Are beating pushers really a right of passage?

[ChrisBackAtIt]

A little background.

(With pace), I'm a solid baseliner who can drive their shots deep, and place them. I have a consistent flat, slice, and kinda combo "hard" slice serve.
I move well, I can hit volleys...all of that..WITH pace.
I hit with upper 4.5 players and can hang when we're playing sets. It becomes a lot more about who is going to force an error, rather than waiting for an unforced error...that an conditioning

Here is the rub

I've played in a few 4.0 tournaments this year, to get back to being more competitive, and each time have encountered the dink and doink player that drives guy like me that love pace crazy.
Inevitably, I start rushing my shots, and I really have to concentrate on slowing my entire game down...to the point that I'm playing right into the pushers advantage.
I'm not saying these types are not skilled at what they do, but good grief.

I know the logic on these forums, is it's important to figure out how to defeat these types of players, and that it's usually not a fun job, but it seems like a lot like a chore.

In your opinion, do I really need to sludge through the pushers to get to the competition that play more aggressively?
Do people jump up in levels even if they are not super-successful at a lower level?

 

[JoelDali]

The best way to transistion from 4.0 to a competitive 4.5 is to play the same pusher for a year or more, constantly. Developing an offensive game is best practiced against those that have no interest in playing offense.

 

[maverick66]

Developing an offensive game is best practiced against those that have no interest in playing offense.

I disagree. You need to develop against players that make you earn your short balls or weaker shots that you can attack. If I play a pusher that leaves the ball short I am not earning my short ball. So when I go to the next level I am not gonna know how to get that ball. If I hit against an attacking player or one that plays a little more all court I will learn to open the court or force the short ball to come.

 

[joe sch]

Look forward to playing against pushers.
This gives you the opportunity to go for winners when you want.
If you can not generate your own pace and put away defensive players at the 4.0 level, then you need to keep playing that level until you hit more winners than errors.

 

[Jracer77]

Do people jump up in levels even if they are not super-successful at a lower level?

Yes they can but they usually get owned at their new level so what good is it?

 

[dana]

The best tip I've seen is to wait just a split-second more before hitting the ball. That allows you to generate a little more pace on the ball that doesn't have much pace. I've found it is hard to generate pace against the type of player you are describing, but this tip has helped a great deal. I've also found that coming in to the net as soon as I hit a good cross court shot that makes my opponent run at all gives me a great chance to put a volley away. It takes a lot of concentration come in to the net a little sooner than I normally would for an entire match, but it helps to defeat the type of player you refer to as a pusher.

 

[ChrisBackAtIt]

I appreciate the input.
I'm considering entering a tournament at a higher level just to see what happens. I'd much rather lose via "out-hit", then lose via "pushed to death"
I also appreciate everybody fighting through my horrible typing and grammar.
Holy S!&*, upon re-reading it AFTER I posted it, I actually cringed!
I apologize and give myself a warning.

 

[KenC]

A pusher seems to me someone who is always on the defensive. When I play against full out aggressive players and put them in difficulty, they end up hitting me defensive shots that are exactly like what a pusher does. The trick in playing pushers is to realize that you already have them on the defensive and tighten the belt and finish them.

Therefore, the trick to beating pushers is to be able to finish points decisively. The best way is to choke them off at the net, but you can try to out bash them at the baseline if your angle shots are good. The few times I found myself in front of a pusher they quickly became unraveled as I used every soft ball for a transition shot and finished all points at the net. I serve and volley every serve since I know they won't attack my serve. I guess this works because they are used to people getting frustrated in front of them while trying to outhit them at the baseline. Take that away from a pusher and watch them get frustrated.

 

[aphex]

is "right" of passage lingo from "pre-madonna" times?

 

[larry10s]

YES. pushers teach you not to beat yourself. you must master beating each style of player

 

[smoothtennis]

Yes - in my mind they are a 'right of passage' to being able to contruct points, and finish short balls. You get the opportunity all match long, every game to do this with a bonafide defensive pusher. You learn patience, oppotunity recognition, and learn to deal with tightness when you start 'pressing' a little too much.

Think of it this way. As another poster stated, when you play higher level players what are you looking for to end the point? The weak reply, the short ball right? What good is that weaker short ball if you don't have 90% confidence that you know how to put it away without over hitting?

Stay at the level you get the dinkers, and learn how to manage those opportunities. Some guys have different issues in this scenario. Do you get tight? Do you have too large a takeback on the short ball? Are you staying balanced as you transition to mid court? Do you look up as you are hitting?

Play enough matches at that level to really find out what gaps to close in practice and then think about moving up in levels. Don't always look to find the weakness in the pusher, but strive also to find your own tendencies and solve the puzzle.

 

[Zachol82]

If life gives you lemon, make lemon juice.

If life gives you a pusher...well you get the idea.

 

[In D Zone]

I agreed with everyone.

I play a guys who is normally a hard hitting baseline basher. But when he feels that he is off. getting behind or felt that I am over powering him during a match, he would change his strategy. He would then push or hit every shots with half volleys (hitting the ball on the rise). I started lost a few games because he is running down every shot throwing lobs, quick punch shots, drop shots and blocking - getting the ball in play.
At first I felt that I cannot get rid of this guy. No matter how hard I hit the ball - it comes back. I stop to panic- change strategy by working on contructing points. Its a lot of work - but it actually made me a better player. I don have to go for the gas on each shot but rather hitting with more control and learning to hit more efficiently to win points.


Here are some pointers:
- be confident with each approach shot
- dont be afraid to come to the net but also be ready to run back to get those lobs.
- move your opponent, focus on hitting to the open court or pull your opponent close to the net. You dont need to hammer each shot just stay consistent.
- be confident with your stroke, play each point and not buckle. Be ready to grind it out.
- be selective and know when pull the trigger (winner).
- know that you opponent do make errors; basically getting them to loose patience.
- don't hit the ball in one mode. vary the speed, pace and length of your shots - topspin, flat, slice, dropshot and even dippers.

 

[raiden031]

I disagree. You need to develop against players that make you earn your short balls or weaker shots that you can attack. If I play a pusher that leaves the ball short I am not earning my short ball. So when I go to the next level I am not gonna know how to get that ball. If I hit against an attacking player or one that plays a little more all court I will learn to open the court or force the short ball to come.

I disagree with both of you. You need to play BOTH types of players. You need to learn how to end the point on your terms, and playing against a pushers provides you a good way to practice this, because you have to learn to do this consistently enough to actually win the match because they won't give you alot of free points. At the same time, you also need to develop shot tolerance against big hitters that will pressure you and run you around the court...you need to learn not only how to stay in the point, but how to turn it around and become the aggressor.

I got my butt-kicked a couple times in 4.0, but the most common thing about my opponents was that they might have had good fitness, consistency, and decent strokes, but they had no weapons. They couldn't really dictate play other than to just out-rally me. I think this is fine for dominating the 4.0s, but I think they wouldn't make it at 4.5 until they start pressuring more.

 

[bukaeast]

Or is it

"Rite of Passage"

 

[GuyClinch]

The fact that your phased by dinkers (pushers is a loaded word on this board) means you need to improve your game. Legit 4.5 and strong 4.0s will handle these players with ease as they lack enough offense game to hurt them and they can patiently set up easy situations in which they have a huge advantage..

Key skill include - dominating the pushers dink servers - and doing something forcing with their inevitable short balls or moonballs..

 

[origmarm]

is "right" of passage lingo from "pre-madonna" times?

Indeed... Pre-Ciccone the "right" of passage was an important concept though, as was the use the royal plural for verbs in the vein of "are beating pushers a xxxxx ?"

Personally I believe Pre-Ciccone times must have been mighty interesting what with all of those "beating pushers" about. You'd have to watch out for them.

 

[aphex]

Indeed... Pre-Ciccone the "right" of passage was an important concept though, as was the use the royal plural for verbs in the vein of "are beating pushers a xxxxx ?"

Personally I believe Pre-Ciccone times must have been mighty interesting what with all of those "beating pushers" about. You'd have to watch out for them.

also, see my sig (actual quote) for another glorious Pre-Ciccone grammatical gem. interesting times indeed...

 

[origmarm]

also, see my sig (actual quote) for another glorious Pre-Ciccone grammatical gem. interesting times indeed...

Indeed! The good doctor always cures my ills ...no apple required