No Wildcard for Shap, but yes for Maria..U.S. Open

West Coast Ace

West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
mavsman149 said:
Shame Shapovalov even needs a Wild Card, he's already in the top 70, I know he reached that ranking too late, but still.
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Agree. The majors could/should wait. Their imaginary deadline is too far out. 2 weeks out - he'd be in.

I hope he can keep his form and get in.

I don't really care if they gave 1 to Sharapova. She's a cheat; (and not just the drugs; the shriek is obvious gamesmanship- even Serena knocked it off) but an ex-winner who served the sentence. Train wreck for women's tennis if she wins.
 
Mr.Lob

Mr.Lob

G.O.A.T.
Doctor/Lawyer Red Devil said:
Live reaction from Bouchard and Mladenovic to Masha news. :)

crying-baby-o.gif
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"Crying baby" is also the live reaction from many T.T poasters.

Congrats to Sugarpova. The tour needs her magnificents.
 
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Talker

Talker

Hall of Fame
Many want to see him in the draw and it adds quite a bit of added excitement, I was looking forward to see how he does.

It is not good business for him to not be there, lost money IMO.

Rising stars have to be capitalized on and they improve the interest of the tournament, how they could pass on a hot prospect is a mistake.

Well, hope he makes it to the main draw.

I don't care about Sharapova but she did her time, so I have no problem with that.
 
deacsyoga

deacsyoga

Banned
West Coast Ace said:
Train wreck for women's tennis if she wins.
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Dont think there is much worry about that. Her lame comeback thus far reflects how much of a non factor she is, and probably always would have been, without the previous aid of PED use. Being in her 30s now doesnt help either.
 
C

Charlie

Guest
Not a Sharapova supporter but she did win Wimbledon and became #1 without the use of whatever that drug was and ironically that's when she beat Serena. It is quite harsh to suggest that she would have been irrelevant on WTA if she never used the drug. Most of the athletes probably do stuff that is legally allowed but still suspicious to gain some sort of advantage anyway so the whole Sharapova case got more attention than it should have IMO.
 
SpinToWin

SpinToWin

Talk Tennis Guru
Sysyphus said:
Setting Denis aside, what's so wrong with giving Sharapova wildcards? She was banned based on strict liability (caused by negligence ostensibly), not any claim of intention to cheat, so it's not like she's morally reprehensible because of it..
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When you enter these threads.... your reason must... well...

lepgux2.gif
 
Aussie Darcy

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
Very strange to give Sharapova a wildcard. No, not because of the whole drug thing, but because she's been given 5 straight wild cards and has pulled out each time (Birmingham, Wimbledon qualies Stanford, Toronto, Cincy). Chances are she's going to withdraw from the USO too so this wildcard may possibly be wasted. Could be given to someone else.
 
Aussie Darcy

Aussie Darcy

Bionic Poster
As for Shapovalov, I don't really care.

It's not like the Canadian Masters organisers gave any wildcards to some US male players. Why should they return the favour? It's all about who'll be put into seats for them and the American crowd like watching Americans. Like Canadians like watching Canadians, Aussies with Aussies etc...
Many of you may like Shapovalov but ask everyday casual tennis fans and they probably wouldn't care about him. He had one good run at a tournament so far, if he's truly a fantastic player then he can back it up and win through qualifying and go deep.
 
DRII

DRII

G.O.A.T.
SoCalJay said:
Promising American? Where?
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all of them are promising!

anyone good enough to put themselves in the position to 'earn' a wildcard into the USO is promising.

it would be derelict to give WCs to other nation's players unless given the previously stated scenario or mutual deals made between different associations.
 
SoCalJay

SoCalJay

Semi-Pro
Aussie Darcy said:
It's not like the Canadian Masters organisers gave any wildcards to some US male players. Why should they return the favour? It's all about who'll be put into seats for them and the American crowd like watching Americans. Like Canadians like watching Canadians, Aussies with Aussies etc...
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I don't particularly like watching American male players because I'm disappointed far more often than not. I've tried to support the likes of Sock, Fritz, Opelka, etc but it's frustrating to watch them fumble around and waste their talent. I wonder what percentage of avid American tennis fans feel the same way.
 
Gary Duane

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
SoCalJay said:
I don't particularly like watching American male players because I'm disappointed far more often than not. I've tried to support the likes of Sock, Fritz, Opelka, etc but it's frustrating to watch them fumble around and waste their talent. I wonder what percentage of avid American tennis fans feel the same way.
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I do. I think our tennis program has been a joke for a long time. Will it ever change?
 
SoCalJay

SoCalJay

Semi-Pro
DRII said:
all of them are promising!

anyone good enough to put themselves in the position to 'earn' a wildcard into the USO is promising.

it would be derelict to give WCs to other nation's players unless given the previously stated scenario or mutual deals made between different associations.
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I suppose that depends on how you define "promising". I see it as being good enough to have a chance at winning the biggest tournaments in the world. I respect the work he puts in but I don't see a guy like Bjorn Fratangelo ever doing that.
 
Gary Duane

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
Aussie Darcy said:
As for Shapovalov, I don't really care.

It's not like the Canadian Masters organisers gave any wildcards to some US male players. Why should they return the favour? It's all about who'll be put into seats for them and the American crowd like watching Americans.
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Not true of me, never was...
 
deacsyoga

deacsyoga

Banned
Charlie said:
Not a Sharapova supporter but she did win Wimbledon and became #1 without the use of whatever that drug was and ironically that's when she beat Serena. It is quite harsh to suggest that she would have been irrelevant on WTA if she never used the drug. Most of the athletes probably do stuff that is legally allowed but still suspicious to gain some sort of advantage anyway so the whole Sharapova case got more attention than it should have IMO.
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She probably wouldnt be irrelevant, but no way she does as well as she did or wins as much as she did without PEDs. You are right she wins the first Wimbledon, maybe the 06 U.S Open, but beyond that, who knows. PEDs certainly helped her extend her prime and career despite injuries and lack of both natural athleticsm and flexability/adaptability in her game, the things which longevity are usually based upon.

And today without PEDs, having declined in a lot of her former strengths years ago, AND in her 30s (which with rare exceptions like Serena or Federer is the kiss of death) these days she is likely to indeed be irrelevant. Particularly with young talent like Ostepenko and Muguruza and others finally starting to emerge, and Serena back soon.
 
checkmilu

checkmilu

Semi-Pro
Terenigma said:
Sharapova getting any wildcards will always irk me. Drug banned players should get no favours, people like Gatlin and Sharapova might be big names for their sport and big draws but it will always annoy me that the world is run by money and not by actual morals.
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The actual morals in this case are:
1- she was announced not a deliberate drug user
2- she has completed her suspension and paid for her mistake.
3- she was a former champion
4- despite being hated by many haters, she is still loved by many people for her heart out fighting spirit on court and being Sugarpova off the courts.
5. She immediately acknowledged her mistake, accept the consequences, showing her remorse and willingness to make it right.

Go get a life, kid
 
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Gary Duane

Gary Duane

G.O.A.T.
FudgeMyn said:
I mean he plays college tennis. USTA needs something to convince kids to play college tennis and still give them the chance to compete in the pros. helps their propaganda of producing bad players.
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I'm not knocking Eubanks. But I think it is odd that he has a spot, and Shap doesn't.
 
Bartelby

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
Neither Errani nor Sharapova is a doping cheat.

Errani moreover got a wild card into Rome after having tested positive and before her hearing.

So a wild card for someone who has served their time seems appropriate:

170807-tainted-maccaroni-tennis-feature.jpg
 
C

Chadillac

Guest
Im glad the 12 people complaining about sharapova were ignored by the us open
 
Terenigma

Terenigma

G.O.A.T.
checkmilu said:
The actual morals in this case are:
1- she was announced not a deliberate drug user
2- she has completed her suspension and paid for her mistake.
3- she was a former champion
4- despite being hated by many haters, she is still loved by many people for her heart out fighting spirit on court and being Sugarpova off the courts.
5. She immediately acknowledged her mistake, accept the consequences, showing her remorse and willingness to make it right.

Go get a life, kid
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she was classified "not a deliberate drug user" despite taking a drug that was claimed to improve bloodflow and oxygen throughout the body.
She was taking it for OVER 10 years.
She had a doctors note advising her to increase the dosage for big matches.
She and her team were informed almost 4 months prior to the actual finding she was still taking it.
She claimed she didn't know what she was taking (y'know, the drug she had been taking for 10+ years)

So spare me the white knight responce. People like you are the reason the world is messed up because you defend people who clearly break the rules. You think a world class athlete was taking a drug for a questionable medical issue for over 10 years without knowing what it does? a drug that had a reputation for improving performance in athletes? Give me a break.

The "finding" still banned her for 2 years and i hate this logic that she "served her time" no she didn't. She is playing sport and broke the rules to try and improve her performance and was lucky that it took this long to find. People like her don't deserve to play for the sport. You think a teacher who touches kids one time and serves time in prison should be allowed to work in schools again? You think a guy in the army who purposely shoots his team-mate and serves time should be allowed back into the army? No. You break the rules, you suffer the consequences. We should be setting an example for other people and future generations. Not forgiving people because they are "pretty" or "make money"

You think i should "get a life" hm? Well i think you should get some perspective.
 
Bartelby

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
You are ranting on from your prejudices without the slightest reference to the facts or the legality of her situation.

She took a banned substance at one event because she did not know her substance had recently been banned.

A completely reasonable excuse compared to Errani's story of a pill jumping into her pasta broth.
Terenigma said:
she was classified "not a deliberate drug user" despite taking a drug that was claimed to improve bloodflow and oxygen throughout the body.
She was taking it for OVER 10 years.
She had a doctors note advising her to increase the dosage for big matches.
She and her team were informed almost 4 months prior to the actual finding she was still taking it.
She claimed she didn't know what she was taking (y'know, the drug she had been taking for 10+ years)

So spare me the white knight responce. People like you are the reason the world is messed up because you defend people who clearly break the rules. You think a world class athlete was taking a drug for a questionable medical issue for over 10 years without knowing what it does? a drug that had a reputation for improving performance in athletes? Give me a break.

The "finding" still banned her for 2 years and i hate this logic that she "served her time" no she didn't. She is playing sport and broke the rules to try and improve her performance and was lucky that it took this long to find. People like her don't deserve to play for the sport. You think a teacher who touches kids one time and serves time in prison should be allowed to work in schools again? You think a guy in the army who purposely shoots his team-mate and serves time should be allowed back into the army? No. You break the rules, you suffer the consequences. We should be setting an example for other people and future generations. Not forgiving people because they are "pretty" or "make money"

You think i should "get a life" hm? Well i think you should get some perspective.
Click to expand...
 
West Coast Ace

West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
SoCalJay said:
I don't particularly like watching American male players because I'm disappointed far more often than not. I've tried to support the likes of Sock, Fritz, Opelka, etc but it's frustrating to watch them fumble around and waste their talent. I wonder what percentage of avid American tennis fans feel the same way.
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You're mixing generations - Sock belongs to the Lost Boys who just emulated Roddick - huge serve, huge FH, not much else. Yeah, don't like watching them either.

Fritz, Fratangelo, Donaldson, Tiafoe, Paul, and even Opelka (and I'm probably missing a few), can hit decent BHs (without red clay courts - sorry Brad Gilbert - although Paul did live in a country for some time that had clay). Will one of them definitely win 1 or more majors? Can't say. But at least they have the framework of a more complete game to build on. Donaldson especially seems to have 'it' - doesn't appear shell shocked playing the bigger names.
 
SoCalJay

SoCalJay

Semi-Pro
West Coast Ace said:
You're mixing generations - Sock belongs to the Lost Boys who just emulated Roddick - huge serve, huge FH, not much else. Yeah, don't like watching them either.

Fritz, Fratangelo, Donaldson, Tiafoe, Paul, and even Opelka (and I'm probably missing a few), can hit decent BHs (without red clay courts - sorry Brad Gilbert - although Paul did live in a country for some time that had clay). Will one of them definitely win 1 or more majors? Can't say. But at least they have the framework of a more complete game to build on. Donaldson especially seems to have 'it' - doesn't appear shell shocked playing the bigger names.
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I know, but the lines are blurring for me. I really WANT these guys just to step up and be winners but their results are so scattered. I'm an optimist so I'll keep up hope but I'm just tired of the rollercoaster.
 
Bartelby

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
Compared to the people who actually receive wildcards, Sharapova is so far at the top of the list of wildcards that the rest can not be seen.
Tennis_Hands said:
The tour didn't change one bit in terms of quality, while she was banned and after she returned, so you are doing false advertising.

:cool:
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deacsyoga

deacsyoga

Banned
Bartelby said:
Neither Errani nor Sharapova is a doping cheat.
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Spoken like a true fan of Errani and Sharapova, and maybe dopers in general. And so what if Errani also got that wild card after the positive drug test, that was a disgrace as well.

Speaking of Errani there is no way a player so technically poor, with a service motion that wouldnt pass even at club level, and so untalented she hit 0 winners in 2 whole sets vs Julia Gorges and had a golden set loss to a little known person in 2 different matches on grass could ever make a slam final, several slam semis, or top 5 in the world. Unless attaining a superhuman level of fitness and endurance which can be provided for someone of her ability level through massive doping.
 
T

Tennis_Hands

Banned
Bartelby said:
Compared to the people who actually receive wildcards, Sharapova is so far at the top of the list of wildcards that the rest can not be seen.
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How can a player who doesn't make any difference be "so far at the top" I will never know.

And since we are at it, Shapovalov, a player that can and will make a difference in the quality of tennis played, doesn't get a WC.

That is to what your BS amounts to, when it really comes to tennis, but you are not concerned with tennis quality are you?

:cool:
 
West Coast Ace

West Coast Ace

G.O.A.T.
deacsyoga said:
Speaking of Errani there is no way a player so technically poor, with a service motion that wouldnt pass even at club level, and so untalented she hit 0 winners in 2 whole sets vs Julia Gorges and had a golden set loss to a little known person in 2 different matches on grass could ever make a slam final, several slam semis, or top 5 in the world. Unless attaining a superhuman level of fitness and endurance which can be provided for someone of her ability level through massive doping.
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Or just shows what a 2nd rate product the WTA peddles - and how ridiculous the social justice warrior equal pay fiasco is.
 
D

Deleted member 688153

Guest
Pova doesn't deserve to participate, really. Let alone recieve a wildcard. What's the chance she withdraws or loses 1R and wastes the chance? She's done.
Compare that to Shapovalov who is a great up-and-coming guy with results, doesn't scream, and hasn't had positive drug tests.
Sad!
 
D

Deleted member 688153

Guest
West Coast Ace said:
Or just shows what a 2nd rate product the WTA peddles - and how ridiculous the social justice warrior equal pay fiasco is.
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My favourite example is the 2012 AO finals.

6-3, 6-0

vs.


5-7, 6-4, 6-2, 6-7, 7-5


I believe that equal pay was recieved for those two matches.
 
Bobby Jr

Bobby Jr

G.O.A.T.
Booger said:
She puts butts in seats. That's all that matters.
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If it was a 250 or 500 tournament you'd have a point but not a majors she doesn't because all of the best tennis players are there. Sharapova wouldn't sell any truly relevant amount of additional tickets to a major - not least because her early matches would be lost in all the 1st round clutter.
 
R

reaper

Legend
DRII said:
so Blancaneaux, and A. de Minaur are more worthy than Shap :confused::eek:

guess these deals were worked out before Montreal...
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De Minaur probably got one because he's Australian. An American will get a wild card at the Australian Open. Clearly Shapovalov should have been wild carded given there's 8 of them, but if he's good enough to go anywhere in the tournament he should be able to get through qualifying.
 
R

reef58

Semi-Pro
wangs78 said:
Not surprising that the USO decides to grant the WC to Sharapova. It's pretty clear that the US has ceded any semblance of moral leadership in the world for quite some time now. It's all about money, money, money in America.
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Tennis is entertainment not a lesson in morality. Add to that she served her suspension. The good news for you is she will likely get bounced out pretty early on.
 
R

reef58

Semi-Pro
TennisATP said:
A lot of people believe that she was simply ahead of the game, basically that she was cheating for all these years with a substance that hadn't been discovered or added to the list yet but that she knew it gave her an advantage. So legally no it was not cheating as it was not an officially banned substance, but morally yes because she knew what the substance did and was using it because it was not "discovered" and officially "banned". I personally give her the benefit of the doubt, but I also understand the few players who believe she knew what she was doing for all these years and the advantage that substance gave her. It's not as simple as it seems.
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If I am a competitive athlete should I not try to find every advantage I can which is legal? How is taking an unknown drug any different than the first person to start interval training, carb loading, vo2max test, use of power meters, and the multitude of other things professionals do to gain an edge? That is what they get paid to do, and then when they do it some accuse them of less than stellar behavior. I find that strange, but maybe it is just me. I am big on bicycle riding, and I do some organized non sanctioned events. I don't make a dime, and even pay to participate. I spend ten to twelve hours per week training and I do this for fun. I can't imagine the lengths professionals and their teams go through to win.
 
14OuncesStrung

14OuncesStrung

Professional
Hasn't this been discussed enough?? Can't you people read?? Meladonium is not a PED. Sharapova is not a drug cheat. She deserves the WC. Didn't anyone her interview with Charlie Rose???
 
wangs78

wangs78

Legend
reef58 said:
Tennis is entertainment not a lesson in morality. Add to that she served her suspension. The good news for you is she will likely get bounced out pretty early on.
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Morality applies to everything in life. I'm no Puritan so don't get me wrong, but it says something that RG did not award her a WC but the USO did. To me, the subtle message is that the ideals of good sportmanship (not cheating intentionally or accidentally for that matter) matter more to the organizers at RG than they do at the USO.
 
Bartelby

Bartelby

Bionic Poster
The organisers of RG gave a wildcard to someone who had been suspended for betting on matches and who then proceeded to assault a female reporter.

So they have no morality at all, puritan or catholic.
wangs78 said:
Morality applies to everything in life. I'm no Puritan so don't get me wrong, but it says something that RG did not award her a WC but the USO did. To me, the subtle message is that the ideals of good sportmanship (not cheating intentionally or accidentally for that matter) matter more to the organizers at RG than they do at the USO.
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