My consistent medium pace flatter serve video.

keepurpowderdry · Dec 29, 2009

Hi everyone Happy Holidays !

This is my consistent medium pace flatter serve. I was hoping to get some feed back on this ONE Type of serve .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=it9Y69gL8NM

Thank all for the time ...

Tony

Jaewonnie · Dec 29, 2009

Idk, but sorta seems rushed.

Anyways, more body action would help. Also it looks like you'd be able to get more racket speed too.

keepurpowderdry · Dec 29, 2009

Jaewonnie said:
Idk, but sorta seems rushed.

Anyways, more body action would help. Also it looks like you'd be able to get more racket speed too.

Lol ... Yep

It was my first time ever operating a video camera and was all excited to see it haha I am such a dork .. I hate electronic gizmos though but the end results is so fun. Thanks for your reply.

Jonny S&V · Dec 29, 2009

It's a nice motion, good rhythm. I'm nit-picking here since I don't see anything blatantly wrong with it, but I would work on using your legs a smidge more, as well as really trying for extension. All in all though, a nice serve, although if this is medium pace, I would like to see 90%. Does your technique break down as the speed goes up?

keepurpowderdry · Dec 29, 2009

Jonny S&V said:
It's a nice motion, good rhythm. I'm nit-picking here since I don't see anything blatantly wrong with it, but I would work on using your legs a smidge more, as well as really trying for extension. All in all though, a nice serve, although if this is medium pace, I would like to see 90%. Does your technique break down as the speed goes up?

When I go 90 percent I change my grip just a little more towards the shaking hands grip (hammer grip) and add a tiny bit more slice. Also change this on my second serve and everyone tells me my second is tougher to return than my flat first serve. But when i look at it from my view it seems the other way around ???? lol.. I think your right about using my legs more but I will have to practice that allot. My serves have been this way since I was 14 years old self taught . I will post a 90% one in the future but tonight I am going to try and make a video of ground stokes or some doubles match play . This christmas gift is so fun . I think I am gonna be addicted to making videos lol..

quicken · Dec 29, 2009

Keep your off hand up longer it helps man.
Great improvement so far

keepurpowderdry · Dec 29, 2009

quicken said:
Keep your off hand up longer it helps man.
Great improvement so far

Ok man thank you. I never even thought that .

UnforcedError · Dec 29, 2009

Just my opinion but looks to me like your left arm isn't ever getting up enough which might be the reason it looks like you you are swinging through/down at the ball instead of more up into the ball.

VaBeachTennis · Dec 29, 2009

You did look a little rushed because of the camera. Nice scenery there!

keepurpowderdry · Dec 29, 2009

UnforcedError said:
Just my opinion but looks to me like your left arm isn't ever getting up enough which might be the reason it looks like you you are swinging through/down at the ball instead of more up into the ball.

I think I swing like that more so when i hit flat. Thank you for your reply .

keepurpowderdry · Dec 29, 2009

VaBeachTennis said:
You did look a little rushed because of the camera. Nice scenery there!

Lol ... Yea I was all excited

Yeah thats Rancho Cucamonga California. You should see it at dusk.. Man I always stop myself while playing just to understand how lucky I am to be enjoying the sport I love so much and have a scenery like that to go with it.

Zachol82 · Dec 29, 2009

If your second serve is a kick serve or a slice serve, then yea it's probably harder to return than a medium-pace flat serve.

People's minds tend to anticipate a lot of the times. Ever watch a Tennis game where there's an awesome, fast-paced rally going on and one person's ball flies into the net but your eyes actually look way past that? Yea, same concept. A fast-paced, flat serve is great, but right as the ball leaves your racket, your opponent's eyes should have picked up and anticipated where it's going. All your opponent needs to do is stick his/her racket out and block the ball back.

As for a serve with any sort of spin on it, the eye must constantly track where the ball is going as it leaves your racket, and even after it bounces, since the ball usually does its weird thing after the bounce. A spin serve is actually quite hard for your opponent to just simply stick his/her racket out to block back, some force is actually necessary to return a spin serve to a desirable spot on the court.

keepurpowderdry · Dec 30, 2009

Zachol82 said:
If your second serve is a kick serve or a slice serve, then yea it's probably harder to return than a medium-pace flat serve.

People's minds tend to anticipate a lot of the times. Ever watch a Tennis game where there's an awesome, fast-paced rally going on and one person's ball flies into the net but your eyes actually look way past that? Yea, same concept. A fast-paced, flat serve is great, but right as the ball leaves your racket, your opponent's eyes should have picked up and anticipated where it's going. All your opponent needs to do is stick his/her racket out and block the ball back.

As for a serve with any sort of spin on it, the eye must constantly track where the ball is going as it leaves your racket, and even after it bounces, since the ball usually does its weird thing after the bounce. A spin serve is actually quite hard for your opponent to just simply stick his/her racket out to block back, some force is actually necessary to return a spin serve to a desirable spot on the court.

Thanks for your input . I stated that I just put a slightly small spin to it. when I decide to stick with hitting flat on a second serve. But I generate a faster serve . Meaning my second serve is faster than my first serve.

xFullCourtTenniSx · Dec 30, 2009

keepurpowderdry said:
This is my consistent medium pace flatter serve. I was hoping to get some feed back on this ONE Type of serve .

It looked like you missed the 2nd and 4th serves, but I could wrong. I'm 99% sure the 2nd one was long though. 50% doesn't qualify for consistent. :wink: Also, use a basket, it'll keep you from being rushed and you won't look quite so queer in the video, meaning more chicks for you!

Jonny S&V said:
I would like to see 90%.

As would I.

Zachol82 said:
A spin serve is actually quite hard for your opponent to just simply stick his/her racket out to block back, some force is actually necessary to return a spin serve to a desirable spot on the court.

Depends. Some are actually quite easy to block back as well, but you can't stick your racket out with a firm wrist to pull it off. If it bounces into your strike zone with plenty of pace and penetration, it's still pretty easy as long as it doesn't stretch you too badly. But you're right that force is needed to control it. A better way of saying it is that some spin usage is required to control it, depending on how heavy the spin is. Though that's not always possible, so you might have to drive through the ball while it still hasn't gotten away from you (before it's too high or too wide).

keepurpowderdry said:
Meaning my second serve is faster than my first serve.

... Then why not hit your second serve as a first serve AND a second serve? It's illogical to save your faster and more consistent serve for merely second serves. If it's faster, use it as a first serve. The more consistent serve should be the second serve, and therefore it should be slower, but have far more spin and action on it.

LeeD · Dec 30, 2009

OK, you're a big, strong guy who's trying to get into shape.
Medium speed slightly spun is the worst serve you can do, at 3.5 and better levels. It slides medium speed medium pace right into the sweetspot of the opponent, and get's blasted back so you're on the defensive immediately.
By medium speed, I'd bet around 85mph.
Instead of this, either hit a real first serve or hit a real second serve at 70 mph, but double the spin. You're not really swinging or moving into the court, so your potential to raise the speed/speed is pretty high.
As said, SLOW down before you toss. Use legs, use hips, use archer's bow, hold your toss hand up there, spring into the court with a purpose.
Watch some vids of pro male players. Nobody hits medium pace, slightly spun shots EVER.

keepurpowderdry · Dec 30, 2009

LeeD said:
OK, you're a big, strong guy who's trying to get into shape.
Medium speed slightly spun is the worst serve you can do, at 3.5 and better levels. It slides medium speed medium pace right into the sweetspot of the opponent, and get's blasted back so you're on the defensive immediately.
By medium speed, I'd bet around 85mph.
Instead of this, either hit a real first serve or hit a real second serve at 70 mph, but double the spin. You're not really swinging or moving into the court, so your potential to raise the speed/speed is pretty high.
As said, SLOW down before you toss. Use legs, use hips, use archer's bow, hold your toss hand up there, spring into the court with a purpose.
Watch some vids of pro male players. Nobody hits medium pace, slightly spun shots EVER.

You said nobody hits a medium paced, slightly spun shot ever. Lol I have the federer nadal australian final recorded and saw that happen allot . Your telling me you never heard the commentary ever say " HE LET UP ON HIS FIRST SERVE WITH SOME SPIN" . I am sure I heard that more than once in a grand slam event on tv. Thanks for all the other tips.

keepurpowderdry · Dec 30, 2009

xFullCourtTenniSx said:
It looked like you missed the 2nd and 4th serves, but I could wrong. I'm 99% sure the 2nd one was long though. 50% doesn't qualify for consistent. :wink: Also, use a basket, it'll keep you from being rushed and you won't look quite so queer in the video, meaning more chicks for you!

Me missing one shot out of 4 doesn't discredit my claims to having that serve be consistent. I just showed up to the court and turned on the camera ran out across the court on purpose to show i can just pick up the balls and hit 2 good ones and run across the other side and do the same (completely cold no basket needed) So maybe the kids on hear would'nt get all bent out of shape on me , but kids will be kids ... No biggy..

Depends. Some are actually quite easy to block back as well, but you can't stick your racket out with a firm wrist to pull it off. If it bounces into your strike zone with plenty of pace and penetration, it's still pretty easy as long as it doesn't stretch you too badly. But you're right that force is needed to control it. A better way of saying it is that some spin usage is required to control it, depending on how heavy the spin is. Though that's not always possible, so you might have to drive through the ball while it still hasn't gotten away from you (before it's too high or too wide).

... Then why not hit your second serve as a first serve AND a second serve? It's illogical to save your faster and more consistent serve for merely second serves. If it's faster, use it as a first serve. The more consistent serve should be the second serve, and therefore it should be slower, but have far more spin and action on it.

I had to disagree with you again but when it comes down to mental tennis (thinking about what to execute) I don't like being logical because it becomes predictable . The players i play with can do anything with the ball so I have to mix it up allot.

keepurpowderdry · Dec 30, 2009

xFullCourtTenniSx said:
It looked like you missed the 2nd and 4th serves, but I could wrong. I'm 99% sure the 2nd one was long though. 50% doesn't qualify for consistent. :wink: Also, use a basket, it'll keep you from being rushed and you won't look quite so queer in the video, meaning more chicks for you!

As would I.

Depends. Some are actually quite easy to block back as well, but you can't stick your racket out with a firm wrist to pull it off. If it bounces into your strike zone with plenty of pace and penetration, it's still pretty easy as long as it doesn't stretch you too badly. But you're right that force is needed to control it. A better way of saying it is that some spin usage is required to control it, depending on how heavy the spin is. Though that's not always possible, so you might have to drive through the ball while it still hasn't gotten away from you (before it's too high or too wide).

... Then why not hit your second serve as a first serve AND a second serve? It's illogical to save your faster and more consistent serve for merely second serves. If it's faster, use it as a first serve. The more consistent serve should be the second serve, and therefore it should be slower, but have far more spin and action on it.

Me missing one shot out of 4 doesn't discredit my claims to having that serve be consistent. I just showed up to the court and turned on the camera ran out across the court on purpose to show i can just pick up the balls and hit 2 good ones and run across the other side and do the same (completely cold no basket needed) So maybe the kids on hear would'nt get all bent out of shape on me , but kids will be kids ... No biggy..

Blake0 · Dec 31, 2009

Considering being rushed and excited..and you only missed 1 out of 4 serves, that is a pretty consistent serve

. Nice motion, overall a pretty good serve. Seems kind of muscled for some reason.
I'm not really good with analyzing serves..so im not sure.

That keeping the left arm up longer someone mentioned. That'll help.

keepurpowderdry · Dec 31, 2009

Blake0 said:
Considering being rushed and excited..and you only missed 1 out of 4 serves, that is a pretty consistent serve . Nice motion, overall a pretty good serve. Seems kind of muscled for some reason.
I'm not really good with analyzing serves..so im not sure.

That keeping the left arm up longer someone mentioned. That'll help.

Thank you blako ! I tried keeping my toss hand up through the whole shot and yes it does bring me to follow through the serve so that i was falling into the court. It actually felt pretty natural

Thanks again..

xFullCourtTenniSx · Dec 31, 2009

keepurpowderdry said:
You said nobody hits a medium paced, slightly spun shot ever. Lol I have the federer nadal australian final recorded and saw that happen allot . Your telling me you never heard the commentary ever say " HE LET UP ON HIS FIRST SERVE WITH SOME SPIN" . I am sure I heard that more than once in a grand slam event on tv. Thanks for all the other tips.

Well, "some spin" is around 1000 RPM for pros... When I slow down a serve and use "some spin", I'm actually using a lot to make sure it goes in...

Federer's first serve percentage was insanely low, so there's no way he was going for a bunch of medium paced spin serves.

Nadal's normal speed is relatively low, but he uses very heavy spin.

You don't really let up on your serve except when you throw in the wide one or the occasional change up, which are still hit with heavy spin.

keepurpowderdry said:
I had to disagree with you again but when it comes down to mental tennis (thinking about what to execute) I don't like being logical because it becomes predictable . The players i play with can do anything with the ball so I have to mix it up allot.

... You're dumb. Being logical in this sense doesn't mean being predictable, it means being smart. You use the safer serve as the second serve. Otherwise, your first serve is going to get killed, you'll double fault far more often, and your chances of holding serve are rather minimal.

Mixing it up means changing up the spin, placement, and/or pace. It doesn't mean do something out of the ordinary that is crazy.

You hold serve by keeping a high first serve percentage and using first serves that set the point up for you or win you a bunch of free points. You don't hold with low first serve percentages and taking risks on the second serve.

keepurpowderdry said:
Me missing one shot out of 4 doesn't discredit my claims to having that serve be consistent.

Looked like 2 out of 4. But like I said, I could've been wrong, so don't mess yourself about it.

keepurpowderdry · Feb 14, 2010

xFullCourtTenniSx said:
Well, "some spin" is around 1000 RPM for pros... When I slow down a serve and use "some spin", I'm actually using a lot to make sure it goes in...

Federer's first serve percentage was insanely low, so there's no way he was going for a bunch of medium paced spin serves.

Nadal's normal speed is relatively low, but he uses very heavy spin.

You don't really let up on your serve except when you throw in the wide one or the occasional change up, which are still hit with heavy spin.

... You're dumb. Being logical in this sense doesn't mean being predictable, it means being smart. You use the safer serve as the second serve. Otherwise, your first serve is going to get killed, you'll double fault far more often, and your chances of holding serve are rather minimal.

Mixing it up means changing up the spin, placement, and/or pace. It doesn't mean do something out of the ordinary that is crazy.

You hold serve by keeping a high first serve percentage and using first serves that set the point up for you or win you a bunch of free points. You don't hold with low first serve percentages and taking risks on the second serve.

Looked like 2 out of 4. But like I said, I could've been wrong, so don't mess yourself about it.

I never double fault . actually everyone says my second serve is the same speed as my first serve with more action

ps2dcgba · Feb 14, 2010

Wow! first off BEAUUUUUTIFUL scenery you have! You lucky bastich!!!
The pace of your serve looks wicked, esp off the far end, normally people say on camera your serve looks slower ( mine is anyway) but your's looks like it has some heat on it, how tall are you if you don't mind me askin ;-p.
Thanks for sharing, and keep workin at it, all the best!

LeeD · Feb 15, 2010

Nothing to be proud of when anyone says..."my second serve is just as fast as my first serve"...
That just means you puffball ball your first serve, and it's slow but doesn't go in!
Do any pro players hit second serves as fast or faster than their first serves?
Guess what? NO.
So your nice second serve is great up to 4.0 levels, then your lack of a first serve means you're gonna lose most matches due to weak, slow servers.

keepurpowderdry · Feb 15, 2010

LeeD said:
Nothing to be proud of when anyone says..."my second serve is just as fast as my first serve"...
That just means you puffball ball your first serve, and it's slow but doesn't go in!
Do any pro players hit second serves as fast or faster than their first serves?
Guess what? NO.
So your nice second serve is great up to 4.0 levels, then your lack of a first serve means you're gonna lose most matches due to weak, slow servers.

I am proud of my serve

Sorry if your offended by me being proud... Kinda wierd but if thats how you feel thats how ya feel lol..These are my 4 puffball serves before I start to practice tennis. I did these 4 puffball serves for fun right when i got to the courts. one of them was out but I just got to the court lol...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=it9Y69gL8NM

keepurpowderdry · Feb 15, 2010

ps2dcgba said:
Wow! first off BEAUUUUUTIFUL scenery you have! You lucky bastich!!!
The pace of your serve looks wicked, esp off the far end, normally people say on camera your serve looks slower ( mine is anyway) but your's looks like it has some heat on it, how tall are you if you don't mind me askin ;-p.
Thanks for sharing, and keep workin at it, all the best!

Thanks man . I am 5'9 .. Yeah i love the scenery big time..

LeeD · Feb 16, 2010

OK, Mr KNOW IT ALL ...
Why ask for tips when you know everything?
I think you should continue practicing medium speed, medium spin serves.
As for pro's serving..... first of all commentator knows, but doesn't say the truth, because YOU don't understand it.
Pros mix up their serves, hit one flat, hit one spun with pace, one spun with less pace, then back to flats. All flats are fast. All spins are swung FASTER than swing for flats.
You don't know, don't assume you do.

defrule · Feb 16, 2010

I suggest practicing with more balls, sucks having to run to the other side after every 2 serves.

Nellie · Feb 16, 2010

If you want more pace - you need to get that toss higher and further out. Your toss is slightly overhead and to the right, meaning that all of the power comes from the arm and not from a forward weight shift. You note, for example, that you start and stop the serve in the same location (not movement)

keepurpowderdry · Feb 16, 2010

LeeD said:
OK, you're a big, strong guy who's trying to get into shape.
Medium speed slightly spun is the worst serve you can do, at 3.5 and better levels. It slides medium speed medium pace right into the sweetspot of the opponent, and get's blasted back so you're on the defensive immediately.
By medium speed, I'd bet around 85mph.
Instead of this, either hit a real first serve or hit a real second serve at 70 mph, but double the spin. You're not really swinging or moving into the court, so your potential to raise the speed/speed is pretty high.
As said, SLOW down before you toss. Use legs, use hips, use archer's bow, hold your toss hand up there, spring into the court with a purpose.
Watch some vids of pro male players. Nobody hits medium pace, slightly spun shots EVER.

again I understand and agree with your input, but my medium consistant speed is around 100 . and 3.5 or even 4.5 can't blast it back ..

EikelBeiter · Feb 16, 2010

You are tossing the ball a little too low, this is probably because of your fast rythem, but I feel you are not hitting the ball as high as you could hit it.

You don't create enough torque in your mid section by winding up your shoulders against your hips.

So I would work on your throphy position if i were you, keeping in mind the two points above.

keepurpowderdry · Feb 16, 2010

EikelBeiter said:
You are tossing the ball a little too low, this is probably because of your fast rythem, but I feel you are not hitting the ball as high as you could hit it.

You don't create enough torque in your mid section by winding up your shoulders against your hips.

So I would work on your throphy position if i were you, keeping in mind the two points above.

Awesome ! .. Ok I will practice that and also watch some pro players on video that have those two quality's. If you don't mind I will send you a video of my progression... Thanks again.. and keep painting those lines .. Tennis tonight weeeee

keepurpowderdry · Feb 16, 2010

LeeD said:
OK, Mr KNOW IT ALL ...
Why ask for tips when you know everything?
I think you should continue practicing medium speed, medium spin serves.
As for pro's serving..... first of all commentator knows, but doesn't say the truth, because YOU don't understand it.
Pros mix up their serves, hit one flat, hit one spun with pace, one spun with less pace, then back to flats. All flats are fast. All spins are swung FASTER than swing for flats.
You don't know, don't assume you do.

I really do appreciate your input minus all the childish talk.. Strange though , because you have said some one liners that make me think your older ?????

keepurpowderdry · Feb 16, 2010

defrule said:
I suggest practicing with more balls, sucks having to run to the other side after every 2 serves.

LOL I did that to show a certain person that I can hit 4 serve cold .. No warm up

EikelBeiter · Feb 16, 2010

keepurpowderdry said:
Awesome ! .. Ok I will practice that and also watch some pro players on video that have those two quality's. If you don't mind I will send you a video of my progression... Thanks again.. and keep painting those lines .. Tennis tonight weeeee

sure np

Have a good practise.

keepurpowderdry · Feb 16, 2010

Nellie said:
If you want more pace - you need to get that toss higher and further out. Your toss is slightly overhead and to the right, meaning that all of the power comes from the arm and not from a forward weight shift. You note, for example, that you start and stop the serve in the same location (not movement)

thanks man, you got me thinking.. no one as of yet can really handle my pace and I have been really working on placement and have got it down so well I can go either side or into the body at will.. Should I really change my serve the ways you guys are correctly telling me to just to get from average 100 to 100+ ? I mean I am only generally playing 4.0 to 4.5 guys and one day a week I hit with a small group of 5.5 guys. but not in tournament's ... Sorry if I am changing my thinking it's good though you guys are getting me to think this through .. Thank you so much for your response ..

My consistent medium pace flatter serve video.

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