Slickest Syn Gut for particular Polys in Poly/Syn gut hybrids

Allcourtguy · Apr 17, 2017

The way I understand the TWU String performance statistics is that the string-to-string friction is measured as a full bed of the string being tested. But when you start mixing strings in a hybrid, the numbers don't always hold true. I am using HyperG as my main right now and had been using Volkl Classic Syn Gut as a cross. I am getting ready to try V-Wrap as a cross per a post I saw a few days ago by SpinToWin.

I am wondering if it is worthwhile for any of you poly/syn gut "hybriders" out there to combine our experiences and try to find the slickest syn gut for each particular poly? A Syn Gut that works well with one poly may not do so well with another. For instance, from the people who have tried multiple syn gut crosses with HyperG, I would like to know which one they have found to be the slickest. Might save dome trial and error, not to mention cost.

But I would like to see the same thing for other polys and try to compile a list of recommended syn guts for each different poly main.

Do you think this is an exercise in futility? Or does anyone else see any value in this idea?

Opinions welcomed....

Here are the recommendations so far for specific poly / syn gut combinations that slide easily against each other:

HyperG / Volkl V-Wrap
Black Force / Gutex Ultra
Cyber Flash / Gutex Ultra
Big Hitter Blue / Tourna Syn Gut Armor
kirschbaum proline x 1.20 in mains / kirschbaum plain syn gut 1.25

Traffic · Apr 17, 2017

Great topic. I'd be interested at a slick(er) and possibly softer S-gut than the OGSM. However, at the price point for the performance, I'm not sure I can rationalize moving away from it. With hybriding, I get over 32 stringings for $43.

Muppet · Apr 17, 2017

It's so subjective which cross strings a player will like for each poly main. I'd recommend that once you've settled on your poly main, order a few and order a few different syngut crosses. You can approach it with some logic. A very crisp and lively main string will combine well with a more muted or mushy cross string. Think complementary parts. The main will provide more of the playability and the cross will provide more of the feel. It's more important to have a slippery cross, but both is very good. I'm still trying to figure out what combinations can cause the crosses to notch and what part my flexible frame plays in this.

Allcourtguy · Apr 17, 2017

Muppet said:
It's so subjective which cross strings a player will like for each poly main. I'd recommend that once you've settled on your poly main, order a few and order a few different syngut crosses. You can approach it with some logic. A very crisp and lively main string will combine well with a more muted or mushy cross string. Think complementary parts. The main will provide more of the playability and the cross will provide more of the feel. It's more important to have a slippery cross, but both is very good. I'm still trying to figure out what combinations can cause the crosses to notch and what part my flexible frame plays in this.

I personally have pretty much settled on HyperG as my main, and am beginning to experiment with different crosses. We will see how it goes...

swinter07 · Apr 17, 2017

According to this

"If the cross is softer than the main", it has negative affect on snapback of the main.

ChicagoJack said:
If the cross is softer than the main, the main will sink into the cross. To initiate movement along the cross, the main will first have to climb a hill out of the valley it sits in, but also it will have to continually plow its way forward as it moves and sinks down the length of the cross. If the cross is a multifilament or multistrand string, it can also fray and break filaments. These can stick up as obstacles, hooks, or spikes that can slow movement over them. If the main is softer than the cross, it will deform over the cross such that it forms a slot or groove to move over the cross. That may actually facilitate movement

So I'm thinking that soft durable main & stiff slick cross maybe way better for snapback ?

And have read that babolat stringsavers are suitable cuz they are slick

Traffic · Apr 17, 2017

Allcourtguy said:
I personally have pretty much settled on HyperG as my main, and am beginning to experiment with different crosses. We will see how it goes...

My son just switched from cyclone to hyper g. So would be very interested in your experience.

ricardo · Apr 17, 2017

Slicky SG but only for a few minutes...

I tried several SG that TWU considers slicky.

And I always get dissapointed.

They are slicky alright but only for a few minutes, at the most, 1 hour.

If I want a slippery set up with any string, I just install Babolat Elastocross (10x12).
The strings remains slippery until they break.
As a bonus, I get significantly extended string life.

fjcamry · Apr 17, 2017

I'm using a round co poly kirschbaum proline x in the mains as a crisp lively string with the kirschbaum regular synthetic gut in the crosses as a muted mushy string . I just take care to move the mains back and forth over the crosses to make movement better as I play . The reverse of syngut mains and proline ll in the crosses tends to be more syn gut playability with a boardlike feel of the co poly crosses but it does have better directional control vs a full syngut .

This all just says that I prefer stiffer mains and softer crosses. I grew up playing with prince original synthetic gut 16g in a head 600 elite pro 18x20 at 60-65 lbs . Much better feel. But I prefer the stiffer mains rather than a mushy syngut in the mains. I read that the kirschbaum regular synthetic gut plays much like prince tournament synthetic gut. That's ok it's going in the crosses after all.

If you put the syngut in reverse as in the mains and a slick co poly in the crosses then you get plenty of movement of syngut mains over slick crosses . It's more pop from the syngut mains but the feel and directional control from the co poly crosses .

One more thing , my preference for the kirschbaum proline x 1.20 in the mains is based on the strings main take away as excellent with placing big serves. It's excellent with location because it's a crisp / control string .The string puts out what you put into it.

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fjcamry · Apr 19, 2017

swinter07 said:
According to this

"If the cross is softer than the main", it has negative affect on snapback of the main.

So I'm thinking that soft durable main & stiff slick cross maybe way better for snapback ?

And have read that babolat stringsavers are suitable cuz they are slick

Yes but I want the mains to be the crisp control kirschbaum proline x and the plain syngut in the cross for its muted feel. The mains help with location and it's main take away is placement on serves . I just move the mains over the crosses in between sets or games to facilitate movement .

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Allcourtguy · Apr 19, 2017

Traffic said:
My son just switched from cyclone to hyper g. So would be very interested in your experience.

I used cyclone for a while and found it to have a plasticky feel and it was a little harsh when I hit high in the hoop of my DR98s. I then went to HyperG 18g and loved the feel, control, spin and ability to do pretty much anything I wanted with it. Bu Ii wanted more pop on my volleys, so I switched to HyperG 18g in the mains and am experimenting with syn guts in the crosses. I mostly play doubles, if I was mostly singles I could have stuck with a full bed of HyperG.

Traffic · Apr 19, 2017

Allcourtguy said:
I used cyclone for a while and found it to have a plasticky feel and it was a little harsh when I hit high in the hoop of my DR98s. I then went to HyperG 18g and loved the feel, control, spin and ability to do pretty much anything I wanted with it. Bu Ii wanted more pop on my volleys, so I switched to HyperG 18g in the mains and am experimenting with syn guts in the crosses. I mostly play doubles, if I was mostly singles I could have stuck with a full bed of HyperG.

Thanks for the feedback. My boy has hyperG 18/OGSM at the moment and he says it's his favorite so far. I'll be ordering a few more sets to get ready for tournaments picking up in May.

Doc Hollidae · Apr 19, 2017

Tourna syn gut armor is pretty slick.

fjcamry · Apr 20, 2017

It's also observed that hybrids tend to be slicker than full beds . This saying in poly / syngut hybrids will have more slipperiness than full beds .

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fjcamry · Apr 20, 2017

Muppet said:
It's so subjective which cross strings a player will like for each poly main. I'd recommend that once you've settled on your poly main, order a few and order a few different syngut crosses. You can approach it with some logic. A very crisp and lively main string will combine well with a more muted or mushy cross string. Think complementary parts. The main will provide more of the playability and the cross will provide more of the feel. It's more important to have a slippery cross, but both is very good. I'm still trying to figure out what combinations can cause the crosses to notch and what part my flexible frame plays in this.

I prefer the kirschbaum proline x 1.20 in mains / kirschbaum plain syn gut 1.25 in crosses for its placement of serves / muted ,soft feel.

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Allcourtguy · Apr 20, 2017

Doc Hollidae said:
Tourna syn gut armor is pretty slick.

Hi Doc,
since I am trying to find particular combinations of poly/syn gut hybrids, I would like to ask you which polys that you tried with Tourna syn gut armor you found to slide the best against it?

Doc Hollidae · Apr 20, 2017

Allcourtguy said:
Hi Doc,
since I am trying to find particular combinations of poly/syn gut hybrids, I would like to ask you which polys that you tried with Tourna syn gut armor you found to slide the best against it?

I did Tourna Big Hitter Blue Mains with Tourna Syn Gut Armor. Strung at 54/51. I'm pretty much only play with Tourna strings, outside of testing. Solinco Hyper G has been the one exception. I'm considering moving to Hyper G over BHB.

swinter07 · Apr 20, 2017

Doc Hollidae said:
I did Tourna Big Hitter Blue Mains with Tourna Syn Gut Armor. Strung at 54/51. I'm pretty much only play with Tourna strings, outside of testing. Solinco Hyper G has been the one exception. I'm considering moving to Hyper G over BHB.

For how long does Hyper-G keep its playability and control ?

Doc Hollidae · Apr 20, 2017

swinter07 said:
For how long does Hyper-G keep its playability and control ?

For me? Longer than any other poly I've tried. While tension does drop, the shape of the string keeps the it playable longer since it bites into the ball so well.

fuzz nation · Apr 20, 2017

fjcamry said:
If you put the syngut in reverse as in the mains and a slick co poly in the crosses then you get plenty of movement of syngut mains over slick crosses . It's more pop from the syngut mains but the feel and directional control from the co poly crosses .

Agree with these findings - syn. gut mains seem to be able to move nicely when combined with a smooth poly cross, but this hybrid offers me a mild bump in control compared with a full bed of syn. gut.

My Volkl C10's give me plenty of power and decent feel when strung with 17 ga. syn. gut in a full bed at perhaps 56 or 57 lbs. I didn't much care for a hybrid including 1.20mm poly mains and 1.30 syn. gut crosses all tensioned at either 50 or 48 lbs. Not awful, but a little too clunky for me despite the lighter gauge of poly at moderate tension.

When I compared a full bed of syn. gut in one of my C10's against another strung with that 17 ga. syn. gut in the mains and 1.25mm poly crosses (55M/45C lbs.), I found a feel that was much more manageable and the response of the hybrid was just a little more composed than the lively setup of full syn. gut.

I generally also use regular Kirschbaum Syn. Gut these days for the full beds in my frames, but when I install hybrids for others, I usually like Gosen OGSM 16 for it's combo of slickness and durability as a cross. There are several other decent syn. guts out there, but I haven't auditioned too many. Prince Original SG is fine, but it didn't lure me away from the affordable K-baum SG that I'm buying in reels. Same experience with Volkl's Classic SG.

fjcamry · Apr 21, 2017

fuzz nation said:
Agree with these findings - syn. gut mains seem to be able to move nicely when combined with a smooth poly cross, but this hybrid offers me a mild bump in control compared with a full bed of syn. gut.

My Volkl C10's give me plenty of power and decent feel when strung with 17 ga. syn. gut in a full bed at perhaps 56 or 57 lbs. I didn't much care for a hybrid including 1.20mm poly mains and 1.30 syn. gut crosses all tensioned at either 50 or 48 lbs. Not awful, but a little too clunky for me despite the lighter gauge of poly at moderate tension.

When I compared a full bed of syn. gut in one of my C10's against another strung with that 17 ga. syn. gut in the mains and 1.25mm poly crosses (55M/45C lbs.), I found a feel that was much more manageable and the response of the hybrid was just a little more composed than the lively setup of full syn. gut.

I generally also use regular Kirschbaum Syn. Gut these days for the full beds in my frames, but when I install hybrids for others, I usually like Gosen OGSM 16 for it's combo of slickness and durability as a cross. There are several other decent syn. guts out there, but I haven't auditioned too many. Prince Original SG is fine, but it didn't lure me away from the affordable K-baum SG that I'm buying in reels. Same experience with Volkl's Classic SG.

I have some problems with depth perception when playing doubles and the syngut in the mains and poly crosses. It was easier to hit with topspin and the ball dip at their feet by the net . It was harder to drive it past the net players and deep a foot in front of the baseline . I would have to focus harder and also serves it was harder to place down the t.

I have since fixed this problem by being more efficient in my shoulder rotation and weight transfer forward . Doing so has put more feeling in the proline ll in the crosses with syngut in the mains . This is now my favorite hybrid setup .

But with the poly in the mains / syngut crosses I had the control , crisp and depth plus the softer , muted feel from the syn gut crosses. And i could place my serves more strategically . Only thing is I felt more connected with my volleys with the syngut mains than poly mains. But to be fair the poly mains was the kirschbaum proline X, and the poly crosses was the proline ll.

The proline ll in crosses is by far the better setup with touch and feel needed with backhands , volleys, drive forehands, and serves with more feel.

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Allcourtguy · Apr 22, 2017

I am trying the Volkl v-wrap sn gut as a cross for HyperG mains and it is definitely much slicker than the Volkl Classic Syn gut I was using before. What surprises me is how much the spin has increased, it has been very noticeable on groundstrokes. But my slices are also much more biting and fun to hit. This is definitely much better playing than the Classic. So for HyperG, V-Wrap is the leading syn gut cross so far for me.

Allcourtguy · Apr 24, 2017

I have 6 hours now on the HyperG / Volkl V-Wrap hybrid and there is some denting on the crosses, but they are still very slick. They are not getting "sticky" and the tension maintenance is much better than the Volkl Classic Syn Gut...

Traffic · Apr 24, 2017

Allcourtguy said:
I have 6 hours now on the HyperG / Volkl V-Wrap hybrid and there is some denting on the crosses, but they are still very slick. They are not getting "sticky" and the tension maintenance is much better than the Volkl Classic Syn Gut...

Great feedback. I think my son's HyperG 18/OGSM 17 was playing great for about 6hrs. But from there to hr 9-ish, the crosses have worn to the point where the mains aren't sliding as well. This is in a PS97LS. Hitting with Cyclone 17/OGSM17 (probably 4hrs but sitting in the bag longer than HyperG) back to back, the HyperG still hit and felt a little better (more spin, better launch angle, comfort).

I thought the OGSM was indestructible, but the HyperG 18 is really digging into them.

ZirkusAffe · Apr 24, 2017

Traffic said:
Great feedback. I think my son's HyperG 18/OGSM 17 was playing great for about 6hrs. But from there to hr 9-ish, the crosses have worn to the point where the mains aren't sliding as well. This is in a PS97LS. Hitting with Cyclone 17/OGSM17 (probably 4hrs but sitting in the bag longer than HyperG) back to back, the HyperG still hit and felt a little better (more spin, better launch angle, comfort).

I thought the OGSM was indestructible, but the HyperG 18 is really digging into them.

I'm doing Kirsch PXL crosses just to experiment and I might have almost 6 hrs on them the OGSM's are getting sawed but they are sliding ok and the spin decent.. not as good as shaped mains / OGSM crosses.

DrumWizOHBD · Apr 24, 2017

I think Volkl V-Wrap is a great cross string for poly, especially because of its slickness and durability. I went through about 10 of the V-Maxx hybrid sets when TW had them priced @$5 and then offered a happy hour discount for BOGO. I even tried the V-Wrap in the mains....played great but the string movement was really annoying. Its a little pricey for a syn gut and I prefer the extra buck or two towards a multi for the extra power, pocketing, and feel on touch shots.

I dont know if it's still available on the internet, but I found Pro Supex Titan syn gut to be very slick and soft....and fairly durable and affordable.highly recommend that one to try as a cross string for poly. Before TW carried Cyber Flash, many of us on the board went to another site that carried Topspin and Pro Supex strings and discovered the CF/Titan combo

Another recommendation is put a Tour Bite Soft in the crosses against the Hyper G mains. I liked that combo better than full Hyper G.

Traffic · Apr 24, 2017

So I'm hearing hyperG/Vwrap is the next hybrid to try?

Muppet · Apr 24, 2017

OGSM was too crisp w/Black Force
AK Pro was too muted w/Black Magic
Pro Stacked was too cushioned w/Black Force

Gutex Ultra is nice w/Cyber Flash and Black Force
Hexy Fiber was almost as good w/Cyber Flash

These were all in my signature MW racquet. Could anyone recommend a good syngut cross string? Would V-Wrap fit the bill? Another one I'm thinking about is Baboloat Spiraltek. It's soft, slippery, and pretty good in a full bed.

Allcourtguy · Apr 25, 2017

Doc Hollidae said:
For me? Longer than any other poly I've tried. While tension does drop, the shape of the string keeps the it playable longer since it bites into the ball so well.

+1

Allcourtguy · Apr 25, 2017

Muppet said:
OGSM was too crisp w/Black Force
AK Pro was too muted w/Black Magic
Pro Stacked was too cushioned w/Black Force

Gutex Ultra is nice w/Cyber Flash and Black Force
Hexy Fiber was almost as good w/Cyber Flash

These were all in my signature racquet. Could anyone recommend a good syngut cross string? Would V-Wrap fit the bill? Another one I'm thinking about is Baboloat Spiraltek. It's soft, slippery, and pretty good in a full bed.

Hey Muppet,
I think V-Wrap is definitely worth trying for you. I have been using the black/silver 17g and just found out that it has been discontinued in that color. So I have ordered the orange (hideous color combination with HyperG mains but I couldn't care less), and will try that to see if it plays as well as the black.

Has anyone played both the black and the orange V-Wrap that could comment on them?

Allcourtguy · Apr 25, 2017

So suggestions so far for slick syn gut crosses by poly main seem to be:

HyperG / Volkl V-Wrap
Black Force / Gutex Ultra
Cyber Flash / Gutex Ultra
Big Hitter Blue / Tourna Syn Gut Armor

correct me if I am wrong, and let me know about other suggestions.

Muppet · Apr 25, 2017

Allcourtguy said:
So suggestions so far for slick syn gut crosses by poly main seem to be:

HyperG / Volkl V-Wrap
Black Force / Gutex Ultra
Cyber Flash / Gutex Ultra
Big Hitter Blue / Tourna Syn Gut Armor

correct me if I am wrong, and let me know about other suggestions.

BF/GU is crisp and dead
CF/GU is plush

fjcamry · Apr 26, 2017

ZirkusAffe said:
I'm doing Kirsch PXL crosses just to experiment and I might have almost 6 hrs on them the OGSM's are getting sawed but they are sliding ok and the spin decent.. not as good as shaped mains / OGSM crosses.

With all due respect I use kirschbaum plx 1.20 in my mains with the kirschbaum plain syngut 1.25 as crosses . The crisp , firm mains compliment with the soft , muted syngut crosses.

I have the same racquet strung with syngut mains and kirschbaum proline ll crosses and it's only decent at first .

Edit : I'm giving the proline ll in crosses a second chance . It's best to use this as it forces you to gain better , more efficient shoulder rotation and weight transfer forwards . I would now rather play hybrid with syngut mains and proline ll crosses than proline x mains / syngut crosses .

As the syngut mains / proline ll crosses have better touch and feel. Better backhands both topspin and slice, better volleys , better feel on serves to force you to put more spin.

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ZirkusAffe · Apr 27, 2017

fjcamry said:
With all due respect I use kirschbaum plx 1.20 in my mains with the kirschbaum plain syngut 1.25 as crosses . The crisp , firm mains compliment with the soft , muted syngut crosses.

I have the same racquet strung with syngut mains and kirschbaum proline ll crosses and it's only decent because the crosses are underpowered and the crosses give the feeling in an already underpowered 18x20 frame . I would rather play full syngut than hybrid with the poly as the crosses.

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I just strung two more racquets the opposite way, I'm picking them up today I'm pretty excited to try the PLX in the mains, OGSM crosses.. you're right about soft/crisp combo and decent playability.. we'll see how it goes, I'm sure it will be 20-30 minutes to break in and then honeymoon for x hrs. It should be interesting it will be the first time I put hybrid in my PAT so we'll see what kind of feel I get compared to full polly and spin potential, either way, fresh string job = fun.

ZirkusAffe · Apr 27, 2017

fjcamry said:
With all due respect I use kirschbaum plx 1.20 in my mains with the kirschbaum plain syngut 1.25 as crosses . The crisp , firm mains compliment with the soft , muted syngut crosses.

I have the same racquet strung with syngut mains and kirschbaum proline ll crosses and it's only decent because the crosses are underpowered and the crosses give the feeling in an already underpowered 18x20 frame . I would rather play full syngut than hybrid with the poly as the crosses.

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BTW PLX mains, OGSM crosses 49/52 played amazing today on both RF97 and PAT... although fresh the feel was great way different than PLX crosses OGSM mains in my strike and ezone xi98.. love the comfort both are slick I can hear the snap back on the PLX which I like, not as much spin as shaped but when shape dull these PLX probably will still be snapping back. PLX in the crosses firm up the bed and is just a different experience.

fjcamry · Apr 30, 2017

ZirkusAffe said:
BTW PLX mains, OGSM crosses 49/52 played amazing today on both RF97 and PAT... although fresh the feel was great way different than PLX crosses OGSM mains in my strike and ezone xi98.. love the comfort both are slick I can hear the snap back on the PLX which I like, not as much spin as shaped but when shape dull these PLX probably will still be snapping back. PLX in the crosses firm up the bed and is just a different experience.

I have the same racquet strung with syngut mains and kirschbaum proline ll crosses and it's only decent at first . However what this setup made me do was to gain better , more efficient rotation and weight transfer forwards on my strokes.

Edit : I'm giving the proline ll in crosses a second chance . It's best to use this as it forces you to gain better , more efficient shoulder rotation and weight transfer forwards . I would now rather play hybrid with syngut mains and proline ll crosses than proline x mains / syngut crosses .

As the syngut mains / proline ll crosses have better touch and feel. Better backhands both topspin and slice, better volleys , better feel on serves to force you to put more spin.

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Traffic · May 1, 2017

fjcamry said:
I have the same racquet strung with syngut mains and kirschbaum proline ll crosses and it's only decent at first . However what this setup made me do was to gain better , more efficient rotation and weight transfer forwards on my strokes.

Edit : I'm giving the proline ll in crosses a second chance . It's best to use this as it forces you to gain better , more efficient shoulder rotation and weight transfer forwards . I would now rather play hybrid with syngut mains and proline ll crosses than proline x mains / syngut crosses .

As the syngut mains / proline ll crosses have better touch and feel. Better backhands both topspin and slice, better volleys , better feel on serves to force you to put more spin.

I guess I just had a rough (pun intended) experience with Pro Line II Rough that I got on a string trade. Way too stiff. Maybe if I tied it at a tension in the 40s. But I think I strung at 51 and my arm really started hurting. It's also possible that the texture may prevent it from sliding as much as the smooth. But it took me 2 weeks to recover from that so a bit gun shy.

On another note, has anyone noticed with Volkl V-wrap that it's not on their Volkl strings inventory page. But if you do a search on V-wrap, it comes up for sale?

ZirkusAffe · May 1, 2017

fjcamry said:
I have the same racquet strung with syngut mains and kirschbaum proline ll crosses and it's only decent at first . However what this setup made me do was to gain better , more efficient rotation and weight transfer forwards on my strokes.

Edit : I'm giving the proline ll in crosses a second chance . It's best to use this as it forces you to gain better , more efficient shoulder rotation and weight transfer forwards . I would now rather play hybrid with syngut mains and proline ll crosses than proline x mains / syngut crosses .

As the syngut mains / proline ll crosses have better touch and feel. Better backhands both topspin and slice, better volleys , better feel on serves to force you to put more spin.
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I just get more vibration /ie flutter from my strike with poly crosses I don't think it has anything to do with Kirsch specifically, although I don't dislike it, it's waaay different and poly mains is more 'traditional feel' for me in hybrid so there is an adjustment.....
I hit a lot of kick and twist serves mainly so snap back is welcome (essential when not using shaped poly) although I serve fine with poly crosses, I get more bite and spin with poly in the mains. I still strike the ball with confidence especially with my Strike but I'm still not happy with the xi98 poly crosses I need to play it more although now with the PAT/RF97 restrung I'm most likely playing them over the other two unless I get into a funk during a match then I go to the Strike or xi.

ZirkusAffe · May 1, 2017

Traffic said:
I guess I just had a rough (pun intended) experience with Pro Line II Rough that I got on a string trade. Way too stiff. Maybe if I tied it at a tension in the 40s. But I think I strung at 51 and my arm really started hurting. It's also possible that the texture may prevent it from sliding as much as the smooth. But it took me 2 weeks to recover from that so a bit gun shy.

On another note, has anyone noticed with Volkl V-wrap that it's not on their Volkl strings inventory page. But if you do a search on V-wrap, it comes up for sale?

I only could find the combo hybrid pack V-Maxx 17
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/Volkl_V-Maxx_17_String/descpageACVOLKL-VMAXX17.html
Maybe it's going away or being replaced they have it some other tennis web store on sale.

Traffic · May 2, 2017

ZirkusAffe said:
I only could find the combo hybrid pack V-Maxx 17
http://www.tennis-warehouse.com/Volkl_V-Maxx_17_String/descpageACVOLKL-VMAXX17.html
Maybe it's going away or being replaced they have it some other tennis web store on sale.

I should be putting together another order soon. So I'll give it a whirl.

OT question, the TW reviews say they love the slickness when it's new. But found that it quickly turned to high friction once the initial coating wears off. Has anyone put in a long-term test on V-wrap that can speak to this?

alidisperanza · Mar 1, 2018

Doc Hollidae said:
I did Tourna Big Hitter Blue Mains with Tourna Syn Gut Armor. Strung at 54/51. I'm pretty much only play with Tourna strings, outside of testing. Solinco Hyper G has been the one exception. I'm considering moving to Hyper G over BHB.

Ever experimented with BHBlack7? instead of the BHB? I'd be curious to know your feedback in a hybrid.

Doc Hollidae · Mar 1, 2018

alidisperanza said:
Ever experimented with BHBlack7? instead of the BHB? I'd be curious to know your feedback in a hybrid.

It's been a while but I wasn't a fan of bhb7. It was too springy and powerful for me if I remember correctly. I think it lost tension quicker as well. I definitely should have strung it tighter than I normally do with bhb. These days my top 3 polys are kirschbaum Max power rough, hyper g, and bhb.

alidisperanza · Mar 1, 2018

Doc Hollidae said:
It's been a while but I wasn't a fan of bhb7. It was too springy and powerful for me if I remember correctly. I think it lost tension quicker as well. I definitely should have strung it tighter than I normally do with bhb. These days my top 3 polys are kirschbaum Max power rough, hyper g, and bhb.

I was big into the BHB rough when playtesting but ultimately I think I bought reels of BHB7 because it was a little more linear and predictable. Softer on my glass bones too. The last string I played that produced that crazy BHBR ball "flutter" wobbling spin like that was Gamma Edge 20. It was ridiculous!

I have a couple sets of HyperG on the way. NY Open got me itching to try it!

Steve Huff · Mar 1, 2018

Head Syn Gut w/PPS is very slippery. So slick in fact that a double half hitch or 2 half hitches will often pull through and not hold. Sometimes, I have to put a dab of SuperGlue on the knot.

alidisperanza · Mar 2, 2018

Steve Huff said:
Head Syn Gut w/PPS is very slippery. So slick in fact that a double half hitch or 2 half hitches will often pull through and not hold. Sometimes, I have to put a dab of SuperGlue on the knot.

Sounds perfect!

alidisperanza · Mar 2, 2018

Steve Huff said:
Head Syn Gut w/PPS is very slippery. So slick in fact that a double half hitch or 2 half hitches will often pull through and not hold. Sometimes, I have to put a dab of SuperGlue on the knot.

Do you know if the white/ original/ black play differently?

warney · Mar 2, 2018

alidisperanza said:
Do you know if the white/ original/ black play differently?

I can vouch for black playing really slick. I have not played with White.

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Steve Huff · Mar 2, 2018

I used the white in 16g and the blue in 17g. Funny, the 16g was much more slippery. Never tried the black.

Tennisist · Mar 2, 2018

The most slippery cross I've come across is Prince Recoil.

All other syn guts fall into two categories for me: the ones that notch ( == lock themselve up ), and the ones that do not ( they wear out a rather long saddle under the main, and do not lock up ). Since I've been checking, all stiff syn guts exhibit that behavior. In my experience, all synguts that are at the hight end of stiffness range by the RSI or TW stiffness measurements make excellent crosses.
[ As a full bed, they are disastrous. I confirm that. Dead-feeling, no power, no softness. This is why you will not find much discussion about them here. But as a foundation for mains' sliding, they do a good job. ] So, I'd just recommend to go by measured stiffness -- you'll not regret it.

The "good" syn guts that are typically discussed here are excellent by themselves, but in combination with much stiffer polys create all sorts of disappointments.

Note: some syn guts *appear* to be extremely slippery. You take them out of the package, and they are covered in oil or something. Even difficult to string. That's a very cheap trick. That "slipperiness" is gone in about 10 minutes of hitting. Let's not be deceived by how slippery the string feels when you take it out of the package.

By the way, you can "lubricate" your strings. You will see great improvement ... for about 1 hour. Unfortunately even liquid teflon does not last longer that that.

Muppet · Mar 3, 2018

Solinco Pro Stacked is slippery and holds tension great. And it really transmits the feel, so you might want to go down a pound. Solinco made it for use as a cross for their shaped polys. When handling it, it feels like a very high quality string.

anfield · Mar 3, 2018

Just a footnote. When hybriding with a syngut, I've had to put at least 2g of lead at 12. At least in my RF97s when coming from gut mains, poly cross. NG is so much heavier, it almost 5g more in static weight. For now I'm sticking with VS touch instead of the TNT mains. I don't have a string machine and have to pay $22 in labor. So with nat gut and KB Max Power cross done on an electronic machine I get a lot of life from that setup. Plus, you can't compete with gut. But I'm open to suggestions.

Slickest Syn Gut for particular Polys in Poly/Syn gut hybrids

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