Murray being compared to Federer (Career Wise)

Turning Pro

Hall of Fame
LOL. This is ridiculous even for the BBC/Editor:

Fallen Favourite - Murray defeat should not spell panic

In the search for perspective following Andy Murray’s fourth-round exit at the Australian Open, it is worth rewinding six years to 2003.

Back then, a 21-year-old Roger Federer – seeded sixth - suffered a five-set defeat by 10th seed David Nalbandian at exactly the same stage in Melbourne.


It prompted one British newspaper journalist to write that the Swiss was "fast taking the Tim Henman mantle of a talented choker".

Federer, as if anyone needs reminding, went on to win the first of 13 Grand Slams (and counting) at Wimbledon later that same season.

Along the way, he has played poor matches and still won: only on Sunday, the world number two was scraping past Tomas Berdych despite dropping the first two sets.

Federer, along with Novak Djokovic, had expressed surprise that Murray had been installed as joint favourite for the title, and the world number two has become increasingly annoyed at having to answer questions about the Scot as the tournament has progressed.

Murray may have had an unbeaten start to the season and been the form player of the last six months, but Grand Slam tournaments, Federer argued, are a "different animal".

So it proved.


No one can blame the bookies for tipping a player who had lost just five matches since Wimbledon.'

Troubled by illness – on which he refused to blame his fluctuating performance against 14th seed Fernando Verdasco – Murray could not even beat his previous Australian Open best.

His critics – many of them on here on 606 – claimed he was overhyped by the British media and the bookmakers.

But it was the Australian Age newspaper which chose to print a picture of Murray on Saturday under the headline: "Can He Do It? Yes He Can."

And no one can blame the bookies for tipping a player who had lost just five matches since Wimbledon, a run which featured two wins over Djokovic, three over Federer and one over Rafael Nadal.

But only the Nadal win came in a five-set match and it was closely followed by defeat in the US Open final by Federer.

He wasn’t quite ready to win his first Grand Slam title then, and it emerged in Melbourne that he perhaps still lacks that maturity which only comes with the big-match experience.

Murray, showing flashes of the sort of petulant behaviour which scarred the early stages of his career, suffered an aberration against an in-form player on Monday.

It happens, and Murray – a voracious student of the game - will learn from it.

Indeed, amid the obvious disappointment of his early defeat, it was Murray who managed to put it into some kind of perspective.

"I'll go and speak to my coach, the guys that I work with, and see if there's things that I could have done better, things that I can improve," he said.

"But, I mean, for me it's not a disaster. I'm still playing well. I lost to a good player in a very close match. I'll have more chances to win Grand Slams."

Federer would attest to that. He prevailed in his 17th Grand Slam tournament. Murray has just lost in his 13th.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A46501030?s_fromedit=1&s_type=15&s_sport=tennis

I still think he's overhyped. His Grass and Clay skills aren't going to magically transfer over from his supposedly god like Hard court preference so he dosen't look like he'll do much damage except maybe the semi's of wimbledon but not really a major threat. Also, he hasn't won a slam yet so everyone should hush on Great player status, at least for some time.
 

batz

G.O.A.T.
LOL. This is ridiculous even for the BBC/Editor:



http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A46501030?s_fromedit=1&s_type=15&s_sport=tennis

I still think he's overhyped. His Grass and Clay skills aren't going to magically transfer over from his supposedly god like Hard court preference so he dosen't look like he'll do much damage except maybe the semi's of wimbledon but not really a major threat. Also, he hasn't won a slam yet so everyone should hush on Great player status, at least for some time.

Where in the article is he hyped? Who is saying he is A Great? Which part of the article is factually incorrect? Why is it that Nadal's clayourt game could be developed to the point where it was effective on grass but Murray's hardcourt game can't?

Over to you.
 

Turning Pro

Hall of Fame
Everyone on this board and the british press media, former players hype him. Do i need to provide factual information? And Nadal's transformation is very different to Murrays. First of all Nadal is one of a kind. Second of all, Everyone who is great against Nadal on hard courts SIMPLY CANNOT make the transition to CLAY and beat him there(eg. Tsonga, Blake, Berdych etc). Understand? Probably not. Over to you.
 

batz

G.O.A.T.
Everyone on this board and the british press media, former players hype him. Do i need to provide factual information? And Nadal's transformation is very different to Murrays. First of all Nadal is one of a kind. Second of all, Everyone who is great against Nadal on hard courts SIMPLY CANNOT make the transition to CLAY and beat him there(eg. Tsonga, Blake, Berdych etc). Understand? Probably not. Over to you.

Everyone on here hypes him - apart form you I assume?

OK - I'll repeat my question to you as you seem to be answering one about people transferring their play from hard to clay - something I never mentioned.

Why is it that Nadal's clayourt game could be developed to the point where it was effective on grass but Murray's hardcourt game can't? Specifically, what is the inherent weakness in Murray's grass game that is not manifest on hard?

Over to you.

Incidentally Murray's Wimbledon record to date is R3,R4,QF - he's improved every year he's played there. It's also interesting to note that the surface on which Murray holds his highest win/loss ratio is grass (75%).
 

GameSampras

Banned
But Murray is the future G.O.A.T :oops:

You know he does have the talent to be the GOAT of his respective era I think.. But I dunno if he has the other intangibles. He plays brilliantly, looks like hes taking a step forward in the right direction than takes 10 steps backwards
 

fgzhu88

Semi-Pro
come to think of it, there is kind of a parallel between Federer and Murray. They both reached the TMC semis prior to the AO where they both lost in the R16 in a pretty schizophrenic 5 setter (no close sets, just swinging of momentum)
 

batz

G.O.A.T.
You know he does have the talent to be the GOAT of his respective era I think.. But I dunno if he has the other intangibles. He plays brilliantly, looks like hes taking a step forward in the right direction than takes 10 steps backwards


Don't you think you're over-stating it a tad when you say he takes 10 steps backwards? He's had 2 'bad' losses in the last 7 or 8 months - only one of which was at a slam.
'
I think some people are now indulging in some 'inverse hype' over Murray - there's a pendulum thing going on. He's gone from GOAT candidate to no-hoper in the space of 24 hours. - it's all a bit silly IMHO.
 

abmk

Bionic Poster
You know he does have the talent to be the GOAT of his respective era I think.. But I dunno if he has the other intangibles. He plays brilliantly, looks like hes taking a step forward in the right direction than takes 10 steps backwards

I don't see how you can come to that conclusion. He's hardly done anything great on clay and best result on grass is the wimby QF in 2008 till now. Potential to be the best hardcourt player of this era, yes. Clay , no ways and grass, not near till now by any means.
 

veroniquem

Bionic Poster
What's ridiculous in that article? Was anything it said not true? Should the British press just club Murray on the head and say he sucks? That would be totally ridiculous IMO. They're trying to emphasize the positive aspects of his AO experience (one learns from one's defeats and everyone loses a lot before winning a lot if they ever do). I think that's exactly what the media and Murray himself should do, avoid unnecessary negativism.
 

GameSampras

Banned
I don't see how you can come to that conclusion. He's hardly done anything great on clay and best result on grass is the wimby QF in 2008 till now. Potential to be the best hardcourt player of this era, yes. Clay , no ways and grass, not near till now by any means.

Well.. He could always improve on both surfaces.. And its not like there are great players on grass and clay these days outside of Fed and Nadal
 

TheMusicLover

G.O.A.T.
I see no problems with that article. It might even be one of the most balanced ones containing the word 'Murray' that I've seen for quite a while.
 

caulcano

Hall of Fame
LOL. This is ridiculous even for the BBC/Editor:



http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A46501030?s_fromedit=1&s_type=15&s_sport=tennis

I still think he's overhyped. His Grass and Clay skills aren't going to magically transfer over from his supposedly god like Hard court preference so he dosen't look like he'll do much damage except maybe the semi's of wimbledon but not really a major threat. Also, he hasn't won a slam yet so everyone should hush on Great player status, at least for some time.

I did think Murray would be a finalist at this year's AO but the whole "comparing Murray with Federer" is a joke. The guy has ZERO GS.
 

NamRanger

G.O.A.T.
Everyone on here hypes him - apart form you I assume?

OK - I'll repeat my question to you as you seem to be answering one about people transferring their play from hard to clay - something I never mentioned.

Why is it that Nadal's clayourt game could be developed to the point where it was effective on grass but Murray's hardcourt game can't? Specifically, what is the inherent weakness in Murray's grass game that is not manifest on hard?

Over to you.

Incidentally Murray's Wimbledon record to date is R3,R4,QF - he's improved every year he's played there. It's also interesting to note that the surface on which Murray holds his highest win/loss ratio is grass (75%).


Murray was lucky that mental midget Gasquet pulled an epic choke in that 4th round. Otherwise, he would have had another disappointing loss.
 

Feña14

G.O.A.T.
I did think Murray would be a finalist at this year's AO but the whole "comparing Murray with Federer" is a joke. The guy has ZERO GS.

Erm, they're comparing careers at the same stage, i.e when Federer was 21. It seems to be a pretty good comparison actually.
 

NamRanger

G.O.A.T.
Erm, they're comparing careers at the same stage, i.e when Federer was 21. It seems to be a pretty good comparison actually.


Except Federer at 21 was losing to a very good Nalbandian. No disrespect to Verdasco, but Nalbandian at that stage in his career was extremely good (because he was actually semi-fit).
 

miyagi

Professional
Murray is a nice player but I dont know whether he will be a slam winner.....I think everyone is hyping him a little...let him win then lets go wild....

For now he is just the 4th best player in the world with alot of potential....
 
S

srinrajesh

Guest
Let us wait for a few years , see Murray win a few grand slams before comparing him to federer...
 

TheMusicLover

G.O.A.T.
I did think Murray would be a finalist at this year's AO but the whole "comparing Murray with Federer" is a joke. The guy has ZERO GS.

There used to be a time when Federer had NO GS titles either. In fact, that was when he was 21. Oh, wait... maybe the comparison isn't as bad as you think. ;)
 
S

srinrajesh

Guest
Erm, they're comparing careers at the same stage, i.e when Federer was 21. It seems to be a pretty good comparison actually.

I would say in that case Murray has achieved far more than Federer at the same stage ... But federer went on to win so many after that period -- murray wont be able to repeat the same as the competition is tougher now
 

OddJack

G.O.A.T.
LOL. This is ridiculous even for the BBC/Editor:



http://www.bbc.co.uk/dna/606/A46501030?s_fromedit=1&s_type=15&s_sport=tennis

I still think he's overhyped. His Grass and Clay skills aren't going to magically transfer over from his supposedly god like Hard court preference so he dosen't look like he'll do much damage except maybe the semi's of wimbledon but not really a major threat. Also, he hasn't won a slam yet so everyone should hush on Great player status, at least for some time.

Sure he is. And it's all co.uk media fault. Leave the kid alone, he cant become what you want him to be just by saying he is.
 

Feña14

G.O.A.T.
I would say in that case Murray has achieved far more than Federer at the same stage ... But federer went on to win so many after that period -- murray wont be able to repeat the same as the competition is tougher now

Yeah I highly doubt he will achieve the same as Federer. As things stand at the moment, as 21 year olds they both had very similar starts to their career though.

Federer then went and kicked on to an extent that I don't think anyone would of really predicted. For all we know Murray could just fade away, he could stay around this level and be a top 10 player and not do too much (like a Davydenko say), or he could kick on to a Federer standard... It's totally impossible to predict.
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
What's ridiculous in that article? Was anything it said not true? Should the British press just club Murray on the head and say he sucks? That would be totally ridiculous IMO. They're trying to emphasize the positive aspects of his AO experience (one learns from one's defeats and everyone loses a lot before winning a lot if they ever do). I think that's exactly what the media and Murray himself should do, avoid unnecessary negativism.

Disagree with you on this one veron,he doesn't need any comparisons with Federer at this stage of his career,that's just putting way too much pressure and expectation on Andy(look what that did to Henman although I consider Murray to have much greater potential).They should just tone down the massive media hype and give Murray some breathing space.He's a very smart,talented player and IMO his time to win a slam will come sooner or later,he should just try to learn what he can from this loss to Verdasco and concentrate on further improving his game which basing on his interview is what he'll do(very mature interview from him btw. after that loss to Verdasco).
 

NamRanger

G.O.A.T.
I see the Murray Bandwagon still has a wheel running. Nonetheless, he needs to play more aggressive tennis, dictating play more often and S&Ving more. He's going to get injured at some point playing that type of tennis.
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
I see the Murray Bandwagon still has a wheel running. Nonetheless, he needs to play more aggressive tennis, dictating play more often and S&Ving more. He's going to get injured at some point playing that type of tennis.

Yeah,he should change and improve his game,dictate and take initiative more.He has good hands at the net so I agree that he should S&V more.I still see him as slam winning talent regardless of the loss to Verdasco.
 

NamRanger

G.O.A.T.
Yeah,he should change and improve his game,dictate and take initiative more.He has good hands at the net so I agree that he should S&V more.I still see him as slam winning talent regardless of the loss to Verdasco.


Yeah, he was getting completely blown off the court by Verdasco in the 4th and 5th sets. He just refused to attack.
 

batz

G.O.A.T.
Murray was lucky that mental midget Gasquet pulled an epic choke in that 4th round. Otherwise, he would have had another disappointing loss.


So Murray was lucky when he came from 2 sets down against the 'mental midget' Gasquet. OK.

I guess that means that Roger was lucky against the similarly courageously challenged Berdych the other day then?
 

zagor

Bionic Poster
So Murray was lucky when he came from 2 sets down against the 'mental midget' Gasquet. OK.

I guess that means that Roger was lucky against the similarly courageously challenged Berdych the other day then?

I would say so.Both Berdych and Gasquet are know for their lack of mental strength,like both of their games very much though.Don't get me wrong,both Murray and Fed fought well in their respective matches to come back from 2 sets down but they were certainly helped by the fact that Berdych and Gasquet were on the other side of the net.
 

Defcon

Hall of Fame
Murray has about 1/10th the talent of Federer, which was obvious to everyone even at that early stage. It was all a matter of putting it together mentally for Fed, he's always had more shots than anyone.

Murray on the other hand is a whiny brat with some talent (but no more than many other promising players) and thanks to Gilbert has developed a really ugly game.

He doesn't have the power or fitness of a Federer/Sampras to blow anyone away no matter how they play, and to stay in the game. No one does. Overhyped is right.
 

batz

G.O.A.T.
I would say so.Both Berdych and Gasquet are know for their lack of mental strength,like both of their games very much though.Don't get me wrong,both Murray and Fed fought well in their respective matches to come back from 2 sets down but they were certainly helped by the fact that Berdych and Gasquet were on the other side of the net.

Don't have a problem with that. My personal view is that neither of them were 'lucky', but I can see your point and it's a good one.

What I would say is that either they were both lucky or neither of them were i.e. if you think Murray was lucky then you'd have to say Roger was also lucky (as you do) and vice versa.
 

OddJack

G.O.A.T.
I see the Murray Bandwagon still has a wheel running. Nonetheless, he needs to play more aggressive tennis, dictating play more often and S&Ving more. He's going to get injured at some point playing that type of tennis.

This is exactly what he said himself, improving his game. If only the media and fans could stop pushing him around. It's become abusive.
 
Top