Pure Aero or Aero Pro or?

[Hawbolt]

Typically use classic frames (PS85, 90s) but was recently blown away by the sheer potential in the PURE AERO.

Im looking to buy a version of the aero pro... is the pure aero recommend? How much better is the original aero pro from the rest?

Also looking to lead the racquet... does the pure aeros higher swing weight become unmanageable with a nadal-esque setup?

All Advice and opinions welcome.

 

[pfrischmann]

Tough comparison and one that is very contested here. If you are talking 2013 APD vs Pure Aero, here's what I would say. Accuracy is better with the APD. You get more spin (slightly), more power (a lot) and more stability from the Pure Aero. The power on the Pure Aero is a double edged sword. It can be intoxicating and make you very dangerous but there's not a lot of forgiveness if you open up your racquet face or slow your swing down. Every once in a while, I'll hit a reflex volley, say against an overhead, and watch the ball hit the back fence..I'm always thinking "where did all that come from'? It's a much more controllable shot with my PS-97. sometimes, I feel a cannot soften my hands up enough with the Pure Aero. It's just too powerful. Most of the times, it's a monster.

One more thing,
The Pure Aero goes through strings very quickly.

 

[n8dawg6]

the pure aero is THE FUTURE. the world has already passed by the aero pro ...

 

[Dominic]

Hi Hawbolt, im also the typical classic type player, SixOne 95, RF97 etc, and as you, i was blown away by the AeroPro...and this got the interest going, so then hit with the Pure Aero....and eventually settled on the Pure Aero Tour.

Pfrischmann is spot on with his/her comments....and a extra mention of the Pure Aero going thru strings kinda quickly...

Another silly thing i like, is that the Pure Aero plays well with virtually any string..i use RPM Blast or STB or just about any poly, and its great,

 

[pfrischmann]

Just got back from playing a pretty competitive lesson. I'm finally at the point where my teacher feels he can go for his shots and I can keep up...mostly. All singles, lots of fun. Hot day, so te balls were jumping. A few extra comments on the pure aero. It's really easy to over hit with this stick. It has so much power that just gliding through the shot is enough for a solid rally ball. It's meant for you to go more up than out. When the strings start moving, it's time for new ones. That is where this stick is different than most. With any of my others (PS-97, Angell tc-100, PS-90, PS-85, 2010 APD) if the strings start to move (not snap back really) I know I am due, kinda like the maintenance light on a car. With the Pure Aero, it's more like the missile warning on a jet fighter. ..Eminent danger. Once this happens, I spend all of my time with more of a windshield wiper stroke just keeping the ball in. For me, that's about 10 hours of use with 16L tourbite..

 

[prjacobs]

Tough comparison and one that is very contested here. If you are talking 2013 APD vs Pure Aero, here's what I would say. Accuracy is better with the APD. You get more spin (slightly), more power (a lot) and more stability from the Pure Aero. The power on the Pure Aero is a double edged sword. It can be intoxicating and make you very dangerous but there's not a lot of forgiveness if you open up your racquet face or slow your swing down. Every once in a while, I'll hit a reflex volley, say against an overhead, and watch the ball hit the back fence..I'm always thinking "where did all that come from'? It's a much more controllable shot with my PS-97. sometimes, I feel a cannot soften my hands up enough with the Pure Aero. It's just too powerful. Most of the times, it's a monster.

One more thing,
The Pure Aero goes through strings very quickly.

Just got my Pure Aero delivered. The 2013 APD has been my go to frame for two years but the PA worked so well for me when I demoed it, I felt it was worth the investment. With trade ins, I won't lose any money should I decide to ditch it! If it doesn't work out, it's your fault ....

 

[pfrischmann]

I bet you will either love it or find it doesn't have enough control compared to your APD.

 

[anubis]

Typically use classic frames (PS85, 90s) but was recently blown away by the sheer potential in the PURE AERO.

Im looking to buy a version of the aero pro... is the pure aero recommend? How much better is the original aero pro from the rest?

Also looking to lead the racquet... does the pure aeros higher swing weight become unmanageable with a nadal-esque setup?

All Advice and opinions welcome.

If I had to use one again, I'd put the lowest power poly I could find in it. I'd also use the Pure Aero Team so that it is a little lighter (I currently use the Pure Drive Team). I prefer my racquets to have a strung/overgrip/dampener weight of no more than 320g.

 

[pfrischmann]

interesting, I'm thinking of going to the PAT. I'm starting to feel a racquet needs to be pretty close to 12 ounces to win the racquet/ball commission, especially on volleys.

 

[pfrischmann]

another outing with the Pure Aero. Doubles. I ended up switching to the Angell tc-100. It's not as dangerous but it's more predictable. By this, I mean it gives me better feedback. I'd hit an amazing shot with the Pure Aero and scratch my head as it was better than I intended. I'd also have one fly on me and scratch my head. With the Angell, i knew where the ball was going the second I hit it.

 

[Readers]

i knew where the ball was going the second I hit it.

But that information is completely useless. It's just a bad habit of needing that, objectively, you don't.

 

[Karma Tennis]

But that information is completely useless. It's just a bad habit of needing that, objectively, you don't.

In one foul swoop of your keyboard, you appear to have decimated the entire Tennis Player Shot Statistics / Shot Analysis Industry in a single statement.

My head is absolutely spinning.

Or rather, it will be if you don't elaborate on your comment.

 

[pfrischmann]

But that information is completely useless. It's just a bad habit of needing that, objectively, you don't.

I'm not sure I follow you. Why would knowing where the ball is going be completely useless? Tennis is a game of accuracy, some say, a game of inches. If you are unsure where your ball is going to land, within whatever standards you set for yourself, how can you have confidence in your shots?

 

[Readers]

In one foul swoop of your keyboard, you appear to have decimated the entire Tennis Player Shot Statistics / Shot Analysis Industry in a single statement.

My head is absolutely spinning.

Or rather, it will be if you don't elaborate on your comment.

High speed video analysis has shown that once the ball impact the stringbed, there is not enough time for you to make any more adjustment to affect that shot. So the

"i knew where the ball was going the second I hit it." information is useless as when you have that feedback it's already too late for you to do anything to change that shot. Also this information would available in a much more accurate form within a second, that is the visual confirmation of where the ball actually went.

 

[pfrischmann]

But that information is completely useless. It's just a bad habit of needing that, objectively, you don't.

I'm not sure I follow you. Why would knowing where the ball is going be completely useless? Tennis is a game of accuracy, some say, a game of inches. If you are unsure where your ball is going to land, within whatever standards you set for yourselfhow can you have confidence in your shots?

High speed video analysis has shown that once the ball impact the stringbed, there is not enough time for you to make any more adjustment to affect that shot. So the

"i knew where the ball was going the second I hit it." information is useless as when you have that feedback it's already too late for you to do anything to change that shot. Also this information would available in a much more accurate form within a second, that is the visual confirmation of where the ball actually went.

Sorry,
I get what you are saying but I think you are missing the point. Your information is a limited test done in a vacuum.I do not believe it has much to do with PLAYING tennis. With the information you stated, it would be impossible to adjust to the difference between a drop shot and a flat serve. To me, they feel very different. I may prepare before contact but having done it 1,000 times, my muscle memory (hopefully) knows what to do to give me the desired result. I can tell if I did it right the second I hit the ball and I am far from alone on this. This can build confidence and improve performance. All related to feel. Tennis is a constant case of adapting and adjusting to perform a very precise activity. If you disagree with what I am saying, play with a cricket bat and see if your results change. I bet they will.

 

[Karma Tennis]

High speed video analysis has shown that once the ball impact the stringbed, there is not enough time for you to make any more adjustment to affect that shot.

So the"i knew where the ball was going the second I hit it." information is useless as when you have that feedback it's already too late for you to do anything to change that shot. Also this information would available in a much more accurate form within a second, that is the visual confirmation of where the ball actually went.

Decent tennis players know intuitively the likely result of a shot often before the ball lands. Actually, even spectators who know a particular player very well can tell from the side-lines if a shot that has just been hit is going to land in the right spot.

The visual confirmation of where the ball actually went is useful feedback that provides an input to setting up for the next shot. But the visual confirmation of the result is useless if it isn't analysed / compared with what the player's expectation of that shot was. (from pre-hit preparation to follow through).

 

[Kalin]

But that information is completely useless. It's just a bad habit of needing that, objectively, you don't.

Agreed. That's why I spend my time between shots looking at my handsome reflection in a little hand-held mirror I keep in the palm of my left hand (I have a one-handed backhand).

 

[pfrischmann]

Agreed. That's why I spend my time between shots looking at my handsome reflection in a little hand-held mirror I keep in the palm of my left hand (I have a one-handed backhand).

That was funny..=)

 

[Readers]

Agreed. That's why I spend my time between shots looking at my handsome reflection in a little hand-held mirror I keep in the palm of my left hand (I have a one-handed backhand).

Might want to read more before you post...



"i knew where the ball was going the second I hit it." information is useless as when you have that feedback it's already too late for you to do anything to change that shot. Also this information would available in a much more accurate form within a second, that is the visual confirmation of where the ball actually went."

 

[Kalin]

Might want to read more before you post...



"i knew where the ball was going the second I hit it." information is useless as when you have that feedback it's already too late for you to do anything to change that shot. Also this information would available in a much more accurate form within a second, that is the visual confirmation of where the ball actually went."

It's a joke. And what was said was meant to say the racquet was very predictable and not necessarily that the information itself was useful. The thread is, after all, discussing a racquet, not groundstrokes technique

 

[prjacobs]

I bet you will either love it or find it doesn't have enough control compared to your APD.

Finally got a chance to hit with my Pure Aero a couple of times. Both times were hard competitive hitting, but not matches.
My demo was from R.P.N.Y. and I bought the frame from TW, with racquet matching so the weight and balance is as listed on their site - 11.3 oz, 4 points head light. I had TW string it with Cyclone @50lbs and it's a bit too powerful with that setup. I've never used Cyclone before. I'll go to R.P.N.Y. and have them put in their own string, I know that string well and it killed in their demo. It's a deader string than Cyclone.
The stock grip is 10% thinner than standard which doesn't work for me. I'll re grip with my usual Head Hydrosorb Comfort. I'd get a blister if I stayed with the Babolat grip.
In terms of play, I hit really well with it. Definitely zeroed in more on the 2nd day and I think with a slightly deader poly, this frame will be an easy transition from my APDs.
There's also no question that this frame crushes the ball. My friends both mentioned that my shots were heavier, which I could see by the way they handled them. My lefty serve also worked really well, which is a big part of my game. Both spin and pace were great.
I also noticed that this frame is noticeably more comfortable than the APDs. I've never had any serious issues with the APDs but I don't even feel liked I played after two days of hitting with the PA. That's a really nice plus for an, um, older player like me .

 

[michael valek]

I tried both pure aero and the tour version but in the end settled on the pure drive tour. It feels better balanced for me that the pat plus the response is consistent. Both pa models felt a bit unpredictable and almost felt to me as if they were kind of forcing me to try to hit massive topspin and play like Rafa, to keep it in. Also I found the control better with the pd tour. I never felt as if I was completely confident what was going to happen with the pa / pat. One shot fine next into or over the fence for no apparent reason.

 

[tennistomcat]

Decent tennis players know intuitively the likely result of a shot often before the ball lands. Actually, even spectators who know a particular player very well can tell from the side-lines if a shot that has just been hit is going to land in the right spot.

The visual confirmation of where the ball actually went is useful feedback that provides an input to setting up for the next shot. But the visual confirmation of the result is useless if it isn't analysed / compared with what the player's expectation of that shot was. (from pre-hit preparation to follow through).

I agree with Pfrischman & Karma on this from my experience. The feel & feedback of the racket makes a big difference in my game. With the Pure Drives & Aeropros that I've owned, I have to settle for hitting for zones. With the more flexible rackets with dwell time, I can consistently hit closer to the lines & hit spots giving me much more confidence to swing out. I've been frustrated with the Pure Drives & AeroPros - knowing where I want to hit the ball & but not being able to put it there.
The pure strikes & pure controls gave me much better feedback & ability to hit the spots - just lacked the pop & stability of the others.

It seems the control of the Pure Aero may be even less than the AeroPro - The talk of the easy power is very enticing, but it doesn't sound like this is the frame for me. I would like the extra power but not at the loss of touch & control.

 

[pfrischmann]

Started Demoing an APD again, unforntunately, the one I have has Luxilon Savage on it. The strings are almost dead on top of that. Now that the honeymoon is over with the Pure Aero, here's a quick comparison.

Overall, The APD is much more accurate, less powerful, less stable with less sping. I used one for two years, so I'm pretty familiar with it. It was like kissing an old girfriend. All my shots were in with margin and I could go for the lines with confidence. My ball doesnt have quite as much spin with the APD. In fact, I have to work harder at everything with the APD. It's much easier to flatten out shots with the APD. Neither volley or half-volley well, not compared to my Angell TC-100 or my Wilson Ps-97.

Ultimately, I feel more connected to the ball and confident with the APD but have to work a point much harder with it as well.

It's tough as each of the sticks I'm currently using has a pro and con.

PS-97 Great serve and volley stick, very stable. A little heavy for top spin shots especially late in the 2nd set or when playing singles (the big problem)
Angel-TC-100: Great all around stick and an especially good server. The unique flex sort of weirds me out. Very stable stick.
2013 APD. My forehand just grooves with this stick Volleys are mediocre at best for me. Serves are decent but it lacks the mass to do any real damage. Consistent but not dangerous.
Pure Aero. Very dangerous bet not consistent. It's really tough to feel the ball.

 

[CopolyX]

Pure Aero.... with the right string and tension setup ...it can turn into a great all court weapon (if you are).

 

[pfrischmann]

Interesting that you say that copoly. I am developing into more of an all court player and think (not sure) I may need a heavier, softer stick with a more neutral launch angle to accomplish this. Spin has always been a big part of my game but for me, that requires a lighter more opened pattern stick. Serve and volley works better for me with a tighter pattern, heavier stick. Great example, playing doubles yesterday. I served and the returner shanked a very short reply. I was on top of it and all I had to do was hit a short angle to get it off the court. A simple touch volley. With the PA, I hit it out by two feet.....boing! Much easier with my TC-100 or PS-97.

BTW,
What is your string and tension set up are you using?

 

[prjacobs]

Hitting some more with the Pure Aero, I think it's a little dead towards the tip, compared to the APD. I'll see how I make that adjustment as I continue to use it, but now, I find myself consciously hitting lower down on the frame. I definitely have to increase the tension in my next string job. Cyclone @50 is too powerful for me.


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[prjacobs]

Pfrischman - any thoughts about adding a touch of lead to my APD to come closer to a Pure Aero? Weight, balance and swing weight are pretty close now.


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[JonnyAbs]

Hitting some more with the Pure Aero, I think it's a little dead towards the tip, compared to the APD. I'll see how I make that adjustment as I continue to use it, but now, I find myself consciously hitting lower down on the frame. I definitely have to increase the tension in my next string job. Cyclone @50 is too powerful for me.


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Let us know how 55 works. I have the pure aero as well and was thinking about picking up some cyclone 16. Right now I am using Pro Line II Rough, and I don't get a ton of spin with it. My APD with cyclone almost had too much spin to the point where it lacked power and plowthrough and just looped. Might have been the string pattern, and the more openness of the PA is just giving me more power. However, curious to see how you do with tighter cyclone.

 

[pfrischmann]

I'm actually reassessing the APD. Off the bench, the PA has a higher SW, like 13 points higher. My problem is that to control the power and get a decent amount of time out of the strings, I have to go with 56lbs and 16 gauge strings. this ups the sw to about 330 and starts to make the racquet feel pretty harsh. That in itself isn't bad but get's a little clunky and then I have to tail weight. All fine but now I'm getting back to the weight of my Pro-staffs which actually feel better and are a bit more head light. AND, I'm having some issues with consistency with the PA. I'll hit a forehand and be like "wow, that was amazing" and then hit another that will hit the back fence..and be scratching my head wondering what just happened. I find the sweet spot...vague with the PA, which has me playing tentatively and going for larger targets. That's not really my style, I'm a bit more of an attacker and I LOVE hitting angles. With the APD, I know what is going to happen as soon as I hit the ball, even more so with the PS-97. With the PA, I cannot really tell.

Don't get me wrong, the PA hits a really mean ball. It's HUGE. Currently, I haven't figured out how to control it. time will tell

I weighted my APD with about 4 grams at 23" and close to the same in the handle. It's helped with stability and swing weight without making it feel sluggish. I started at 12 and worked my way down until I felt like I had a good balance between plow through and whippy-ness.

 

[avocadoz]

If only the APD was less harsh on my elbow like the PA...hopefully Babolat goes back to the APD specs for the next iteration but with less vibration and harshness.

 

[pfrischmann]

I'd like to play that racquet. I think the oblong grommets and the wider crosses are just too much of a good thing. I'd like regular grommets and maybe try splitting the difference in the string spacing between the APD and PA. A little more control than the PA and a little more power/less harshness than the APD..

 

[prjacobs]

Let us know how 55 works. I have the pure aero as well and was thinking about picking up some cyclone 16. Right now I am using Pro Line II Rough, and I don't get a ton of spin with it. My APD with cyclone almost had too much spin to the point where it lacked power and plowthrough and just looped. Might have been the string pattern, and the more openness of the PA is just giving me more power. However, curious to see how you do with tighter cyclone.

I don't think I'll go that high. Maybe 53. I did love the way my 2nd serve dipped down into the service box. At first, I thought they were going long. I put in an R.P.N.Y. string that's their less spiny version of RPM Blast @ 52. It's a little deader than Cyclone and seems okay at first hit. My serves just kill with this frame!


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[Karma Tennis]

If only the APD was less harsh on my elbow like the PA...hopefully Babolat goes back to the APD specs for the next iteration but with less vibration and harshness.

If you put Bostik Blue-Tak or silicon in the handle and use 17g poly string (or multi or NG) you might be surprised at how much of that harshness you are feeling disappears.

I keep saying this over and over, the stock APD is too light. It shines when weight is added to it. Much of the vibration and harshness disappears if the handle is dampened.

Saying all that, I would love to see a PAT with the APD string pattern and standard grommets. It could be an absolute weapon in the right hands.

 

[JonnyAbs]

I'd like to play that racquet. I think the oblong grommets and the wider crosses are just too much of a good thing. I'd like regular grommets and maybe try splitting the difference in the string spacing between the APD and PA. A little more control than the PA and a little more power/less harshness than the APD..

I am in total agreement with you here. I am having issues controlling the PA. They probably could have just increased the swingweight of the APD and called it a day. I think its the string spacing that is giving me the consistently issues. I am going to try some more string setups before I move on, but I did just buy a cheap @SS Prince Response because I had good control with that when I demo'd it last year. Did I see in another thread that you owned this or another racquet not so similar to the PA within the last few years?

 

[JonnyAbs]

If you put Bostik Blue-Tak or silicon in the handle and use 17g poly string (or multi or NG) you might be surprised at how much of that harshness you are feeling disappears.

I keep saying this over and over, the stock APD is too light. It shines when weight is added to it. Much of the vibration and harshness disappears if the handle is dampened.

Saying all that, I would love to see a PAT with the APD string pattern and standard grommets. It could be an absolute weapon in the right hands.

Are you still using the APD, and did you try the PA only to find consistency issues? PAT also have the same issues as PA?

 

[pfrischmann]

If you put Bostik Blue-Tak or silicon in the handle and use 17g poly string (or multi or NG) you might be surprised at how much of that harshness you are feeling disappears.

I am in total agreement with you here. I am having issues controlling the PA. They probably could have just increased the swingweight of the APD and called it a day. I think its the string spacing that is giving me the consistently issues. I am going to try some more string setups before I move on, but I did just buy a cheap @SS Prince Response because I had good control with that when I demo'd it last year. Did I see in another thread that you owned this or another racquet not so similar to the PA within the last few years?

I demoed a response 97. Possibly the best volley stick I've ever used. The RF-97 close behind. I didn't like how it felt on groundies..too muted. If I was a serve and volley guy. The Response would be on the short list.

 

[Karma Tennis]

Are you still using the APD, and did you try the PA only to find consistency issues? PAT also have the same issues as PA?

I've stuck with the custom APDs. PAT doesn't suit my game as well. I hope that Babolat comes up with something in between the PAT and the 2013 APD next time round.

I've mentioned a few times that I think the 2013 APD is like a sports car whereas the PA / PAT are more like souped up family saloons.

I would be very interested to know how the PA line is selling compared to the 2013 APD line at the same point. I remember when the 2013 APD was released, I was seeing them everywhere pretty quickly. I don't see as many players using the PA. Actually I'm still seeing a lot more 2013 APDs than PAs suggesting some are hanging onto them for longer.