Jonathan P.
Rookie
Hi guy... what do you think is the more important to hit a heavy ball racket head speed or racket weight?
Heavy ball - racket head speed or racket weight?
- Thread starter Jonathan P.
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- heavy ball racket weight rhs
BlueB
Legend
jersey34tennis
Professional
combo. head speed, weight, string pattern, and string. the heaviest balls I've hit were with the pog oversize, ktour 90, a ksurge weighted to 12.5 ounces all in the grip, and my favorite = the prince tour pro 100 esp with lead under the bumper and grip. even with syn gut it was the kind of ball that created a lot of mishits by whomever I played.
styksnstryngs
Professional
Whatever has max momentum/kinetic energy, still trying to figure out which one. A tennis ball lingers in the frame for a while, so it's technically an inelastic collision for a fair amount, which means momentum is what is conserved, but obviously it's not a perfect system. Somebody educate me.
BlueB
Legend
It's flawed logic. Most players can swing lighter racquet faster then a heavy one. So, it's really a personal combo for every player, heaviest racquet that you can swing fastest.
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Jonathan P.
Rookie
So if I have a -light HH racket- vs a -heavy HL racket- the one with more static weight (in this case the HL racket) will hit the ball harder assuming head speed is the same?
JustTennis76
Hall of Fame
Yes. Heavier HL racket is also more arm friendly than the other option.
BlueB
Legend
Not necessarily. The one with more swing weight will hit harder. You could have a lighter, but more head heavy racquet, that has more swing weight then heavier, head light racquet.
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PrinceMoron
Legend
SW104 perfect example
mhkeuns
Hall of Fame
I can relate to this topic with having expereinces hitting against different heaviness in balls. For instance, there are two hitters that I know who hit real heavy flat shots. One used the Pro Staff 90 and the other uses the Six One 95 18x20. Their shots feel like they are pushing my racket back. I can really feel the weight of the incoming shots. Then there are guys who hit real heavy topspin strokes (*most are Pure Drive and Pure Aero/APD users) that feel like they could take the racket out of my hand. They are both heavy balls and difficult to handle but different.
What I’m trying to say is that there is the optimal mix of weight, balance and the swing speed for each players style that will help to create the heavy ball. It can’t be determined just based on the rackets being light and head heavy, or heavy and hl. But, we can probably summarize it by saying there has to be enough heft, sw and swing speed to hit heavy balls. I do agree with getting the heaviest racket that a player is comfortable swinging, though.
What I’m trying to say is that there is the optimal mix of weight, balance and the swing speed for each players style that will help to create the heavy ball. It can’t be determined just based on the rackets being light and head heavy, or heavy and hl. But, we can probably summarize it by saying there has to be enough heft, sw and swing speed to hit heavy balls. I do agree with getting the heaviest racket that a player is comfortable swinging, though.
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
I shorten my frames by 0.25” to reduce swingweight, then add mass to the head. This way I can still swing fast but have the advantage of more mass too. Get to have my cake and eat it too.
Mark-Touch
Legend
How do you go about shortening your frames 0.25"?
travlerajm
Talk Tennis Guru
Remove the buttcap. Saw 0.25" off the end. Replace buttcap. Secure with several tightly-wrapped layers of 2"-wide stretchable packing tape.
I've now shortened more than 30 frames (pretty much every frame in my collection).
Every time I get a new frame, I try to like it in stock form, but I never do. Once I cut it down, it's like... ahh, that's much better. Plays all-around better.
I've yet to find a disadvantage. Even on the serve, I find I can serve just as big or even bigger with the shorter frame because I can swing the lower swingweight faster to more than offset the loss of leverage.
Mark-Touch
Legend
Thanks. I was mostly curious about it.
In my situation, I guess the more pertinent question would be "how do you lengthen a racket?"
Because I use strange grips: When changing from 2-handed LH FH to 1-handed RH FH, my RH is left holding the racket in a choked position, hence I could use a longer racket.
In my situation, I guess the more pertinent question would be "how do you lengthen a racket?"
Because I use strange grips: When changing from 2-handed LH FH to 1-handed RH FH, my RH is left holding the racket in a choked position, hence I could use a longer racket.
time_fly
Hall of Fame
I came across some interesting articles about weight, swingweight, and swing speed ... in baseball and softball. Since baseball is a much simpler case than tennis (the bat is symmetric around its long axis; there is much less variation in baseball swings by a given player than tennis swings), you would think there would be an easier answer about the ideal weight, balance, and length of the bat. But no ... the upshot is that even in baseball, you just need to try different setups and see what gets the best result for you:
Bat weight vs. swing speed:
https://www.acs.psu.edu/drussell/bats/batw8.html
Bat swing weight / moment of inertia ("MOI") vs swing speed:
https://www.acs.psu.edu/drussell/bats/bat-moi.html
A few tidbits that I found interesting from these articles:
* "Several recent field studies of real players swinging both softball bats[8,10] and baseball bats[9,11-13] have conclusively demonstrated that the speed with which a player can swing a bat depends very strongly on the moment-of-inertia of the bat." Not too surprising: bat swing speed is more strongly correlated with swing weight than static weight. There are graphs of this on the second page above.
* "In fact, when a player switches to a lower MOI [swing weight] bat, the increase in batted-ball speed due to higher swing speed is almost exactly cancelled out by the reduction in batted-ball speed because the lower MOI bat impacts the ball less effectively." Now this is interesting! Somehow changing swing weight exactly balances out: more bat head speed IS EXACTLY CANCELLED BY less "effective impact" (deflection of the bat?) with the result that batted ball speed remains the same as the bat's swing weight is lowered or raised -- presumably within some reasonable range of values.
And the not so surprising conclusion: "If a lower MOI bat doesn't hit balls as effectively, why would a player want to switch to a lower MOI bat? A lower MOI bat would provide a player with greater bat control. The increase in bat-swing speed means a player could wait a split second longer before committing to a swing. Waiting a couple of milliseconds would allow a player to watch a fast-pitched baseball travel an additional 5-6 feet before having to commit to a swing - and that additional time (distance) could enable the player to distinguish between a curve or sinker, or between a strike or ball. Bat control would improve for a lower MOI bat, and that might allow a player to make solid contact with the ball more frequently. But, a lower MOI bat will not help a player hit balls faster. So, if you want to increase your batting average, switch to a lower MOI bat. But, if you want to hit more home runs (which requires a faster BBS) you'll need to increase your arm and upper body strength and generate a faster bat-swing speed."
Bat weight vs. swing speed:
https://www.acs.psu.edu/drussell/bats/batw8.html
Bat swing weight / moment of inertia ("MOI") vs swing speed:
https://www.acs.psu.edu/drussell/bats/bat-moi.html
A few tidbits that I found interesting from these articles:
* "Several recent field studies of real players swinging both softball bats[8,10] and baseball bats[9,11-13] have conclusively demonstrated that the speed with which a player can swing a bat depends very strongly on the moment-of-inertia of the bat." Not too surprising: bat swing speed is more strongly correlated with swing weight than static weight. There are graphs of this on the second page above.
* "In fact, when a player switches to a lower MOI [swing weight] bat, the increase in batted-ball speed due to higher swing speed is almost exactly cancelled out by the reduction in batted-ball speed because the lower MOI bat impacts the ball less effectively." Now this is interesting! Somehow changing swing weight exactly balances out: more bat head speed IS EXACTLY CANCELLED BY less "effective impact" (deflection of the bat?) with the result that batted ball speed remains the same as the bat's swing weight is lowered or raised -- presumably within some reasonable range of values.
And the not so surprising conclusion: "If a lower MOI bat doesn't hit balls as effectively, why would a player want to switch to a lower MOI bat? A lower MOI bat would provide a player with greater bat control. The increase in bat-swing speed means a player could wait a split second longer before committing to a swing. Waiting a couple of milliseconds would allow a player to watch a fast-pitched baseball travel an additional 5-6 feet before having to commit to a swing - and that additional time (distance) could enable the player to distinguish between a curve or sinker, or between a strike or ball. Bat control would improve for a lower MOI bat, and that might allow a player to make solid contact with the ball more frequently. But, a lower MOI bat will not help a player hit balls faster. So, if you want to increase your batting average, switch to a lower MOI bat. But, if you want to hit more home runs (which requires a faster BBS) you'll need to increase your arm and upper body strength and generate a faster bat-swing speed."
There is no clear conclusion on what the "heavy ball" means to players, AFAIK but general consensus is certain good combination of pace AND spin.
So there is also no definitive answer to what type of racquets promotes heavy ball but there are bits of what people saying about it.
Some of those bits I've heard is heavy head light frames and dense pattern often promotes heavy balls but like I mentioned, there is no definitive answer to this, IMHO.
