Guess how much my emergency appendectomy cost? *invoice*

How much was my emergency appendectomy?

  • $14,826

  • $28,826

  • $44,826

  • Slightly less than the new Wilson Clash

Results are only viewable after voting.
norcal

norcal

Legend
Just got the invoice, surgery was in October.

facts: after being in pain all morning went to urgent care. they told me to go to emergency (no ambulance; they offered).

admitted to emergency late afternoon, mri showed bogus appendix, then surgery.

released the next day noon-ish.

How much do you think it cost me (well my insurance thank god)?

Vote BEFORE you click spoiler or I'll kick you in the appendix!

32279776427_6fd8746fcb_c.jpg
 
C

Chadalina

Guest
Got it right without cheating. Hope your feeling better, someone has to cover the slackers who dont pay :(

Medical and education systems need to be put in check, id like to see their rates on a bar graph and compare it to other stuff. They are gouging
 
Tshooter

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
I got it right.

We have a very messed up medical system. I hope you live in a state which prohibits balance billing which should obviously be illegal everywhere but isn’t because it sounds “socialist.” Anytime you can’t scr$w people it’s “socialist.”

I hope it all worked out well for you.
 
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C

Chadalina

Guest
[QUOTE="Tshooter, post: 13153354, member: 24172"
We have a very messed up medical system. I hope you live in a state which prohibits balance billing which should obviously be illegal everywhere but isn’t because it sounds “socialist.” Anytime you can’t scr$w people it’s “socialist.”

I hope it all worked out well for you.[/QUOTE]

Edit your post, he made it a spoiler for a reason...
 
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movdqa

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
hollywood9826 said:
Went middle just beciase 45k sounded high.

What state?

Chadlina that graph you speak of probably looks like the price is right hill climber yodeling guy expect itll never fall off.
Click to expand...

Assuming Cali given the username.

I had a look at exchange plans in NY vs NH. Insurance is 50% higher in NY ($36K vs $24K). Costs can vary widely by state.

Those are small numbers compared to cancer treatment.
 
GeoffHYL

GeoffHYL

Professional
Just for another data point, 18 years ago I had a ruptured appendix, wasn't diagnosed for 5 days due to various reasons, spent a total of 10 days in the hospital. My total bill was in the $25K range, which included a night in the ICU (yes, this was no ordinary appendicitis). I had to pay my deductible, somewhere in the $1,000 range if I remember correctly. Hate to think of what this would cost now. Probably 5 times as much.
 
Nostradamus

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
norcal said:
Just got the invoice, surgery was in October.

facts: after being in pain all morning went to urgent care. they told me to go to emergency (no ambulance; they offered).

admitted to emergency late afternoon, mri showed bogus appendix, then surgery.

released the next day noon-ish.

How much do you think it cost me (well my insurance thank god)?

Vote BEFORE you click spoiler or I'll kick you in the appendix!

32279776427_6fd8746fcb_c.jpg
Click to expand...
Flu Vaccine just cost you $314 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is so ripoff. Did you ask for it ?? if not you go tell them, you didn't ask for it and you want your money back. Flu vaccine you can get that FREE in some clinics.
 
movdqa

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Nostradamus said:
Flu Vaccine just cost you $314 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is so ripoff. Did you ask for it ?? if not you go tell them, you didn't ask for it and you want your money back. Flu vaccine you can get that FREE in some clinics.
Click to expand...

I went to get one at work and was waiting for the bill. There wasn't one. Some employers have in-office clinics to administer them at no charge. I guess the costs of employees getting sick is a lot worse than paying for the shot. My son's workplace requires employees to get flu shots. If an employee gets the flu, they can't come back to work for at least a week and need to be cleared.
 
movdqa

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Raul_SJ said:
Does this mean that if you did not have insurance, the hospital would have billed you $44,000?

:unsure:
Click to expand...

Yes. But you can usually negotiate that down. 40% of something is better than 100% of nothing. Prices are high because so many don't pay for services.
 
norcal

norcal

Legend
Nostradamus said:
Flu Vaccine just cost you $314 !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That is so ripoff. Did you ask for it ?? if not you go tell them, you didn't ask for it and you want your money back. Flu vaccine you can get that FREE in some clinics.
Click to expand...

Yeah I asked for it because I was hanging out watching football the next morning and it crossed my mind. I was shocked it was that much. The best value on the whole invoice was $100 for morphine and $50 each for fentenyl and propofol. I was in so much pain in the ER, morphine was the best thing ever. No wonder people get addicted, I had zero cares after they shot me up.

The only portion of the bill I had to pay was a $50 copay for the ER.
 
Raul_SJ

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
movdqa said:
Yes. But you can usually negotiate that down. 40% of something is better than 100% of nothing. Prices are high because so many don't pay for services.
Click to expand...

Don't know how much of the high prices are due to non-payers vs just plain price gouging by hospitals and their $500 thermometers.
Hospitals seem to operate much like government -- bloated wasteful bureaucracies.
:rolleyes:
 
movdqa

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Raul_SJ said:
Don't know how much of the high prices are due to non-payers vs just plain price gouging by hospitals and their $500 thermometers.
Hospitals seem to operate much like government -- bloated wasteful bureaucracies.
:rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Do you read hospital earnings reports? I do. Maybe a few are doing well but they're typically struggling. Lots are closing in rural areas. Basically you have to get enough private-paying patients to offset losses from Medicare, Medicaid and non-paying patients. Most hospitals are non-profits. I did have a look at Healthcare Corporation of America and they seem to be doing reasonably well financially but it's a debt-laden company with $32 billion in debt and $500 million in cash. It may be that private hospitals have figured out how to avoid providing coverage to those who can't pay or those on Medicaid and Medicare. But that's not most hospitals. Please don't lump them together without having the financial facts.
 
MatsPhilander

MatsPhilander

Legend
movdqa said:
I don't see how they could refuse to operate if you show up at an emergency room.
Click to expand...

I believe it is at their discretion. I don't really want the operation to have my gallbladder removed which is free, if I had to pay 30 grand sterling for it they could go whistle.
 
C

Chadalina

Guest
movdqa said:
Do you read hospital earnings reports? I do. Maybe a few are doing well but they're typically struggling. Lots are closing in rural areas. Basically you have to get enough private-paying patients to offset losses from Medicare, Medicaid and non-paying patients. Most hospitals are non-profits. I did have a look at Healthcare Corporation of America and they seem to be doing reasonably well financially but it's a debt-laden company with $32 billion in debt and $500 million in cash. It may be that private hospitals have figured out how to avoid providing coverage to those who can't pay or those on Medicaid and Medicare. But that's not most hospitals. Please don't lump them together without having the financial facts.
Click to expand...

If no one is making money, where does it all go?
 
Turbo-87

Turbo-87

G.O.A.T.
Raul_SJ said:
Does this mean that if you did not have insurance, the hospital would have billed you $44,000?

:unsure:
Click to expand...
Good question. I believe they bill an allowable amount to the insurance company based on a contract. Cash price would be less since that cuts out the middle man. People with no coverage usually pay a partial amount and the rest gets written off. Of course the hospital has to make up that cash in other ways, i.e. charging insurance companies more. This is why insurance companies dictate EVERYTHING these days ... who you can see, where you go, etc.
 
movdqa

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Tshooter said:
Yeh, no one is making money. :-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:-D:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:

https://www.npr.org/sections/health...re-skyrockets-so-does-pay-of-health-care-ceos

https://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/18/sunday-review/doctors-salaries-are-not-the-big-cost.html
Click to expand...

We're talking about hospitals. Your article's picture is a protest of Gilead, a pharmaceutical.

Hospital CEOs can get paid a lot, but, one of their jobs, similar to college presidents, is fundraising. And they may well raise far more in funds than their salaries.
 
Nostradamus

Nostradamus

Bionic Poster
norcal said:
Yeah I asked for it because I was hanging out watching football the next morning and it crossed my mind. I was shocked it was that much. The best value on the whole invoice was $100 for morphine and $50 each for fentenyl and propofol. I was in so much pain in the ER, morphine was the best thing ever. No wonder people get addicted, I had zero cares after they shot me up.

The only portion of the bill I had to pay was a $50 copay for the ER.
Click to expand...
I think it might be including the nursing charge for nurse to give you the flu shot. hope the nurse was hot at least
 
mmk

mmk

Hall of Fame
My youngest sister was on a Caribbean cruise with her husband and daughter when she had appendicitis. The ship's infirmary couldn't operate, so they got off at Atlantis and she had the operation there. They had to pay for it as her insurance wasn't accepted there, IIRC it was around $27K. Insurance paid her back, but there's a good reason to have a good credit line.
 
Tshooter

Tshooter

G.O.A.T.
movdqa said:
We're talking about hospitals. Your article's picture is a protest of Gilead, a pharmaceutical.

Hospital CEOs can get paid a lot, but, one of their jobs, similar to college presidents, is fundraising. And they may well raise far more in funds than their salaries.
Click to expand...

You’re talking about hospitals. I’m talking about the medical world where insurance companies, administrators, drug execs and specialist doctors are all making a killing. Yes, SOME hospitals too. Yes, non-profits too which is simply a tax status having zero to do with how much revenue is derived or how large salaries are.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...yre-mostly-nonprofits/?utm_term=.3943553b2558
 
Raul_SJ

Raul_SJ

G.O.A.T.
IA-SteveB said:
Good question. I believe they bill an allowable amount to the insurance company based on a contract. Cash price would be less since that cuts out the middle man. People with no coverage usually pay a partial amount and the rest gets written off. Of course the hospital has to make up that cash in other ways, i.e. charging insurance companies more. This is why insurance companies dictate EVERYTHING these days ... who you can see, where you go, etc.
Click to expand...

I think you're saying if a patient is uninsured and cannot pay, the hospital is insured for such cases, and they get some/all reimbursement from the insurance company?...

Billing is confusing. Once went to a Doctor for an injection. At the time, I had no insurance and paid out of pocket.
Recall seeing the itemized bill and it was like $400 but the Doctor's office only billed me $150.
 
movdqa

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Tshooter said:
You’re talking about hospitals. I’m talking about the medical world where insurance companies, administrators, drug execs and specialist doctors are all making a killing. Yes, SOME hospitals too. Yes, non-profits too which is simply a tax status having zero to do with how much revenue is derived or how large salaries are.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...yre-mostly-nonprofits/?utm_term=.3943553b2558
Click to expand...

Yes, that's what we were discussing. Hospitals.

Some of these folks are doing well. Not all of them are. Not all of the people at these companies are doing well. Please don't make blanket statements. If you know of a company where this occurs, then state the company. Don't lump them all together because they aren't all the same. Neither are the employees all the same. It's lazy to rail at groups of people or organizations.

I know how non-profits work. I also know how to read financial reports. Do you read the financial reports of these companies and organizations that you complain about or do you do a blanket broad brush?
 
movdqa

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
Raul_SJ said:
I think you're saying if a patient is uninsured and cannot pay, the hospital is insured for such cases, and they get some/all reimbursement from the insurance company?...

Billing is confusing. Once went to a Doctor for an injection. At the time, I had no insurance and paid out of pocket.
Recall seeing the itemized bill and it was like $400 but the Doctor's office only billed me $150.
Click to expand...

The cash price is usually a lot more than the negotiated insured price. [I know that you didn't say this - the person you were responding to said this]

If the patient is uninsured, they have to make it up somewhere else or eventually go bankrupt.

If you don't have insurance, you can ask them what they will take or they may offer you an amount that will take care of the bill.
 
esgee48

esgee48

G.O.A.T.
Health care is a case of overkill in the US. If they do not take all the needed measures whether the patient needs it or not, they could be sued for negligence. That drives up costs because they are practicing NOT to be sued.
 
Rosstour

Rosstour

G.O.A.T.
Mine was $35K and change, in 2005. So I went with the $44K figure.

I did spend a week in the same hospital that Dick Cheney goes to after his heart attacks, so there is that.

I didn't have insurance though :sick:
 
movdqa

movdqa

Talk Tennis Guru
esgee48 said:
Health care is a case of overkill in the US. If they do not take all the needed measures whether the patient needs it or not, they could be sued for negligence. That drives up costs because they are practicing NOT to be sued.
Click to expand...

Maybe in the past.

I see care driven by big data today. But first a note on Electronic Medical Records.

I was in a pre-op check visit and a doctor wanted to take routine bloodwork. I said that I had routine bloodwork done a week ago at my local hospital. So he just pulled up the bloodwork records on EPIC and said that I didn't need bloodwork today. The ability to share medical records across hospitals is pretty cool as it meant that I didn't have to get stuck, and we didn't need the additional costs for bloodwork.

In the cancer world, there are Standard of Care treatment plans so, if you have a particular type of cancer, you get a standard treatment plan. There are also clinical trials that can change up the treatment plans and they may change doses, schedules of chemo, amount of radiation, more drugs, less drugs or even the order of treatment. From my perspective, the standard of care for what I had changed during treatment. The standard of care for surveillance for me used to be blood tests every three months for five years, and scans twice a year for two or three years and then annual scans afterward. They changed to annual scans. They take data from a bunch of patients and look at treatments and outcomes and do clinical trials where they think that they can improve outcomes. This stuff can often reduce costs or decrease the damage that treatment causes.

In the past, the approach was to throw the kitchen sink at cancer to get rid of all of it. There have been clinical trials in the past five years to dial back the chemo, radiation, surgery to see what minimal level of treatment kills the cancer. I would guess that doctors and hospitals don't have to worry about lawsuits if they follow the standard of care treatment plans. Other countries around the world often base their standard of care plans on those in the US.
 
R

RVAtennisaddict

Professional
Most hospitals provide 20-40% care for free - i.e. they are not paid a penny for the care provided.

If you show up at the hospital, they can not refuse to treat non-elective/emergency conditions (see line 1). If they do they are subject to possible fines and loss of all Medicare/Medicaid reimbursement which is a significant portion of the net collections.

Hospital charges do not in anyway reflex actual collections (amount paid). As stated above, most hospitals will write off a significant portion (such as 40%) for cash pay patients, however they are not allowed by the insurance companies to match the insurance company's various rates (constitutes a breech of contract with the insurers).

Insurance is definitely a racket, they like to send you the bill.. for 45k. Then say that because you have us and our contracts, we negotiated to a new bill of say 15k, of which your responsibility is your deductible (say 5-10k).
 
Hmgraphite1

Hmgraphite1

Hall of Fame
norcal said:
Just got the invoice, surgery was in October.

facts: after being in pain all morning went to urgent care. they told me to go to emergency (no ambulance; they offered).

admitted to emergency late afternoon, mri showed bogus appendix, then surgery.

released the next day noon-ish.

How much do you think it cost me (well my insurance thank god)?

Vote BEFORE you click spoiler or I'll kick you in the appendix!

32279776427_6fd8746fcb_c.jpg
Click to expand...
Any warning signs?, this is the one that concerns me, as I don't have a substitute.
 
S

sureshs

Bionic Poster
Tshooter said:
I got it right.

We have a very messed up medical system. I hope you live in a state which prohibits balance billing which should obviously be illegal everywhere but isn’t because it sounds “socialist.” Anytime you can’t scr$w people it’s “socialist.”

I hope it all worked out well for you.
Click to expand...

CA is passing a law to prevent balance billing. The idea was that patients with proper insurance should pay more to cover the costs of those who can't. It is not a bad thing when kept under limits, but this particular case was too much from what I gather.
 
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