ball.

 

[acer]

Hi Mucat, thanks for your reply. That makes sense to me. I guess you can toss the ball higher as long as the contact point is lower (and in the correct position for the serve you want,i.e. topspin serve, over your head, etc) so you can brush up to get that spin.

I was reading on a tennis instruction site that said that Topspin serves require a slightly higher toss that makes the contact point directly above the player’s head and that Kick serves need a toss that is very similar to the topspin serve, but the contact point needs to be more behind the player’s head (this will force a back arching). So I understand where contact should be, it was just at what height.

Interestingly, another site said that a higher ball toss will help generate more spin as the ball is travelling quicker as the ball drops and gains velocity. Thus you can generate more a opposing force that generates more spin. Again, I just wasn't sure at what height the ball should be contacted at.

At any rate, thanks Mucat.

Acer

 

[LuckyR]

The contact is one issue of course. The other is: how high above the contact point should the ball apex, because it would be the unusual service motion where you have gone through the entire motion when the ball passes the contact point on the way up. Most hit the ball passing back through the contact point on the way back down. This will be dictated by the speed of your motion.

 

[acer]

The contact is one issue of course. The other is: how high above the contact point should the ball apex, because it would be the unusual service motion where you have gone through the entire motion when the ball passes the contact point on the way up. Most hit the ball passing back through the contact point on the way back down. This will be dictated by the speed of your motion.

Yes, I guess I should have clarified my question. My question is how high the contact point should be on a Topspin/Kick serve. (I guess I was assuming higher toss/higher contact point in my initial question which obviously depends on the person I guess). Should the contact point be higher or lower on a Topspin/Kick serve than on a flat serve? Mucat's answer is lower, which makes sense to me.

Thanks

Acer

 

[LuckyR]

Oh, sorry I guess I read your OP too literally. The answer to your question is to do your motion w/o a ball and see where you prefer to bring your racquet head for each serve. Then toss the ball so it crosses that area. For most the kick will be lower, slices can be the same and twist serves are so slightly lower that it might look the same.

 

[ZPTennis]

I have researched some postings here and on other websites and I find some conflicting information on what the height of a ball toss should be on a Topspin or Kick serve. Note: I am not talking about ball location, i.e. toss more over your head at 11:00 to get topspin, etc. I am talking about the ball toss height. I have read that on a flat serve that the ball toss should be tossed to the tip of your extended racquet and a few inches more so that the ball makes contact in the sweetspot. Now, to do a topspin/kick serve some say that the ball toss (granted tossed more over your head) should be lower than a normal flat serve. Again, I am talking ball height not placement i.e. overhead at 11:00 for ex. Other sites say the ball toss on a topspin and kick serve should be higher than a normal flat serve. Do anyone have any info on this? P.S. every tidbit I find on a slice serve says that the toss should be lower than a flat serve so I find no conflicting info here.

Thanks

Acer

This is kind of a different way of explaining it but it might help.

I have a pretty decent kick serve and I would say that when I make contact with the ball, My arm is maybe around 120 degrees before full extension. So maybe you can use that info to figure out how high the ball toss should be for you. Hope this helps.

 

[acer]

This is kind of a different way of explaining it but it might help.

I have a pretty decent kick serve and I would say that when I make contact with the ball, My arm is maybe around 120 degrees before full extension. So maybe you can use that info to figure out how high the ball toss should be for you. Hope this helps.

Hi ZPTENNIS, thanks for your reply. I guess I am not a visual person as I can't picture what 120 degrees is before full extension. Am I correct in that with your arm fully extended it would be at 90 degrees (or perpendicular to the ground) thus 120 degrees would have just a slight bend?

 

[ZPTennis]

Hi ZPTENNIS, thanks for your reply. I guess I am not a visual person as I can't picture what 120 degrees is before full extension. Am I correct in that with your arm fully extended it would be at 90 degrees (or perpendicular to the ground) thus 120 degrees would have just a slight bend?

With your arm fully extended it would be 180 degrees. And your arm bent at at 90 degrees would have your elbow looking like this |_ . So its in between your arm being fully extended or a staight line and your arm being bend at a right angle. Im not talking about any relationship to the ground.

So your arm is something like this \_ <but rotate that line. I hope i didnt confuse you more. Im much better at explaining by demonstration.

Zach

 

[acer]

Thanks ZPTENNIS, your explanation was great. I understand what you mean. I will try this.

Thanks
Acer