Is this a real Head Pro Stock TGK?
- Thread starter Marcus2137
- Start date
Marcus2137
Rookie
Thanks again Bro!
Anyone else?
I think that just about seals the deal, huh?
Anyone else?
I think that just about seals the deal, huh?
pshulam
Hall of Fame
That's one of main reason that my Paypal account is tied to a credit card as opposed to my bank account. It should be a lot easier to dispute a charge.
Marcus2137
Rookie
Thanks DR.
Thanks for all of the guys, with so much experience with these rackets, helping out a new guy like me! I hope I can give something back to this community.
Marcus2137
Rookie
After this experience, I'll probably change my account and do the same. My bank already said that I can be assured that they will get the money back if it comes down to that, but it can't hurt to have a little extra protection from using a credit card.
I don't know about taxes on tennis rackets - I thought they were an exempt item!? I'm sure I looked in to this when I sent one to Portugal - the guy didn't have to pay any tax and I've never had to pay tax and I've received a racket or two from New Zealand!!
Besides, as I see it it's tough luck on him for not selling what he said he was. How can you not know if its a TGK model or not?
Besides, as I see it it's tough luck on him for not selling what he said he was. How can you not know if its a TGK model or not?
PED
Legend
IIRC, it sucks for the seller because paypal charges higher % on credit card linked accounts.
Because of this, I prefer to deal with those paypals linked with the bank account.
I did a couple of sales and got dinged. It may be different now.
Marcus2137
Rookie
HOLY CRAP! I feel like I'm just banging my head against a wall.
The seller says he talked to the 'pro' he got the rackets from and that guy told him that it doesn't have the code under the pallet because only pro stock rackets made for a professional player has the code under the pallet. And he said that the stuff inside the throat is just added on later, so I guess that means the hologram sticker.
The seller says he talked to the 'pro' he got the rackets from and that guy told him that it doesn't have the code under the pallet because only pro stock rackets made for a professional player has the code under the pallet. And he said that the stuff inside the throat is just added on later, so I guess that means the hologram sticker.
movdqa
Talk Tennis Guru
Holograms are a retail security mechanism. They make no sense in pro stock frames because pro stock frames aren't retail frames.
http://www.retailtechnologyreview.c...etail_print_label.aspx?articleid=585&zoneid=8
It appears that this "pro" believes that customized retail frames are Pro Stock.
The original ad was for 238.4 XL and the ad said code under the pallet. The connotation on SF for an XL is a 28 inch hairpin that was cut down (or no) to something longer than 27 inches. The code wasn't under the pallet so you got something that wasn't as advertised.
I have the feeling that there are language issues and a misunderstanding (by the pro) about what Pro Stocks are. Maybe Head gave him some free retail frames and he sent them to the US to get customized and he considers that to be Pro Stock. In the TW forums, Pro Stock has a pretty specific meaning. Customized retail frames are different - a good example is Roger's frames. We'd call an H19 or H22 Pro Stock but we'd call Roger's frames customized retail.
http://www.retailtechnologyreview.c...etail_print_label.aspx?articleid=585&zoneid=8
It appears that this "pro" believes that customized retail frames are Pro Stock.
The original ad was for 238.4 XL and the ad said code under the pallet. The connotation on SF for an XL is a 28 inch hairpin that was cut down (or no) to something longer than 27 inches. The code wasn't under the pallet so you got something that wasn't as advertised.
I have the feeling that there are language issues and a misunderstanding (by the pro) about what Pro Stocks are. Maybe Head gave him some free retail frames and he sent them to the US to get customized and he considers that to be Pro Stock. In the TW forums, Pro Stock has a pretty specific meaning. Customized retail frames are different - a good example is Roger's frames. We'd call an H19 or H22 Pro Stock but we'd call Roger's frames customized retail.
Marcus2137
Rookie
Here are some excepts from the last email I just wrote him:
"First, you advertised the rackets wrong, you told me many things about the rackets that were not right. If I knew everything about the rackets that I know now, I WOULD NOT have bought them. But you said these were XL, had code under pallet, silicon in handle, and lead on the head.
Second, there is NO proof these are pro stock except your friend says they are, what your friend says isn't good enough proof. Maybe he doesn't understand what a pro stock TGK means.
Third, there is A LOT of proof that these are NOT pro stock.
Fourth, All of the expert racket sellers online say this is not pro stock."
And also:
"It isn't my job as a buyer to prove this ISN'T a real pro stock TGK, it is YOUR job as a seller to prove it IS pro stock. And you have not proved this is pro stock, you only have told me your friend says it is, and THAT is NOT proof."
I am tired of dealing with this and I feel like it's just ridiculous in so many ways.
I've told him that he has until tomorrow to refund my money. I told him that if he refunds the money by tomorrow, I will still pay the money to ship the racket back to him, as I offered before. I also said that if he doesn't refund my money, I've already talked with my bank and they assure me I am protected and they can get the money back for me. Then he will have to send me more money to send the racket back.
I feel like these options are more than fair.
If anyone is willing, please send him a PM over on SF and offer your support. I'd still like the most peaceful resolution possible, which is a voluntary refund.
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Marcus2137
Rookie
Well, it is done!
The seller is stepping up and sending the money back.
I honestly believe that he was cheated when he bought the racket and simply didn't realize it when he sent it to me. I think that he was told things about the racket, from a semi-pro, and passed those things on to me.
After talking with him and the final outcome, I really don't believe he had any intention of taking advantage of me. He might not be as much of a pro stock expert as some of you guys, but I don't think he purposely meant any ill-will. I think that's why it was so hard for him to believe, because he sincerely believed it was pro stock.
Thanks for all the guidance guys. I'll update once more when the money comes in.
The seller is stepping up and sending the money back.
I honestly believe that he was cheated when he bought the racket and simply didn't realize it when he sent it to me. I think that he was told things about the racket, from a semi-pro, and passed those things on to me.
After talking with him and the final outcome, I really don't believe he had any intention of taking advantage of me. He might not be as much of a pro stock expert as some of you guys, but I don't think he purposely meant any ill-will. I think that's why it was so hard for him to believe, because he sincerely believed it was pro stock.
Thanks for all the guidance guys. I'll update once more when the money comes in.
chrischris
G.O.A.T.
Good to hear this.
Hope this works out in a civilised and decent fashion for you guys now.
Hope this works out in a civilised and decent fashion for you guys now.
Marcus2137
Rookie
Looks like it's going to work out great. I couldn't understand why the seller was fighting so hard, but now I realize that he 100% believed that it was prostock because the friend that sold it to him said it was (and maybe the friend believed it too), so it was hard for him to believe it wasn't.
But now, he's really taking care of things in a very civil and mature manner, and the outcome is very acceptable.
But now, he's really taking care of things in a very civil and mature manner, and the outcome is very acceptable.
Marcus2137
Rookie
It is done!
Paolo rafa80 made it right. I won't bore everyone with the all the details, but he came through in the end and I am 100% satisfied.
So in the end, rafa80 and I both learned a lot .
I can honestly say that I would buy another racket from him in the future. I might ask to see a few more pictures next time because we all make mistakes (and he and I both made mistakes during this deal, and he has admitted his mistakes and taken responsibility for them), but I don't believe he is a dishonest person at all. He showed himself to be honest and do the right thing in end, and we were able to come to a mature and civil result.
Thank you for making it right seller!!!
Paolo rafa80 made it right. I won't bore everyone with the all the details, but he came through in the end and I am 100% satisfied.
So in the end, rafa80 and I both learned a lot .
I can honestly say that I would buy another racket from him in the future. I might ask to see a few more pictures next time because we all make mistakes (and he and I both made mistakes during this deal, and he has admitted his mistakes and taken responsibility for them), but I don't believe he is a dishonest person at all. He showed himself to be honest and do the right thing in end, and we were able to come to a mature and civil result.
Thank you for making it right seller!!!
hrstrat57
Hall of Fame
I was watching this thread with great interest and I am very pleased for you regarding the positive outcome.
I have come full circle on my whole outlook on Head player frames. I have a prostock frame and multiple Austrian made prestige and radical frames as well.
All are brilliant.
To me the most important thing tho is to be able to reach into my bag for a backup stick and have it play the same. I think this is an outcome nearly impossible for us recreational players to achieve chasing prostock frames on the other string forum, e baey or from other sources.
I will say this, my 2 YT prestige MP frames bought from TW, matched and spec'd are very, very good. I have modified them to my specs and they are still light enuff to be swung easily and efficiently....the retail YT Prestige MP is light enuff to be modified and I am now convinced will satisfy over 95% of good players seeking a players stick in a 18x20 frame. Most importantly, I cannot tell them apart.
Further, I think now that Head is hiding the prostock frames under retail markings it is very tricky to be certain you are getting a pro stock racquet unless buying it directly from a pro. I think this thread is evidence of that. I truly believe Head doesn't want us to have pro stock frames and believes most of us don't get any benefit from them. The ironic thing is I bet if the OP strung up the frame being discussed here it would play great! I was hoping we would get that commentary here.
I am very happy with my 2 retail frames, blissfully happy actually. I thank those here on the forums who convinced me my Austrian frame snobbery was silly and suggested I abandon my quest for TGK 238.4 frames and go with a matched retail pair instead. Good call!!!
My .02....thread poach off, congrats again on the positive outcome.....and good luck with your ongoing quest. My quest is over, thankfully.
I have come full circle on my whole outlook on Head player frames. I have a prostock frame and multiple Austrian made prestige and radical frames as well.
All are brilliant.
To me the most important thing tho is to be able to reach into my bag for a backup stick and have it play the same. I think this is an outcome nearly impossible for us recreational players to achieve chasing prostock frames on the other string forum, e baey or from other sources.
I will say this, my 2 YT prestige MP frames bought from TW, matched and spec'd are very, very good. I have modified them to my specs and they are still light enuff to be swung easily and efficiently....the retail YT Prestige MP is light enuff to be modified and I am now convinced will satisfy over 95% of good players seeking a players stick in a 18x20 frame. Most importantly, I cannot tell them apart.
Further, I think now that Head is hiding the prostock frames under retail markings it is very tricky to be certain you are getting a pro stock racquet unless buying it directly from a pro. I think this thread is evidence of that. I truly believe Head doesn't want us to have pro stock frames and believes most of us don't get any benefit from them. The ironic thing is I bet if the OP strung up the frame being discussed here it would play great! I was hoping we would get that commentary here.
I am very happy with my 2 retail frames, blissfully happy actually. I thank those here on the forums who convinced me my Austrian frame snobbery was silly and suggested I abandon my quest for TGK 238.4 frames and go with a matched retail pair instead. Good call!!!
My .02....thread poach off, congrats again on the positive outcome.....and good luck with your ongoing quest. My quest is over, thankfully.
movdqa
Talk Tennis Guru
> I have come full circle on my whole outlook on Head player frames. I
> have a prostock frame and multiple Austrian made prestige and radical
> frames as well.
I have six pro stocks and one in (delayed) transit. Three are XLs and
two of them are matched. I'm getting more comfortable with the XLs and
may consider getting the third one matched to the other two (I can get
access to an RDC machine though it's a bit of a headache).
> To me the most important thing tho is to be able to reach into my bag
> for a backup stick and have it play the same. I think this is an
> outcome nearly impossible for us recreational players to achieve
> chasing prostock frames on the other string forum, e baey or from
> other sources.
There are sets of frames out for sale from time to time. The person
that sold me my first XL offered me a pair. I should have taken him up
on it. The problem with buying one and then liking it is that it is
often hard to get a second unless you have the ability to match
weight, balance and swingweight.
> I will say this, my 2 YT prestige MP frames bought from TW, matched
> and spec'd are very, very good. I have modified them to my specs and
> they are still light enuff to be swung easily and efficiently....the
> retail YT Prestige MP is light enuff to be modified and I am now
> convinced will satisfy over 95% of good players seeking a players
> stick in a 18x20 frame.
I feel the same way about my two 238.4 XLs. I have six YT Pro Stocks
but I don't believe that any of them have the YT material and from
comments seen in these forums, I (or my arm) might not like it.
> Further, I think now that Head is hiding the prostock frames under
> retail markings it is very tricky to be certain you are getting a
> pro stock racquet unless buying it directly from a pro. I think this
> thread is evidence of that. I truly believe Head doesn't want us to
> have pro stock frames and believes most of us don't get any benefit
> from them. The ironic thing is I bet if the OP strung up the frame
> being discussed here it would play great! I was hoping we would get
> that commentary here.
The potential beneift that I see (as an older player) is comfort. The
whole industry is going stiffer. The availability of a few flexible
frames is nice but there seem to be fewer and fewer options in that
genre.
That customized retail frame might play just fine but the OP was buying
something specific. I didn't hear anything about the other two frames
that were sold so perhaps the other buyer(s) is/are happy.
> I am very happy with my 2 retail frames, blissfully happy
> actually. I thank those here on the forums who convinced me my
> Austrian frame snobbery was silly and suggested I abandon my quest
> for TGK 238.4 frames and go with a matched retail pair instead. Good
> call!!!
I keep reading reviews on potential retail racquets out there,
especially with companies that have a record of making the same frame
year-in and year-out.
Good job by the original poster on an amicable solution.
> have a prostock frame and multiple Austrian made prestige and radical
> frames as well.
I have six pro stocks and one in (delayed) transit. Three are XLs and
two of them are matched. I'm getting more comfortable with the XLs and
may consider getting the third one matched to the other two (I can get
access to an RDC machine though it's a bit of a headache).
> To me the most important thing tho is to be able to reach into my bag
> for a backup stick and have it play the same. I think this is an
> outcome nearly impossible for us recreational players to achieve
> chasing prostock frames on the other string forum, e baey or from
> other sources.
There are sets of frames out for sale from time to time. The person
that sold me my first XL offered me a pair. I should have taken him up
on it. The problem with buying one and then liking it is that it is
often hard to get a second unless you have the ability to match
weight, balance and swingweight.
> I will say this, my 2 YT prestige MP frames bought from TW, matched
> and spec'd are very, very good. I have modified them to my specs and
> they are still light enuff to be swung easily and efficiently....the
> retail YT Prestige MP is light enuff to be modified and I am now
> convinced will satisfy over 95% of good players seeking a players
> stick in a 18x20 frame.
I feel the same way about my two 238.4 XLs. I have six YT Pro Stocks
but I don't believe that any of them have the YT material and from
comments seen in these forums, I (or my arm) might not like it.
> Further, I think now that Head is hiding the prostock frames under
> retail markings it is very tricky to be certain you are getting a
> pro stock racquet unless buying it directly from a pro. I think this
> thread is evidence of that. I truly believe Head doesn't want us to
> have pro stock frames and believes most of us don't get any benefit
> from them. The ironic thing is I bet if the OP strung up the frame
> being discussed here it would play great! I was hoping we would get
> that commentary here.
The potential beneift that I see (as an older player) is comfort. The
whole industry is going stiffer. The availability of a few flexible
frames is nice but there seem to be fewer and fewer options in that
genre.
That customized retail frame might play just fine but the OP was buying
something specific. I didn't hear anything about the other two frames
that were sold so perhaps the other buyer(s) is/are happy.
> I am very happy with my 2 retail frames, blissfully happy
> actually. I thank those here on the forums who convinced me my
> Austrian frame snobbery was silly and suggested I abandon my quest
> for TGK 238.4 frames and go with a matched retail pair instead. Good
> call!!!
I keep reading reviews on potential retail racquets out there,
especially with companies that have a record of making the same frame
year-in and year-out.
Good job by the original poster on an amicable solution.
Marcus2137
Rookie
If you match the 3rd one, you aren't going to start wishing for a 4th one also, right? Sounds like a slippery slope
. I was just talking to the guy that you bought your rackets from and I think he said he just ordered a batch of 238.4s for someone (I think he said 5). I know someone else on here ordered a set of 4 or 5 238.5s that were all matched. If you think you will want more than just the 3rd one, it might be the way to go.Ya, I've tried a retail frame and have been dying to try a TGK 238 to compare. And where I live, the only option is just to buy one since there aren't any around. I really wanted the pro stock for 2 reasons:
1. I really love a dampened and muted feel. My retail prestige is already good at that, but if the TGK can add even more dampening and muted feel, I'm very interested in it.
2. The main reason is that I wanted the lighter base weight in order to have more room to customize. There was just no way to get a retail stick to do what I wanted. I wanted something that didn't end up too heavy and had a nice headlight balance. I played with the retail Prestige and to get it at the setup I liked (the balance I liked), it came up at about 370g, which is way to high for me. I actually like the weight of an uncustomized retail Prestige but I want the balance and weight distribution of a customized Prestige, so as soon as you customize the retail Prestige, it starts to get out of my comfortable weight range (I am willing to give up some stability to get a more whippy racket, and I find that even though it's very stable after about 330-340, I loose too much head speed and spin potential.)
Thank you. I'm happy it all work out. Thank you and others for all the amazing help and support through this first purchase experience!
Marcus2137
Rookie
Poach away if you want. I'm done here, my situation is resolved and it was a happy conclusion. Feel free to use this thread however you want, or start another, it's up to you. It's true that you might get other responses in another thread with a title that communicates the real topic though, instead of people seeing my title and never coming in to read what you write.
movdqa
Talk Tennis Guru
> If you match the 3rd one, you aren't going to start wishing for a
> 4th one also, right? Sounds like a slippery slope . I was just
> talking to the guy that you bought your rackets from and I think he
> said he just ordered a batch of 238.4s for someone (I think he said
> 5). I know someone else on here ordered a set of 4 or 5 238.5s that
> were all matched. If you think you will want more than just the 3rd
> one, it might be the way to go.
I could probably get along with just two but I already have the third
and it would be a bit of a waste to just leave it in the closet
because it wasn't matched up. It's about a 45 mile drive for me to get
the specs so that I could match them up (or they will do it for me)
and that's not something that I want to do again. I definitely do not
think that I'm going to need more than three given that I'm going with
full poly.
> 4th one also, right? Sounds like a slippery slope . I was just
> talking to the guy that you bought your rackets from and I think he
> said he just ordered a batch of 238.4s for someone (I think he said
> 5). I know someone else on here ordered a set of 4 or 5 238.5s that
> were all matched. If you think you will want more than just the 3rd
> one, it might be the way to go.
I could probably get along with just two but I already have the third
and it would be a bit of a waste to just leave it in the closet
because it wasn't matched up. It's about a 45 mile drive for me to get
the specs so that I could match them up (or they will do it for me)
and that's not something that I want to do again. I definitely do not
think that I'm going to need more than three given that I'm going with
full poly.
