Head Prostock frames, my updated take

[hrstrat57]

Starting a new thread on the old hot topic of Head prostock racquets (PT57A/E and TGK's etc) and curious on the take others may have regarding Head prostock frames / re-posting my comment from another thread with slight modification to hopefully initiate some discussion......

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I have come full circle on my whole outlook on Head player frames. I have a prostock frame and multiple Austrian made prestige and radical frames as well.

All are brilliant!!

To me the most important thing tho is to be able to reach into my bag for a backup stick and have it play the same. I think this is an outcome nearly impossible for us recreational players to achieve chasing prostock frames on the other string forum, e baey or from other sources.

I will say this, my 2 YT prestige MP frames bought from TW, matched and spec'd are very, very good. I have modified them to my specs and they are still light enuff to be swung easily and efficiently....the retail YT Prestige MP is light enuff to be modified and I am now convinced will satisfy over 95% of good players seeking a players stick in a 18x20 frame. Most importantly, I cannot tell them apart.

Further, I think now that Head is hiding the prostock frames under retail markings it is very tricky to be certain you are getting a pro stock racquet unless buying it directly from a pro. I think the recent thread regarding the questionable TGK 238.4 is evidence of that. I truly believe Head doesn't want us to have pro stock frames and believes most of us don't get any benefit from them.

I am very happy with my 2 retail frames, blissfully happy actually. I thank those here on the forums who convinced me my Austrian frame snobbery was silly and suggested I abandon my quest for TGK 238.4 frames and go with a matched retail pair instead. Good call!!!

Let's discuss?

 

[HiroProtagonist]

As with nearly all things generalizing doesn't work.

It comes down to what the individual is looking for when purchasing a racquet. If the retail racquet does not allow for an individuals preference in specs to be achieved, or the retail frames are too stiff, you need to go to prostock.

Personally I have no trouble customizing Prestiges to my spec, but I prefer the feel of older models, so I tracked some down, moded em up and have no need for prostocks.

I believe if you can find what works for you without going the prostock route than it makes more sense to save the money and do so. But if you have the money and either can't find what works for you, or you just want a PT630 in a YTK PJ or a PT630 w/ a 16x19 SP then it's about as silly as buying any other racquet.

 

[hrstrat57]

As with nearly all things generalizing doesn't work.

It comes down to what the individual is looking for when purchasing a racquet. If the retail racquet does not allow for an individuals preference in specs to be achieved, or the retail frames are too stiff, you need to go to prostock.

Personally I have no trouble customizing Prestiges to my spec, but I prefer the feel of older models, so I tracked some down, moded em up and have no need for prostocks.

I believe if you can find what works for you without going the prostock route than it makes more sense to save the money and do so. But if you have the money and either can't find what works for you, or you just want a PT630 in a YTK PJ or a PT630 w/ a 16x19 SP the it's about as silly as buying any other racquet.

Hey Hiro, I know it took you a while to achieve your quest, which I believe I recall ended in carefully modded PT57E's(i Prestige MP's) I remember your quest for a matched pair coincided with mine and I believe we traded a few comments last year.

Curious did you ever hit with a YT or MG Prestige MP or (if you did) bump one up to your preferred specs?

One of my main points for discussion is I personally snubbed the chinese retail stuff, retaining huge snobbery regarding not playing anything but the Austrian stuff or Pro Stock stuff.....

Went with retail and was shocked at how good they were....heck at $200 a pop they should be good I know, but I was still surprised and pleased that I was able to bump up the swingweight a bit and still keep my swing quick.

I am going to back away now and enjoy the discussion.

 

[movdqa]

My reply from the other thread:

> I have come full circle on my whole outlook on Head player frames. I
> have a prostock frame and multiple Austrian made prestige and radical
> frames as well.

I have six pro stocks and one in (delayed) transit. Three are XLs and
two of them are matched. I'm getting more comfortable with the XLs and
may consider getting the third one matched to the other two (I can get
access to an RDC machine though it's a bit of a headache).

> To me the most important thing tho is to be able to reach into my bag
> for a backup stick and have it play the same. I think this is an
> outcome nearly impossible for us recreational players to achieve
> chasing prostock frames on the other string forum, e baey or from
> other sources.

There are sets of frames out for sale from time to time. The person
that sold me my first XL offered me a pair. I should have taken him up
on it. The problem with buying one and then liking it is that it is
often hard to get a second unless you have the ability to match
weight, balance and swingweight.

> I will say this, my 2 YT prestige MP frames bought from TW, matched
> and spec'd are very, very good. I have modified them to my specs and
> they are still light enuff to be swung easily and efficiently....the
> retail YT Prestige MP is light enuff to be modified and I am now
> convinced will satisfy over 95% of good players seeking a players
> stick in a 18x20 frame.

I feel the same way about my two 238.4 XLs. I have six YT Pro Stocks
but I don't believe that any of them have the YT material and from
comments seen in these forums, I (or my arm) might not like it.

> Further, I think now that Head is hiding the prostock frames under
> retail markings it is very tricky to be certain you are getting a
> pro stock racquet unless buying it directly from a pro. I think this
> thread is evidence of that. I truly believe Head doesn't want us to
> have pro stock frames and believes most of us don't get any benefit
> from them. The ironic thing is I bet if the OP strung up the frame
> being discussed here it would play great! I was hoping we would get
> that commentary here.

The potential beneift that I see (as an older player) is comfort. The
whole industry is going stiffer. The availability of a few flexible
frames is nice but there seem to be fewer and fewer options in that
genre.

That customized retail frame might play just fine but the OP was buying
something specific. I didn't hear anything about the other two frames
that were sold so perhaps the other buyer(s) is/are happy.

> I am very happy with my 2 retail frames, blissfully happy
> actually. I thank those here on the forums who convinced me my
> Austrian frame snobbery was silly and suggested I abandon my quest
> for TGK 238.4 frames and go with a matched retail pair instead. Good
> call!!!

I keep reading reviews on potential retail racquets out there,
especially with companies that have a record of making the same frame
year-in and year-out.

-------------------------------------------

One other aspect of using Pro Stocks is if you are a collector or if you just like knowing that you're using the frame of a particular pro. In most cases, you don't know who your frame was allocated to but sometimes you do.

 

[Marcus2137]

One other aspect of using Pro Stocks is if you are a collector or if you just like knowing that you're using the frame of a particular pro. In most cases, you don't know who your frame was allocated to but sometimes you do.

Ya, I hear that. If I had the money I would love to find a frame used by the guys I loved watching when I first got into tennis (Kuerten, Chang, Safin, Hewitt, or later, Federer, etc). And even if it wasn't their personal frame, it would be cool to have a frame that is the same version they used with the similar setup.

I think it comes down to whatever the users final goal is. I think for some users a retail stick is probably perfect, for others it might be impossible to get a retail stick that can be customized the way they want. For me, I definitely enjoy playing with different setups and tinkering with the weight and feel of my racket, so a pro stock gives me a little more range to experiment with. Perhaps, in the end, I will find that I really enjoy the specs that a retail racket can match, and I might just stick with retail. I doubt it though because as I've played with weight on my retail racket, I've already hit the wall about how far I can go in some customization, and I want to go farther, and only a retail racket will let me.

 

[dr325i]

Further, I think now that Head is hiding the prostock frames under retail markings it is very tricky to be certain you are getting a pro stock racquet unless buying it directly from a pro. I think the recent thread regarding the questionable TGK 238.4 is evidence of that. I truly believe Head doesn't want us to have pro stock frames and believes most of us don't get any benefit from them.

I am very happy with my 2 retail frames, blissfully happy actually. I thank those here on the forums who convinced me my Austrian frame snobbery was silly and suggested I abandon my quest for TGK 238.4 frames and go with a matched retail pair instead. Good call!!!

Let's discuss?

First of all, the TGK frames are NOT Made in Austria. It is easily proven by taking the pallets off.

Second, even with the retail specs inside the throat now, the Pro stock frame is easy to spot:
- buy it from the reputable source (a few of those on the string forum, also members here)
- The pro stock has the pro butt cap, (most of the time) Calfsin and most importantly the black sticker with a A/B code where the last three difits depict the Pro code.

 

[movdqa]

If you read up on Pro Stocks, I think that they are easy to spot but the String Forums isn't exactly the easiest place to find out about the small world - you can pick it up from reading the for sale posts and some of the threads on this forum.

The first purchase is a little scary and my feeling was that I was willing to part with the purchase amount if I was scammed. I was sending a few hundred to a stranger in another country using a payment system that was non-recourse (I'm not actually sure whether it is non-recourse or not but I assumed that it was). I should have bought the second matching frame but I wanted to see I would actually get the first one. As it turned out, I bought from one of the many reliable sellers.

My view of the world would have been different if I had a different outcome. I think that I would have been far more cautious if I had an experience like that of Marcus.