Poor Alcaraz....got destroyed again..lol

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Getting this one started...
First of many ocassions where the lack of a good serve combined with an opponent zoning on serve led to the horrific destruction of this Spaniard.

Felix beat him 3 & 2, facing just one break point in the entire match, thoroughly exposing the weakness of Alcaraz on this type of surface, that is his serve & return

 

[Slicehand]

Right, poor number one, he just gets beat all the time

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Right, poor number one, he just gets beat all the time

I like the kid's game & mentality, man. But he is mediocre at best in the 2 most important shots in tennis, serve & return. You can't win everything based on sheer athleticism & mental toughness all the time; you need free points and reliability in service games, as well as the ability to be able to find a way through an opponent who's zoning on serve

 

[wangs78]

It's pretty clear we're back in an era where matchups and surfaces are going to have a meaningful difference on the outcome of a match. The days of having three all-surface greats are just about over.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

It's pretty clear we're back in an era where matchups and surfaces are going to have a meaningful difference on the outcome of a match. The days of having three all-surface greats are just about over.

Alcaraz with a better serve & FAA with a better toughness have the ability to be all court players.

 

[Slicehand]

I like the kid's game & mentality, man. But he is mediocre at best in the 2 most important shots in tennis, serve & return. You can't win everything based on sheer athleticism & mental toughness all the time; you need free points and reliability in service games, as well as the ability to be able to find a way through an opponent who's zoning on serve

Tell that to the male player with more grand slams in history... sure, serve is so important, but experience is more, at 19, i dont worry about him losing indoors to a player serving like felix is

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Tell that to the male player with more grand slams in history... sure, serve is so important, but experience is more, at 19, i dont worry about him losing indoors to a player serving like felix is

Nadal's serve was indeed poor at Alcaraz's current age, but not as bad as Carlos's. Rafa already had one of the best returning games of all time, plus his leftiness gave him a massive advantage in serving from the ad court. All this, combined with the fact that his slice serve was already a killer, made his S&R combo at 19 much better than Carlitos's at 19.

 

[initialize]

It looks like the Career Inflation Era won’t be going away any time soon as long as the next gen and next-next Gen mugs continue to be inconsistent lol

 

[flyingboris]

Getting this one started...

Haha, thanks for making a proper one. Someone else started one titled “Poor little Alcaraz”, which seemed too mean spirited, even for TTW.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Haha, thanks for making a proper one. Someone else started one titled “Poor little Alcaraz”, which seemed too mean spirited, even for TTW.

You're welcome dear.
And that must be @Lleytonstation

 

[Oval_Solid]

he needs a heavier racket

 

[duaneeo]

The days of having three all-surface greats are just about over.

We're talking indoor hard, so this analogy doesn't work.

 

[ghostofMecir]

I like the kid's game & mentality, man. But he is mediocre at best in the 2 most important shots in tennis, serve & return. You can't win everything based on sheer athleticism & mental toughness all the time; you need free points and reliability in service games, as well as the ability to be able to find a way through an opponent who's zoning on serve

You've been anti-Alcaraz from the beginning ever since he started getting attention. Apparently getting even an ounce of attention is attention taken away from the precious Rafito.

 

[Lauren_Girl']

He still hasn't broken Auger-Aliassime once....
0 break in 3 matchs and 7 sets.

That might be a huge matchup issue if he doesn't fix this ASAP (Same for Sinner vs FAA)

 

[duaneeo]

He still hasn't broken Auger-Aliassime once....
0 break in 3 matchs and 7 sets.

That might be a huge matchup issue if he doesn't fix this ASAP

It might just be an indoor hard matchup issue.

 

[TearTheRoofOff]

Boo! https://tt.tennis-warehouse.com/ind...estroyed-once-again-lol.737617/#post-16861867

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

You've been anti-Alcaraz from the beginning ever since he started getting attention. Apparently getting even an ounce of attention is attention taken away from the precious Rafito.

W R O N G

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

He still hasn't broken Auger-Aliassime once....
0 break in 3 matchs and 7 sets.

That might be a huge matchup issue if he doesn't fix this ASAP (Same for Sinner vs FAA)

He needs to fix his serve

 

[GhostOfNKDM]

I like the kid's game & mentality, man. But he is mediocre at best in the 2 most important shots in tennis, serve & return. You can't win everything based on sheer athleticism & mental toughness all the time; you need free points and reliability in service games, as well as the ability to be able to find a way through an opponent who's zoning on serve

It depends on the surface and format. This is Basel we're talking about - one of the fastest indoor courts on tour in a BO3 format.

The same FAA beat Roger at Halle too.. I mean it's not like the kid did not show potential on fast courts in the past but that hasn't translated to slam success, whereas Alcaraz is a proven slam champion.

Your larger point about Carlos needing more cheap points is not wrong, but the overall tone of your post is overly generic and dismissive like he were an overhyped failure.

It's players like FAA that have to prove themselves over the long term.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

It depends on the surface and format. This is Basel we're talking about - one of the fastest indoor courts on tour in a BO3 format.

The same FAA beat Roger at Halle too.. I mean it's not like the kid did not show potential on fast courts in the past but that hasn't translated to slam success, whereas Alcaraz is a proven slam champion.

Your larger point about Carlos needing more cheap points is not wrong, but the overall tone of your post is overly generic and dismissive like he were an overhyped failure.

It's players like FAA that have to prove themselves over the long term.

It surely does depend upon the surface. However, Alcaraz doesn't lack the potential to be a great indoors player, as he showed us last year in Vienna. If his serve is improved, he'll be a dangerous player there too.

And come on, man. 2021 Roger was not Roger. While FAA does have the potential on low bouncing fast courts, thanks to his serve, he has also improved leaps and bounds on clay as well. Remember, he was the player to provide the toughest challange to Rafa at RG this year.

I'm not dismissing him; I'm just saying that serve & return combo is the only area of his game which didn't improve from 2021, while everything else did.

 

[EdMcMush]

Felix has been amazing the last few weeks. 12 match winning streak is impressive as all hell

 

[socallefty]

The days of having three all-surface greats are just about over.

FIFY - The days of having two all-surface ATGs are just about over. One of the Big 3 has always not been an ATG on fast, low bouncing hard courts like you see during most of the indoor season. That’s why it is harder for him to get accepted as GOAT unless he has a big lead in Slam titles at the end of his career.

 

[GhostOfNKDM]

It surely does depend upon the surface. However, Alcaraz doesn't lack the potential to be a great indoors player, as he showed us last year in Vienna. If his serve is improved, he'll be a dangerous player there too.

And come on, man. 2021 Roger was not Roger. While FAA does have the potential on low bouncing fast courts, thanks to his serve, he has also improved leaps and bounds on clay as well. Remember, he was the player to provide the toughest challange to Rafa at RG this year.

I'm not dismissing him; I'm just saying that serve & return combo is the only area of his game which didn't improve from 2021, while everything else did.

I mean results speak for themselves. You think his 2022 results are not good?

As for improvement, time will tell. He's got plenty of time on his side. I say he's more than earned himself room for some faith.

I'd reserve that kind of critique for players like Tsitsipas who've made no improvements despite being on that slam success threshold for a while now.

 

[GhostOfNKDM]

Felix has been amazing the last few weeks. 12 match winning streak is impressive as all hell

Seems like a good part of the season for him this year and hopefully more to come.

 

[wangs78]

FIFY - The days of having two all-surface ATGs are just about over. One of the Big 3 has always not been an ATG on fast, low bouncing hard courts like you see during most of the indoor season. That’s why it is harder for him to get accepted as GOAT unless he has a big lead in Slam titles at the end of his career.

Agreed. I was trying to be diplomatic and avoid hostilities from certain fanboys

 

[socallefty]

Agreed. I was trying to be diplomatic and avoid hostilities from certain fanboys

Keep being hostile to unthinking fanboys We want more ‘thinking’ tennis fans on these forums.

 

[duaneeo]

You've been anti-Alcaraz from the beginning ever since he started getting attention. Apparently getting even an ounce of attention is attention taken away from the precious Rafito.

Some Rafa fans may be getting worried. There's been the question of if 19 year old Alcaraz can surpass the achievements of 19 year old Nadal. Carlos already has a slam, two Masters, and the #1 ranking, and there are still many big tournaments to play before his 20th birthday.

 

[stringertom]

Getting this one started...
First of many ocassions where the lack of a good serve combined with an opponent zoning on serve led to the horrific destruction of this Spaniard.

Felix beat him 3 & 2, facing just one break point in the entire match, thoroughly exposing the weakness of Alcaraz on this type of surface, that is his serve & return

A tribute to @sureshs with that intentional misspelling, no? Our guy did share his big A.S.S* tip a few years ago.

*Another Serve Secret

 

[Rosstour]

Nadal's serve was indeed poor at Alcaraz's current age, but not as bad as Carlos's.

what

lol

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

what

lol

Read full

 

[Sentinel]

A tribute to @sureshs with that intentional misspelling, no? Our guy did share his big A.S.S* tip a few years ago.

*Another Serve Secret

Juiced above his name is a link that says Click to Expand.
Lol.

 

[I Am Finnish]

@Lleytonstation shouldve make the topic

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

@Lleytonstation shouldve make the topic

Let me have something

 

[I Am Finnish]

Let me have something

No

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

No

Bbbbbbbb.....ut...... you're my friend.
Puhleaseeeeeee.....

 

[I Am Finnish]

Bbbbbbbb.....ut...... you're my friend.
Puhleaseeeeeee.....

 

[NeutralFan]

Cringe thread

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

 

[DSH]

@Lleytonstation shouldve make the topic

Is he Finnish?

 

[abmk]

Nadal's serve was indeed poor at Alcaraz's current age, but not as bad as Carlos's. Rafa already had one of the best returning games of all time, plus his leftiness gave him a massive advantage in serving from the ad court. All this, combined with the fact that his slice serve was already a killer, made his S&R combo at 19 much better than Carlitos's at 19.

I think nadal's serve was a little worse and return a little better at best, but not by much.

Alcaraz leads the tour in return games won this year at 31.76% FWIW.
Alcaraz has 30.4% of return games won on HC in 2022 compared to Nadal at 29.4% (of course nadal's is way ahead on clay, but that's more on baseline game)
Ace% against is 3.6% for Alcaraz in 2022, while it was 5.3 for Nadal in 2005.

I know difference in competition accounts for chunk of it, but difference isn't as much as you make it out to be.

 

[abmk]

It surely does depend upon the surface. However, Alcaraz doesn't lack the potential to be a great indoors player, as he showed us last year in Vienna. If his serve is improved, he'll be a dangerous player there too.

And come on, man. 2021 Roger was not Roger. While FAA does have the potential on low bouncing fast courts, thanks to his serve, he has also improved leaps and bounds on clay as well. Remember, he was the player to provide the toughest challange to Rafa at RG this year.

I'm not dismissing him; I'm just saying that serve & return combo is the only area of his game which didn't improve from 2021, while everything else did.

Alcaraz went up from 74.6% service games held in 2021 to 83.1% service games held in 2022. clearly improved his serve.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

Alcaraz went up from 74.6% service games held in 2021 to 83.1% service games held in 2022. clearly improved his serve.

That was mainly due to the ground game improvements. The serve as a shot is still almost the same.

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

I think nadal's serve was a little worse and return a little better at best, but not by much.

Alcaraz leads the tour in return games won this year at 31.76% FWIW.
Alcaraz has 30.4% of return games won on HC in 2022 compared to Nadal at 29.4% (of course nadal's is way ahead on clay, but that's more on baseline game)
Ace% against is 3.6% for Alcaraz in 2022, while it was 5.3 for Nadal in 2005.

I know difference in competition accounts for chunk of it, but difference isn't as much as you make it out to be.

I don't deny the states, Ab. What I'm saying is based on what I've seen so far. Alcaraz has failed to maintain a break lead many times, failing to consolidate the advantage.

 

[abmk]

That was mainly due to the ground game improvements. The serve as a shot is still almost the same.

return games won% difference is not that much, like 1%.
service games% difference won far more. That is due to serve improving to a an extent, not mainly ground game only.

 

[abmk]

I don't deny the states, Ab. What I'm saying is based on what I've seen so far. Alcaraz has failed to maintain a break lead many times, failing to consolidate the advantage.

that's partly due to serve being merely decent (not mediocre though) and partly inconsistency on ground game.

 

[sportsfan1]

Uhmm, what? I suppose rf was winning all his earlier matches with his baseline grinding, before he started serving really well.

So I think that serve is the area that Carlos has got to improve.
Of course, Roger Federer started serving really well later in his career.

Mats Wilander worried about significant weakness in Carlos Alcaraz's game - "The way that he plays matches is that he does not serve well"

Carlos Alcaraz has a big weakness in his serve according to seven-time Slam champion Mats Wilander.The World No.1 has not had things easy since topping the rankings by winning the US Open in September...

tennisuptodate.com

 

[Rafa4LifeEver]

return games won% difference is not that much, like 1%.
service games% difference won far more. That is due to serve improving to a an extent, not mainly ground game only.

I think his +1 shot has improved more than the serve itself, giving him an instant advantage if a good serve is landed in unlike in 2021 where I found his +1 shot to be mediocre at best.

And that's a good point you mentioned as well, his return game has only marginally improved. I think that's purely because of the more consistent ground game that he possesses compared to 2021; however, the ROS as a serve has not improved even a little bit imo.

that's partly due to serve being merely decent (not mediocre though) and partly inconsistency on ground game.

Let's say merely average

 

[Chanwan]

In order for Alcaraz to not finish the year as the youngest YE no. 1, Rafa has to turn a 3 match losing streak into a 4 match winning streak beating 4 top-10 players, most likely including Novak Djokovic, on indoor hard court.

I like Alcaraz' chances

 

[Winners or Errors]

...and Alcaraz is year end #1.

 

[Soul_Evisceration]

In order for Alcaraz to not finish the year as the youngest YE no. 1, Rafa has to turn a 3 match losing streak into a 4 match winning streak beating 4 top-10 players, most likely including Novak Djokovic, on indoor hard court.

I like Alcaraz' chances

It's almost certain that Alcaraz will remain #1 as I doubt Nadal will beat FAA,Ruud, Djokovic and Tsitsipas/Rublev in an Indoor event.