I'm looking for a new(used) car and need some friendly advice. I've narrowed down my 2 choices to either the 97-01 Audi A4 or the 97-01 Subaru Impreza OBS. I'm trying to find out which car will last longer without having to fix a problem, that of course with me doing routine maintenance(oil changes, tune-ups, etc.). Basically i want to know which car won't dent my wallet. Any useful advice will be appreciated.
Need car advice.
- Thread starter ChuDat
- Start date
LuckyR
Legend
If you are looking at durability and low cost maintainance, I think you are not choosing among the best. The Audi has the distinction of being both unreliable and expensive to fix. The Subaru, merely not very reliable.
For your criteria (I won't comment on that issue) I would choose a Certified Used Korean make, Kia or Hyundai. You will be hard pressed to find a better combination of reliability, inexpesive repairs and great warranty.
I'm not sure Lucky I right about the subies. I have a lot if buddies who've had great success with them from many different model years, but I've never had one and they could've just gotten lucky.
On the flip side, I think he's spot on about audis, especially the expense of fixing them. It's brutal.
On the flip side, I think he's spot on about audis, especially the expense of fixing them. It's brutal.
tipsa...don'tlikehim!
Talk Tennis Guru
South corean cars... ? hmm nope
I don't mean they are bad but they are not the best, compare Japanese and Corean car prices and see... there is a reason why Japanese cars are a bit more expensive = quality.agree with tbuggle: Toyota or Honda (or Mazda)
Nice cars, I had a Honda Civic from 1994, awesome car, so reliable.
Never had a Toyota but they are said to be very solid, same for Mazda, i like the 323.
Old BMW also are probably very reliable
tipsa...don'tlikehim!
Talk Tennis Guru
I had his 1994 Civic coupé, miss it so bad damn accident with a motorbike
damn accident with a motorbike
South corean cars... ? hmm nope
This is not true.
The price difference comes from a lot of things, one being their market share capture strategy. Toyota and Honda did the same thing when they entered the American market. Quality for Korean cars is now very high.
I had a moped once, crashed into a car and the car exploded. Luckily I had the invincibility cheat on
Fifth Set
Professional
Between those cars definitely Subaru will cause you less pain.
But more importantly, between any cars, make sure you are familiar with what Consumer Reports says. Their data is based on actual surveys of real owners, with huge sample sizes. Only that kind of quality data can accurately predict reliability.
And it shouldn't surprise you then if you have talked to industry folks that Consumer Reports always recommends Honda for reliability.
But more importantly, between any cars, make sure you are familiar with what Consumer Reports says. Their data is based on actual surveys of real owners, with huge sample sizes. Only that kind of quality data can accurately predict reliability.
And it shouldn't surprise you then if you have talked to industry folks that Consumer Reports always recommends Honda for reliability.
Kevin T
Hall of Fame
Mopeds are like fat girls. Fun to ride but you don't want your friends seeing you do it.
chatt_town
Hall of Fame
Hey...I have a 97 Mercury Sable that just caught on fire on the way to work that I'll sale ya. SOB caught on fire while on the way in the parking lot with some 5000 folks coming and going...I'm sure I will have a bunch of folks ticked at them getting strikes for being late because the whole area got shut down til fire department came and put it out. Thank god they were less than a mile. very scary..but yet and still...I'll entertain offers...lol Good luck with your search bro.
Peace,
Chatt_town
SOB caught on fire while on the way in the parking lot with some 5000 folks coming and going...I'm sure I will have a bunch of folks ticked at them getting strikes for being late because the whole area got shut down til fire department came and put it out. Thank god they were less than a mile. very scary..but yet and still...I'll entertain offers...lol Good luck with your search bro. Peace,
Chatt_town
DRII
G.O.A.T.
C.R. is highly overatted and uses highly questionable sampling techniques.
to the OP; the Subaru will be less expensive to maintain than the Audi, but neither would i call trouble free. Subarus tend to be fickle in that they last a longtime but tend to have teething issues 9especially for a Japanese brand)...
LuckyR
Legend
I didn't say that the Subarus are unreliable. I said they are "not very reliable". What I mean is you can find makes of higher reliability (namely the more expensive Japanese ie Toyota/Honda and the Korean makes). The Koreans have the edge over Toyota and Honda in warranty, not necessarily reliability.
WildVolley
Legend
With used cars you need to be very selective (have a mechanic look it over if you can).
But go with the Subaru Impreza if money for repairs is an issue. Audi is still a luxury brand and the cost of German parts and mechanics to fix them is still too high.
But go with the Subaru Impreza if money for repairs is an issue. Audi is still a luxury brand and the cost of German parts and mechanics to fix them is still too high.
Forget Subaru if you expect economy.
Audi is only for the rich who are willing to spend 3 grand a year just on maintainance.
Honda, Toyota, Nissan are your friends.
I've had TWO HondaCivics, both went over 290,000 miles with no clutch work, no engine work except for timing chain (at 90,000), no oil changes after 100,000, ONE total water pump, one CV joint on one of the cars, on one side.
Audi is only for the rich who are willing to spend 3 grand a year just on maintainance.
Honda, Toyota, Nissan are your friends.
I've had TWO HondaCivics, both went over 290,000 miles with no clutch work, no engine work except for timing chain (at 90,000), no oil changes after 100,000, ONE total water pump, one CV joint on one of the cars, on one side.
DRII
G.O.A.T.
BOTH Honda Civics, one '86, the other '85, NO oil changes after 100,000 miles.
But I topped them to 1/2 quart below max every 7,000 miles.
Naturally, as the mileage approached 250,000, they drank some more oil (burned or leaked).
I've had Ford Vans that never got an oil change after purchase, and I put in well over 60,000 miles. Yes, I added oil when below a full quart, but never topped to max.
But I topped them to 1/2 quart below max every 7,000 miles.
Naturally, as the mileage approached 250,000, they drank some more oil (burned or leaked).
I've had Ford Vans that never got an oil change after purchase, and I put in well over 60,000 miles. Yes, I added oil when below a full quart, but never topped to max.
chrischris
G.O.A.T.
Get a Volvo or some other car thats safe.
Nostradamus
Bionic Poster
I had his 1994 Civic coupé, miss it so bad
was tipsa on that motorbike ?
dr325i
G.O.A.T.
Absolutely.
Have the MK6 6MT, after the 335is and an S4 and loving every minute in it!
WildVolley
Legend
Don't know if this is a joke or not?
In the United States, Volkswagen's have a terrible reputation for reliability. Though that may be changing in recent years, there does seem to be a difference between the European and American view. Basically, Volkswagen's are considered troublesome cars in the US that cost a lot to repair.
movdqa
Talk Tennis Guru
I owned Audis for 18 years. They were wonderful cars to drive and I put a combined 400K miles on them but they cost a fortune to maintain and finding qualified mechanics to work on them was a headache. Parts were crazy expensive too because they weren't a lot of them sold - mass production decreases prices on parts.
I bought a Toyota Avalon afterwards and put 250K miles on it. Maintenance costs went way, way down. I replaced it last year with a new Camry. I've paid $0 in maintenance costs so far though it comes with 2 years free maintenance.
I have friends, coworkers and relatives with Subarus and would recommend them if you want AWD/4WD. There is a small mileage and complexity penalty for AWD/4WD. My impression with Subarus is that they last forever and I believe that their maintenance costs are a lot lower than Audis. Perhaps a bit higher than Hondas and Toyotas.
I wouldn't rule out domestic cars either - I really don't much about them but their sales are doing much better so I assume that at least some of them are far better in quality and reliability today.
I bought a Toyota Avalon afterwards and put 250K miles on it. Maintenance costs went way, way down. I replaced it last year with a new Camry. I've paid $0 in maintenance costs so far though it comes with 2 years free maintenance.
I have friends, coworkers and relatives with Subarus and would recommend them if you want AWD/4WD. There is a small mileage and complexity penalty for AWD/4WD. My impression with Subarus is that they last forever and I believe that their maintenance costs are a lot lower than Audis. Perhaps a bit higher than Hondas and Toyotas.
I wouldn't rule out domestic cars either - I really don't much about them but their sales are doing much better so I assume that at least some of them are far better in quality and reliability today.
tipsa...don'tlikehim!
Talk Tennis Guru
was tipsa on that motorbike ?
haha no !! me in the car! this 17 yo stupid kid on the motorbike!
tipsa...don'tlikehim!
Talk Tennis Guru
Yes Toyota Camry is probably a very good choice indeed
If you want an reliable Mazda, buy an old one, not a new one, this 323 is the perfect car, you can buy it cheap
If you want an reliable Mazda, buy an old one, not a new one, this 323 is the perfect car, you can buy it cheap
In my experience, Hondas and Acuras have great reliabilty.
For some reason my father loves Hyundai Sonantas. Partly bc of the CR recommendations.
But looking over his service records they haven't been "reliable". Plenty of stuff needed fixing.
His 2008 Sonata with 85K just died. Bc he wasn't the original owner, it wasn't covered under warranty and it needed a new engine, so said the dealer.
So my father goes out and buys a 2012 Sonata with 26K.
For some reason my father loves Hyundai Sonantas. Partly bc of the CR recommendations.
But looking over his service records they haven't been "reliable". Plenty of stuff needed fixing.
His 2008 Sonata with 85K just died. Bc he wasn't the original owner, it wasn't covered under warranty and it needed a new engine, so said the dealer.
So my father goes out and buys a 2012 Sonata with 26K.
azn_lefty_roddick_jr
Rookie
+1. Loving my 2005, and mine isn't even a Type S! Still looks sharp, even after all these years, excellent blend of luxury and sport; and while it comes in only two ways - auto or manual, navigation or no navigation - it is still loaded with modern-day comforts, but not to the point where electronics will wreak havoc with the overall operation of the car.
The 2004-08 TL is newer than what you're looking at OP, but I'll also assure you that it's more reliable than either... My uncle has a 2000 S4 since about 2008, and already has spent a ton of money on it, including about $5,000 to replace the engine after one of its turbos blew (I don't know the specifics on this, just what I was told from memory). The 2004-06 TLs can also be found relatively cheap nowadays, if you don't mind the higher mileage... The 2007-08 has the more updates, though.
Best of luck in your search!
SystemicAnomaly
Bionic Poster
Yup, Volvo cars are very safe. However, they are very pricey to maintain. I do not believe that this is what the OP is looking for. I also agree that the VW GTI is fun to drive. However, as others have said, VW does not have the best rep for reliability in the US.
Perhaps something to consider is to buy a used car with low miles (20-30k) and then get rid of it in 3-4 yrs. I really like some of the newer Chevy cars that I've driven. Great gas milage even if you don't buy a hybrid. Other newer non-hybrids with good fuel economy include car from Ford, VW, Honda and BMW.
I would still put my faith in Consumer Reports. Can you recommend a better, unbiased source?
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tipsa...don'tlikehim!
Talk Tennis Guru
the record of Km from a car is by a Volvo, i think it's something like 4 or 5 millions (3 million miles)
movdqa
Talk Tennis Guru
My manager's husband bought a Hyundai a few years ago and they had to replace the transmission after a few hundred miles. They also apparently lied about the gas mileage. That and our local dealer has very cramped service bays has turned me off to Hyundai. Hyundai is certainly selling a lot of cars today.
I would take a look at the Ford Focus too if it's big enough. That one seems to be getting some pretty good reviews. I don't know anything about long-term reliability on the car though.
My Audis had great longevity too but that's because you went around replacing a good many of the parts and that's an expensive process. I'd guess that the same is true for the Volvo as well.
Longevity is great and I certainly keep cars for a long time but at some point, you're missing out on technological and safety improvements. I see so many drivers talking on their cell phones by holding them up to their ears while driving. I have the base model Camry and it came with a complete electronics package including Bluetooth so that I can place and receive calls while my phone is in my pocket. It has controls on the steering wheel for the electronics system.
The gasoline mileage of cars in the last five years is pretty amazing too. That may or may not be a factor given the falling price of gasoline and increased domestic and North American oil production.
I would take a look at the Ford Focus too if it's big enough. That one seems to be getting some pretty good reviews. I don't know anything about long-term reliability on the car though.
My Audis had great longevity too but that's because you went around replacing a good many of the parts and that's an expensive process. I'd guess that the same is true for the Volvo as well.
Longevity is great and I certainly keep cars for a long time but at some point, you're missing out on technological and safety improvements. I see so many drivers talking on their cell phones by holding them up to their ears while driving. I have the base model Camry and it came with a complete electronics package including Bluetooth so that I can place and receive calls while my phone is in my pocket. It has controls on the steering wheel for the electronics system.
The gasoline mileage of cars in the last five years is pretty amazing too. That may or may not be a factor given the falling price of gasoline and increased domestic and North American oil production.
Bdarb
Hall of Fame
If you're looking for affordable upkeep, I will tell you that Subaru's having all wheel drive is a headache. Everytime you get a flat or something, you need to change out ALL 4 TIRES. Not cheap.
And you are looking at audi's because they are nice to drive and comfortable inside. But the years you are looking at tell me what you want to spend, you don't want those tired old audi's that people are getting rid of because expensive maintenance is coming soon. Its not worth the heated leather seats trust me.
I have an 04 Toyota Corolla. About as reliable and cheap to fix as I've seen. Plus awesome mileage. That being said, I am in the market for a subaru haha.
And you are looking at audi's because they are nice to drive and comfortable inside. But the years you are looking at tell me what you want to spend, you don't want those tired old audi's that people are getting rid of because expensive maintenance is coming soon. Its not worth the heated leather seats trust me
. I have an 04 Toyota Corolla. About as reliable and cheap to fix as I've seen. Plus awesome mileage. That being said, I am in the market for a subaru haha.
I got you.
I interpreted a little harsher than that, and was just pointing out that there are a ton of ski bums and hipsters in the PNW who drive subies forever with great success.
Personally, I drive a beat up Camry that's approaching 200k miles and all it's ever needed has been oil changes, tires, brakes, and shocks. I'm amazed how it's held up.
Stick to Honda/Acura and Toyota/Lexus and you will probably not be disappointed. The Korean cars may be good value as well, but I simply do not like the way any of their cars look.
I agree with those that said to look at the consumer reports car issue. I have found it very helpful and informative in the past, especially when buying used cars.
I agree with those that said to look at the consumer reports car issue. I have found it very helpful and informative in the past, especially when buying used cars.
Bdarb
Hall of Fame
If you don't change them the tread wears on them differently and over time it messes with the differential. Maybe it's okay to do two at a time, I donno, I'm not a mechanic. I've heard it can cause much more serious problems than having to change tires though.
chatt_town
Hall of Fame
We will see how long that lasts. I worked at the vw plant here and I saw some weird stuff. The wrong parts & $h*t being sent to the line. We will see how long that lasts with them being reliable. Personally, the Honda Accord is much better. Price lower and you get just as much if not more miles out of them. I buy them after they get about 120 or 130 thousand miles and drive them for another 200,000 K. Try doing that with a Passat.
chatt_town
Hall of Fame
That's because they have an outside company handling their inventory that gets sent to the line(here at least) and the turnover is high because they don't pay ***** so you get crappy workers...with records & ***** that can't get employed anywhere else. I worked there last summer for about 3 months to pick up some extra cash and it was a nightmare. If someone gave me a Passat I'd sale it for whatever I could get within 24 hours.
movdqa
Talk Tennis Guru
I had a look at Audi's recommendations on tires for Quattros: the tires should be within 4/32" of each other on tread. It appears that you can replace one tire if it is damaged and the approach is to get a new tire of the same brand and wear and then shave it down to the tread of the other tires. Apparently there are services to do this.
That's pretty ancient. If you want an A4, go for the B6 revision from 02 on. Significantly better than the previous gen. To be honest, at this price point, its better to buy on mechanical condition rather than specific models. A good condition Honda for example, is going to be better than the equivalent priced A4.
G
guitarplayer
Guest
This is your answer.