Ashamed i went to the "pusher" side

[Gasolina]

Ok me and a bunch of 4.0 friends organized our own tournament. In the first round I was up against my regular hitting partner who basically plays the same way I do. I'm an offensive baseliner, and hit with power and spin, going for broke on dtl winners on both sides. He hits with evil angles from the baseline.

I know my biggest weakness was fitness, and knew that if it went three sets I'd lose. So at the start of the game I didn't go for my usual big forehands and backhands and just played rallies waiting for a chance to hit a winner. Hitting junk while I can, trying to throw off my opponent with drop shots, slices, lobs and other crap. I knew if I got into a baseline rally I would lose because I'm prone to overhitting and he does a good job using my power against me. Also, that would tire me out, and I wasn't planning on playing three sets.

Eventually I won straight sets. Frustrating the hell out of my opponent. Feeling a bit ashamed now because I despise moonballers/pushers and I myself have trouble beating them. Sine we played a similar game, my plan was to use the same tactics of these moonballers/pushers.

I don't know what I should be feeling right now. Obviously its good to win, but at the expense of playing my game? Honestly I didn't enjoy one bit of playing junk

 

[dcdoorknob]

I don't understand why so many people have this hang up about playing the 'right' way, whatever that is.

It's not cheap to play certain shots that your opponent doesn't seem to like, it's just smart.

 

[Gasolina]

I don't understand why so many people have this hang up about playing the 'right' way, whatever that is.

It's not cheap to play certain shots that your opponent doesn't seem to like, it's just smart.

I don't know. You know a good match when you see one. I probably had 3 winners the whole game and didn't really learn anything good after the match.

Just the week before I played against one of the top players and got beat. But I could clearly remember all the right things I did and all my mistakes. Basically I was able to improve myself even by losing.

 

[dcdoorknob]

Why is it that only winners count as 'right things' though? There are other things to notice that can make you a better tennis player.

If I notice someone is handling my flat serves pretty well but usually offers a weaker return or miss when I slice it or kick it to their backhand, I'm probably going to start hitting those serves more often, even if it never is an ace. If I notice that someone tends to make more errors if I can make them hit a low forehand, I'm probably going to throw in a few more slices to the forehand to try and give them more opportunities to hit those errors.

Again, It seems like some people would rather play into their opponents strengths because it looks prettier (even if it is a losing proposition) than to notice their opponents weaknesses and work to make them overcome those weaknesses if they want to beat you (or just do a better job of exposing your weaknesses). This is a mindset I still just don't get.

I mean, there is certainly place for powerful booming shots too, if you can make those consistently most opponents will have trouble dealing with that. But if you can't, or are up against an opponent who can do that better than you, there should be no shame in thinking critically about the tennis matchup and using some variety to give yourself a better chance to win.

 

[jmverdugo]

When you see a high level match, let's say 5.0, you do not see them going for winner after winner, they also try to keep a rally and hit whatever they need to do to keep the opponent of balance an win, the difference is that their moonballs have more pace and their junk are deep low skidding slices or killer razor type dropshots but believe me they do what they have to do to win that match. That is what everybody has to do, be consistent and solid is what wins matches at any level. I also play 4.0 and in our case there is also the component of will, the one that wants it the most is the one that wins it. For instance, my last singles league match i realize that the guy wanted to hit a winner after every slice I hit to his FH and he was missing a lot of those "winners", so I basically fed him slices to his forehands the whole night, I think he put in 2 winners.

 

[larry10s]

Ok me and a bunch of 4.0 friends organized our own tournament. In the first round I was up against my regular hitting partner who basically plays the same way I do. I'm an offensive baseliner, and hit with power and spin, going for broke on dtl winners on both sides. He hits with evil angles from the baseline.

I know my biggest weakness was fitness, and knew that if it went three sets I'd lose. So at the start of the game I didn't go for my usual big forehands and backhands and just played rallies waiting for a chance to hit a winner. Hitting junk while I can, trying to throw off my opponent with drop shots, slices, lobs and other crap. I knew if I got into a baseline rally I would lose because I'm prone to overhitting and he does a good job using my power against me. Also, that would tire me out, and I wasn't planning on playing three sets.

Eventually I won straight sets. Frustrating the hell out of my opponent. Feeling a bit ashamed now because I despise moonballers/pushers and I myself have trouble beating them. Sine we played a similar game, my plan was to use the same tactics of these moonballers/pushers.

I don't know what I should be feeling right now. Obviously its good to win, but at the expense of playing my game? Honestly I didn't enjoy one bit of playing junk

the ability to adapt your game to the opponent and win is a trait of champions
you should be proud of yourself to have found a way to win

 

[LuckyR]

A "W" is a "W". The perjorative "pusher" is a meaningless word invented by those with more bravado than tennis skills to make their emotional state feel better when they lose.

 

[Gasolina]

Thanks for the comments guys. I guess I just needed a fresh perspective on tennis. You could even say I come from the peeps with more bravado than tennis skills.

I realized I hit a lot more winners than initially thought. A few drop shots and a moonball that hit the line. Even if they're not cross court backhand rips or dtl forehand returns, its still a good shot because the situation called for it.

I guess the key is being able to adapt. If a more skilled opponent steps in and hit a mean cross court on my drop shot, then maybe I won't use it for him.

 

[sphinx780]

At 4.0 and 4.5, we all still have very obvious flaws in our games that can help us improve and move towards the next level. I think many of us get caught up in that single aspect for way too long.

There's another very obvious choice to accelerate winning and taking that step forward to the next level. Removing the ego of 'this is my game' and allowing yourself to do just as you did. Utilize an intelligent strategy that you know will be effective against your opponent. The more important number to look at is how many unforced errors you had. I bet they were reduced compared to your normal game against your friend.

Most of us can improve on every single aspect of our game and learning when and where to play a defensive/patient strategy versus when to go for broke is just as important as the rest if not more so.

 

[darrinbaker00]

Ok me and a bunch of 4.0 friends organized our own tournament. In the first round I was up against my regular hitting partner who basically plays the same way I do. I'm an offensive baseliner, and hit with power and spin, going for broke on dtl winners on both sides. He hits with evil angles from the baseline.

I know my biggest weakness was fitness, and knew that if it went three sets I'd lose. So at the start of the game I didn't go for my usual big forehands and backhands and just played rallies waiting for a chance to hit a winner. Hitting junk while I can, trying to throw off my opponent with drop shots, slices, lobs and other crap. I knew if I got into a baseline rally I would lose because I'm prone to overhitting and he does a good job using my power against me. Also, that would tire me out, and I wasn't planning on playing three sets.

Eventually I won straight sets. Frustrating the hell out of my opponent. Feeling a bit ashamed now because I despise moonballers/pushers and I myself have trouble beating them. Sine we played a similar game, my plan was to use the same tactics of these moonballers/pushers.

I don't know what I should be feeling right now. Obviously its good to win, but at the expense of playing my game? Honestly I didn't enjoy one bit of playing junk

You noticed what your opponent was doing, you made the necessary adjustments to your game, and you wound up winning. You have nothing to be ashamed about. In fact, if more WTA players employed that strategy, it would make their product more interesting to watch.

 

[Bhagi Katbamna]

I bet Federer doesn't feel ashamed of slicing his backhand and making an opponent play a shot that he doesn't like. You should be proud to win by exposing your opponent's weakness not ashamed at doing so.

 

[LuckyR]

Thanks for the comments guys. I guess I just needed a fresh perspective on tennis. You could even say I come from the peeps with more bravado than tennis skills.

I realized I hit a lot more winners than initially thought. A few drop shots and a moonball that hit the line. Even if they're not cross court backhand rips or dtl forehand returns, its still a good shot because the situation called for it.

I guess the key is being able to adapt. If a more skilled opponent steps in and hit a mean cross court on my drop shot, then maybe I won't use it for him.

Maybe thet's where you've been but that's not where you are going.

"Just win baby!"- A. Davis.

 

[dizzlmcwizzl]

I certainly understand your post. We watch really good players (or pros)spank the ball and they have a clean fluid game that we envy. They hit it hard and sometimes play spectacular shots and we all want that.

However, at a ATP tour stop last year I was able to watch professional matches from several vantage points. What I noticed was that although they were hitting the ball hard ... most pros hit the ball well above the height of the net. Also, for 95% of their shots they were no where close to the lines. To me it seemed that they were often playing what I would call a pushing style, except at thier level "safe shots" were better than my best struck ball ... the main difference was that as soon as they had an oppening to finish a point, they did.

That is what we should aspire to ... hit the best safe shot we can until the opportunity to win the point comes up.

 

[Mick]

lots of people here don't like to play against pushers but i do. i would prefer to play against them then playing against those who would go for broke and hit a winner or an error after 3 or 4 strokes. my reasoning is i would rather spend most of my time hitting tennis ball than picking up the tennis balls

 

[ckhirnigs113]

I often "push" when I play, but I have never felt bad about my style. I stay in the point until I get the opportunity to end it. Knowing one's own shot-making ability is important so that one isn't always going for very low percentage shots. Low percentage shots can be very different from one player to the next.

 

[jdubbs]

Played a self described 4.5 yesterday (I'm a 4.0).

He started off playing a harder hitting game, but somehow his shots were just in my perfect zone. I was playing great (been working on my fitness a ton) and moved him from side to side. He couldn't hurt me. Won the first set 6-3.

Midway through the 2nd, he started trying to slice and push everything to throw my off balance. I got to net, hit great overheads, and stayed aggressive. Won 6-0 in the 2nd.

Then I mentioned to him I'd like to maybe play on his 4.5 team next year, he said "well, you know, you've got to get to those short balls better, they'll crush you at 4.5."

Uh...ok. Didn't I just beat you 6-3, 6-0?
Anyway, I think I'm past the pushers now, they can't hurt me too much any more IF and only if I'm in great shape, which I am right now.

 

[Gasolina]

The more important number to look at is how many unforced errors you had. I bet they were reduced compared to your normal game against your friend

Yes now that I look back I did have very few ones. In fact, I was pretty happy of the way I played defense (the moonballs). If I had played my normal game I would have tried a nasty shot which would probably have resulted in an UE.

 

[Mick]

I often "push" when I play, but I have never felt bad about my style. I stay in the point until I get the opportunity to end it. Knowing one's own shot-making ability is important so that one isn't always going for very low percentage shots. Low percentage shots can be very different from one player to the next.

yeah i don't know why most tennis players would look down on the pushers. you play the way you like and let them play the way they like. that is unless they can't handle the pushers

 

[Kaz00]

You did learn something. You learned how to change up your gameplan to defeat your opponent.

 

[Angle Queen]

I, too, have joined...the pusher side. Rejoined is actually more like it. When I started out at 3.0, I was definitely a pusher. Not because I wanted to, but because that's all I could do. Then after lessons, clinics and many (enjoyable!) hours on court, I developed more skills, hit more "pretty" winners. In anticipation of playing "up," I even specifically worked on playing with more pace, from my own shots to those of my opponents.

But alas, my arrival at 4.0...has shown me the pusher side again. At that level (and above, I'm sure), it's generally not done because it's the only thing in the arsenal. Rather, it's done situationally...when necessary. Just like you did. You knew that kind of ball, point, game would frustrate your opponent and would work in your favor.

As many of the other replies here suggest, you did indeed learn something very valuable, in addition to getting the win and moving on to the next round. And therein, perhaps lies a difference you can "justify" to yourself (should you feel the need to). Do you need or even want to play that way...in a hitting session or even league, where one GSM won't make a hill of beans difference? Tournaments are different. It's win or go home. And that's what I think many "fans" of professional tennis don't really get: half the field goes home, after the first round. Most of the other sports have season standings or, heck, you even get four rounds in golf. But tennis is the ultimate in do-or-die tactics and philosophy. It's why guys who hang in the Top 10 for, in some cases, many years...are the epitome of consistency and clutch players.

Dizz is right. It's all about hitting "the best safe shot we can until the opportunity to win the point comes up."

 

[whomad15]

Sometimes you have to change your game. Look at the Djok/DelPotro match. Djok wins the first. Delpo switches it up and stops trying to crush every single shot and wins the 2nd. Delpo goes back to crushing and gets destroyed.

 

[Fuji]

Meh, if it wins why care about it in a tournament? Playing social matches I can see not wanting to resort to pushing because of ego and whatever else comes into the equation! In official matches, go for whatever wins. I've said it before and I'll say it again, hitting whatever shot your opponent can't handle is the shot you should be hitting!

Enjoy the win, and keep on keeping on! You'll get over the thought of "Being A Pusher"!

-Fuji

 

[Tennis Is Magic]

There's nothing wrong with playing smart tennis. In reality, it's better to play safe shots and leave a ball short than to take a very low-percentage shot to try and win the point outright. At least if you hit a short ball, you still have a chance to win the point with defense or if your opponent misses, whereas if you miss a shot long or wide, the point's just over.

Also, GOOD aggressive players don't take a rally ball and try to get on highlight reels. Good offensive players construct points by hitting crosscourt angles and into the corners, serving wide and following it into the net, and pass up good chances for the right chance.

Don't think not aiming for the line every shot = pusher ball, it's most definitely not.

 

[qriusgeorge]

I'd like to chime in and say I personally can't stand pushers, but perhaps my definition of a pusher is different. I consider a pusher someone that chooses to hit a moonball or some ridiculously junk shot even when they could take a better shot. I would rather lose the point to a well played shot than win the point because they were too scared to go for something. i have a decent serve and many times in tournaments the opponent returns a 20 foot high lob type deal that has a 10ft bounce right at the service line, or some type of soft flat shot with out spin just sitting there to be crushed while they stand flat footed in the middle waiting. i would much rather they step up their game so we can have a rally or something. i'm not that good. sometimes I do well against open players, sometimes i'm in the midst of 5.0's, but i welcome getting beat up on and respect someone that takes a chance. i dunno.

i mean, my thinking is that a tournament is the platform for the players to showcase the result of all the years of practice and training. all those days and hours of drills. show me yours and i'll show you mine. bring the best you have. strategy is always a good component, but I personally tend to go all out with the shots. instead of slicing it 5 times, construct a point with 2 slices a topspind bh, a topspin forehand, and a flat forehand for a potential winner. instead of consistently playing the safe shot, challenge yourself.

Maybe it's just me since I rarely have the patience to play smart shots all day and tend to crave ripping a winner somewhere, but many times i find my best offense is getting them out of position to hit a good shot, any shot, basically trying to keep them on the run and demanding good footwork and positioning instead of good shot mechanics. they in turn hit something back that either passes me of puts me out of position and on defense, making me step up and do better as well. that's why i love tournaments. there are some really good players out there that hit magic. i go to tournaments to see what people can do, and sometimes im the one that pushes them to hit these amazing shots. i feel priveleged about that. sometimes i just get dealt with and feel like a jerk for wasting their time and go home early.

but in summary, i dont like pushers. i see it as the easy way out. i hate the easy way out, but then again, i dont care that much if i lose. im just there to have fun. i'm not a professional. sometimes, just sometimes, if i play a younger kid that is good, i'll go to the net and invite him to pass me. even if it's close and i could potentially get it, i'll let him pass me and congratulate him on the excellent pass after the game.

 

[North]

Like other posters have mentioned... If you play like a pusher because that is all you are able to do, then you are lucky that your very limited skills happen to work well against impatient aggressive players found at lower levels. That doesn't mean you are a good player as you will only get so far (typically up to about 4.0) and really are good at only one thing. Many people are happy with that.

If you learn to be more as a player than simply a pusher (you know- improve), well then you have an arsenal of skills you can call on. If you choose to play pusher-like because that is the most effieient way to win that is just playing smart and is your choice against a given opponent in a given match.

I will say, however, that when I have resorted to pushing (eg: early rounds of a tournament when I want to get through as quickly as possible and conserve energy for later rounds) it is extremely boring. When I am playing with friends and for practice I will virtually never choose to push and opt, instead, on improving my net/all-court attacking game.