NandoMania
Rookie
hello!!!!! The words "kobe" and "good" do not belong in the same sentence. why do you think he paid off his alleged sexual assault victim so that she would refuse to testify in her own case against him :evil:
Could a 30 year old dominate tennis?
- Thread starter VictorS.
- Start date
hello!!!!! The words "kobe" and "good" do not belong in the same sentence. why do you think he paid off his alleged sexual assault victim so that she would refuse to testify in her own case against him :evil:
NandoMania
Rookie
I'm not sure of the value of that point. Roger Federer (SUI)/Birthdate: 8-Aug-81, which means that in 2005 fed was 23 years old. He was 24 in 2006 and 25 in 2007. Nobody, not even a 30 year old Roger, himself, will be able to "dominate the game like fed did from 05-07."
Regarding Kobe's athleticism: I hear that sometimes but really I disagree. This dunk he did from last year says it all:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzd0oHANvZU&feature=related
Let's not forget Steve Nash playing also at an MVP level in his early 30s. Granted he is now beginning to slow a bit.
Leublu tennis
Legend
Oh, do I agree with you. Look tennis is pretty much for life and before very long you are mainly playing doubles and not singles. And look at the doubles field at IW: with the exception of Blake and Djokovic, every player seeded 1 - 16 is playing doubles and I think Djokovic is making a mistake by not playing. Nadal plays a lot and Federer used to be a terrific doubles player up until a couple of years ago. Now he seems to be getting back into it. Doubles are really fun to watch. I think ATP is wrong in not supporting doubles by being so skimpy with money.
SaintClaires
Banned
YES.
More players should be encouraged to play doubles.
Doubles players should be given more singles points and more prize money
I don't see why a Pete Sampras, who still loves the game & can certainly play at a high level doesn't continue playing in doubles competitively, a la Martina Natratilova. His game is obviously tailor-made for the doubles game (big serve, excellent volleys, etc). I just think it would be great to keep some of the legends in the game a bit longer. It would definitely spice up the doubles scene. Now I know Sampras wouldn't want to play year-round, but he could play for example the slams & a few of the master series tourneys.
SaintClaires
Banned
GugaGuga
Rookie
You can choose not to believe him if you want. After all, veroniquem, what is Agassi's opinion on the sport of tennis compared to yours?
topher.juan
Rookie
what about a player who came into the scene at 25-27? is that possible? surely by the time a player who's done tennis their whole life will get tired of the routines and fitness requirements when getting near 30, i think that's a huge part of the reason why not many 30+ 'dominate' or have a high ranking (agassi was one for sure).... but has there ever been someone who came late into the scene and maybe not dominated, but got a high ranking??
julesb
Banned
Yes because we know athletes are always fully objective when speaking of themselves. We also know it is no part of the mental makeup of any champion to shoot, strive, and believe even beyond realistic goals.
SaintClaires
Banned
GameSampras
Banned
Last year he was still in his 20s I think.. I think he was 29 last season maybe 30. Late 20's is a players typical prime in the NBA physically whereas its usually the early 20s in tennis. But if you watch Kobe this year you can see that he relies more heavily on the outside game. Same thing happened to Jordan's game in his mid 30s. Even in 93 when he hit 30 years old. Jordan was still the best player on earth at 30 by far , but he was nowhere the physical genetic athletic freak he was circa 87-88.
Kobble
Hall of Fame
Look how many overfunded tennis brats it takes to get some into the top 200. In order for someone to make it past 25 years old there would need to be like three thousand or more fighting for the job. Strength in numbers, few people training regularly after 20. Most guys who are over 24 and haven't made it have flawed, weak, or incomplete games, which will never cut it.
Moz
Hall of Fame
The reason no one could dominate in their 30's these days is not because of the classical view definition of fitness, i.e. strength, flexibility, aerobic / anaerobic fitness or even speed.
It's because if you've played top flight tennis for over 20 years your joints, cartilige and tendons are probably ruined. This affects the amount you can train and more importantly the speed at which you recover.
Anyone who argues otherwise must be in their 20's or younger.
It's because if you've played top flight tennis for over 20 years your joints, cartilige and tendons are probably ruined. This affects the amount you can train and more importantly the speed at which you recover.
Anyone who argues otherwise must be in their 20's or younger.
D
Deleted member 21996
Guest
Rafter? not domination per se but he did get to number one very late in his career, and did win USO and Runner up to W (his latest at 29)!
I guess the consensus is that most great players have a window to really play successful tennis 4-5 years. Most great players begin this period sometime in their early 20s & taper down sometime in their mid 20s. Examples such as Rafter, Stepanek, & Agassi prove that players can achieve a high level of success later in their 20s & early 30s. However these guys are more of the exception rather than the rule.
I think tennis would be better served shortening the schedule & allowing players more of an offseason to rest. This, I think, would allow players more time to recuperate & rejuvenate, which in turn would hopefully lengthen players' careers. Is the indoor season really necessary??
I think tennis would be better served shortening the schedule & allowing players more of an offseason to rest. This, I think, would allow players more time to recuperate & rejuvenate, which in turn would hopefully lengthen players' careers. Is the indoor season really necessary??
NandoMania
Rookie
And this year Pete lost to both Tommy Haas and Lleyton Hewitt.
S
srinrajesh
Guest
I think they can if they bring in a entirely different style of play .. mix the baseline rallies with strong serve and volley game
If they are not good at the net .. it would be very difficult in this scenario
If they are not good at the net .. it would be very difficult in this scenario
NandoMania
Rookie
Good concept. Taylor Dent is a case in point. Did you see his match Sunday against Jurgen Melzer? Some of his serves were in the 135 range, and he was able (even though he looks like The Hulk) to get up to net extremely fast. However, Melzer was passing him just enough to leave Dent in the dust.
tennis_hand
Hall of Fame
the slow court and slow and high bouncing balls and the modern racket and strings are killing PURE serve and volley play.
pure serve and volley are in the museum now. enjoy what u have.
pure serve and volley are in the museum now. enjoy what u have.
vince evert
New User
It depends on their level of fitness and work ethic and not so much on their talent. Connors, Lendl, Becker, Agassi, Gomez, and Sampras all won Grand slams when they were 30 or older.
I think of the current players Nadal certainly can go on beyond 30 but provided he does not get any serious injury.
I think of the current players Nadal certainly can go on beyond 30 but provided he does not get any serious injury.
J
Julieta
Guest
To be successful (earning a decent living) in tennis these days (I dont think this was as true even ten to fifteen years ago as it is today) there are certain things you have to do to your body and this is not sustainable over a period of years. One option is the stop and start method - go for it for two to three years, see how much money you can make, quit for awhile and give your body a rest from all of the stress and then go back again.
The only way I could see someone playing in their 30s at a high level is if they were an elite junior, so they had a good foundation, but then quit tennis for several years and then went back again. If I think of someone from my generation, I think of someone like an Al Parker without the injuries. If he had quit at 20, did something else, and then started again at 29 or so, and did the necessary training program, he could probably play at a very high level in his 30s.
The only way I could see someone playing in their 30s at a high level is if they were an elite junior, so they had a good foundation, but then quit tennis for several years and then went back again. If I think of someone from my generation, I think of someone like an Al Parker without the injuries. If he had quit at 20, did something else, and then started again at 29 or so, and did the necessary training program, he could probably play at a very high level in his 30s.
nfor304
Banned
I dont think rafter is a great example... He won the USopen when he was 24 and was the ATP newcomer of the year when he was 21. There are a few guys who have hit their highest ranking late in their career, like Werner Eschaur, Dick Norman, Younes El Aynauoi, Peter Luczak, Wayne Arthurs, Rainer Schuttler,
Martin Vassallo Arguello, Christophe Rochus, Julian Bouter.... etc etc
Some guys just take there time getting to the top 100 and end up peaking in their late 20s-early 30s, but they still have pretty good careers and stay there for a several years
Martin Vassallo Arguello, Christophe Rochus, Julian Bouter.... etc etc
Some guys just take there time getting to the top 100 and end up peaking in their late 20s-early 30s, but they still have pretty good careers and stay there for a several years
BorisBeckerFan
Professional
I've herad several different NBA commentators say that not including the wizards playing time, Michael Jordan was actually better after 30 than before. Dr. Jack Ramsey, And Coach Phil Jackson among them. Despite deminishing athletic abilities he continued to improve his skills as a player and that had more than made up for the lose in athleticism.
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TsongaEatingAPineappleLol
Banned
Connors did it. I'm not sure it's possible in today's competition though.
mental midget
Hall of Fame
given we keep the window of 'domination' to just a year or so, the answer's probably yes, with a ton of qualifiers.
assuming a player's managed not to completely grind their soft tissue into oblivion, a 30yo can technically operate at close to the highest levels of athleticism. playing style would have to be more of a shotmaker, with some pretty serious firepower.
assuming a player's managed not to completely grind their soft tissue into oblivion, a 30yo can technically operate at close to the highest levels of athleticism. playing style would have to be more of a shotmaker, with some pretty serious firepower.
I will be very interested to see how Federer & Roddick fare in the next few years as they get older. I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see them compete well into their late 20s & possibly early 30s. Roddick has that big serve which I don't think is going anywhere. In addition, he looks to be very committed to fitness at the moment. Federer himself is a very good offensive player with big weapons. In addition, I think he has a smoothness about him, which will help him as his body ages.
380pistol
Banned
Very unlikely, as you can't compare tennis to other sport. Basketball players peak later than tennis players. A tennis player's peak is generally 22-26/27. An NBA player peaks at 27-32/33. I mean Jordan won his first scoring title at 24, MVP at 25, an title at 28. Which tennis player accomplishes sucj feats at that age?? It would be considered late.
Even baseball. Alex Rodriguez won all 3 of his MVP's after his 28th b-day. Steve Young won 2 MVP's 6 passing titles (4 consecutively, no one else has 3), and a Super Bowl MVP, all after age 30.
It's the dynamics of each sport, and position Tennis players, running backs will peak earlier, but start to fade earlier. 27 in tennis isn't the same as 27 in every other sport. I mean take boxing, Pacquiao has come into his own and he's 29.
hoahuyen
Rookie
why the insult?
Don't know about dominate but certainly 30+ being number 1
Don't know about domination, but therehave been quite a few number 1's on the computer past the age of 30:
Newcombe - 30 and number 1 in 1974 (last time number #1 was July 28, 1974)
Connors - nearly 31 and number 1 in 1983 (last time number #1 was July 3, 1983)
Lendl - 30 and number 1 in 1990 (last time number #1 was August 12, 1990)
Agassi - 33 and number 1 in 2003 (last time number #1 was September 7, 2003)
I know that is different than domination - but still to be number 1 it means that they had the best previous 12 months of any player.
Don't know about domination, but therehave been quite a few number 1's on the computer past the age of 30:
Newcombe - 30 and number 1 in 1974 (last time number #1 was July 28, 1974)
Connors - nearly 31 and number 1 in 1983 (last time number #1 was July 3, 1983)
Lendl - 30 and number 1 in 1990 (last time number #1 was August 12, 1990)
Agassi - 33 and number 1 in 2003 (last time number #1 was September 7, 2003)
I know that is different than domination - but still to be number 1 it means that they had the best previous 12 months of any player.
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DunlopDood
Semi-Pro
Agassi became number 1 in the world at the age of 33!
Sure
2009 is not that much different than 2003 when Agassi was number one. The court surfaces and the rackets aren't that much different. (The stringing is a bit better and allows a bit more variety though). Agassi with a bad back and 35 years old and was pushing a peak Federer hard in the US Open in 2005. Hence, yes a 30 year old could dominate (or at least be number 1 which isn't quite the same thing).
2009 is not that much different than 2003 when Agassi was number one. The court surfaces and the rackets aren't that much different. (The stringing is a bit better and allows a bit more variety though). Agassi with a bad back and 35 years old and was pushing a peak Federer hard in the US Open in 2005. Hence, yes a 30 year old could dominate (or at least be number 1 which isn't quite the same thing).
With age I think you lose your fitness and stamina before losing your raw skills. With team sports, you can still be a contributor because you share duties with teammates and can depend on your skills and strategy much more than fitness, whereas in tennis your skills won't hold up if you can't go the distance or move quite as well.
Perfect example is that players can have a longer doubles career than singles because its more about skills and strategy and less about movement than singles.
Perfect example is that players can have a longer doubles career than singles because its more about skills and strategy and less about movement than singles.
you have made a perfect argument for why tennis needs a vibrant and active seniors tour. Best 2 of 3 sets, smaller draws (32) and a casual tournament schedule.
1/2 of the reason pros quit as early as they do is mental burnout. IMHO the time off that Agassi had during his career away from tennis helped his longevity.
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