You ready... Kiefer did nothing wrong

[MARK ANDERS]

He was just hoping the stick would hit the ball and pop it over. He had no chance otherwise and he threw it at the last minute. He DID NOT throw it at SG, as Gilbert insisted, he would have came much closer if that was his intention. If you watch the slow mo you will see that Carlos B. was correct in that it did not interfer with SG's shot, he hit the ball before he even saw it.

Although I have never been a big fan of Kiefer, I do RESPECT his balls out effort and drive to win.....which he did!

 

[vkartikv]

are you saying the umpire had a slow motion replay of the point in his head that allowed him to make the 'correct' decision?? You always have to give the benefit of the doubt to Grosjean.....

 

[dmastous]

Great effort - no class.
Gilbert was wrong, I agree, he wasn't throwing his racquet at Grosjean. He was throwing it into the path of the ball as you say. But he did throw it over the net and into the view of Grosjean as he was hitting his volley. Then he put up his hands as if to deny that he did anything wrong. Like a kid caught with his hands in the cookie jar.
Even if he managed to hit the ball Grosjean with the thown racquet the point would have been Groshean's. All he did was mess up Gorsjean's concentration then deny deny deny.

 

[phil10s]

Sorry.. Deliberate Hinderance... or at least a Hinderance and take 2. Delibrate Hinderance is a judgement call by the Chair.

Everyone knows that you cant throw your racquet at the ball. Even if the ball hits it and some how goes over, it only counts if the racquet is in your hand.

 

[phil10s]

Having had another 30 seconds to think about it, its possible that HINDERANCE is an issue avoided on the Pro Tour cause then everyone would calim they were hindered.

 

[West Coast Ace]

He was just hoping the stick would hit the ball and pop it over. He had no chance otherwise and he threw it at the last minute. He DID NOT throw it at SG, as Gilbert insisted, he would have came much closer if that was his intention. If you watch the slow mo you will see that Carlos B. was correct in that it did not interfer with SG's shot, he hit the ball before he even saw it.

Although I have never been a big fan of Kiefer, I do RESPECT his balls out effort and drive to win.....which he did!

Opinions are like 'rear ends' - everyone has one. And you're entitled. But I think you're wrong. Grosjean might have caught it out of the corner of his eye - peripheral vision. If there was even a slight chance that Grosjean did see Kiefer getting ready to launch his racket, the sportsmanlike thing for Kiefer to do would be to concede the point. He didn't - and it shows him for the weasel he is.

 

[MARK ANDERS]

You can't just give the benefit of the doubt to SG! It's a judgement call by the chair, no different than a baseball umpire calling an out. Of course SG is gonna protest, but the slow mo proves (IMO) that Carlos was right.

What if SG said a bug distracted him, the chair can't just say, ok. He is up there for a reason and he made the right call which was backed up by Morrissey.

 

[Safina]

He was just hoping the stick would hit the ball and pop it over. If you watch the slow mo you will see that Carlos B. was correct in that it did not interfer with SG's shot, he hit the ball before he even saw it.

ahh senor mark anders is once again airing his ridiculous and flawed opinions.
kiefers racquet toss was conceding the point because you can't win the point by tossing your racquet and hitting the ball. i have seen the play several times and kiefer definitely was distracting and let go of the racquet before grosjean hit the ball. whether or not the racquet was a "hindrance" really should not matter when your opponent is behaving so ridiculously... The chair ump should err on the side of the person that was NOT acting like a jackaZZ.

even worse was kiefer acting like his actions should not matter waving his finger and saying "no, no" instead of just giving grosjean the point.

the crazy thing is that this was one of the easiest overheads i have ever seen and i am not sure how or why grosjean missed it into the net... i am not sure he was distracted, but i think he probably saw something to distract him.

I HOPE FEDERER TRIPLE BAGLES THIS JOKER.... I was rooting for Kiefer in previous matches because his fitness level is the best on tour right now, and his idiosyncrasies were entertaining.. but this crossed the line into poor sportsmanship and for that he will feel the righteous hand of justice as delivered by Roger the Great.

 

[BreakPoint]

He was just hoping the stick would hit the ball and pop it over. He had no chance otherwise and he threw it at the last minute. He DID NOT throw it at SG, as Gilbert insisted, he would have came much closer if that was his intention. If you watch the slow mo you will see that Carlos B. was correct in that it did not interfer with SG's shot, he hit the ball before he even saw it.

Although I have never been a big fan of Kiefer, I do RESPECT his balls out effort and drive to win.....which he did!

Copied from my post in a related thread below:

It doesn't matter, the racquet has to be in your hand when you hit the ball for the point to count. Say you miracously threw the racquet at the ball and the racquet managed to make contact with the ball and hit it over the net, you'd still lose the point since the racquet was not in your hand when the ball was struck.

As soon as Kiefer threw his racquet over the net before the point was over, he automatically lost the point. He knew that. It's amazing that the umpire didn't.

 

[vkartikv]

Just imagine, Kiefer was playing well as it is and he would have won even if that incident had not occured. So he would still be in the semis but now the underdog against the mighty Fed and would have had the crowd behind him because everyone loves an underdog.

But now look what he has done. As it is there are few things to dislike about Fed, and now the crowd knows what kind of character Kiefer possesses - well the whole tennis world knows now. What was rearing its ugly head every once in a while is now a marked presence and I wonder what kind of support Kiefer will get, even in front of a home crowd. The sporting world is very unforgiving....

 

[West Coast Ace]

... a bug... He is up there for a reason and he made the right call which was backed up by Morrissey.

A bug? Come on. Stay on the topic.

And Morrissey could only base his decision on what the chair told him - he said SG wasn't affected. It's very easy to conclude he took the easy way out - I still think he knew that if they reversed it, Kiefer would explode and they'd have to default him - and he didn't want to do that to the crowd.

 

[BreakPoint]

What if SG said a bug distracted him, the chair can't just say, ok. He is up there for a reason and he made the right call which was backed up by Morrissey.

Huge difference, my friend. A bug was not CAUSED by your opponent.

 

[Max G.]

He was just hoping the stick would hit the ball and pop it over.

And that would have been illegal - you can't hit the ball with the racquet if you're not holding it.

[qupte]He had no chance otherwise and he threw it at the last minute. He DID NOT throw it at SG, as Gilbert insisted, he would have came much closer if that was his intention. If you watch the slow mo you will see that Carlos B. was correct in that it did not interfer with SG's shot, he hit the ball before he even saw it.[/quote]

And as far as I could tell, Grosjean clearly flinched as he was hitting the ball and just as the racquet was flying past him. I don't think Kiefer threw it AT Grosjean, but it certainly came close enough.

And the human brain has this wonderful thing called peripheral vision and instincts, which means that if out of the corner of your eye you see something being thrown toward you you're going to have a very hard time continuing a regular tennis swing.

Although I have never been a big fan of Kiefer, I do RESPECT his balls out effort and drive to win.....which he did!

I respect his effort and drive to win. I no longer respect his sporsmanship or him as a player.

This wasn't winning ugly - this was winning dirty. There's a difference.

 

[MARK ANDERS]

I do agree that their is a VERY slight chance that SG could have saw the stick and that Kiefer should have conceded the point, but this is big time with $$$$ on the line and he choose not to. I still think the call was correct and that it has to be a judgement call by the chair.

 

[Shabazza]

OMG!!
there where many incidents, which were worse: like spitting on your opponent, trying to punch him, verbal attacks, doping etc.
and you guys make Kiefer look like the devil himself over some racket throw - so much about double standards -
I'll be back, if some posters here can be rational again!

 

[BreakPoint]

This wasn't winning ugly - this was winning dirty. There's a difference.

Yes, I agree. Even Brad Gilbert slammed Kiefer for what he did, and BG is the master of "winning ugly".

 

[dmastous]

Ok, when was the last time there was a spitting or punching incident in tennis? I've heard of a few but nothing recent. Sometimes punching an opponent is deserved. For instance I would not be too upset if Grosjean had decked Kiefer. Not just for the racquet throwing, but for all the times he delayed the match arguing calls (wrongly) and spouting off at the umpire.

 

[MARK ANDERS]

Right on Shabazza!

Furthermore (West Coast Ace), Whether Kiefer knew or did not know the rule (that he would lose the point if the stick popped the ball over), is completely irrelevant to the call.

 

[BreakPoint]

OMG!!
there where many incidents, which were worse: like spitting on your opponent, trying to punch him, verbal attacks, doping etc.
and you guys make Kiefer look like the devil himself over some racket throw - so much about double standards -
I'll be back, if some posters here can be rational again!

I think throwing your racquet at your opponent before the point was over and then denying you did anything wrong is much worse than spitting at your opponent during a changeover when it has no effect on the game.

BTW, are you German by any chance?

 

[VictorS.]

Was it unsportsmanlike? Yes it was. However, I don't think we should make Kiefer out to be the villian in this case. The umpire really dropped the ball on this one. Obviously it would've been talked about either way. However, if the umpire awarded the point to Grosjean...Kiefer would've been sufficiently punished and the match could've continued. Nobody's perfect. Kiefer on the tennis court seems to be an a***hole . But this is a competition, and the nice guy doesn't always win.

 

[MARK ANDERS]

I meant to gear my last post more specifically toward Breakpoint's input

 

[BreakPoint]

Right on Shabazza!

Furthermore (West Coast Ace), Whether Kiefer knew or did not know the rule (that he would lose the point if the stick popped the ball over), is completely irrelevant to the call.

Of course Kiefer knew the rule! He's an ATP pro that's been on the tour for more than 10 years. I'm sure he's touched every rule in the book by now from having played tennis his entire life.

 

[vkartikv]

Of course Kiefer knew the rule! He's an ATP pro that's been on the tour for more than 10 years. I'm sure he's touched every rule in the book by now from having played tennis his entire life.

No breakpoint, he doesnt know the rules. he thinks they are not meant for him. his blatant display only shows his limited knowledge of the sport. but then again, does he not need to emulate his fellow countrymen??

 

[MARK ANDERS]

Breakpoint, you would make a bad attorney! Again, even if he was aware of the rule (which I'm sure he is), that is completely irrelevant to the call, which was correct. The veteran is in the chair for a reason, he doesn't let EMOTIONS (like most of you guys) dictate the rules!

 

[Shabazza]

I think throwing your racquet at your opponent before the point was over and then denying you did anything wrong is much worse than spitting at your opponent during a changeover when it has no effect on the game.

BTW, are you German by any chance?

He didn't throw it at SG, even if Kiefer is crazy on court, he's not as ******** to intentionally injure his opponent, he was trying to get the smash and threw the racket without thinking, which distracted SB!

I'm not defending Kiefer, this point should have been replayed, which was a clear mistake by the umpires - all I'm saying is that there was much worse on and off the court - some people here are over reacting, period!

Anyway, I'm going to watch Hingis-Clijsters now.

 

[Keifers]

I've lost all respect for Kiefer.

Kiefer was not throwing his racquet at Grosjean, but it was a stupid thing to do. The thrown racquet was a hinderance -- nothing to do with whether it happened just before Grosjean hit the ball or just after -- and to not concede the point or suggest a play-over was cheap, cheap, cheap.

And to cap it off, that perfunctory handshake at the end. Not only is he a head case, he's a cheater, low-rent, mutt head case.

I hope his next opponent creams him.

 

[Keifers]

Was it unsportsmanlike? Yes it was. However, I don't think we should make Kiefer out to be the villian in this case. The umpire really dropped the ball on this one. Obviously it would've been talked about either way. However, if the umpire awarded the point to Grosjean...Kiefer would've been sufficiently punished and the match could've continued. Nobody's perfect. Kiefer on the tennis court seems to be an a***hole . But this is a competition, and the nice guy doesn't always win.

Kiefer not the villain here? How is that the case? Because the umpire dropped the ball? You're joking!...

 

[BreakPoint]

Breakpoint, you would make a bad attorney! Again, even if he was aware of the rule (which I'm sure he is), that is completely irrelevant to the call, which was correct. The veteran is in the chair for a reason, he doesn't let EMOTIONS (like most of you guys) dictate the rules!

But if he knew the rule and knew that he automatically loses the point if he throws his racquet across the net, why did he not concede the point to Grosjean, but instead made believe as if he did nothing wrong and deserves to win the point anyway, if he knew he already lost the point when he threw his racquet? Isn't that just incredibly bad sportmanship?

 

[Keifers]

He didn't throw it at SG, even if Kiefer is crazy on court, he's not as ******** to intentionally injure his opponent, he was trying to get the smash and threw the racket without thinking, which distracted SB!

I'm not defending Kiefer, this point should have been replayed, which was a clear mistake by the umpires - all I'm saying is that there was much worse on and off the court - some people here are over reacting, period!

Anyway, I'm going to watch Hingis-Clijsters now.

Yeah, take off, Shabazza. Your supercilious comments are not needed here.

 

[Keifers]

But if he knew the rule and knew that he automatically loses the point if he throws his racquet across the net, why did he not concede the point to Grosjean, but instead made believe as if he did nothing wrong and deserves to win the point anyway, if he knew he already lost the point when he threw his racquet? Isn't that just incredibly bad sportmanship?

Yes, it is incredibly bad sportsmanship. His action hindered his opponent and he made like he did nothing wrong.

The OP hasn't got a leg to stand on.

 

[equinox]

Copied from my post in a related thread below:

It doesn't matter, the racquet has to be in your hand when you hit the ball for the point to count. Say you miracously threw the racquet at the ball and the racquet managed to make contact with the ball and hit it over the net, you'd still lose the point since the racquet was not in your hand when the ball was struck.

As soon as Kiefer threw his racquet over the net before the point was over, he automatically lost the point. He knew that. It's amazing that the umpire didn't.

Grosjean should have been awarded the point for deliberate hinderance from Kiefer.

Kiefer threw his racket over the net towards grosjean as he was playing his shot. Grosjean was right to protest about this distraction, which may have contributed him to missing his shot.

Now if Kiefer had lost his rackets grip after playing his stroke follow through, i could see an unintentional hinderance being called and playing a LET.

This was a very unsportsman like action from Kiefer. Maybe the heat and pressure of the match got to him and affected his judgement for a second.

The match umpire sucks. This was deliberate act from Kiefer to distrupt grosjeans shot.

Only time i've seen this deliberate act to disrupt an opponents shot once or twice. Both times were in junior matches involving 12 year old beginers!

 

[Michael Haller]

No breakpoint, he doesnt know the rules. he thinks they are not meant for him. his blatant display only shows his limited knowledge of the sport. but then again, does he not need to emulate his fellow countrymen??

You mean

a) the ****s killing 30 millions or

b) Parche stabbing Monica?

 

[VictorS.]

Kiefer not the villain here? How is that the case? Because the umpire dropped the ball? You're joking!...

My point is this: Kiefer did something which was unsportsmanlike. It wasn't sneaky in any sense. In fact it was clear as day. Therefore I think the responsiblity lies with the umpire to punish him sufficiently for his mistake. To me, he's in the wrong, even moreso than Kiefer.

 

[Shabazza]

Yeah, take off, Shabazza. Your supercilious comments are not needed here.

Supercilious?!
I find it supercilious, when vkartikv claims that german sportsmen in general should change their attitude towards sport and that germans arrogance is unsurpassed, without even knowing them.

 

[Kaptain Karl]

He was just hoping the stick would hit the ball and pop it over. He had no chance otherwise and he threw it at the last minute.

This post made me wonder if you know the Rules of Tennis....

Whether Kiefer knew or did not know the rule (that he would lose the point if the stick popped the ball over), is completely irrelevant to the call.

... Then this post confirmed that you don't know the rules.

I'll be back, if some posters here can be rational again!

Then why'd you bother posting several more times?

... even if Kiefer is crazy on court, he's not as ********...

I'm not so sure. I actually doubt his intellectual prowess.

... he was trying to get the smash and threw the racket without thinking...

TILT!!! Watch the tape again, doofus. Keifers hit the ball with one motion ... stopped that motion ... then threw the racket with another, separate motion.

... which distracted SB!

Which is a violation of the rules. Thanks for proving our point.

... this point should have been replayed...

No. (You're wrong again.) It should have been awarded to Grosjean.

... some people here are over reacting...

And some people should learn the "First Rule of Holes." (When you find yourself in one ... stop digging!)

- KK

 

[Shabazza]

This post made me wonder if you know the Rules of Tennis....

I know them thx!
And I never said it wasn't a violation of rules!

Then why'd you bother posting several more times?

because of some unnecessary and childish insults to germans in general from particulary one poster here.

I'm not so sure. I actually doubt his intellectual prowess.

yeah, whatever

 

[Kaptain Karl]

I know them thx!
And I never said it wasn't a violation of rules!

Keep up, Shabazza. I wasn't posting to YOU.

yeah, whatever

Dooh!!! You got me with that one!

- KK

 

[Shabazza]

Keep up, Shabazza. I wasn't posting to YOU.

Dooh!!! You got me with that one!

- KK

ok sorry, I wasn't looking at all the quotes, saw my name 2 times and thought you were responding to me, my bad!
Still Kiefer is not insane or mentally ill, despite his on-court behavior!

 

[MARK ANDERS]

K Karl, you are devoid of LOGIC and I question your intelligence.

The issue is not whether Kiefer knew the rule of not getting the point if stick hit ball over net. I know the rule as does he, I'm sure. THE ISSUE IS WHETHER IT WAS A HINDRANCE OR NOT, PERIOD. THE VETERAN CHAIR UMP MADE THE RIGHT CALL. You're at your little keyboard and he is umping a grand slam qtr. final...for a reason!

 

[I.hEaRt.KeAbLe]

This is probably the thing that has made me the most maddest person ever.What the hell is wrong with Kiefer.He chucked it he didnt just let go of it.He such an idiot.Whats his problem. I mean seriously.I dont have any respect after watching him do that.no respect whatsoever.that is all.xx

 

[old_lobster]

Yeah, take off, Shabazza. Your supercilious comments are not needed here.

It is obvious that Kiefer was wrong wrong wrong and should have just tossed the racquet directly at the chair umpire ... this German is dirty, unsportsmanlike, and doesn't deserve to even be alive. Your supersilly views are not needed here.

Same goes for BreakPoint.

 

[jonolau]

K Karl, you are devoid of LOGIC and I question your intelligence.

The issue is not whether Kiefer knew the rule of not getting the point if stick hit ball over net. I know the rule as does he, I'm sure. THE ISSUE IS WHETHER IT WAS A HINDRANCE OR NOT, PERIOD. THE VETERAN CHAIR UMP MADE THE RIGHT CALL. You're at your little keyboard and he is umping a grand slam qtr. final...for a reason!

Yes, he is umping a grand slam qtr final because he wasn't good enough to become pro .... LOL.

 

[BreakPoint]

K Karl, you are devoid of LOGIC and I question your intelligence.

The issue is not whether Kiefer knew the rule of not getting the point if stick hit ball over net. I know the rule as does he, I'm sure. THE ISSUE IS WHETHER IT WAS A HINDRANCE OR NOT, PERIOD. THE VETERAN CHAIR UMP MADE THE RIGHT CALL. You're at your little keyboard and he is umping a grand slam qtr. final...for a reason!

But why does it matter whatsoever whether or not it was a hinderance if he automatically is suppose to lose the point as soon as he threw his racquet over the net? Kiefer could have thrown his racquet twenty feet over Grosjean's head without Grosjean even noticing at all that he threw it and Keifer would still automatically lose the point just for throwing his racquet over the net before the point was over. That's the rule.

 

[opiate]

I thought, except for the ball, what's on one side of the net, stays on that side of the net.

Tennis is fast turning into a contact sport... One writer wrote that with the violent ball-bashing and over-hyped play under the sun, and with temper fraying around the edges, it's only a matter of time before Tennis turns into a Taekwondo.

 

[tennisjunkiela]

I HOPE FEDERER TRIPLE BAGLES THIS JOKER.... I was rooting for Kiefer in previous matches because his fitness level is the best on tour right now, and his idiosyncrasies were entertaining.. but this crossed the line into poor sportsmanship and for that he will feel the righteous hand of justice as delivered by Roger the Great.

it is very sad to me that "winning at all costs" has become acceptable enough that some posters on this board are actually trying to defend Kiefer's actions. kiefer's racquet throwing incident, and more importantly, him getting away with it, is proof that tennis is on a downward slope where poor sportsmanship is becoming more acceptable.

i too hope that federer triples bagles him and teaches him a lesson!!! if roger can be a sportsman and win GS's without cheating, then everyone else should be required to win without cheating and with good sportsmanship!

 

[jonolau]

it is very sad to me that "winning at all costs" has become acceptable enough that some posters on this board are actually trying to defend Kiefer's actions. kiefer's racquet throwing incident, and more importantly, him getting away with it, is proof that tennis is on a downward slope where poor sportsmanship is becoming more acceptable.

i too hope that federer triples bagles him and teaches him a lesson!!! if roger can be a sportsman and win GS's without cheating, then everyone else should be required to win without cheating and with good sportsmanship!

tennisjunkiela - I like the way you have summed it up so gracefully!

 

[NXG-Tecnifibre]

I think we should have a kiefer award? Just like the Edberg award.
Anyone sneakier or dirtier from today onwards will get the Kiefer award.
For the most unsporting sportsman award... definately this year will go to Kiefer. I'll vote for him.
He needs the recognition.

How about the replay of the throw and the thrown racket of kiefer in the tennis hall of fame and of course the tennis history book... It would be great if he won the Aus open.

Headlines will be... Kiefer won Aus open by racket throwing.

Heh... i think i could try that in my tournament... i'll throw at my opponent's head and get a walk over

 

[johnmcc516]

doesn't matter what his motive was, you can't throw your racquet in the direction of your opponent as it may be a distraction.

 

[tom-selleck]

you know, you aren't really supposed to be throwing your racquet at the path of the ball.

terrible sportsmanship, worse officiating.... ridiculous situation. and yes, kiefer should have conceded point.

 

[Dan007]

After seeing the replay like 5-6 times, I think Keifer threw the racket at Grosjean on purpose. He got to the net in time and was holding on to his racket for a while then threw it at Grosjean to mess up the volley. There is no way the racket will fly out of your hand like that unless he was running at full speed to reach the ball and somehow flew out of his hand. I think Keifer is the #1 @$$hole in ATP and Coria comes in 2nd. Terrible sportsmanship from Keifer.