Forehand advice

[Flavio]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEYoa...ature=youtu.be

Here's some video of me hitting, I'm in the white. I cut and edited it a lot to mainly show my forehand. My backhand was off that day but I'd prefer to just get advice on the forehand.

Last 30 seconds shows match points with the view of my forehands coming at you. Edited to make me look good...

 

[Flavio]

Bad link in fits post. Here it is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEYoaMTK_mw&feature=youtu.be

 

[LeeD]

Not bad.
Try to prep your shoulder turn earlier, then wait for the ball.
Don't stress your followthru so much, as you get off balance trying too hard to finish your followthru. You can start to relax just as you hit the ball, and think of RECOVERY after the moment of impact. This is not good advice for most of us who pull off the ball too early, but you're trying to add a followthru way after you've hit the ball. Keep your torso controlled, don't lean to the left to finish your followthru.

 

[TheCheese]

Yeah, not too bad.

Looks a lot like you're trying to model it after Djokovic's forehand. The one bit of advice I'd give is to make sure that you're still pronating your forearm at the end of your racket drop.


Do this:

Rather than this:

 

[Cheetah]

The swing is by far the least of the issues.
Footwork is the main problem.
And the left arm criss crossing your right arm.
Off balance. He almost falls over a few times.
No weight transfer.

 

[Flavio]

Haha, that's the main thing I noticed as well, I open my racquet too early. I tried to follow the popular saying of keeping a loose wrist, but that is causing me to open my racquet too early. Should I consciously close my racquet face more, or is it in the motion of the whole arm?

 

[LeeD]

You don't see yourself almost falling over to your left from your extended followthru?

 

[Cheetah]

Groundstrokes start from the ground. you have to have a stable base. fix your footwork. it has to be stable, not leaning over, falling down, hopping up, moving to the left or skipping.
then fix your left arm.

 

[Cheetah]

Haha, that's the main thing I noticed as well, I open my racquet too early. I tried to follow the popular saying of keeping a loose wrist, but that is causing me to open my racquet too early. Should I consciously close my racquet face more, or is it in the motion of the whole arm?

the arm motion is fine. fix the other stuff.

 

[LeeD]

Everything is fine FOR YOUR LEVEL OF PLAY.
To improve, the ball needs to go faster have more spin, better direction, and your movement needs a complete overhaul.

 

[Flavio]

I understand what you're saying, but we were hitting mostly rally balls at the beginning, so I wasn't aiming it anywhere but the middle. Also, I understand that footwork could be much improved, but I also tend to get tired early, so it's partly a stamina issue. And the reason I'd like to have a better arm motion too is so I ingrain good habits. But I completely understand how the footwork and earlier turn is what would yield the most immediate results.

 

[5263]

Groundstrokes start from the ground. you have to have a stable base. fix your footwork. it has to be stable, not leaning over, falling down, hopping up, moving to the left or skipping.
then fix your left arm.

Yes, I though he looked pretty good when he got some good position on the ball,
but often that was not the case.
Swinging the racket pretty good when you get there right.

 

[TheCheese]

Yeah, if you want to get to the next level the stroke and footwork is gonna need an overhaul.

 

[user92626]

Yeah, not too bad.

Looks a lot like you're trying to model it after Djokovic's forehand. The one bit of advice I'd give is to make sure that you're still pronating your forearm at the end of your racket drop.


Do this:

Rather than this:

Wow, these photos look cool. They're better as a learning tool than a thousand words.

However, i don't understand the significance that you point out about pronating. The white tshirt player has the racket face more open due to the grip, no?

 

[TheCheese]

Wow, these photos look cool. They're better as a learning tool than a thousand words.

However, i don't understand the significance that you point out about pronating. The white tshirt player has the racket face more open due to the grip, no?

No, it's actually due to less pronation of the forearm. Look at which way the top of their hands are facing. Djokovic also holds a pretty western grip, but the back of his hand is facing up and the girl's is facing down.

What ends up happening when you have less pronation at the bottom of the racket drop is that the racket opens up when you come through and you generate less topspin, or end up having to trade power for spin.

 

[NLBwell]

Fundamentally pretty bad.
All you motion and energy is going back and to the left (sometimes almost falling over). Try to stay with your weiight and energy moving into the ball at impact. Sometimes you are almost having to throw the racket at the ball, because your body is moving so quickly away from it at impact.
In baseball, that's called bailing out on the pitch.
Stand in there and hit the ball solidly, no matter what stance you are using at the time.

KEEP YOUR HEAD STILL!

 

[3fees]

Get to the Ball and do a unit turns to address and swing at the ball..

 

[Flavio]

Well I experimented with pronating all the way through the backswing, and it's a very different feeling now hitting the ball with a closed racquet face. I also felt more comfortable moving my hand down to a Djokovic/Nadal grip to do this. I feel it also helps address some balance issues as my arm structure had too much action in it with pronating early that I had to move back to gain time.

 

[netguy]

Pay attention to your left arm. It's all over the place. Try to connect it with your core....

 

[xFullCourtTenniSx]

Well I experimented with pronating all the way through the backswing, and it's a very different feeling now hitting the ball with a closed racquet face. I also felt more comfortable moving my hand down to a Djokovic/Nadal grip to do this. I feel it also helps address some balance issues as my arm structure had too much action in it with pronating early that I had to move back to gain time.

Everyone has stated what your issue is - footwork. Why are you ignoring everyone's advice and just doing what you want?

What is the point of posting the damn video for everyone to see when you just go off on your own analysis. When everyone is citing the exact same problem for your shots and you go off and ignore it, you're wasting EVERYONE'S time that was spent to help you.

Footwork. It needs a MASSIVE improvement. The shot itself has no massive flaws that need immediate attention. Improving the footwork will make any other issues more obvious and relevant. At this point, any decent, consistent player can 6-0 you off the basis that they will hit every shot cleanly and you will fall over or stretch to hit every one of your shots.

Always have both feet planted solid when you hit the ball, bend your knees, and have your weight centered (and if possible, move it into the ball as you hit). You're always jumping around or leaning to the side to compensate for your poor positioning.

 

[tennisboi007]

The swing is by far the least of the issues.
Footwork is the main problem.
And the left arm criss crossing your right arm.
Off balance. He almost falls over a few times.
No weight transfer.

Agree completely.

 

[Flavio]

Everyone has stated what your issue is - footwork. Why are you ignoring everyone's advice and just doing what you want?

What is the point of posting the damn video for everyone to see when you just go off on your own analysis. When everyone is citing the exact same problem for your shots and you go off and ignore it, you're wasting EVERYONE'S time that was spent to help you.

Footwork. It needs a MASSIVE improvement. The shot itself has no massive flaws that need immediate attention. Improving the footwork will make any other issues more obvious and relevant. At this point, any decent, consistent player can 6-0 you off the basis that they will hit every shot cleanly and you will fall over or stretch to hit every one of your shots.

Always have both feet planted solid when you hit the ball, bend your knees, and have your weight centered (and if possible, move it into the ball as you hit). You're always jumping around or leaning to the side to compensate for your poor positioning.

Relax. I didn't ignore what people said.

I don't know if it's apparent, but most balls I hit in this video were coming at me pretty deep, so I had to move to create some space. Obviously this should be done earlier and my unit turn as well.

 

[Cheetah]

It wasn't apparent because that's not what happened. Just watched it again. I counted 6 maybe 7 balls only that were deep.
The rest were short to very short so that means 95% of the balls in the video were short. Of the 6 or 7 deep balls they were all very very slow with a minimal amount of spin so you had more than plenty enough time to move into position but you didn't and were off balance. Even the short super slow balls where you eons of time you didn't position yourself properly.

Poor footwork and poor balance = poor hitting...
...even if your racquet path is better/prettier/faster/more biomechanically correct than Federer or Djokovic.

 

[KenC]

I think a lot of the footwork and other issues may stem from a lack of a solid foundation from which to build on. Tennis like you play is fine for having some fun on the court, but if you want to get better you need to start building a better athletic foundation. First, you are always standing up straight, you need to start lowering your core and keeping your quads constantly engaged. This usually means getting down about a foot from your normal height and leaning slightly forward onto the balls of your feet to keep your weight balanced. Then stay down, even when running. Second, split step every time your opponent hits the ball, this gets you prepared early to hunt down the ball no matter where it goes. Next, take controlled steps while running, usually the first step or two is long, but the steps shorten in length and accelerate in time as you approach the ball.

Once you have the proper foundation for groundstrokes, then you can start to work on form.

 

[Flavio]

Well another thing is that I don't attack short balls during practice rallies, they are mainly to groove my strokes from the back. So all the balls that I leaned for because they were short....I did not mean to hit them well, just to get them back. I.e. I was not trying on those short balls so maybe that's part of the confusion. In the game I obviously try to move up and attack every short ball.

 

[chico9166]

Bad link in fits post. Here it is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEYoaMTK_mw&feature=youtu.be

I disagree with most in that the footwork is the major culprit. Of course, a player could work the remainder of their life on improving their efficiency of movement. However, in two of the more critical aspects, alignment and redirection of momemtum,,,,you do a resonably good job with.

One of the more pressing problems is (and this maybe more conceptual) is your desire to lunge at the ball. Understand, you will not hit the ball any harder, or maximize spin momentum, when you lunge in the direction of your weight shift. In this case, (with an open stance) the weight shift is more lateral in nature. Can you see how, (on almost every ball) you tilt your spine in that direction? Can you see how that throws you off balance when you create dynamic rotation of the core? One of the basic tenents of rotational efficiency is what I call vertical stacking, which is simply shoulder over hip alignment i.e.Good posture......This will tremendously improve your balance, increase spin momentum, lead to better contact/swing path integrity, and speed up your recovery loops.

Also, as some have mentioned, the use of your left arm, is way off. As you take your final step out to the ball, (right foot) get that left arm straight, and across (parallel) to the baseline. Sweep it across, (in the direction of core rotation) and then tuck it....This movement increases angular momentum...Gone will be the days of your arms crossing...a big no no.

 

[Cheetah]

I disagree with most in that the footwork is the major culprit. Of course, a player could work the remainder of their life on improving their efficiency of movement. However, in two of the more critical aspects, alignment and redirection of momemtum,,,,you do a resonably good job with.

One of the more pressing problems is (and this maybe more conceptual) is your desire to lunge at the ball. Understand, you will not hit the ball any harder, or maximize spin momentum, when you lunge in the direction of your weight shift. In this case, (with an open stance) the weight shift is more lateral in nature. Can you see how, (on almost every ball) you tilt your spine in that direction? Can you see how that throws you off balance when you create dynamic rotation of the core? One of the basic tenents of rotational efficiency is what I call vertical stacking, which is simply shoulder over hip alignment i.e.Good posture......This will tremendously improve your balance, increase spin momentum, lead to better contact/swing path integrity, and speed up your recovery loops.

Also, as some have mentioned, the use of your left arm, is way off. As you take your final step out to the ball, (right foot) get that left arm straight, and across (parallel) to the baseline. Sweep it across, (in the direction of core rotation) and then tuck it....This movement increases angular momentum...Gone will be the days of your arms crossing...a big no no.

That's a lot whacky terms you used there.
Spin momentum is a term used in quantum mechanics / electromagnetic waves or particles.
momentum redirection is not what you do to a tennis ball. you impart your momentum into the ball. this momentum is added to the ball's momentum to give total momentum. you don't redirect the ball's momentum. redirecting momentum is something you do in martial arts for example or high jumping. an attacker comes at you with momentum - you side step and push/pull and redirect his momentum to a different direction.
dynamic rotation is rotation that constantly changes its angle/speed. not really applicable to tennis.
vertical stacking?
swing path integrity?
recovery loops?

I've never heard these terms applied to tennis.

 

[vil]

I disagree with most in that the footwork is the major culprit. Of course, a player could work the remainder of their life on improving their efficiency of movement. However, in two of the more critical aspects, alignment and redirection of momemtum,,,,you do a resonably good job with.

One of the more pressing problems is (and this maybe more conceptual) is your desire to lunge at the ball. Understand, you will not hit the ball any harder, or maximize spin momentum, when you lunge in the direction of your weight shift. In this case, (with an open stance) the weight shift is more lateral in nature. Can you see how, (on almost every ball) you tilt your spine in that direction? Can you see how that throws you off balance when you create dynamic rotation of the core? One of the basic tenents of rotational efficiency is what I call vertical stacking, which is simply shoulder over hip alignment i.e.Good posture......This will tremendously improve your balance, increase spin momentum, lead to better contact/swing path integrity, and speed up your recovery loops.

Also, as some have mentioned, the use of your left arm, is way off. As you take your final step out to the ball, (right foot) get that left arm straight, and across (parallel) to the baseline. Sweep it across, (in the direction of core rotation) and then tuck it....This movement increases angular momentum...Gone will be the days of your arms crossing...a big no no.

Are you from Big Bang Theory? :???:

 

[chico9166]

Are you from Big Bang Theory? :???:

I like that one Vil, that's a good one.

 

[TennisCJC]

I see 2 things that I hope will help you improve the forehand.

1. You need to use you left arm a lot more. Now, it dangles a lot and gets in the way. Pivot with 2 hands on the racket. When you take the left hand off to start the swing/loop; extend it out a bit parrellel to the baseline for balance, and when you rotate your body into contact; the left arm should pull in and tuck by you left side for balance.

2. You right hip and leg are over rotating causing you to lose balance. Load the right side before you start forward into the ball. Then rotate by pushing up with legs, rotating hips/shoulders and finally arm/racket into contact. It is OK for the back leg to come forward a bit but you don't want it to push your body through contact. I suggest you hit a few forehands from a semi-open statnce and pushing up and rotating only hips/shoulders/arm - push up and in off right leg and it will dislodge weight on it but the foot will land/stay in roughly the same place.

Go to youtube and watch Agassi forehands for example of good L hand and R side:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXWks8yvRJQ

Even when Agassi back leg comes forward to equal with his body, he leg stays back until the hip drags it forward. Try a few without pulling it forward at all to get the feel. Then you can have it move a bit forward but don't let the leg drag you body rather you hips pull the leg.

 

[watungga]

With this kind of prep, are you ready to put the racquet head OUT to the front with the same outstretched arm?

That's a world class Djokivic 2.0 stroke.

Yup... not easy...

 

[Cheetah]

Actually that is not a Djoko 2.0 stroke. That's a Djoko 1.0 stroke. He has since changed his prep to a better, more compact and more advanced form that gives him more spin and control. He doesn't swing that way anymore particularly the extended takeback.

 

[user92626]

June 09, 2011. Djokovic 2.0 yet?

See big difference???
.
.
.
.
.I can't tell

Wait, he bends his ankle, is that it?

 

[Cheetah]

There's quite a big difference between DJ 1.0 ad 2.0 strokes. If you can't see it then..

 

[Flavio]

Thanks for the advice. Aside from the one guy who took it upon him to call me rude....I definitely will try to focus on being centered and balanced on my groundstrokes. As I said some of the analysis may have been slightly skewed because I was not putting effort into many of the balls I had to run for...I was trying to focus on balls in the center. Not because I'm lazy, but because I have limited stamina and I didn't want to expend it before the game.

Also, it is a point of emphasis to close my racquet face in the forward swing and strike the ball with a closed face. I know this is not my main issue, but I want to establish correct form, especially on the arm motion, which is harder to unlearn. I have already seen substantial benefit being able to swing harder this way without worrying about so many balls sailing out.

Also, now that I changed to a more western grip, as it helps close the face, my backhand grip has changed with my right hand moving to a continental grip from its previous semi-western, as I realize how ridiculous it is now to hit with the right as a western. I feel this correct BH grip makes my stroke more fluid and less restricted in motion.

Perhaps I will upload some more in the future, thanks again.

 

[xFullCourtTenniSx]

I don't know if it's apparent, but most balls I hit in this video were coming at me pretty deep, so I had to move to create some space. Obviously this should be done earlier and my unit turn as well.

No. It's not apparent. Because like someone else said, only 6 or 7 balls can be defined as deep.

Work on your footwork, and you'll start hitting those "deep" balls for winners or approach shots because they were far from deep.

 

[rkelley]

The footwork is the first thing I noticed. Footwork is one of those things that's easy to see is wrong when you're watching someone else and seems like it should be easily correctable, but it's not really. The thing about good footwork is that you have to know where you want to get to and how you want to be set-up when you get there. This is not a trivial task considering that the ball is moving, spinning, bouncing. and you can move to a whole range of locations to hit it.

Know where your ideal contact point is. Know how you want to be balanced when you're going to hit the ball. Work to get yourself set-up so that those two things are correct. You'll help yourself a bunch. It's not easy. Go hit a couple of hundred balls against the wall and count how many of them you hit that are truly perfect in terms of your set-up.