BaseLineBash
Hall of Fame
The worlds wisdom is foolishness. We are all here for His pleasure.
The Meaninglessness of Life, it doesn't really matter?
- Thread starter Federererererer
- Start date
The worlds wisdom is foolishness. We are all here for His pleasure.
BaseLineBash
Hall of Fame
I read your post again and regardless if you are sincere or not, I feel I should say something else. It would be best for you to get to know your creator and seek out His Kingdom. Human life is too short to live so empty and broken and it sounds like you don't want that. Eventually is this life we all run out of places to hide... why prolong this fact? Too often, too many of us choose to reject His love and for what... a life of needless pain and loneliness.
zapvor
G.O.A.T.
hahaha your Disney comment made me laugh. thanks
zapvor
G.O.A.T.
why dont you stop lying? its obivous you or someone else convinced you of this agenda and now you are trying to spread it for some reason. you probably are just caught up in the frenzy at the moment. who was it? perhaps a book? you should cite references you know; no plagarism
Federererererer
Banned
You're a very good example of the one of the most common traits of humanity, preference of ignorance and bliss over knowledge and "unhappiness". But who is to say I am unhappy. I am not, I feel great. I guess you all have presupposed that I don't enjoy anything because it doesn't matter, but I do enjoy it. My life is great in my opinion. I'll be going to USC next fall, I enjoy spending time with those I know, and if I lose it all, it won't hurt because I have come to the realization that life is futile. I hope those of you infused with these falsities will enjoy your lives, in spite of it or because of it. It means nothing either way, just be happy (but logically it would seem that freedom to do what makes you happy, as prescibed by nihilism, would be the best way to go about it.)
BaseLineBash
Hall of Fame
I'm sorry you feel this way. It is not a matter of ignorance and bliss over knowledge and unhappiness. Just talk to Him, that's all it takes, really.
FitzRoy
Professional
I, too, am a fan of the movie; but have you read Robert E. Howard? As Conan quotes on that subject go, I much prefer one from the short story "The Queen of the Black Coast":
"Let teachers and priests and philosophers brood over questions of reality and illusion. I know this: if life is illusion, then I am no less an illusion, and being thus, the illusion is real to me. I live; I burn with life. I love, I slay, and I am content."
Why do you believe that the bible is the word of God? Is it because your parents taught you from a young age that the bible is the word of God, or is there something that the book itself says that is evidence (to you) that it is truly the book of God?
I grew up in a household where my father was Jewish and mother was Catholic, but neither of them practiced their religion, so religion was not forced upon me. Therefore, I have no reason to believe that any book: bible, koran, whatever is the true word of God more than any other. I'm just trying to figure out why you have the faith that you have, other than that it was hardwired in your brain as a young child. I know that what was hardwired in my mind was that there are conflicting religions out there, and as far as I'm concerned, none of them have it right.
TonLars
Professional
Just as the way I have done with questioning and believing in God, one has the ability to also question and look at signs, or evidence as you call it, that would lead one to believe that the Bible is the inspired word of God for us to have. There are many signs, but here are some of the strongest for you to read:
- its unity, with 66 individual books, written on three continents, in three different languages, over a period of approximately 1500 years, by more that 40 authors and remains unified today without contradiction. Some will "find" contradictions without full understanding or out of context and they are all disproven.
- contains hundreds of detailed prophecies. Unlike the prophecies found in other religious books or those done by Nostradamus, the biblical prophecies are extremely detailed and have never failed to come true.
- details historical events, and its truthfulness and accuracy is subject to verification like any other historical documentation. Through both archaeological evidences and other written documents, the historical accounts of the Bible have been proven time and time again to be accurate and true.
I agree, most people practice a religion simply because of what their parents do, and then it is never questioned. Such questioning is also unfortunately looked down upon by most and seen as wavering in ones faith. But it is this questioning, seeking of answers and truth, that builds a belief and truly makes it ones own. My parents raised me into a Baptist church, and thats how I started. Christianity is where I am at now too as well, because through seeking information and questioning many things, it is now my own personal belief. A belief in a God, and the belief in Jesus as the Savior. The belief that a book like the Bible is all I need to base how to live as a Christian. Though it was written by men, there is reason to see that it has divine origin.
As Ive said, im no expert, and I know religions conflict, but I have done this questioning and my belief is therefore stronger in God. Nobody will ever find hard evidence, because it is all based upon the belief. It wouldnt be this way if everyone saw or heard from God. We have free will to make choices on how we want to live, and so it is much more meaningful in this way. Religion is a man made thing, and I am turned off by how religions are political in many ways. I dont consider myself a "Baptist" anymore, as if Baptist, Lutheran, etc were a seperate religion. I am a Christian, which is the only thing that matters. Many religions and denominations make extra rules and doctrines, and this does not follow God. Im not going to get caught up in religions and how they conflict, because I have no control over that. Again, I simply believe strongly in a God, and I will follow the best word I have of that, which is the Bible, to guide how I should and should not live my life.
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Federererererer
Banned
I truly don't feel any animosity or care about what you say; I guess it is good you talk to imaginary things since it makes you happy and you don't listen to people and science who confirm it is a complete lie, because it makes you happy. I can't talk to someone to be happy, it would make me unhappy, but thats just me. Do whatever floats your boat, the truth of it is irrelevant, although there is a truth and it goes againt that voodoo you believe in.
TonLars
Professional
You simply have chosen to believe what you do, as I and others believe the way we do. But no, science does not do what you claim.
Federererererer
Banned
I firmly believe that Science (and logic) disputes all of religion, but to be fair, you must concede that it does disprove that magic created existence in 7 days.
anonymous2364
Banned
Emo Emo Emo
TonLars
Professional
The Bible is VERY symbolistic and poetic in parts. "7 days" very likely could mean any amount of time. Theres no reason that it could or couldnt have been either 7 days or a very long amount of time. It is foolish to think science "disputes" or proves any of that wrong. It also is foolish to think that an all powerful creator could not easily do something. Who knows how it went? Nobody does, and it doesnt matter, but we do know that science does not prove God, creation or anything false. If that was actually true, then nobody would have their belief in their right mind. Its all about belief.
Give an example or more please of these scientifical disputes. The creation thing is definitely not an example. Id me more than happy to accept your position if you can use science to "prove" that God does not exist. The very things science uses and discovers are created and designed by God. Because of that and how it is plausible concerning logic, your argument wont hold there unless you find something that actually proves God doesnt exist.
Federererererer
Banned
And here in lies the foremost problem with religion, its parishoners blindly following it. By your logic though shalt not kill could very well mean any array of verbs, like hurt, or tap, or touch. Then you'd be on your way to my philosophy, ITS ALL RELATIVE. To me, 7 days means, 7 days. Notice, I didn't say science disputes GOD, for no test could ever take data over the existence of a deity (but conspicously you all have made him out to be such that he cannot be disproven, perhaps to further your belief that he exists by disallowing a test of his existence), but of religion. It is impossible for a god, the way Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinuism, or the like exists because the claims made by those religions are completely stupid and dumbfounded, and quite honestly made up. Your scriptures were written by men you realize, just atoms and molecules.
TonLars
Professional
You definitely are not well informed as far as this goes, but I suppose I can continue replying to your responses.
Please read the creation account in the Bible. Its extremely poetic. Indeed as you said, these are compilations written by men, each with their own style of writing. Ive already posted earlier about the Bible itself in this thread. These men obviously believed in God, and many of them died for their beliefs. There is no reason to believe they were all lying about what they wrote, it was sincere. Also, many of them lived in the same time period as when there were accounts of Jesus and what he did, and people believing that God spoke to them. You can either take their word or dont. But they obviously believed in God and what they were writing. It doesnt make sense to me for the Bible to go to the lengths to tell exactly how everything was created and how long a period of time, etc. Thats not the point, you understand? lol. The commandments, for example such as do not kill... how can you interpret that any differently? Its very straight forward unlike a story. Without even ever reading anything or being raised by anyone, one would feel differently and at least slightly guilty of killing someone, or other offenses. One can logically understand and figure out why these things are wrong if the person is intelligent enough to reflect on what they did. But as I said, I also believe morals are inherent in people, and that itself is a strong indication to me and others that there is a higher power.
I dont like repeating myself. Yes, people do sometimes unfrotunately blindly follow a religion. Religion, as you said, is different than God. I tell you again, there is no need for religions and man made rituals and rules. This is not what was meant to be. Going to church and/or being loyal to a religion or denomination does not make you a Christian. Many churches and "religions" are very political, and cultish would be a good word I think. The best way for a real Christian to think about church is as a place to learn about God, worship, and have fellowship with other people- hopefully some other believers. To get caught up in a church that makes its own rules and rituals that conflict with the Bible is not in line with God, and there are many churches that unfortunately do these things. I however, like many others, have made my faith real by questioning things, thinking, and having discussions like these with others. Only then does one have a strong belief and make it their own. I am very convinced in my belief, and it is far from blind.
For you to say "but conspicously you all have made God out to be such that he cannot be disproven, perhaps to further your belief that he exists by disallowing a test of his existence" does not have much logic to it. The existence of a God, according to the attributes that are said of God in the Bible, simply just cannot directly be proven or disproven by hearing, seeing, or using science. As I said in an earlier post, it wouldnt make sense for it to be that way. Rather, there are many indirect ways which I have shared with you which make me have a belief that there is a God. The only direct piece we have is the Bible, and that is why it is important to try to follow that.
To say "It is impossible for a god, the way Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinuism, or the like exists because the claims made by those religions are completely stupid and dumbfounded, and quite honestly made up", doesnt make sense either. You certainly can choose not to believe, but there is nothing stupid or made up about it. Again, its not something anyone could just simply prove to you; its about belief. You also cant disprove God, as you said. So theres nothing foolish about having the belief. Accept it, or dont, it is everyones choice.
alwaysatnet
Semi-Pro
You are too campy and silly to be taken seriously. Your "philosophy" is a patchwork of self serving comments and self centered egotism. If you don't want to believe in religion or a higher purpose in life,than that's fine. For you. But you can't dismiss one philosophy because it was written by mere men(just atoms and molocules) and then claim that Nietzsche,or some other existential writer has it all figured out. They are just men composed of atoms and molocules also. If they have any special answers you haven't shown it or discussed them. You have only decided that since the world will be a smoldering cinder or less someday, that nothing matters because we can't change that(?).How long do you expect to live anyway? What does some cosmic event that may be possibly a billion years away have to do with you anyway? It just sounds like you have the lamest excuse in the world so you feel you are free to do what makes you happy. It sounds like you have constructed this confused sounding rationale so you don't have to feel like you have any special need other than to enjoy yourself or do something that does not gratify you. If you want to be a selfish self centered egotist than by all means go ahead.No one can stop you anyway. But stop trying to rationalize your behavior. The things we do in this lifetime for each other and to each other matter a great deal. What difference does it make if someday an asteroid might plow into earth? Why should that have any effect on how you treat your fellow man today or tomorrow or twenty years from now? It sounds as though you reject religion,not out of any real philosophical insights,but because it imposes a moral straight jacket on you,and you don't want anyone telling you what to do. Then just say so. Cut out the existential b.s.
Science does not dispute religion for one very simple reason. It does not deal with the supernatural. You seem to have read up on philosophy but I suggest you brush up on your science before heading off to college.
BaseLineBash
Hall of Fame
The truth is He. We as humans do not have the capacity to understand anything outside what has been revealed to us. Deuteronomy 29:29 – “The secret things belong to the Lord our God, but the things revealed belong to us…”, and what belongs to us is in the amount of the perfect sum. Think about the earths distance from the sun, our orbit, our nightlight the moon and stars at night... everything is perfect and no philosopher nor scientist made it that way. You are letting the unanswerable get in the way of the already answered and you aren't alone. We are all imperfect, but realize that in the same breath.
TonLars
Professional
Yes, interesting isnt it!? And all of what you listed is just a sampling of "coincidences" to be seen, theres so much more too. It really is like science can be used indirectly to understand that there really is a God. This can give people the signs and hope they need to believe, and maybe change their ways and ultimately live for God! All the conditions for life to be possible are present here for Earth. What are the odds?? Its astronomical to think about the probablitity that somewhere in the incredibly vast universe that all of what is necessary, even right down to the cellular and molecular level, is to be found on another planet in another galaxy, much less being an intelligent and evolving race as humanity is. It definitely to me points to the work of a designer. It says to me- theres just no way all of what we see and have here just happened by chance!
The odds are 1. Think about it, we're here, aren't we? Just look at the lottery. The chances of winning are small yet it happens all the time.
Federererererer
Banned
"What difference does it make if someday an asteroid might plow into earth?"
YES, YES, THAT'S BEAUTIFUL.
"Why should that have any effect on how you treat your fellow man today or tomorrow or twenty years from now?"
EXACTLY, NOTHING SHOULD, DO WHAT YOU WANT!!! BEAUTIFUL!!!!
"How long do you expect to live anyway? What does some cosmic event that may be possibly a billion years away have to do with you anyway?"
NOTHING, and I mean nothing, we all mean nothing.
Don't look now, but your arguing for me. Fight on!
Federererererer
Banned
Perfect??? If it were perfect we could all fly and no one would starve and we could all do whatever we wanted including morphing into dinosaurs. Things just are the way they are, don't look any further into it. It means nothing.
Federererererer
Banned
I think this is a good time to reiterate my point, since it is being forgotten because of this useless religious debate.
Human beings affect nothing, and all are actions lead to the same effect, nothing, so do what you want.
Human beings affect nothing, and all are actions lead to the same effect, nothing, so do what you want.
TonLars
Professional
The odds are "1"? That isnt odds. Unless you mean 1:1? But yeah, looking at it from the creation belief, then the odds were certain that it would happen, lol.
We are here. Now, the odds of everything being in place like it is on Earth to have life, or intelligent life for that matter, somewhere else in the universe? Obviously the probability is incredibly astronomical, which is exactly the point. This doesnt even take into account all of the other signs present to observe, which point to an intelligent designer of our Earth and life as we know it.
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TonLars
Professional
Ummm, I didnt say life is perfect, please read before responding.
And what youre asking for in a perfect life was not my point or anyone else's. You could think of it as near perfect though however, although that is subjective calling it "perfect". But thinking about, as the other guy said, the positioning of our planet to the sun, and the way our bodies are designed both at a broad and cellular prespective (along with many other things which I forget because im not a scientist), if anything was off on just one of these aspects, life and survival would be much more difficult, and in many cases life simply would not be possible at all. Things are the way they are, I believe, because it was created and designed by God. It definitely seems that way to me, and that is why I believe in God. Again as I said before, there is no scientific evidence that is going to either prove or disprove God, but I do see indirect evidence, and as a result we both are going to choose to see those signs differently and believe differently. Thats the concept of our free will
And it seems we can be frank here in this discussion, so I just want to let you know also what I think about what youve said: "Human beings affect nothing, and all are actions lead to the same effect, nothing, so do what you want."
To me, thats just taking an easy way out. Even outside of one's belief concerning God existing, it is important to many people for obvious reasons to live their life with some sort of meaning. If nothing else, to respect and have relationships among people, respect for the fact that there are others like you who are alive here. Being grateful for all that you have and understanding the beauty of life and all that it can bring, rather than being pessimistic, depressed and defeated. And having the common sense to realize that your philosophy is far inferior to the idea that cooperation, love and respect accomplishes much more and is very satisfying, than self gratification, hedonism, and thinking nothing matters. People realize that if everyone thought this way, than there would be mass chaos and humanity could not survive for long.
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alwaysatnet
Semi-Pro
I couldn't possibly fight on for you. You have made yourself meaningless and your arguements amount to nothing. You are a colossal waste of time and it's obvious there is no point in your point of view.
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I'll come in at this moment to disagree...
Human beings affect each other. When you do something nice for a friend and they smile, you have affected them. What happens a million years after doesn't change the fact that you have affected their day.
And of course, the other way works too. If you hurt somebody, then you've affected them negatively. A affects B, regardless of what happens when both A and B are long gone.
I'll just have to say that that doesn't really make much of a point. The universe itself is, kind of by the definition of the word, "astronomical" in size. The very word "astronomical" comes from the fact that the numbers and distances being dealt with in astronomy are ridiculously large.
If the odds against something are astronomical, that still doesn't mean it's unlikely to happen in the entire universe
Though I disagree with your religious beliefs, I have to say A-men to that... Agreed wholeheartedly with that bit of text. I don't have (or need) a belief in a deity to bring some meaning to what I do in this life, and it's nice when people can agree on life philosophies wherever they come from
TonLars
Professional
I'll just have to say that that doesn't really make much of a point. The universe itself is, kind of by the definition of the word, "astronomical" in size. The very word "astronomical" comes from the fact that the numbers and distances being dealt with in astronomy are ridiculously large.
If the odds against something are astronomical, that still doesn't mean it's unlikely to happen in the entire universe
My point is that seeing these odds, and how large the universe is, and then looking at Earths life conditions and how things would be different if something on some level were even slightly different, one has to think about how it all probably couldnt and wont happen anywhere else. Basically its just a sign to me that furthers my belief. I understand what youre saying though.
Hm, that's not the impression I get. The universe is a really big place. We exist on the surface of one planet - the surface is a barely a speck compared to the entire planet, which is barely noticeable compared to the size of the sun it orbits, which is so tiny compared to the galaxy it is in, which is one of the countless numbers of galaxies in the visible universe (and we can't even see all of the universe - our vision is limited by how far light had time to propagate since the beginning!) I don't find it at all surprising that somewhere in this vastness, the conditions were right for order and then life and intelligence of a sort to emerge.
Sure, the probability of it occurring exactly here, at this one star, at this one planet, in exactly the form it did - yeah, that's pretty miniscule. But the probability of getting to some form of intelligent life that can ponder its own existence - well, I have no idea what that is, considering we don't even have a good scientific grasp of what "intelligence" is or how life appeared in the first place, and we know little about how planetary systems form anyway. But in a universe as vast as ours is I wouldn't be surprised if it was significant - lots of things become become probable when you throw billions of years and countless numbers of stars at them. I certainly can't with certainty say that there isn't life anywhere else in the universe - sure, if it's there, it's probably different, but I would never feel comfortable make the leap of faith and say that "it all probably couldnt and wont happen anywhere else."
Ah well, it's not as if the probability of finding life elsewhere affects anything here - I'm not optimistic enough about science to think we'll ever be able to get too far off of this little planet of ours, so I don't think we'll ever know for sure. But hey, there are optimists out there that think that science will take us everywhere, if they can make it happen more power to them
BaseLineBash
Hall of Fame
God is truly amazing. Earlier this evening while I was driving, it began to rain. I started to think of all the things we take for granted. The rain to nourish the plantlife and replenish ponds for the animals, the gravity that kept my car on the ground and that of which keeps us planted, the sunlight through out the day so that we may see, the darkness at night so that we may rest, the moonlight and stars if our rest is to be postponed, the oxygen so that we may breathe and all the chemical reactions so that life on earth can move forth. I thought to myself, I'm not even scratching the surface. The fact of the matter is, here on earth within the flesh, there is meaning to our lives, we are given the opportunity to get to know our maker. God wants a relationship with each and every one of us, but it's our choice. We can turn to Him or we can kiss goodbye the cheek of our true love.
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Trainer
Rookie
This is called apologetics.
What you call "disproven" is nothing more than your choice of some interpretation that provides you some rationalization about what is obviously a contradiction.
And many of them that are completely wrong.
Mixing some facts into a mythological tale adds no weight to the supernatural claims made in the bible. Mixing fact with lies is a common tactic of storytellers to gain credibility.
None of these things you have posted give any credibility to the Bible.
Perhaps for someone who desperately wants to see it that way. Unfortunately, your "reason" just isn't there.
I'll agree with that.
You seem to be playing both sides of it here. You say that you have done all of this research that proves the divinity of the bible, and then you say that it will never be proven, but is based on faith alone. Which is it. The two positions are miles apart.
Trainer
Rookie
I think it's important to make a distinction here. There is a difference in proving something about God and proving something about the Bible. The two are very different. The Bible is far easier to disprove, especially when taken literally. Things like
Young Earth Creationism is so easy to disprove it's laughable. Yet, millions upon millions believe in it. So I have to ask, do you?
But if you have a different interpretation, one that isn't literal, as you stated that 7 days may not mean 7 days, then you can use that throughout the bible to water down everything in it. Once you start reinterpreting it this way, there is no way to know when to stop. Sort of a catch 22.
TonLars
Professional
Hm, that's not the impression I get. The universe is a really big place. We exist on the surface of one planet - the surface is a barely a speck compared to the entire planet, which is barely noticeable compared to the size of the sun it orbits, which is so tiny compared to the galaxy it is in, which is one of the countless numbers of galaxies in the visible universe (and we can't even see all of the universe - our vision is limited by how far light had time to propagate since the beginning!) I don't find it at all surprising that somewhere in this vastness, the conditions were right for order and then life and intelligence of a sort to emerge.
Sure, the probability of it occurring exactly here, at this one star, at this one planet, in exactly the form it did - yeah, that's pretty miniscule. But the probability of getting to some form of intelligent life that can ponder its own existence - well, I have no idea what that is, considering we don't even have a good scientific grasp of what "intelligence" is or how life appeared in the first place, and we know little about how planetary systems form anyway. But in a universe as vast as ours is I wouldn't be surprised if it was significant - lots of things become become probable when you throw billions of years and countless numbers of stars at them. I certainly can't with certainty say that there isn't life anywhere else in the universe - sure, if it's there, it's probably different, but I would never feel comfortable make the leap of faith and say that "it all probably couldnt and wont happen anywhere else."
Ah well, it's not as if the probability of finding life elsewhere affects anything here - I'm not optimistic enough about science to think we'll ever be able to get too far off of this little planet of ours, so I don't think we'll ever know for sure. But hey, there are optimists out there that think that science will take us everywhere, if they can make it happen more power to them
You simply have a different perspective than me and others about this. I look at our planet, and our life, and all the things BaselineBash said below your post, and its a very good sign to me that there was a creator, and how none of this happened by chance.
TonLars
Professional
Ahhh here it is. Trainer, I really didnt want to get into a big discussion that is going to go nowhere, as these usually go. You will have an argument for everything, and I will have something to say back to you. But, for now at least, I feel incliuned to respond to what youve said as much of it just isnt the truth of the matter.
The bible does not have "obvious contradictions", as I said, that is your and other uninformed persons' interpretation reading it out of context usually or whatever. You can give a contradiction, and sometimes people like me even though im not an expert can often give you a perfectly valid explanation. I have heard many of these so called contradictions, and if they actually had merit to them, I would accept it as such, although the fact is that men did write it, and it wouldnt be all that surprising. It also more importantly wouldnt change anything about my belief just because of a minor contradiction between two writers. What is important is the Bible itself is of divine origin for anyone to follow.
You "think" the Bible is mythological and supernatural, and that is unfortunate. But just because you think that way, does not mean its a fact. I have plenty of reason, like I have said, to believe in God as I do, and there is plenty of credibility to the Bible, for the reasons I stated. It is not "desperate" as you say at all. All of these things are subjected to people, like you, who dispute it, yet it all holds up against futile attempts to disprove God or the Bible with "logic". As I said earlier, there are plenty of ways that science and logic actually give me insight into the belief that there is a God.
Again, its all about faith. Im not playing both sides. There are signs that give credibility to the belief I and many others have. What I am saying, is that neither way can just be physically proven to us. Its all about belief, as you agreed with. You can look at the signs and choose not to believe, but I do believe. We can post on here alot about this, but Id rather not since it will never end. We can agree to disagree.
TonLars
Professional
As you show, millions upon millions of people do not go in depth, question, reflect, and truly understand the Bible and their belief. But, Ill say again, with attributes that God is supposed to have, there is no reason to say that God couldnt create in 7 days. But obviously seeing the fact that its a writer, with his own style here, and observing how poetic the creationism account is, I am fairly sure that "7 days" etc is just a way of writing it. It really is not important at all, and it is far from the point of things and so I really wonder why it is focused on. Do you understand?
One gets out of the Bible what is important. It is the one piece people have to follow and learn. Of course with human writers, there will be some difference in the way they write. Many things are symbolic and not literal. But the important things remain for followers to see. It really is not surprising to me that some writers did it this way for certain things (like creation), like any other writer. It makes no sense to me at all for the writer in Genesis to tell it like a biology book with the exact length of time and science of it all.
Trainer
Rookie
So you say.
So, are there contradictions or not? Biblical scholars who study the original Greek text can even show where passages in later versions don't exist in the original. This is easily verifiable by viewing the originals and subsequent versions.
By definition, the bible is mythological and supernatural. Perhaps you should look at the meanings of those words before you object to them.
Perhaps for those willing to deny the proof that is presented to them.
You most certainly are. You speak of all of this reason and evidence, and then claim that nothing is proven.
Yes, it can. Proving something is a subjective thing. It's up to you whether it's proven to you or not, no matter how solid the evidence is, you can simply ignore it.
But scientifically speaking, the proof is there.
I suspected as much.
I'd still like to know if your a YEC or not.
35ft6
Legend
That doesn't compute with me. It's like a non-sequitor. It's like when Christians say "if God doesn't exist, then what's the basis of morality" as if all that's standing in the way of them becoming a child molesting murderer is a belief in the supernatural.
Yes, the moon will still be orbiting around the earth long after you're dead, but so what? The implication seems to be life isn't worth living unless the universe revolves around you somehow. Just find what it is that makes you happy, try not to hurt people, and be courageous, make this life count. Let it be a liberation, the fact that the universe will long outlive you.
Sure, if you have a child, care because you want to make them smile, and you want them to grow up to be a smart, compassionate person. Enjoy the feeling of standing on the tennis court on a sunny day. Enjoy the wagging of a dog's tail, or watching two old people who have probably been married twice as long as we've been alive dancing in the subway station (I've seen this). The reason I care is because I believe we're all in this together, I think it's beautiful that we're all going to be dead, and more or less forgotten, yet we still care about stuff.
It's strange that a parent will literally let themselves be killed for the life of their children, or how animals have been known to starve to death because they were so despondent over the death of a mate. I know it's a biological imperative, but still, this crazy little thing called love, it's why people should care. Find what it is you care about, pursue it with courage, don't hurt anybody, learn to play nicely with people, and you'll have a good life.
I have slight problems with it, but I'm a pretty big fan of utilitarianism as a life philosophy.
I think pondering our life in an existential sense should be left to the professionals, the one in a 100 million genius. For the rest of us, it's just a form of procrastination -- analysis paralysis. But, yeah, we're going to think about this **** anyway. I know I do. Just sit in the shade and drink some cold ice tea, feel the breeze, and listen to the birds, and feel lucky that you're able to experience such things.
And if I haven't gotten corny enough, watch this.
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TonLars
Professional
Are there contradictions? Like I said, the ones I have heard from athiests, which are supposedly big revealing contradictions to them, are completely not contradictions at all. Most of the time, they were taking things out of context, or they didnt understand what was being said. Please give an example of a contradiction and I will see if I can help you. As for minor "nit picky" if you will contradictions, I dont know how I can say it any better than I did. Yes, men, who are not perfect, wrote the contents in the Bible. Because they lived at different times, have a different style to their writing, and think differently, there may be some little thing that you would call a contradiction. This is not important, and should not change someones belief. The Bible itself is truly a work, and I believe it was inspired by God to these writers as it shows in many parts, and it has found its way to us still today.
Yeah I didnt say what I meant and was thinking with my comment on you saying the Bible is mythological and supernatural, sorry. Yes, there are supernatural accounts if you want to call it that within the Bible. But you said "mythological", which is your opinion, and is unfortunate. You make the Bible sound like just a big story, and again that is just your opinion, not a fact.
You do not have, what my definition of "proof" is. Ive said many times, the fact that God cannot be either proven or disproven. Scientifically speaking, you think you have proof. But I havent seen it. So, if you could please give me an example of actual proof, id appreciate that. Otherwise, the "proof" ive heard is not actual proof. You are in fact then the one who is ignoring things. The reason for saying that is you must assume science and God are seperate. But because God created the very things science uses and discovers, it doesnt make sense to think some scientifical thing disproves God. Proving something is absolutely not a subjective thing, are you serious about that? Our definitions of "proof" just must be different I guess.
Again, go back and read those previous posts if you need, because I am not actually "playing both sides" as you said. lol. There is a difference between saying there are indirect signs that further the belief in God and the work of a creator... and then actual, hard copy, objective proof. Ive listed all kinds of signs, and that is what is subjective. Looking at these things, we basically just see them differently, with me beliving in God.
What is a "YEC"? Sorry. Ill tell you once I know what that is. But anyways ill look for reply again I guess, please give me some examples like I said, so I can see what exactly we are talking about, and then lets see if I can come up with something to help you out with them. Talk to you later my friend!
I think its "Young Earth Creationist" - so suggests http://acronymfinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=YEC and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YEC. The first paragraph of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Young_Earth_creationism describes what is meant by that view, though I don't know how standardized that definition is.
TonLars
Professional
Ohhhhh ok yeah that. That whole topic really is somewhat speculation if theres several ways it could be, and anyways I have no idea obviously. If the science on determining the age is really accurate, then I would definitely accept that and realize that the account in Genesis is just as it sounds and not necessarily literal 6 days. It really makes no difference to me or other believers; thats just something scientifical to look into, and im not a scientist.
Federererererer
Banned
I think its time for you and I to find what we do agree on...cuz this back and forth stuff is accomplishing nothing.
Just for my own assurance, lets compile a list of what we all can agree on.
-Everything is subjective, you may thing one thing, i think another
-There is no overall truth, as a human, you are as right as I
Federererererer
Banned
EXACTLY, no point in anything really
Federererererer
Banned
You're thinking inside the box. Sure we affect eachother in transcience, but it means nothing. Whose to say what is negative or positive, it brings the same end......infinitum.
alwaysatnet
Semi-Pro
Then there is no point in your whining self centered ego fest of a post. And yet you bothered to make it anyway and took the time to argue with some about it. Odd,isn't it?
At least be honest with yourself if you can't be honest with others and admit this whole exercise in adolescent nacissism has been a heaping steamy load of B.S.. Maybe when you've gotten through college(funny how all the "anarchists" and "existentialists" reject all of society's conventions but still take the time and trouble to get a degree) and actually do something you will look back and feel as foolish as you seem.
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Federererererer
Banned
Funny to get a degree? I'd say smart, while living a pointless life, why not do what you want????????
Answer that! Why not do anything? You take nihilism as a negative.
