Are the courts so slow?
- Thread starter Brett UK
- Start date
abmk
Bionic Poster
Other courts are slower.
Grandstand in particular seemed pretty slow in the Thiem/Delpo match.
yes, very slow
I'm going on the eye test, but am confident that looking at numbers (aces, rally length, winners etc.) and comparing to other tournaments and editions of US Open would indicate just that
Strange the way so many big tournaments have been changing it up... London last year, Aus Open, even Wimbledon was slow (think that was a mistake, the courts were just badly prepared overall)
Edit - Federer banged down 18.3 aces per match in his 3 5 setters in Aus
In his 2 here, its been 14.5
- Nadal had 5.3 aces per match in his 3 straight setters in Aus
In his 2 here, he's at 4.5
I'm going on the eye test, but am confident that looking at numbers (aces, rally length, winners etc.) and comparing to other tournaments and editions of US Open would indicate just that
Strange the way so many big tournaments have been changing it up... London last year, Aus Open, even Wimbledon was slow (think that was a mistake, the courts were just badly prepared overall)
Edit - Federer banged down 18.3 aces per match in his 3 5 setters in Aus
In his 2 here, its been 14.5
- Nadal had 5.3 aces per match in his 3 straight setters in Aus
In his 2 here, he's at 4.5
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D
Deleted member 688153
Guest
When they're putting down the paint, if any grains of sand even so much as look like entering the mix they should be shot on sight.
The surface should then be carefully polished with one of these:
And they should find the heaviest balls they can, close the roof permanently, confiscate anything that looks even vaguely larger than 98", and mandate that any player who wants to string full poly must do it themselves with their bare hands.
Problem solved.
The surface should then be carefully polished with one of these:
And they should find the heaviest balls they can, close the roof permanently, confiscate anything that looks even vaguely larger than 98", and mandate that any player who wants to string full poly must do it themselves with their bare hands.
Problem solved.
So when brad gilbert said the courts are playing slow he invented that in case Fed might lose?
Noelan
Legend
abhimawa
Rookie
"slower courts" were invented when the governing body thought spectators were bored because of players acing each other too often, long before Federer or Nadal. No need to rewrite history.
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Dolgopolov85
G.O.A.T.
Blame it on Gilbert. I think it's the usual - slower than Cincy and a bit faster than Montreal.
MichaelChang
Hall of Fame
Courts are fine, and regardless just relax and have some confidence in your old man.
TennisATP
Professional
I see the play as normal too both in terms of speed and bounce... this slow/high thing is just an excuse if Fed loses.
When I watch some players playing each other ( Federer vs Tiafoe, Anderson vs Querrey ) I get a feeling that the courts arent slow, in fact they are fast.
After Schwartzman beat Pouille he was asked for the courts condition, he said that the courts are pretty much fast for a baseliner like him.
After Schwartzman beat Pouille he was asked for the courts condition, he said that the courts are pretty much fast for a baseliner like him.
D
Deleted member 688153
Guest
My opinion is that a lot of that slowness has been due to spells of moisture and humidity.
They're grittier than previously, sure, but it's still Deco II they're using out there. It's not Miami.
They're grittier than previously, sure, but it's still Deco II they're using out there. It's not Miami.
K-H
Hall of Fame
Haha what a post.When they're putting down the paint, if any grains of sand even so much as look like entering the mix they should be shot on sight.
The surface should then be carefully polished with one of these:
And they should find the heaviest balls they can, close the roof permanently, confiscate anything that looks even vaguely larger than 98", and mandate that any player who wants to string full poly must do it themselves with their bare hands.
Problem solved.
Shaolin
G.O.A.T.
You're probably 12 and don't know the actual reason hard courts can be slower or faster so have concocted this theory of yours.
It's ok...you've probably played on the same court your whole life so wouldn't know.
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swordtennis
G.O.A.T.
Can't be slow Djokovic and Murray are not in the draw so I will let you know if the courts are or were slow depending on who wins. Stand by. answer right after the final.
Jaitock1991
Hall of Fame
That is if he's even played at all.
zagor
Bionic Poster
I think so. From what I understand, it was slow in the beginning because they had to do an emergency resurface (because bubbles formed up on AA) but they should have gotten faster with more play on it.
Al Czervik
Hall of Fame
Guys, they use the same mix on each court. How can it be different court to court? Now, if you are saying the surface overall is slower compared to prior years, I'm willing to entertain that.
DRII
G.O.A.T.
the courts speed up as the tournament progresses.
perhaps some of the sand is blasted/worn off by the players and cleaning of the courts.
also, the better players get more used to playing conditions as they go further in the draw, so they know which spins works best in certain situations.
a lot of the times when players say the court is fast, it could mean they're timing is just not finely tuned yet...
perhaps some of the sand is blasted/worn off by the players and cleaning of the courts.
also, the better players get more used to playing conditions as they go further in the draw, so they know which spins works best in certain situations.
a lot of the times when players say the court is fast, it could mean they're timing is just not finely tuned yet...
Shaolin
G.O.A.T.
I'd say 90% of the time I hear a player say the court is slow/fast it's backed up by several others as well.
I doubt its a coordinated effort by the locker room to cover up their timing issues.
BeatlesFan
Bionic Poster
So you know more than all those who have actually played on the courts, all of whom affirm they are the slowest courts ever at the Open?
The people chiming in on the courts being slow are Gilbert, Courier, Mardy Fish (who said two nights ago, "they border on green clay conditions"), J-Mac and Chris Evert. It's not just the slow courts, it's the balls they are using, which are high bouncing. That makes is next to impossible for Fed to stand on the baseline and hit half volley winners, as he did at will in Australia.
abmk
Bionic Poster
That's a very lazy analysis. Firstly, aces don't indicate accurately the serving prowess itself (you need unreturnable serve%), let alone speed.
And even for that part, you don't take per match, you take per service point.
Federer's 5-setters here have been clearly shorter than the ones in Aus.
Nadal's straight-setters were also shorter over here IIRC.
Federer in first 4 rounds at the USO : 53 aces in 415 service points. 1 ace per 7.83 service points.
Federer in first 4 rounds at the AO : 49 aces in 449 service points. 1 ace per 9.16 service points.
Federer in all rounds at the AO : 89 aces in 809 service points , 1 ace per 9.09 service points.
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Having said, the ace rate for the first 4 rounds at the US Open this year has been : 7.37%, which is the 3rd lowest among the years I have from 2003 onwards (2003,2004,2007,2008,2011-2016) --- after 2011 (7.08%) and 2016 (7.17%). (these are for all 7 rounds)
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Data shows Fed' ace rate is higher in USO. May be surface is faster?
Dedans Penthouse
Legend
I clearly said that's just my feeling I get when I watch some matches on TV.So you know more than all those who have actually played on the courts, all of whom affirm they are the slowest courts ever at the Open?
I, neither you I suppose, have stepped down and played on the courts to really find out whether they are slow or fast.
Since you mentioned the balls, can you please tell me what type of balls exactly are they using ? Have they not used such balls before ?
Boom-Boom
Legend
Lol yeah very doubtful to say the least
kalyan4fedever
Legend
Arthur ashe is slower than clay.....blue clay
abmk
Bionic Poster
no, ace rate at AO in 2017 was clearly higher than at USO overall.
Like I said , Ashe is playing faster than the other courts. Federer has only played on Ashe.
Overall, AO 17 was definitely faster.
kalyan4fedever
Legend
and you are saying this based on what?
abmk
Bionic Poster
Ace rate in first 4 rounds at USO : 7.37%
Ace rate in AO 2017 overall : 9.35%
Highest among the ones I have at both AO and USO from 2003 onwards
https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/index.php?threads/stats-for-uso-and-ao-speed-differences.593882/
Doesn't mean AO 2017 was necessarily the fastest, given UE error rate wasn't near the lowest, but just saying, if you are measuring by ace rate, USO 17 doesn't come close to AO 17.
abmk
Bionic Poster
I was there at the USO on Sunday and Monday.
Plus seeing the other matches online.
Based on Fed' serve stats alone, USO proves to be faster. but overall data says opposite.
Have you got SF tickets? It's is once in lifetime opportunity. Don't think Fedal will happen again at Uso.
abmk
Bionic Poster
Fed's serve stats alone are : a) just 4 matches b) vs a different set of opponents c) just on Ashe
Overall data includes for all the courts. I'd take that over Fed's stats.
However from QF onwards, its all going to be on Ashe. So to be more precise, one would have to take all the matches on Ashe. I think the ace rate would be around 8% or more -- just a guess though.
abmk
Bionic Poster
nah, had to come back - work. Went there during Labour day weekend.
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