From a Fed fan: Nadal is extraordinary

Federev

Legend
I’m a Fed fan first and foremost. No close second.

But I’m sure there are many Fed fans around here who would agree that Nadal is simply extraordinary.

He retired injured today and he’s catching a lot of flak for it - And for his grinding style and medical timeouts. ( something legal and which Fed is increasingly familiar with we should admit.)

But Man, The Dude. Is. A. Freaking. Warrior.

I watched him play much of that match with Schwartzman, hoping as a Fed fan the little dude would take it. The Shwartz was playing incredible. Redlining and painting the lines. Seriously extremely high-quality and he was on fire.

But it became plain clear enough that he just had no chance. Rafa just wore him out time after time after time with quality positioning, great defending, consistent court placement, incredible spin, and his usual unmatched intensity that just would not go away as Schwartzman faded.

I know it was only Schwartzman. But he was playing at an extremly high quality and that’s not really the point. Nadal Was just doing what he always does: taking just about everything anybody can throw at him and sending it back with interest. And it just reminded me that even when he isn’t playing his best-which I don’t think he was playing his best that day - no one is more committed than Nadal.

What keeps him down most of the time -is simply his body. It’s not his commitment or will and it’s not his underrated skill and brilliance.

You can fault him for grinding it out and making his body suffer for that, but he’s a massively gifted physical and mental athlete with an incredible drive to win and a work ethic that’s insane. World class Athletes pay a price for that. Fed’s not the rule on longevity at his level. ...That’s another way to look at it.

He’s number one in the world at 31 and even now his play bears out that when healthy he is usually able to vanquish just about everybody he plays - except Fed off clay.

Simply put : His body holds up today and Cilic goes home. Losing the war of attrition to the Bull like just about everybody else.

Even after last year, there is nobody I would rather Fed play less than Rafa. The scar tissue is too thick in my brain to ever actually want to see him on the other side of the net from the GOATERER.

He’s probably one of the two best players in history, in large part due to how he’s responded to Federer’s greatness with his own brand.

Much more I could say about Rafa. And even though some of his fans here leave a lot to be desired by the way they post - (and some Fed fans can be likewise obnoxious)-that’s not his fault.

So a universe size tip of the hat to the extraordinary Rafa, and wishes for a speedy recovery, provided of course, that he never catches Fed’s slam count.
 

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
While the OP is in good spirits , let us not make Rafa a super hero.

Part of the reason Nadal fell to cilic today was because Schwartz softened him big time. Both matches are close to 4 hours.

If Nadal cannot play aggressive and finish points in earlier rounds that is his issue. But let us not fool ourselves into thinking that but for injuries he would be the greatest , which is a oft repeated myth by the VamosBrigade.
 

Jmauer

Semi-Pro
From a fellow Fed fan:

I couldn't agree with you more. The dude IS an absolute warrior. He's the "life-match" guy. And you know that he would have continued to play, if there were any possible way, regardless of pain.

He is an absolute animal on the tennis court, and very gracious off it.

I think that tennis is so fortunate to have had Nadal, and I wish him a speedy and full recovery.

How many kids in the last 10-15 years were watching him on their televisions at home, marveling at his awesomeness.

Among many inspiring moments, one of my favorites that captures his mental fortitude and absolute steel will was that 2013 USO final when he lost his footing at 0 30 on a must hold game, and fell down, going down 0 40.

And the guy got up, toweled off, won the next few points, and went on to hold serve and win the final.

Nerves of steel and a will to compete that is out of this world.
 

RVAtennisaddict

Professional
While the OP is in good spirits , let us not make Rafa a super hero.

Part of the reason Nadal fell to cilic today was because Schwartz softened him big time. Both matches are close to 4 hours.

If Nadal cannot play aggressive and finish points in earlier rounds that is his issue. But let us not fool ourselves into thinking that but for injuries he would be the greatest , which is a oft repeated myth by the VamosBrigade.

Well Rafa's game is much more brutal than Feds. And Rafa may find he needs to shorten matches and points like Fed to stay healthy/competitive. I have been telling my friends for the last three years, Fed needs efficiency to the finals. He realy only seems to have one tough/long 4set or 5 setter in him at each grand slam. Even if he wins, he is out the next round to follow. The body just doesn't recover like it used to.
 

Federev

Legend
While the OP is in good spirits , let us not make Rafa a super hero.

Part of the reason Nadal fell to cilic today was because Schwartz softened him big time. Both matches are close to 4 hours.

If Nadal cannot play aggressive and finish points in earlier rounds that is his issue. But let us not fool ourselves into thinking that but for injuries he would be the greatest , which is a oft repeated myth by the VamosBrigade.

I think he does not have the body / skill set needed to be GOAT. While Nadal is more physically powerful I think, Fed has the slightly better measure of skill and physical gifts to be able to shorten points and survive as he does so late into his career. But I think - if you didn’t have a declining body - which is an impossibility and science fiction- Rafa would have the GS count.

And remember, a healthy Novak might mean that Fed may not take any of the two slams he took last year. Now Rapha would be one away from matching Federer with a clear advantage in the head-to-head.

That didn’t happen cause Fed plays an incredibly balanced body-mind-near-perfect game matched by a greatly underrated work ethic as well.

Fed is the goat, But gotta respect Nadal’s extraordinary career.
 
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Federev

Legend
Well Rafa's game is much more brutal than Feds. And Rafa may find he needs to shorten matches and points like Fed to stay healthy/competitive. I have been telling my friends for the last three years, Fed needs efficiency to the finals. He realy only seems to have one tough/long 4set or 5 setter in him at each grand slam. Even if he wins, he is out the next round to follow. The body just doesn't recover like it used to.
But Fed played 3 five setters in a row against top 10 players to take the AO last year.

Quarters to Final: Kei, Stan, Rafa - all in a row. Beat em all. At 35. Incredible.
 

BeatlesFan

Bionic Poster
But I’m sure there are many Fed fans around here who would agree that Nadal is simply extraordinary.

I figured out he was extraordinary in 2006 in the Dubai final and that was cemented 4 months later in the '06 Rome final. How can any tennis fan (Fed fan or not) not see this and acknowledge Rafa's greatness?

I don't like Rafa's time wasting or grunting, those are my issues with him and always have been. But I have never disliked him because he owned Roger all those years. He was stronger physically and mentally and he didn't choke. He has always been mentally the strongest player I have ever seen, with Pete and post-2010 Djokovic tied for second.
tumblr_nvx828LCEB1rpqu91o1_400.gif
 

tennisaddict

Bionic Poster
I think he does not have the body / skill set needed to be GOAT. While Nadal is more physically powerful I think, Fed has the slightly better measure of skill and physical gifts to be able to shorten points and survive as he does so late into his career. But I think - if you didn’t have a declining body - which is an impossibility and science fiction- Rafa would have the GS count.

And remember, a healthy Novak might mean that Fed may not take any of the two slams he took last year. Now Rapha would be one away from matching Federer with a clear advantage in the head-to-head.

That didn’t happen cause Fed plays an incredibly balanced body-mind-near-perfect game matched by a greatly underrated work ethic as well.

Fed is the goat, But gotta respect Nadal’s extraordinary career.

Rafa maximized his physical abilities to achieve what he has. His declining body is a result of how hard he plays.

If Rafa had the body of Federer, he would not have won half the slams he has.
 
N

nikdom

Guest
Sorry to rain on the parade here, but the 'Warrior' motif is more amplified projection of the optics and less of a testament to athletic character

Exhibit A: Which player would you call a Warrior based on these pictures?

bjorn-borg.jpg



OR

Rafael-Nadal-Celebrate-4-540.jpg



Bjorn was described with words like 'Cool' and 'Ice flows in his Veins', but was he less of a fighter than Nadal?

Sure, Nadal hits outrageous shots in crunch time and fights to stay in the game - but so do others!

Roger, Stan, Djokovic, Murray are all Warriors yet it's all about demeanor - the bare biceps, clenched fists and bared teeth - that account for a greater amount of that characteristic ascribed to Nadal than to his peers.

There are other Warrior characteristics too... how about physical resilience and longevity, ability to adapt to different battlefields and taking defeat on the chin instead of complaining about circumstances. Do you think Nadal aces those aspects of warrior-hood too?

Not saying he isn't mentally tough, but people like to say 'If my life were on the line, I'd let Nadal play a point for me'.

B.S!!

I'd take Pete Sampras or Federer putting in a first serve any day over Nadal playing an extended rally for my life.
 

DRII

G.O.A.T.
Sorry to rain on the parade here, but the 'Warrior' motif is more amplified projection of the optics and less of a testament to athletic character

Exhibit A: Which player would you call a Warrior based on these pictures?

bjorn-borg.jpg



OR

Rafael-Nadal-Celebrate-4-540.jpg



Bjorn was described with words like 'Cool' and 'Ice flows in his Veins', but was he less of a fighter than Nadal?

Sure, Nadal hits outrageous shots in crunch time and fights to stay in the game - but so do others!

Roger, Stan, Djokovic, Murray are all Warriors yet it's all about demeanor - the bare biceps, clenched fists and bared teeth - that account for a greater amount of that characteristic ascribed to Nadal than to his peers.

There are other Warrior characteristics too... how about physical resilience and longevity, ability to adapt to different battlefields and taking defeat on the chin instead of complaining about circumstances. Do you think Nadal aces those aspects of warrior-hood too?

Not saying he isn't mentally tough, but people like to say 'If my life were on the line, I'd let Nadal play a point for me'.

B.S!!

I'd take Pete Sampras or Federer putting in a first serve any day over Nadal playing an extended rally for my life.
23 > 15...

Sampras and Federer may have acumen in spades (and no, Federer's serve is not close to Sampras' just like Sampras' ground game is not close to Federer's), but they have more than once wilted when they could not overwhelm their opponents with their respective talent.

Nadal will fight, and most likely win, as long as his body holds out. you can't count on 1 hand the amount of times a healthy, motivated Nadal wilted in the face of competition.
 

1HBHNation

Rookie
Lmao at these fake crocodile tears from fedfans today that Nadal lost. I'll speak the truth that they're trying to say which is that they're ecstatic. Now they're playing w house money.
 

vanioMan

Legend
I’m a Fed fan first and foremost. No close second.

But I’m sure there are many Fed fans around here who would agree that Nadal is simply extraordinary.

He retired injured today and he’s catching a lot of flak for it - And for his grinding style and medical timeouts. ( something legal and which Fed is increasingly familiar with we should admit.)

But Man, The Dude. Is. A. Freaking. Warrior.

I watched him play much of that match with Schwartzman, hoping as a Fed fan the little dude would take it. The Shwartz was playing incredible. Redlining and painting the lines. Seriously extremely high-quality and he was on fire.

But it became plain clear enough that he just had no chance. Rafa just wore him out time after time after time with quality positioning, great defending, consistent court placement, incredible spin, and his usual unmatched intensity that just would not go away as Schwartzman faded.

I know it was only Schwartzman. But he was playing at an extremly high quality and that’s not really the point. Nadal Was just doing what he always does: taking just about everything anybody can throw at him and sending it back with interest. And it just reminded me that even when he isn’t playing his best-which I don’t think he was playing his best that day - no one is more committed than Nadal.

What keeps him down most of the time -is simply his body. It’s not his commitment or will and it’s not his underrated skill and brilliance.

You can fault him for grinding it out and making his body suffer for that, but he’s a massively gifted physical and mental athlete with an incredible drive to win and a work ethic that’s insane. World class Athletes pay a price for that. Fed’s not the rule on longevity at his level. ...That’s another way to look at it.

He’s number one in the world at 31 and even now his play bears out that when healthy he is usually able to vanquish just about everybody he plays - except Fed off clay.

Simply put : His body holds up today and Cilic goes home. Losing the war of attrition to the Bull like just about everybody else.

Even after last year, there is nobody I would rather Fed play less than Rafa. The scar tissue is too thick in my brain to ever actually want to see him on the other side of the net from the GOATERER.

He’s probably one of the two best players in history, in large part due to how he’s responded to Federer’s greatness with his own brand.

Much more I could say about Rafa. And even though some of his fans here leave a lot to be desired by the way they post - (and some Fed fans can be likewise obnoxious)-that’s not his fault.

So a universe size tip of the hat to the extraordinary Rafa, and wishes for a speedy recovery, provided of course, that he never catches Fed’s slam count.

Yes, I concur. I can’t say I’m sad that he lost, but he’s an undisputed legend of the game and doesn’t deserve the childish insinuations doing the rounds on here.

From a fellow Fed fan:

I couldn't agree with you more. The dude IS an absolute warrior. He's the "life-match" guy. And you know that he would have continued to play, if there were any possible way, regardless of pain.

He is an absolute animal on the tennis court, and very gracious off it.

I think that tennis is so fortunate to have had Nadal, and I wish him a speedy and full recovery.

How many kids in the last 10-15 years were watching him on their televisions at home, marveling at his awesomeness.

Among many inspiring moments, one of my favorites that captures his mental fortitude and absolute steel will was that 2013 USO final when he lost his footing at 0 30 on a must hold game, and fell down, going down 0 40.

And the guy got up, toweled off, won the next few points, and went on to hold serve and win the final.

Nerves of steel and a will to compete that is out of this world.

tenor.gif


From a Fed fan: Nadal is extraordinarily consistent ....









... at not winning AO for 9 years straight. Vamos!

FlimsyIncompatibleAnemonecrab-size_restricted.gif
 

1HBHNation

Rookie
Also possible that the tears aren't fake but some 'fedfans' are ;)

Yea I question if some of these "Federer fans" aren't just Nadal fans masquerading around in sheep's clothing praising his fight and grit and mad respect for him. Etc...
 

1HBHNation

Rookie
I love Nadal, but why isn't he ever "injured" during the French Open or when he plays Federer?

And why has he never retired or gotten hurt when he's up in the match. Hmmmmm.... I bet you if he didn't lose that break in the 5th and won against cilic yesterday. This "leg injury" wouldn't even be a thing. That MRI is gonna be normal guys. Sorry to spoil the ending for ya. He's gonna be bouncing around like a jackrabbit on steroids come French open time.
 

Steve0904

Talk Tennis Guru
I've always thought Nadal was extraordinary even when he was beating Federer and I didn't like it. He doesn't deserve to be catching flak for his injury in this particular instance, but his reputation isn't that great on this front so I get it (not that I'm condoning anybody who wishes him an injury, I'm not).

As far as him being healthy and Cilic losing, that's not a guarantee. It never was and it was evident if you watched the match. I don't care how good you think Nadal is. Him being unbeatable at 100% (even against Cilic) is a total myth that needs to be stamped out. I can start with a couple matches on grass against Rosol and Muller (or any other on grass). Apparently if Nadal was that good at 100% surface shouldn't matter should it? For that matter it doesn't matter if it was 2015 or 2016 (and the same goes for Fed's 2013). You take the court, they all count. Verdasco, Fognini, Brown, and the list goes on.

Give Nadal his proper credit, but don't BS us with the whole Rafa is unbeatable because he's a warrior line. It's old and tired and completely false anyway. He was uninjured last year against Muller, fist pumping like a mad man and it didn't make one ounce of difference to the final result.
 

BeatlesFan

Bionic Poster
Lmao at these fake crocodile tears from fedfans today that Nadal lost.

Who are you to speak for Fed fans? Even when Fed fans pay tribute to Nadal, you still are bitter which is beyond pathetic. So if Fed fans rejoice he's out, they're losers and when they legitimately post favorable words about him, it's "crocodile tears." I see you have all the angles covered.
 

mike danny

Bionic Poster
Lmao at these fake crocodile tears from fedfans today that Nadal lost. I'll speak the truth that they're trying to say which is that they're ecstatic. Now they're playing w house money.
So what do you want from us? No Fed fan will ever wish injury to a player because injury is the worst ever way to go out. I would have preferred to see Rafa beaten fair and square than what actually transpired.
 

sarmpas

Hall of Fame
On clay he's stellar, extraordinary. Off clay being faster, fitter, stronger allowed him to overcome his tennis deficiencies on those other surfaces and be a great success. With physical decline were seeing how much game he has off clay, he can't at will make the contest a war of attrition any more.
 

1HBHNation

Rookie
Lmao at all the hate from fed fans. Lets be honest here... You know u didn't wanna face rafa Nadal in the finals with vengance on his mind. Fed fans be parading in the streets today like it's Christmas.
 

1HBHNation

Rookie
So what do you want from us? No Fed fan will ever wish injury to a player because injury is the worst ever way to go out. I would have preferred to see Rafa beaten fair and square than what actually transpired.
Im not saying ur rooting 4 injury. Just ecstatic he lost. Rafa was beaten yesterday by the big man. Can't take nothing away from Marin county cilic as brad Gilbert calls him.
 

JoshuaPim

Semi-Pro
This thread reminds me of St Patrick's Day in Ireland. Starts out calm and civilised but ends up in a drunken brawl. So predictable!!
 

skip1969

G.O.A.T.
I've never understood why whenever Nadal loses, it's nothing but praise and glory for how wonderful he is; what an athlete; what a fighter; what an ultimate warrior . . .

TTW goes gaga over him like he's some God. It's re-donkulous. Just about every athlete who reaches the apex of his/her sport and stays there for any serious length of time is a fighter, a competitor, an amazing specimen. That's how they got to the top. Poasters here make the mistake of thinking that just because Nadal grunts louder, grimaces more, grinds out rally after rally, screams, yells, and flexes his biceps in his sleeveless tank tops, that somehow he's the epitome of a champion.

Did any of you witness Borg, or Evert, or Sampras at their peaks? How about Martina, or Steffi, or McEnroe or any other long-standing Number 1? Those players were all ruthless. They all had killer instincts. At their peaks, they steamrolled people. They were merciless. Competitive as hell. The only difference is they didn't have to win two-hundred 25-stroke rallies to win. They didn't win by attrition. They didn't have games that necessitated that sort of time or energy. Nadal's own style of play makes him have to earn every point with monumental effort and strain. But that doesn't make him any more of a warrior than anybody else. It doesn't give him a bigger heart, nor does it make him more courageous.

I'm with @nikdom on this one. Why would I want Nadal playing a 30-shot rally to save my life, when I could just have Sampras save me with an ace?
 

ingvar

Rookie
23 > 15...

Sampras and Federer may have acumen in spades (and no, Federer's serve is not close to Sampras' just like Sampras' ground game is not close to Federer's), but they have more than once wilted when they could not overwhelm their opponents with their respective talent.

Nadal will fight, and most likely win, as long as his body holds out. you can't count on 1 hand the amount of times a healthy, motivated Nadal wilted in the face of competition.

Look I dont want to derail the good spirits in this thread, but this big match stuff you proclaim above is a complete myth and legend. EVERY SINGLE grand slam is a big match. Nadals repeated losses in the 4th round, 1st round, 2nd round, QF and repeatedly to mugs when nads is in his very peak are all examples of big matches he lost when as you put it a healthy, motivated nadal couldnt overwhelm his competition. Its not on one hand as you put it. The competition in those cases was a 100 ranked player having a good day, sometimes it was a top 20 player. He regularly turns what should be routine straight set beat downs in to "epic 5 hour battles" and turns what should be 90 minute masterclasses into 5 hour marathons

This whole id bet my life on rafa is also nonsense.
Statistically you'd be much better betting on fed or djok as they are actually going to reach a final and then its 50 50 what will hapen. With nads theres a very high chance he will be knocked out 4th round or even 1st round. In feds peak you didnt even need to watch tennis matches until the semi finals as you know he would go through. You didnt even need to watch the semi you know he would be in the final. These days I actually watch old man feds QF matches live as I am not sure he will win. Nads has an air of epicness about his as he wears short sleeves, has bigger biceps than most tennis players and grunts and shouts and yells. He also has an air of epicness about him because of his amazing shots, defense, defense to attack but it is the extras like the shouting etc that adds up for the whole package. Its not so much results

put it this way if you are happy to overlook nads countless 4th round, 2nd round, QF and mug losses and only focus on his big matches that he won such as W08 AO 09 then you might as well completely forget about all of feds or djokovics losses in FINALS (as a pose to 4th rounds like nads) and only remember their big wins

And all pros are carrying injuries, aches and pains and have home and personal issues. Some people broadcast them some dont. Fed has never mentioned having 4 kids in a negative way but surely that has affected him and he has injuries his whole career he doesnt like to talk about. Djokovic clearly has a lot of crap going on in his personal life

and yes if it is not clear nadal is epic and amazing. an idiot would think otherwise. Their are plenty of reasons to like him and be a fan. Their are plenty of reasons to actively not like him or not be interested but in no universe is he not an amazing player and epic
 
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smoledman

G.O.A.T.
I never understood this 'betting my life on Player X' business. Imagine if even Rafa had to play for your life, he'd be so wrecked with nervousness he'd lose 6-0, 6-0, 6-0.
 

Federev

Legend
This thread reminds me of St Patrick's Day in Ireland. Starts out calm and civilised but ends up in a drunken brawl. So predictable!!
So TRUE! That is every thread here.

Even when it starts out as a thread about Martina Navratilova's changes in eye wear throughout her career - and wether the French or Italian eye glass frame designers were using better factory plastics and color dye techniques -

Somehow it still ends up in a Fedal bloodbath
 

Federev

Legend
some fa
I've always thought Nadal was extraordinary even when he was beating Federer and I didn't like it. He doesn't deserve to be catching flak for his injury in this particular instance, but his reputation isn't that great on this front so I get it (not that I'm condoning anybody who wishes him an injury, I'm not).

As far as him being healthy and Cilic losing, that's not a guarantee. It never was and it was evident if you watched the match. I don't care how good you think Nadal is. Him being unbeatable at 100% (even against Cilic) is a total myth that needs to be stamped out. I can start with a couple matches on grass against Rosol and Muller (or any other on grass). Apparently if Nadal was that good at 100% surface shouldn't matter should it? For that matter it doesn't matter if it was 2015 or 2016 (and the same goes for Fed's 2013). You take the court, they all count. Verdasco, Fognini, Brown, and the list goes on.

Give Nadal his proper credit, but don't BS us with the whole Rafa is unbeatable because he's a warrior line. It's old and tired and completely false anyway. He was uninjured last year against Muller, fist pumping like a mad man and it didn't make one ounce of difference to the final result.

Some fair points. Maybe I'm wrong about Cilic/Nadal. Cilic can def get the job done and GOAT insane on his day (see USO'14). I just saw Nadal as so hampered after taking the 3rd that I thought that was definitive.

And - for myself - I put him up there in the top 2 w Fed (w Fed as GOAT) because I do buy the hype that they made each other better.

Anyway - you made some good points.
 

Federer_pilon

Professional
Not saying he isn't mentally tough, but people like to say 'If my life were on the line, I'd let Nadal play a point for me'.

B.S!!

I'd take Pete Sampras or Federer putting in a first serve any day over Nadal playing an extended rally for my life.

I think people usually say they would let Nadal play a match for them, not just one single point lol
IMO it makes a huge difference...
 
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